Re: Prime ODLH beats Manny and floyd
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Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
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Originally Posted by
BlackRazor
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Originally Posted by
THE THIRD MAN
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Oscar has never beaten an A+ slick fighter in their prime. Floyd would beat him. Hell if people want to say ODLH beat Sweet Pea, then I'll argue that he lost to Quartey.
You could argue he beat Trinidad and Mosley in fight 2?
Right, Oscar won some fights he probably didn't deserve to win as some have pointed out but he also "lost" these 2 where he probably didn't to deserve to as well.
He also took out (impressively!) a maybe not prime Vargas but still a tough guy where early on it looked like Vargas was too big & strong(he was probably on roids that night). That was a pretty big fight too as I recall in the months leading up to it.
Yeah he did, but Vargas was ruined by Tito, and possibly brought on too fast and early in his career. Even Still Oscar would have beaten him no matter when they fought.
lets not forget that Vargas was also roided up against DLH
but i disagree, IMO if they would have taken their time with Vargas he would have beaten both Trinidad and DLH, and possibly would have gone down as one of the best fighters at 154, just goes to show that you can't be great on talent alone, and that it only takes one fight to ruin a guy
Re: Prime ODLH beats Manny and floyd
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BlackRazor
Quote:
Originally Posted by
THE THIRD MAN
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Oscar has never beaten an A+ slick fighter in their prime. Floyd would beat him. Hell if people want to say ODLH beat Sweet Pea, then I'll argue that he lost to Quartey.
You could argue he beat Trinidad and Mosley in fight 2?
Right, Oscar won some fights he probably didn't deserve to win as some have pointed out but he also "lost" these 2 where he probably didn't to deserve to as well.
He also took out (impressively!) a maybe not prime Vargas but still a tough guy where early on it looked like Vargas was too big & strong(he was probably on roids that night). That was a pretty big fight too as I recall in the months leading up to it.
Yeah he did, but Vargas was ruined by Tito, and possibly brought on too fast and early in his career. Even Still Oscar would have beaten him no matter when they fought.
lets not forget that Vargas was also roided up against DLH
but i disagree, IMO if they would have taken their time with Vargas he would have beaten both Trinidad and DLH, and possibly would have gone down as one of the best fighters at 154, just goes to show that you can't be great on talent alone, and that it only takes one fight to ruin a guy
If you mean, taken their time before putting him the ring with the big guns? Then yeah he would have been better against them because they would have been old and declining. Tito I think beats him anyway because of that power. And Oscar would outbox him, and because of that power.;D
Re: Prime ODLH beats Manny and floyd
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BlackRazor
Quote:
Originally Posted by
THE THIRD MAN
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Oscar has never beaten an A+ slick fighter in their prime. Floyd would beat him. Hell if people want to say ODLH beat Sweet Pea, then I'll argue that he lost to Quartey.
You could argue he beat Trinidad and Mosley in fight 2?
Right, Oscar won some fights he probably didn't deserve to win as some have pointed out but he also "lost" these 2 where he probably didn't to deserve to as well.
He also took out (impressively!) a maybe not prime Vargas but still a tough guy where early on it looked like Vargas was too big & strong(he was probably on roids that night). That was a pretty big fight too as I recall in the months leading up to it.
Yeah he did, but Vargas was ruined by Tito, and possibly brought on too fast and early in his career. Even Still Oscar would have beaten him no matter when they fought.
lets not forget that Vargas was also roided up against DLH
but i disagree, IMO if they would have taken their time with Vargas he would have beaten both Trinidad and DLH, and possibly would have gone down as one of the best fighters at 154, just goes to show that you can't be great on talent alone, and that it only takes one fight to ruin a guy
If you mean, taken their time before putting him the ring with the big guns? Then yeah he would have been better against them because they would have been old and declining. Tito I think beats him anyway because of that power. And Oscar would outbox him, and because of that power.;D
but if you really break down both fights Vargas just wasn't ready to deal with either guy, against Trinidad he was like what? 22-0? the fact that he had already beat Campas, Quartey, and Wright (even if controversially) is even more impressive, Vargas wasn't mentally ready for either fight, physically he was mature but not mentally, not by a long shot, the way he'd pout his lips prior the Trinidad fight shows this
Re: Prime ODLH beats Manny and floyd
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ElTerribleMorales
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Quote:
Originally Posted by
BlackRazor
Quote:
Originally Posted by
THE THIRD MAN
Quote:
Originally Posted by
JonesJrMayweather
Oscar has never beaten an A+ slick fighter in their prime. Floyd would beat him. Hell if people want to say ODLH beat Sweet Pea, then I'll argue that he lost to Quartey.
You could argue he beat Trinidad and Mosley in fight 2?
Right, Oscar won some fights he probably didn't deserve to win as some have pointed out but he also "lost" these 2 where he probably didn't to deserve to as well.
He also took out (impressively!) a maybe not prime Vargas but still a tough guy where early on it looked like Vargas was too big & strong(he was probably on roids that night). That was a pretty big fight too as I recall in the months leading up to it.
Yeah he did, but Vargas was ruined by Tito, and possibly brought on too fast and early in his career. Even Still Oscar would have beaten him no matter when they fought.
lets not forget that Vargas was also roided up against DLH
but i disagree, IMO if they would have taken their time with Vargas he would have beaten both Trinidad and DLH, and possibly would have gone down as one of the best fighters at 154, just goes to show that you can't be great on talent alone, and that it only takes one fight to ruin a guy
If you mean, taken their time before putting him the ring with the big guns? Then yeah he would have been better against them because they would have been old and declining. Tito I think beats him anyway because of that power. And Oscar would outbox him, and because of that power.;D
but if you really break down both fights Vargas just wasn't ready to deal with either guy, against Trinidad he was like what? 22-0? the fact that he had already beat Campas, Quartey, and Wright (even if controversially) is even more impressive, Vargas wasn't mentally ready for either fight, physically he was mature but not mentally, not by a long shot, the way he'd pout his lips prior the Trinidad fight shows this
I agree 100%. They brought him along too fast. The only way he beats them is if he'd been given a few more fights, but then they would have been older. So that also would have helped.
Re: Prime ODLH beats Manny and floyd
I think the "pre-Tito" Vargas would've had an excellent chance to beat DLH. Remember... this was a Vargas that after the Tito fight was put on his ass by the light-punching Wilfredo Rivera. Wilfredo would've KO'ed him, too.... if he had pressed his advantage when he had Vargas down.
Yes, Vargas was DEF damaged by Tito, and DLH benefited from it.
Re: Prime ODLH beats Manny and floyd
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Originally Posted by
Boxer4life
any arguments? i think he would kick their ass, this coming from a huge floyd maywaether fan and manny fan
Oscar didn't beat legit ATG's, he was notch below them, and these are two very highly ranked all-time greats. Oscar was a great fighter, but not quite on their level.
A younger Oscar was faster than the one that fought Floyd, but not as big and strong. Also when he was younger he tried to box with guys more, and the more he would try and straight up box with Mayweather the worse he would lose. The reason why he did as well as he did was experience and wisdom. He did his best to corner and contain Mayweather. A younger Oscar would have tried to play the speed game with Floyd, and also try to knock him out which would have resulted in Oscar getting outboxed, and tiring earlier in the fight.
As for Manny, there is now no evidence for me to believe that Oscar could hurt Manny with any one big punch. Sure it could happen, but once again I see Manny being to fluid offensively and too fast for Oscar. Oscar would obviously be more competitive than the weight drained version we saw face Manny, but besides his jab and occasional left hook I don't see him having enough weapons to outdo Manny's arsenal for 12 rounds.
