Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
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Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
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Originally Posted by
jehoshaphat
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Originally Posted by
IamInuit
Make a rule and not an offer. Real simple. Its not rocket science.
Or if Rodriguez's team only brings up additional PED testing AFTER the fight is signed then they should have to pay for the cost. They had 2 negotiations to bring up additional PED testing. They did not. Why would Rodriguez wait to get in front of the media to bring up PED testing? It seems to be an attempted smear campaign...and by the looks of it many are buying it.
Rodriguez is trying to smear Ward, and shame on them for it. HOWEVER, there is a really easy way to quiet any bad talk: take the test.
And I agree that will clear the smear but its not as easy as just saying "take the tests." Rodriguez can't just wait to call out Ward in the press conference, pick the agency, and make Ward pay for the additional testing. They have negotiations for a reason. Who pays for it? Which agency or agencies do they agree on? What are the stipulations of the test as to when it starts and how close to the fight can you be blood tested? In this particular fight and situation Ward is not wrong if there is no agreement on testing. They had 2 negotiations that are now over, additional PED testing wasn't even brought up by team Rodriquez, and they have less than a month until the fight.
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
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Originally Posted by
IamInuit
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Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
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Originally Posted by
IamInuit
I dont blame Ward. The media establishment is starting to get a little stupid now. They dont even talk about the topic for 30 years and now since Manny/Floyd, any athlete for any fight that does not agree to additional testing is guilty. What made the Floyd/Manny circus news worthy in that regard was the fact that it could have been a 100 million dollar fight after all was said and done. Wards making a statement whether he knows it or not. The boxing establishment does not really want to catch the cheaters. If it did a newer designed testing regiment would have been implemented from the ground up long ago.It would be enforced by commissions and the boxing orgs. Fact of the matter is, they dont want testing programs that might actually catch people. This window dressing they use in an attempt to show steps are being made does not fool me.
I disagree 100%. Take the damn test. Since the Pacquiao/Mayweather situation, if you are a fighter getting paid HBO money to fight, there are no excuses for not taking the test. In a perfect world, the commissions and the boxing organizations would make strict drug testing mandatory for all boxers, but we're not in a perfect world. If you are clean, prove it, be the example for clean competition, not the other way around. So far, Donaire is the only competitor I'm aware of that is on 24/7/365 testing. He shouldn't be the only one. Marquez should have taken the tests. Ward should take the tests. That's it.
Disagreement is allowed. Look if boxers are now to be expected to extra testing then make it a damn law or rule or whatever and the Organizations, Commissions and broadcasters who pimp them can pay for the tests. Either everyone does it or forget it. You don't start singling out certain fighters or fights, you do a full court press. They have random drug tests in many workplaces. You mean to tell me these people cant figure out a way to fund a program? Of course they could but they don't want to. They would lose to many highlight reels and probably half of the stars. I don't like Ward but I doubt he cheats. He seems like one of these straighter then straight guys that was raised by Ozzie and Harriet.
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Originally Posted by
ruthless rocco
i'm certain andre ward has done a lot of different steroids and drugs while recovering and rehabilitating after his injuries and surgery... maybe he's scared to stop using or maybe he knows he didn't stop in time for them to have cleared out of his system.
@
ruthless rocco , wasn't that Braun's excuse? Someone should ask Ward what drugs he took during his recovery from injury.
A little hasty fellas. He might be using for injury rehab and he could also test in the allowable levels for that. That is why Lamont got his belt back. Him refusing testing does not mean therefore that he would test over those limits. This thread is a giant rush to judgement. Seems a slippery slope to me without a demand via rule changes.
I bet Provo and Alvarado did not use VADA so by the standards on display here they must both be cheats.
did both Provodnikov and Alvarado say they were going to voluntarily have themselves tested on camera? were they both being given nutritional aids by a known and confessed drug cheat? if no, then you've missed the point.
Ward said he would submit himself to testing and hasn't... and he has had association with Conte. that's the difference
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
Boxers have been on roids for god damn 30 years i think in the top level does it really matter. I mean if we just make them Legal we can bypass all this we want boxing clean but really we just want to look good and do nothing. I think just make it legal because i think everyone on them anyhow who cares.
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
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Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
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Originally Posted by
Spicoli
If its the most full proof and thorough system it should simply be mandatory regardless of class or economic status. Frankly it not Wards responsibility to set an example and be a role model. Boxing needs to clean its own house at the foundation before it counts on the renters to do it for them. Just cause he's well payed doesn't make him any more suspect than a highly touted kid just starting out on FoxDeportes with investors.
On a side note Rodriquez can shate dynamite and have horse shoes in his gloves, he's still not beating Ward.
It does make him more suspect because, unlike the kid on Fox Deportes, he has the financial means to do the tests, whereas the kid on Fox Deportes doesn't. More importantly, he was asked to take the test, and refused. If the kid on Fox Deportes refused, I'd be suspicious too. I'm more suspicious with Ward because he can afford to it.
It's not Ward's responsibility to do it,
but that doesn't mean he shouldn't. It just means he doesn't have to. The distinction is significant.
I get the gist of that, totally, I just don't think he's obligated to do anything simply because he seemingly is able to spend the money. I think it's more about the powers that be trying to put on a show and act like they are doing everything conceivable to clean it up. Basically everyone is a suspect now but I think holding a man in judgement on what he should do rather than meeting the set requirement put forth for everyone else is something out of a fantasy novel.
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
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Originally Posted by
jehoshaphat
clear the smear "
Is that anything like what Salido did, smear the queer? ;D
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jehoshaphat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Rantcatrat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
jehoshaphat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
IamInuit
Make a rule and not an offer. Real simple. Its not rocket science.
Or if Rodriguez's team only brings up additional PED testing AFTER the fight is signed then they should have to pay for the cost. They had 2 negotiations to bring up additional PED testing. They did not. Why would Rodriguez wait to get in front of the media to bring up PED testing? It seems to be an attempted smear campaign...and by the looks of it many are buying it.
Rodriguez is trying to smear Ward, and shame on them for it. HOWEVER, there is a really easy way to quiet any bad talk: take the test.
And I agree that will clear the smear but its not as easy as just saying "take the tests." Rodriguez can't just wait to call out Ward in the press conference, pick the agency, and make Ward pay for the additional testing. They have negotiations for a reason. Who pays for it? Which agency or agencies do they agree on? What are the stipulations of the test as to when it starts and how close to the fight can you be blood tested? In this particular fight and situation Ward is not wrong if there is no agreement on testing. They had 2 negotiations that are now over, additional PED testing wasn't even brought up by team Rodriquez, and they have less than a month until the fight.
Ward should take the test on his own volition.
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
This shit is so situational. A working end justifies the means thing. Institute random tests for at least to start tile fights or stfu. If this crap could be put into math it might solve the perpetual motion equation.
This picking and choosing horse shit while agreeing that everyone is guilty. It gets a little thick.
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
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Originally Posted by
erics44
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Originally Posted by
DavilaJones
Well...I can't really say Ward juices since he doesn't KO anyone really but outboxes them. I'm just rather surprised is all.
Are the only people that juice those that knock people out?
No you're right however, I don't think from a risk reward point of view it would suit him to take it, he's night lightning fast, has unending stamina or punches like a truck. Of all people to Juice I'd say GGG is more likely and I'm almost positive he's clean as well...but I can be dead wrong so who knows?
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
Quote:
Originally Posted by
IamInuit
This shit is so situational. A working end justifies the means thing. Institute random tests for at least to start tile fights or stfu. If this crap could be put into math it might solve the perpetual motion equation.
This picking and choosing horse shit while agreeing that everyone is guilty. It gets a little thick.
Thats what tweeks me, its not a fighters responsibility to disprove or one up the excepted requirements based on his status or standing. Set the parameters and enforce them or no one needs to be jumping through the hoops for the gallery. Assbackwards!
Is he refusing to be tested by the law as it stands???
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
I think it's absurd to expect any fighter to submit to testing that they aren't required to, or hold them as being more suspect for not doing so. Who on earth wants to be comprehensively drug tested under any circumstance? If it's optional, people are not going to do it and nor should they, the only way to resolve this is have it standardized and that's a long way from happening.
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
it may be absurd to expect someone to test themselves beyond the limit of the rules as the currently stand... but Ward said he would do the testing and since saying that, hasn't. there's the problem...and its only amplified when you take into consideration his relationship with Victor Conte who is an admitted steroid supplier/nutritionist.
Re: Andre Ward has refused to participate in the VADA testing
Peope keep mentioning his connection to Conte without noting the elephant in the room. Conte made designer steroids that couldn't be caught until someone sent a sample to the testing agencies to study. So he very well could have made another steroid that can't be detected. So given his association with Conte testing means fuck all to prove innocence. Testing can only prove guilt.
As for Donaire, sure he tests year round but he had the same Conte association sohe can never be innocent in my eyes. Testing or not. He might and probably is innocent but again testing means fuck all.
And FTR many people test year round now. Bradley does, all of Mayweather Promotions does ever since Love got popped for a diarrhetic.
Should Ward test, yes. But all of boxing should test. But it has to be independent because it is not in the organizations best interests to catch fighters. That's why they test after fights, they want the fights to happen. You aren't protecting anyone catching cheats after the fact.
I hope Ward makes a show of this, refusing testing and letting everyone know he's about to make a point. Then after the weigh in he tells the media he's juiced to the gills and going to kill his opponent. At that moment you create a huge story that could force real change. Then he tests clean after the fight and says I was just making a point. The BS of the system would be caught and it would be front page news.
Imagine the commissioners explaining that there was nothing they could do under the rules until after the fight. All hell would break loose on such a preposterous failed and faulty system that is clearly designed to fail. The squirming of the commissioners in front of Congress would be glorious.
Or maybe I'm drunk and need to go to bed.
