Do you think Sam Peter hits harder than Dempsey, louis, marciano, foreman liston

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by skyler

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lyle

Bx730NY....Sam Peter couldn't put Wlad away where as if a Rocky, Louis, Foreman, Dempsey, Tyson had Wlad hurt, they would have won.

Sam's chin is pretty good but that has nothing to do with his or Wlad's power....and nor does the fact Sam hit Wlad behind the head......a very HUGE sign that Sammy doesn't hit as effectively as other fighters.



Your dislike of Wladimir has no point in any argument that can go on in here given the topic at hand.

---

You have GOT to be joking ::** Do you honestly believe that Marciano, Dempsey, or Louis would even be competitive with a 6'6 245 lb fighter like Wlad to begin with ::** (please don't try comparing an un-coordinated, walking tomato can with zero skills like Jess Willard to Wladimir Klitchko).

---

What utter nonsense!
The difference being that Wladimir Klitschko has a chin made of glass while Marciano, Dempsey and Louis did not.
What has Wladimir Klitschko ever done to get mentioned in the same breath as Joe Louis.
Maybe you should try watching some of these fighters actually fight.
Klitschko is an average Heavyweight- decent technique and size but nothing more. ::**

He may have more power than Dempsey and Louis, but the rest of the guys on that list hit like trucks and I highly doubt Peter could hang with those Monsters. Marciano wasnt the best boxer but he had 2 mean ass hooks. Foreman is strong as an Ox. Liston knocked everyone silly except Ali, he brutalized Patterson twice.

I really don't buy Marciano as the hardest hitter of all time. Maybe P4P one of the hardest hitters of all time, but I think punchers like Shavers and Foreman, who had a lot of "good" weight on him, just hit above and beyond him. Don Cockell stated after the Marciano fight that Marciano wasn't the hardest hitter he fought. I really think it comes down to bias towards the old guys, and boxing fans trying to be "old school". I love Rocky and Louis as much as the next guy, and while I feel that they used their bodies more effectively in the punch, I'll never buy that they hit as hard as guys like Shavers, Foreman, or even Tyson and Peters.

Peter is a Heavyhanded and big guy but his shots are crude swipes.
Dempsey was a very over-rated puncher and a small man.apart from the damage he did to Willard (with allegedly loaded gloves) what were his best ko`s???? i think it was Sharkey who said he was "a respectable but not devestating hitter".
anyway back to Peter,i think its crazy to even mention him in the same breath as the truly great punchers.if he is that good how did Klitchko finish their fight,never mind clearly beat him????
apart from Jeremy Williams what impressive KO`s has he scored??
he couldnt even KO Maskaev for chrissake

I think he does hit harder than the smaller HWs of yesteryears like Marciano, Dempsey, Louis, ect. Because lets face it, these guys were just cruiserweights and in some cases Light heavyweights.

I dont think he hits harder than Liston or Foreman though.

I dont think hes even top 50 hardest hitting heavyweights of all time. He has good power, but as ive said before his power is vastly overrated.

A prime Riddick Bowe would blast out any heavyweight today within two rounds, including Peter.

Does that make him the biggest puncher ever? Nope. He was damn heavy handed though and could put his punches together.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deanrw

A prime Riddick Bowe would blast out and heavyweight today within two rounds, including Peter.

Does that make him the biggest puncher ever? Nope. He was damn heavy handed though and could put his punches together.

---

True, but Riddick was only in his prime for like 4 fights ;) Too bad. He could have been an ATG if it wasn't for Don King and the buffet table.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RozzySean

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deanrw

A prime Riddick Bowe would blast out and heavyweight today within two rounds, including Peter.

Does that make him the biggest puncher ever? Nope. He was damn heavy handed though and could put his punches together.

---

True, but Riddick was only in his prime for like 4 fights ;) Too bad. He could have been an ATG if it wasn't for Don King and the buffet table.

---

haha very true. Buffet table and laziness on top of it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lyle

Sam Peter doesn't hit THAT hard....sure he's a KO puncher but he is wide and slaps with his punches whereas Louis snapped his punches, Dempsey, Foreman, and Marciano really used their legs when they threw their punches.


I would say Sam Peter is one of the best power punchers today but as far as ALL-TIME he's not even close.

Guys like Lewis, Tyson, Frazier, Wladimir, Vitali, Foreman, Shavers, Rocky, Dempsey, and others are ahead of Sam.

---

Agreed...Frazier and Marciano threw their whole bodies into their shots not just upper or even using their legs they used everything..Frazier had a mean leaping left hook...Marciano was an animal especially being such a small HW...Dempsey was just brutal no other way to describe it.....Tyson used his speed to go with the power adding so much more to the punches...(The ones you don't see hurt much more)...Shavers and Foreman were punching machines...Those guys rattled bones...you felt their shots from head to foot....Lennox had one of the hardest right hands ever P4P....Vitaly and Wlad land so cleanly their opp gets the full effect each time..never anything taken off...

Some of the hardest hwts punchers of all time

http://youtube.com/watch?v=ClaGs1_1RGA

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deanrw

A prime Riddick Bowe would blast out any heavyweight today within two rounds, including Peter.

Does that make him the biggest puncher ever? Nope. He was damn heavy handed though and could put his punches together.

---

He was his own worst enemy.One of the best inside fighting heavies in a while when he was in top form.When the crazy talk about refrigerators In the bedroom started it was clear what was ahead Lol.

I think too much emphasis is put on pure punching power these days.With out technique and full skill set it can be misleading.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Spicoli surfs 'Nawlins

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deanrw

A prime Riddick Bowe would blast out any heavyweight today within two rounds, including Peter.

Does that make him the biggest puncher ever? Nope. He was damn heavy handed though and could put his punches together.

---

He was his own worst enemy.One of the best inside fighting heavies in a while when he was in top form.When the crazy talk about refrigerators In the bedroom started it was clear what was ahead Lol.

I think too much emphasis is put on pure punching power these days.With out technique and full skill set it can be misleading.

---

I think Laziness combined with the Freakish Chinned, Iron Willed Holyfield took way too much out of him. He was never the same after the first Holyfield fight. he also kinda wrecked Holyfield.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deanrw

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Spicoli surfs 'Nawlins

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deanrw

A prime Riddick Bowe would blast out any heavyweight today within two rounds, including Peter.

Does that make him the biggest puncher ever? Nope. He was damn heavy handed though and could put his punches together.

---

He was his own worst enemy.One of the best inside fighting heavies in a while when he was in top form.When the crazy talk about refrigerators In the bedroom started it was clear what was ahead Lol.

I think too much emphasis is put on pure punching power these days.With out technique and full skill set it can be misleading.

---

I think Laziness combined with the Freakish Chinned Holyfield took way too much out of him. He was never the same after the first Holyfield fight.

---

Yep.At times You could see it in his body language.Just seemed Aloof and disinterested.He was always doing that Ali Impersonation and mugging in interviews.Nice enough guy with great skills who I don't think ever realized his full potential.

That 1st Holyfield war took some out of him Indeed.Holyfield made that one much tougher than he should have (Whats new?).After a nice first round working with the jab and boxing well,It all changed up in the 2nd when holyfield got pissed,Planted his feet and started swapping bombs.The best Bowe has ever looked I think.Sad now....Makes Mayweather sr. look like a great orator.Is he still planning on fighting?

Daxx, not only did those guys put their whole weight behind their punches, they threw technically correct punches and not wide looping hayemakers (for the most part)


As for Riddick Bowe, he came up as a sparring partner for Holyfield and I think that would take a lot out of him to begin with. If you look at his style and his training you can understand why his career was so short.

His style was that of a Holyfield-Lewis hybrid and sometimes he would give his height up and take un-needed punishment or exchange on the inside.

His training was like that of Ricky Hatton, get really fit and then blow up between fights.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Spicoli surfs 'Nawlins

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deanrw

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Spicoli surfs 'Nawlins

He was his own worst enemy.One of the best inside fighting heavies in a while when he was in top form.When the crazy talk about refrigerators In the bedroom started it was clear what was ahead Lol.

I think too much emphasis is put on pure punching power these days.With out technique and full skill set it can be misleading.

---

I think Laziness combined with the Freakish Chinned Holyfield took way too much out of him. He was never the same after the first Holyfield fight.

---

Yep.At times You could see it in his body language.Just seemed Aloof and disinterested.He was always doing that Ali Impersonation and mugging in interviews.Nice enough guy with great skills who I don't think ever realized his full potential.

That 1st Holyfield war took some out of him Indeed.Holyfield made that one much tougher than he should have (Whats new?).After a nice first round working with the jab and boxing well,It all changed up in the 2nd when holyfield got pissed,Planted his feet and started swapping bombs.The best Bowe has ever looked I think.Sad now....Makes Mayweather sr. look like a great orator.Is he still planning on fighting?

---

I certainly hope not. I heard he now has like a 75 IQ. The wars have certainly taken a toll on him. He never did see his full potential unfortunately. But you could see his greatness almost come out in certain fights. His prime was soooo short though. It is a shame really. He and Holyfield stole each others primes.

I've just discovered this thread and I'm afraid it's one of those threads If I read I will get upset

I gotta go with Marciano fighting around 185 lbs and able to knock guys out 20,30,or even 40 lbs heavier than him say what you will, but Marciano's record speaks for itself.I like the fact he did it at such a lower weight and was able to get those big guys out of their.As for Foreman,Liston,Peter.From I've seen and read it looks as if they outweight their oppenents also.Which in theory is easier to knock someone out.That's my story and I'm sticking with it.

I think that there are punchers, and there are punchers.

The blow that knocks you cold is the one you never see coming .... whereas people can stand up to much heavier punches if they see it and can subconsciously tense up ready for it etc.

Personally, I think that someone like Tyson or (to a slightly lesser extent) Dempsey, attacked so ferociously and threw bunches of combinations so that the final blow landed was either unseen by the other guy, or landed while he was on the way down. Frazier's wide left hook (which was a bit of a freakish punch as he could not straighten his left arm fully, after a childhood accident) was also like a bolt from the blue and took people out who had not even seen it coming. I guess that the reason that someone like Ingemar Johansson being such a destroyer - without being a devastating pure puncher - was he could hit you so fast you never even saw it.

Marciano was just a guy who would hit you anywhere he could, as hard as he could - knowing it would wear you down. The Rock, didn't knock people cold .... he budgeoned them to smithereens until they couldn't get up any more. Pure power.

I think that Sam Peter probably most closely resembles someone like Sonny Liston. A big solid guy, slightly ponderous, but each shot is thrown with lots of power. That's why Sonny could be outboxed and sometimes ran out of steam even early in his career ... and I think Peter will be the same. If you stand in front of either guy, you are probably going to get stiffed because they both have solid chins and are pretty tough cookies.

For me, the greatest heavyweight puncher of all was Joe Louis.

I didn't say he was the hardest, nor the fastest ..... but he is the hardest and the fastest (if you know what I mean). The guy absolutely controlled distance, and when he got close he was a wrecking machine ..... fast, hard, multiple combinations that you never saw coming. He had everything in terms of an offensive arsenal.

So, I don't think Peter punches harder than Marciano, Foreman or Liston (if you just measured the psi). I think that he might well punch harder than Dempsey or Tyson but they were faster and threw combinations better.

I'd have him on a par with Liston ..... BUT his career needs more time until he can get truly ranked and remembered. Don't forget that those other guys were undisputed all time greats and Peter most certainly is not yet.

I think Louis hit as hard as Peter, but was a more precise hitter, he also threw better combinations and was a better finisher once the other guy was hurt !!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hitmandonny

I've just discovered this thread and I'm afraid it's one of those threads If I read I will get upset

---

Why would you get upset? Everyone knows Sam Peter has power just some people like to exaggerate how good he is at using it....the greatest power punchers of all time found ways to land their punches, and Sam Peter just doesn't do that very well.

I can't see Sam Peter beating anyone the way Marciano beat Walcott, the way Foreman beat Frazier, the way Lewis beat Rahman, or the way Tyson beat Spinks.


I can see how you can compare Peter to Sonny Liston especially when you look at Liston-Patterson I & II .....the only thing is Liston had a great jab that set up his power punches and he was a mean S.O.B and that honestly means a lot.


I still don't see danger when I see Sam Peter fight....when you saw Tyson or Prime Foreman then you'd see a look that would put the fear of God into pretty much anyone....if I see Sam Peter I see someone who doesn't look mean, doesn't act mean, and doesn't really punch mean. Sure Lewis, Marciano, Wlad, and other top punchers don't have that scary side to them but Lewis and Wlad are Boxer/Punchers and Marciano was more of a pressure guy who would take your will away, he could blast you out but ususally he got guys tired from accumulation of punches and then landed one big one at the end. Foreman and Tyson would eat your heart and crap out your soul before the bell rang to start the fight and they punched to punish people for even thinking they were worthy enough to set foot in the same ring as them

And yes Joe Louis was a hell of a puncher, he knew his range better than any fighter I know of and he didn't miss much and even if he did he didn't leave himself off balance

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Lyle

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hitmandonny

I've just discovered this thread and I'm afraid it's one of those threads If I read I will get upset

---

Why would you get upset? Everyone knows Sam Peter has power just some people like to exaggerate how good he is at using it....the greatest power punchers of all time found ways to land their punches, and Sam Peter just doesn't do that very well.

I can't see Sam Peter beating anyone the way Marciano beat Walcott, the way Foreman beat Frazier, the way Lewis beat Rahman, or the way Tyson beat Spinks.


I can see how you can compare Peter to Sonny Liston especially when you look at Liston-Patterson I & II .....the only thing is Liston had a great jab that set up his power punches and he was a mean S.O.B and that honestly means a lot.


I still don't see danger when I see Sam Peter fight....when you saw Tyson or Prime Foreman then you'd see a look that would put the fear of God into pretty much anyone....if I see Sam Peter I see someone who doesn't look mean, doesn't act mean, and doesn't really punch mean. Sure Lewis, Marciano, Wlad, and other top punchers don't have that scary side to them but Lewis and Wlad are Boxer/Punchers and Marciano was more of a pressure guy who would take your will away, he could blast you out but ususally he got guys tired from accumulation of punches and then landed one big one at the end. Foreman and Tyson would eat your heart and crap out your soul before the bell rang to start the fight and they punched to punish people for even thinking they were worthy enough to set foot in the same ring as them

And yes Joe Louis was a hell of a puncher, he knew his range better than any fighter I know of and he didn't miss much and even if he did he didn't leave himself off balance

---

Lyle, I feel Peter is incomparable.



With Marciano, he went in to finish. If the guy was too tough to finish, we'd see Marciano jumping all over him looking for the stoppage for 15 rounds. He never ever backed down.

Liston went in to finish. He jabbed set up his big punches and threw with intent. Like marciano, he looked for the stoppage every round and he constantly chased opposition with numerous punches.

Louis. Well Louis was Louis. He got in there. Threw percise punches which were all aimed to neutralise the opponent. To beat him you had to nail him. Another man who did not surrender.

Dempsey was a wild man. A small heavy even in those days, he was a ferociously aggresive fighter, magnificently fit considering his era's lack of training and technique. A fighter who threw his soul into his fights.

Peter is a fighter who enters the ring to attempt to blast an opponent out. It doesn't always happen and we end up seeing a boring UD.
I don't want to disrespect Peter but it's the truth. His power carried him upward through the ranks, but dwindles at the top level. He cannot compensate with any speed, skill or athleticism. He will never be a great.


I know the thread was a question on power alone and I strayed from those issues, but if boxing was decided on power alone Earnie Shavers may have been the GOAT.

Peter hits like a girl compared to Foreman

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al

Peter hits like a girl compared to Foreman

---

This may sound like an exaggeration, but i think he's right;D

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BoomBoom

I dont think hes even top 50 hardest hitting heavyweights of all time. He has good power, but as ive said before his power is vastly overrated.

---

P4P i totally agree i can think of 50 Heavyweights who for certain hit harder than Peter P4P.

Rocky Marciano
Mike Tyson
Razor Ruddock
George Foreman
Gary Mason
Frank Bruno
Max Baer
Mac Foster
Earnie Shavers
Joe Louis
Vitali Klitschko
Wladimir Klitschko
Alex Stewart
Joe Frazier
Jack Dempsey
Max Baer
Tim Witherspoon
Larry Holmes
Evander Holyfield
Riddick Bowe
Cleveland Williams
Lee Savold
Elmer Ray
Ken Norton
David Tua
Ike Ibeabuchi
Buddy Baer
Sonny Liston
Ingemar Johansson
Gerry Cooney
Lennox Lewis
Max Schmeling
Bert Cooper
Ron Lyle
Oscar Bonavena
Muhammad Ali
James Boncrusher Smith
Tony Tucker
Tommy Morrison
Sam McVea
Corrie Sanders
Michael Moorer
Jersey Joe Walcott
Tom Sharkey
Greg Page
Herbie Hide
Tommy Burns
Jack Johnson
Ray Mercer
Jess Willard
Archie Moore

Theres 50 random names i just done quickly, i mean if you really thought about the list and added more of the old legends, you could make a case at least 70 Heavyweights are better punchers than Peter P4P.