Most of great men of science were either Jews or believers by the wayQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuit
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Most of great men of science were either Jews or believers by the wayQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuit
Seems to be you are the one struggling w/basic English. Spicoli didn't say anything about a "god" defined over the past 2000 years. In fact I'd say his post suggested a lack of definition. I'd say the evidence that the Universe is expanding and therefore had a definitive starting point suggests a catalyst to the Universe that we currently and more than likely never will be able to comprehend. I don't really like using the term "god" to describe this ambiguous and infinite concept but I don't begrudge others that do.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
No, but for some eye candy I don't even care.Quote:
Originally Posted by SpicoliWait, is that a dudeQuote:
Originally Posted by SpicoliWow, Jesus fuckin Christ :o !Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorCharlie
Believing in God!!!!!!!! many funereal services say they are none religious, in the Crematorium
but they seem to have religious content, they have Hymns and prays, some people are just
hedging there bets.;)
That is simply not true. Science deals in empirical evidence. There is no room for belief for its own sake. That might be its problem. No room for the unknown. The arrogance of our species is not only obvious by our wanted destruction of this planet but it is also present in our own minds.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSeminMost of great men of science were either Jews or believers by the wayQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuit
The fact of the matter is, we dont know How can we? Big bang theories dont prove nothing else intelligent exists anymore then evolution does. That's the beauty and the mystery.
This is simply your Opinion. You just too scared to face the factsQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitThat is simply not true.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSeminMost of great men of science were either Jews or believers by the wayQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuit
What facts? The facts are that most scientists are atheists just like most Christians are dogmatic.You believe in a God that rewards and punishes the objects of his creation. A God then that is no better then us. I dont. That's a fact not an opinion. You believe what you want.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSeminThis is simply your Opinion. You just too scared to face the factsQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitThat is simply not true.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSeminMost of great men of science were either Jews or believers by the wayQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuit
[QUOTE=IamInuit;1201129]You may hate and try to punsih cancer, but it does not mean you hate and try to punish the person who has it.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSemin
Same for God, who hates sin, but loves sinners
[QUOTE=NVSemin;1201139]Then why create the sin for us to manage? Look your hell and damnation does not wash with me and I was raised Lutheran. In the end you are talking about a flawed God. An emotional one that makes decisions based on the same weaknesses that we do. A God in short that is no better then we are. Whats the point? Its like some cosmos reality tv show and much of the reason I became an existentialist. I may believe that there must be something else other then the fossil fuel I am destined to become at times but it certainly is not the vengeful God you born agains talk about. Now I have to remove myself from this thread because its starting to feel like a vacuum and nothing will be solved.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitYou may hate and try to punsih cancer, but it does not mean you hate the person who has it.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSemin
Same for God, who hates sin, but loves sinners
I believe in consequences of our own actions in this life and our past, not punishments,not one life,that is a joke.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitWhat facts? The facts are that most scientists are atheists just like most Christians are dogmatic.You believe in a God that rewards and punishes the objects of his creation. A God then that is no better then us. I dont. That's a fact not an opinion. You believe what you want.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSeminThis is simply your Opinion. You just too scared to face the factsQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitThat is simply not true.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSeminMost of great men of science were either Jews or believers by the wayQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuit
If we have one life and the modern Christian and Islamic God is a loving forgiving God then why are some people born disformed why are some born into rich families and others into pits and starve to death in their first few years? Is that because of the all loving and forgiving God who has total control over all things?
These modern religions have taught their people to say in reply to those who ask that exact question: "God moves in mysterious ways".
Bullshit, they are covering for what they deleted from their books so there is no longer an answer to that question for them.
Fear and love in their purest forms cannot exist together, one defeats the other, these are the main reasons why many people instinctively avoid these man made modern Christian and Islamic orders. They have shaped a form of mind control over the masses with lies and deceit with built in excuses for why things are the way they are. All of their followers are all taught what to think to support the religion, while the real truth is hidden away in their controllers vaults. They knew once but they went for control over the masses and hid the truth.
[QUOTE=IamInuit;1201140]Just remember my name, because when GOd will exalt me, your eyes may be opened, and we go back to discussion. My dream is to win Nobel Prize and be a boxing coach, raising Tyson 2.0 and Sugar Ray 1001. So keep eyes on that. God will make it happen. Then I will go back to thios thread and turn all sinners into believers.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSeminThen why create the sin for us to manage? Look your hell and damnation does not wash with me and I was raised Lutheran. In the end you are talking about a flawed God. An emotional one that makes decisions based on the same weaknesses that we do. A God in short that is no better then we are. Whats the point? Its like some cosmos reality tv show and much of the reason I became an existentialist. I may believe that there must be something else other then the fossil fuel I am destined to become at times but it certainly is not the vengeful God you born agains talk about. Now I have to remove myself from this thread because its starting to feel like a vacuum and nothing will be solved.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitYou may hate and try to punsih cancer, but it does not mean you hate the person who has it.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSemin
Same for God, who hates sin, but loves sinners
Nuff said!
[QUOTE=NVSemin;1201144]Why a boxing coach? Why seek world acclaim? Why not build a shelter and protect homeless children instead?Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitJust remember my name, because when GOd will exalt me, your eyes may be opened, and we go back to discussion. My dream is to win Nobel Prize and be a boxing coach, raising Tyson 2.0 and Sugar Ray 1001. God will make it happen. So, sit and waitQuote:
Originally Posted by NVSeminThen why create the sin for us to manage? Look your hell and damnation does not wash with me and I was raised Lutheran. In the end you are talking about a flawed God. An emotional one that makes decisions based on the same weaknesses that we do. A God in short that is no better then we are. Whats the point? Its like some cosmos reality tv show and much of the reason I became an existentialist. I may believe that there must be something else other then the fossil fuel I am destined to become at times but it certainly is not the vengeful God you born agains talk about. Now I have to remove myself from this thread because its starting to feel like a vacuum and nothing will be solved.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitYou may hate and try to punsih cancer, but it does not mean you hate the person who has it.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSemin
Same for God, who hates sin, but loves sinners
[QUOTE=NVSemin;1201144]Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitJust remember my name, because when GOd will exalt me, your eyes may be opened, and we go back to discussion. My dream is to win Nobel Prize and be a boxing coach, raising Tyson 2.0 and Sugar Ray 1001. So keep eyes on that. God will make it happen. Then I will go back to thios thread and turn all sinners into believers.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSeminThen why create the sin for us to manage? Look your hell and damnation does not wash with me and I was raised Lutheran. In the end you are talking about a flawed God. An emotional one that makes decisions based on the same weaknesses that we do. A God in short that is no better then we are. Whats the point? Its like some cosmos reality tv show and much of the reason I became an existentialist. I may believe that there must be something else other then the fossil fuel I am destined to become at times but it certainly is not the vengeful God you born agains talk about. Now I have to remove myself from this thread because its starting to feel like a vacuum and nothing will be solved.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitYou may hate and try to punsih cancer, but it does not mean you hate the person who has it.Quote:
Originally Posted by NVSemin
Same for God, who hates sin, but loves sinners
Nuff said!
OMG You are so thsuuuper :lickish:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdpK-vaCqwM
I understand why Some people don't believe. Faith is the assurance in things hoped for and the belief in things unseen. It goes against our nature at times. What I don't understand is why some have contempt for individuals who do believe. I love to discuss faith but when people want to argue I usually run.
We have some decent conversations about it all in here these days.Quote:
Originally Posted by walrus
I think generally the mistrust comes when they see a church has mass wealth, gold and marble on the alters and then they walk around the block and see kids begging in the streets is when the questions start.
Alot of these institutions have set their followers up so that they personally dont have to do anything but have faith and pay up a certain amount (preferably 10%) and then all is supposed to be well.
I was not going to return to this but at the first sign of dogma and thinking that soon it will be put forth that we had ridden on the back of dinosaurs and that the earth is only 7 thousand years old is when I run as a rule. I am fully aware that belief does not require anything but itself. You quoted Hebrews and I understand but that also is a clever way not to investigate or open ones mind to others.Quote:
Originally Posted by walrus
Most Christians do not believe the ten thousand year thing. What.you say proves you have done little investigation. What I quoted was Saint Paul talking about faith being difficult sometimes. I made sure I did not insult atheists as that would counter my post.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitI was not going to return to this but at the first sign of dogma and thinking that soon it will be put forth that we had ridden on the back of dinosaurs and that the earth is only 7 thousand years old is when I run as a rule. I am fully aware that belief does not require anything but itself. You quoted Hebrews and I understand but that also is a clever way not to investigate or open ones mind to others.Quote:
Originally Posted by walrus
fact is, anybody who says they KNOW God exists or that they KNOW their religion is correct is full of donkey, horse, mule, dog, rat, cat, and camel shit. YOur religion is NOT correct. Becuase if you'd been born in India you'd most liely be a Hindu; and if in Mexico a Christian. And if in the INdus Valley you'd be sitting here telling me that Zoroaster was the One True prophet. And if you'd been born in Japan you'd be mouthing off that Shinto was the rage. And if you'd been born in Macapa, Brazil you'd be telling me your animist religion was the One True religion. And if in Lhasa, Tibet you'd be championing Buddhism.
Therefore you are full of llama, ostrich, and dung-beetle shit to say that yours and yours alone is the correct and One True religion.
Now onto the the existence of God Itself---for I will not attribute testosterone nor estrogen to anything which hath supposedly creating the Universe(s).
Of course its hard to imagine a beginning because it implies that previous to that there was Nothing. Which contains nothing for anything to spring out of. But who am I to say that something cannot spring out of nothing? Makes little sense to human minds, but it could be just like that. Infinity makes little sense to us too.
So God could or could not exist. I dont know and we will never know atleast not
To be honest does anyone here really want to go to heaven ( if it exists ) ?
Think about it , if NVSEMIN is there does anyone want to listen to that cunt for eternity ?
I for one will pass the chance.
Six thousand children die daily from a lack of clean drinking water/sanitation. Billions of people, currently breathing, think they're "special" because they reached an age where they were able to query their existence.
100 years from now virtually nobody will even know us Saddo pals even existed.
((I'm available for birthdays, weddings and bar mitzvahs))
They may not remember us but they will all remember NVsemin.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Quote:
Originally Posted by walrus
As a Christian one will believe I am going to hell when I die, which is much worse than anything I could ever wish upon anyone. I think people are within their rights to be offended by that in the abstract, but as long as such an opinion isn't presented to me I would never judge anyone personally for having an imaginary friend.
I can't speak speak for all Christians but Catholics do not believe that people who don't believe are destined for he'll. The theology for people who did not believe during life but make it anyway is actually quite sound. So feel as you must but what you are saying does not hold true to the 1.3 billion Catholics in the world. It's fine you don't believe but perhaps you should clarify some of your misconceptions.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pkingQuote:
Originally Posted by walrus
As a Christian one will believe I am going to hell when I die, which is much worse than anything I could ever wish upon anyone. I think people are within their rights to be offended by that in the abstract, but as long as such an opinion isn't presented to me I would never judge anyone personally for having an imaginary friend.
Having misconceptions about any religion is almost a paradox to me, as I belive it to be nothing more than fiction in the first place. I do find it fascinating that people are so predisposed to believe in personal gods and I should absolutely learn more about the basis for all of them, but it's not at the top of my list if I'm honest. Imo it's exciting that religion has been all but dismissed amongst serious thinkers in the last few centuries, and any evidence against it will only grow exponentially. Suppose we find concrete proof of life on another planet in our time, what would that mean to you?Quote:
Originally Posted by walrusI can't speak speak for all Christians but Catholics do not believe that people who don't believe are destined for he'll. The theology for people who did not believe during life but make it anyway is actually quite sound. So feel as you must but what you are saying does not hold true to the 1.3 billion Catholics in the world. It's fine you don't believe but perhaps you should clarify some of your misconceptions.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pkingQuote:
Originally Posted by walrus
As a Christian one will believe I am going to hell when I die, which is much worse than anything I could ever wish upon anyone. I think people are within their rights to be offended by that in the abstract, but as long as such an opinion isn't presented to me I would never judge anyone personally for having an imaginary friend.
When you think about our Sun; It can fit our earth into it about a million times and our sun fits into the largest Sun in our Universe a billion times! Then there are more stars in our Universe than there are grains of sand in all the beaches of the world. Then we have 12 dimensions around us unseen. That sort of tells me we cant be the only ones in this.We are on the scale of things low lifes the way we treat each other and the planet. First time Ive used a lap top without mouse just then.:mad: I want my mouse back!Ah the trivialities.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pkingHaving misconceptions about any religion is almost a paradox to me, as I belive it to be nothing more than fiction in the first place. I do find it fascinating that people are so predisposed to believe in personal gods and I should absolutely learn more about the basis for all of them, but it's not at the top of my list if I'm honest. Imo it's exciting that religion has been all but dismissed amongst serious thinkers in the last few centuries, and any evidence against it will only grow exponentially. Suppose we find concrete proof of life on another planet in our time, what would that mean to you?Quote:
Originally Posted by walrusI can't speak speak for all Christians but Catholics do not believe that people who don't believe are destined for he'll. The theology for people who did not believe during life but make it anyway is actually quite sound. So feel as you must but what you are saying does not hold true to the 1.3 billion Catholics in the world. It's fine you don't believe but perhaps you should clarify some of your misconceptions.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pkingQuote:
Originally Posted by walrus
As a Christian one will believe I am going to hell when I die, which is much worse than anything I could ever wish upon anyone. I think people are within their rights to be offended by that in the abstract, but as long as such an opinion isn't presented to me I would never judge anyone personally for having an imaginary friend.
Quote:
“Barefoot conducts his seminars on his houseboat in Sausalito. It costs a hundred dollars to find out why we are on this Earth. You also get a sandwich, but I wasn't hungry that day. John Lennon had just been killed and I think I know why we are on this Earth; it's to find out that what you love the most will be taken away from you, probably due to an error in high places rather than by design.”
Quote:
“In the face of the obscene, explicit malice of the jungle, which lacks only dinosaurs as punctuation, I feel like a half-finished, poorly expressed sentence in a cheap novel.”
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“I spent the afternoon musing on Life. If you come to think of it, what a queer thing Life is! So unlike anything else, don't you know, if you see what I mean.”
Quote:
“A myth is a way of making sense in a senseless world. Myths are narrative patterns that give significance to our existence.”
Quote:
“It's not always easy to distinguish between existentialism and a bad mood.”
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“You say 'I' and you are proud of this word. But greater than this- although you will not believe in it - is your body and its great intelligence, which does not say 'I' but performs 'I'.”
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“One must not let oneself be misled: they say 'Judge not!' but they send to Hell everything that stands in their way.”
Now I'm not as dark and hard deterministic and these people but I'm at the door. I hold on tightly to the thoughts or belief that there must be something else. That random chance cant be the father of all of things. But the God of religion and especially Christianity has about the same odds as being the omnipotent one as random chance.Quote:
“Take it moment by moment, and you will find that we are all, as I’ve said before, bugs in amber.”
How much do you charge,!!! I hope your cheap.;DQuote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
But that has nothing to do with God. God is a word is it not and it is a word that has been defined by religious doctrine and so it is only right to use it in that context. If there is some other expansion of the word then you need to explain that otherwise it is just a random word. To be attacking my comprehension skills when it was IamInuit trying to attack mine when he was obviously wrong is just a weird bamboozle deflection.Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorCharlieSeems to be you are the one struggling w/basic English. Spicoli didn't say anything about a "god" defined over the past 2000 years. In fact I'd say his post suggested a lack of definition. I'd say the evidence that the Universe is expanding and therefore had a definitive starting point suggests a catalyst to the Universe that we currently and more than likely never will be able to comprehend. I don't really like using the term "god" to describe this ambiguous and infinite concept but I don't begrudge others that do.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
Now if Spicoli was talking about science then fair enough, but science has NOTHING to do with God or God's. Science has systematically destroyed concepts of God for centuries and religious people keep on moving the goalposts. 'Okay, maybe wrong here, but you still haven't answered that. That could be God'. So, here we are at 0.000032% of a chance and still there is clinging. But let's just call it science and forget with the God nonsense. To use the word God means that they were semi right, when that is blatantly untrue. They have always made it up and changed the goalposts.
All I ask is what is the problem with just being happy with what you have and to use it well and that just be it for you. It's a selfish, selfish thing to cling on to the belief that there is more and that I must be part of it. Maybe there are more dimensions, maybe much more to know, but you as a conscious person are likely nothing to do with it. We are born into lives and live them through and that is what we do here. Nobody comes back from the dead and says 'Hi, It's lovely here in the 8th dimension, avoid the 10th one'. No evidence at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
Pot, Kettle, BlackQuote:
To be attacking my comprehension skills when it was IamInuit trying to attack mine when he was obviously wrong is just a weird bamboozle deflection.
As an agnostic I use the word "God" when referring to an unknown/undefined higher being b/c it is easier when speaking w/theists and atheists b/c that is the word they use/understand. I'm not sure what you are saying has nothing to do w/god? If you are referring to the expansion of the universe, I'd argue that the universe having a distinct starting point challenges a purely secular viewpoint.Quote:
But that has nothing to do with God. God is a word is it not and it is a word that has been defined by religious doctrine and so it is only right to use it in that context.
No, I call bullshit on that. That's a cop out. Mine was an obvious criticism whilst you had no clearly defined parameters to argue with.Quote:
Originally Posted by VictorCharlieQuote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
Pot, Kettle, BlackQuote:
To be attacking my comprehension skills when it was IamInuit trying to attack mine when he was obviously wrong is just a weird bamboozle deflection.
As an agnostic I use the word "God" when referring to an unknown/undefined higher being b/c it is easier when speaking w/theists and atheists b/c that is the word they use/understand. I'm not sure what you are saying has nothing to do w/god? If you are referring to the expansion of the universe, I'd argue that the universe having a distinct starting point challenges a purely secular viewpoint.Quote:
But that has nothing to do with God. God is a word is it not and it is a word that has been defined by religious doctrine and so it is only right to use it in that context.
In your second argument you are just arguing semantics. I disagree with the origins of the universe having anything to do with God, it is a scientific thing that will be explained.
Science has always explained, religion has always ceded ground. Logic would assume the former makes a lot more sense.
Oh well you called BS so I guess that ends it. ;D
Considering we agree that the universe has a distinct starting point and that it would have required something incomprehensible to the human brain to create this sudden and massive expansion, I find this to lead to natural agnostic belief. I think that is where the use of the word shallow and arrogant is applied to atheists. I find the way organized religion attempts to define infinite concepts equally absurd but considering what we know/don't know about the origins of the universe I don't understand some sort of hardline stance that we as finite beings can understand/define all things. Some things are simply beyond our comprehension. All that aside, I completely understand and agree w/your rejection of religion.
You know, maybe it does have a starting point, and maybe it doesn't.
All I know is that I look at the sun and sometimes wonder why it doesn't shatter this world to bits right now. Then I realise it is because we seem to understand a bit about it. That is science. It's all we know, so we should believe in what we know rather than what doesn't.
I don't think any of that matters though. I think maybe I have a few decades left and then I am dead and you cannot rely on anything after that. In that sense, it doesn't matter about any of this religious nonsense.
As long as you die with only a few people calling you a bigot to the grave then that is a job well done. You've pissed me off with this bigot language. :rolleyes:
Miles, if I were to start post full of misconceptions and inaccuracies about say the NHS in the UK or its firearm policy followed by a litany of insults about the people of Britain and how their policies are utter nonsense, the UK crowd would rightfully chastise me for trying to preach my American beliefs to them particularly considering outside of flying through Shannon I've never spent any time in the UK. This is pretty much what you have always done. I don't call you a bigot b/c of your beliefs about US foreign policy b/c that actually has some impact on you but the way you criticize American domestic policy despite not really understanding it is absurd. I wouldn't expect a pass on telling people in another country how I know better than them about their nation, how it should work and how horrible it is and you shouldn't either. Be pissed if you want but it seems what you really don't like is having a mirror put in front of you.
I think the starting point is way back beyond 'the splitting point of one into many' which is where we can see back to while in this dimension looking out of material eyes at material.We can be blinded by the light but only when we look one way.
I am writting to reply to a question p4p asked me. He asked how my religion would change if life were found on another planet. I can tell you it wouldn't change at all. Saying we are the only life in the universe would be putting a max on the big guys creation abilities so it would not alter anything. Sorry to reply so late, I just saw your question.
The Jehovah witnesses keep coming to my door, on average twice a month they must think
I need saving, fuck them I don't answer the door.
They are like fly's round shit, funny when I had Pit bulls I never had many visitors.;D
You did the right thing, they are fakeQuote:
Originally Posted by Dia bando
When I feed a Jehovah witness to my Pit Bulls, the next day I had to feed them a Mormon to
get the taste out of there mouths.:lolhaha:
I just had some Jehovas come to the door yesterday disrupting me as I was painting. The pamphlets they hand out are too damn cheap. They need to gloss those babies up. It was a cute African American girl. I could tell she wanted me. I can't blame her.
;DQuote:
Originally Posted by walrus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pZinXoUyeQ