Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
Pac is unquestionably the #1 pfp fighter in the world. He is now also the biggest draw in boxing. Mad respect to him. Having said that...some people are clearly getting carried away by already putting him in the top 5 all time, let alone top 10. He beat Barrera twice. He fought Marquez twice: first fight a draw, second fight a questionable win. He fought Morales 3 times: lost the first time, beat a shot Eric the second and third fights. He beat an average lightweight in Diaz. He beat a past it and weight drained Oscar (though he still deserves massive respect for beating a 147 pounder). And now he beat Hatton...which is a legitamately big win, especially the way he won. Now...that is not a bad resume at all. In fact...Manny is one of the few fighters who fights the best out there. STILL...no where near top 10 or top 5. IF...he beats Floyd...then we can have a serious discussion.
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
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Originally Posted by
CFH
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Originally Posted by
brucelee
Let's remember he was loosing to Agapito in their fight and and was down at least 3 points. It was a very dirty fight and Agapito was as dirty as they came if not for the point 2 deductions Pac would have lost this fight.
I beg to disagree on the losing part. Had the fight been continued, Sanchez would have been TKoed, IMO. Watch the last part when Pac was giving Sanchez all those powershots.
Regarding Marquez, I hate to say this but during Pac vs JMM 2, Marquez was saved by the bell during the 3rd round. Had the KO happened 2 minutes before the bell, he would have been a goner like Morales in the Pac vs Morales 3.
Honestly, I can sense that Pac would TKO Marquez next time they fight. Marquez has never downed Pac but Pac has downed marquez so many times already.
Hope Marquez wins over Floyd so we can see Pac vs JMM3. Regardless of the result of this dream fight, Pac is ATG top5 for me in terms of oppositions.
Just imagine, from 106 lbs to 147, still carrying with him his power and speed. Hatton lasted only 2 rounds, my theory about DLH is then confirmed.What Pac had done to DLH is something not everyone can do.Not even Mayweather.:cool:
Pac is a class of his own. An ATG top 5 (probably top 1, if he defeats PBF) in our lifetime and I'm proud to have witnessed his fights.:cool:
You're utterly delusional if you believe that. He's an ATG without a doubt, but there is no chance he's the best fighter ever if he beats Mayweather.
What, if he beat even Floyd Mayweather there's no chance he'd be the best ever? Even CutMeMick thinks he'd have a case.
Seriously how would Ray Robinson or Ali, Armstrong and Pep achieved more than a flyweight from Asia who rose from absolute poverty to conquer 7 weight classes beating a whose who of hall of fame fighters and then went up to welter weight and defeated the greatest fighter of his generation, the undefeated 6 weight world champ Floyd Mayweather?
That would be a rise of 10 (TEN) weight divisions from where he started.
Now I don't think Ali, Robinson, Armstrong, Pep, Leonard, Duran hell ANYONE could claim such a feat.
Ali proved himself to be the best heavyweight of his generation, but he had losses along the way, even in his prime.
Robinson seemed to be untouchable at welterweight but lost his title 5 times at middleweight so was clearly not unbeatable.
Armstrong held 3 world titles at 3 weight classes simultaneously, Pacman would have won 4 in succession (if we count Floyd as the true champ at welter which I think most would agree he is)
Now, I'm really not convinved that Pacquaio can beat Floyd Mayweather, but IF he did he would without a shadow of doubt jump to being in the top 3, eclipsing Armstrong and Pep and imo it would only be nostaliga stopping him from topping Ali.
He's gone through 10 weight classes Josh, 10 that is unbelievable.
Ray Robinson failed in his attempt to go from middlweight to light heavy, Manny has gone from minimum weight where started at 106 to if he beat Floyd, ruling the 147 lb 10 weight classes higher.
Nobody else would have achieved anything like that.
However, I don't think he will beat Floyd, but if he did it would be incredible.
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
Pac hasn't "conquered" all the divisions he's won fights in. That's going way over the top.
It's pointless comparing the amount of weightclasses that mordern fighters have covered compared with old fighters.
There were no intermediate weightclasses for the old boys.
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
there is one thing that pac has that the old timers doesn't have... 4 Fukking LINEAL WORLD TITLE.. Where will pac be in the all time list... he does not belong in the list coz no matter what he does he will not be given the right recognition that he deserve..
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
Quote:
Originally Posted by
antimoron
there is one thing that pac has that the old timers doesn't have... 4 Fukking LINEAL WORLD TITLE.. Where will pac be in the all time list... he does not belong in the list coz no matter what he does he will not be given the right recognition that he deserve..
What four lineal titles did he win?
Hatton 140
Barrera 126
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
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Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
antimoron
there is one thing that pac has that the old timers doesn't have... 4 Fukking LINEAL WORLD TITLE.. Where will pac be in the all time list... he does not belong in the list coz no matter what he does he will not be given the right recognition that he deserve..
What four lineal titles did he win?
Hatton 140
Barrera 126
see this is what im talking about.. you don't recognize his win over Marquez at 130 Lineal title and the first recognise lineal title he has at 112 against bad ass sasakul of thailand..
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
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Originally Posted by
antimoron
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Originally Posted by
Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by
antimoron
there is one thing that pac has that the old timers doesn't have... 4 Fukking LINEAL WORLD TITLE.. Where will pac be in the all time list... he does not belong in the list coz no matter what he does he will not be given the right recognition that he deserve..
What four lineal titles did he win?
Hatton 140
Barrera 126
see this is what im talking about.. you don't recognize his win over Marquez at 130 Lineal title and the first recognise lineal title he has at 112 against bad ass sasakul of thailand..
Hold up.. you're jumping to conclusions.
I can't remember why Marquez was the lineal 130 champ? And why was bad ass sasakul the 112 champ?
Hatton beat Kostya.
Barrera beat Naz.
People are throwing about 10 weight divisions and 7 championships, just want to see what's what, that's all. ;)
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
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Originally Posted by
Fenster
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Originally Posted by
antimoron
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Originally Posted by
Fenster
What four lineal titles did he win?
Hatton 140
Barrera 126
see this is what im talking about.. you don't recognize his win over Marquez at 130 Lineal title and the first recognise lineal title he has at 112 against bad ass sasakul of thailand..
Hold up.. you're jumping to conclusions.
I can't remember why Marquez was the lineal 130 champ? And why was bad ass sasakul the 112 champ?
Hatton beat Kostya.
Barrera beat Naz.
People are throwing about 10 weight divisions and 7 championships, just want to see what's what, that's all. ;)
Sasakul was no where near the Lineal champ. he wasn't even the best Flyweight of the div. Mar Too Sharp Johnson was the best.
I can only agree that he beat 2 lineal guys and JMM who was the best Super Feather. at that time.
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
Well lets not forget the age Pac was when he started i mean he was 16 thats the reason think he could start as low as he did at 106. But weight classes are different then they used to be there alot more of them now. I mean if you want to go off how much weight they moved up in there career then it would be Holyfeild for me he start at 175 and fought guys that were up to 246 and still managed to win the title off him as well. I mean that is a move up of about 69 pounds which i cant think of to many people to do that but i dont hear Evanders name anywear near Alis.
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
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Originally Posted by
KKisser
i think talk of atg regarding manny should only be after he's finished with his career.
there's still pbf and jmm looming.
Agree, let's see what the legacy is when he walks away. At the moment there are too many holes , we can say ODLH was washed up , Hatton was overated, JMM was too close to call.
One thing he does have in his favour, he doesn't duck anyone so has the chance to get some more big names to his credit.
At the moment , wouldn't be in my top 5.
Re: Where will you put Pac in the All-Time Greats?
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Originally Posted by
CutMeMick
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Originally Posted by
Fenster
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Originally Posted by
antimoron
see this is what im talking about.. you don't recognize his win over Marquez at 130 Lineal title and the first recognise lineal title he has at 112 against bad ass sasakul of thailand..
Hold up.. you're jumping to conclusions.
I can't remember why Marquez was the lineal 130 champ? And why was bad ass sasakul the 112 champ?
Hatton beat Kostya.
Barrera beat Naz.
People are throwing about 10 weight divisions and 7 championships, just want to see what's what, that's all. ;)
Sasakul was no where near the Lineal champ. he wasn't even the best Flyweight of the div. Mar Too Sharp Johnson was the best.
I can only agree that he beat 2 lineal guys and JMM who was the best Super Feather. at that time.
Johnson was on a frigging tear no doubt.....Aka Sasakul knew he was not facing the same Arbachakov that had already beat him prior.No timing,lay off and hand prob did him in.Caught Yuri at the right time.
