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[quote=Kirkland Laing;688046][quote=Lyle;687884]GALLUP can't you read?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
We pay into something and the early investors get paid off and I'm going to get stuck with el zilcho....it's the fucking definition of a Ponzi scheme.
Video - CNBC.com
[quote=Lyle;688066][quote=Kirkland Laing;688046]If you're not going to provide a source then there's no reason to believe those numbers are correct. Here's even Fox news :Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Just over half of Americans — 51 percent — support the economic stimulus and spending plan passed by Congress last week and 40 percent oppose it.
Moreover, 58 percent think legislation was necessary — that's 24 percentage points higher than the 34 percent who think the economy would have improved on its own without government intervention.
FOXNews.com - FOX News Poll: Slim Majority Supports Stimulus - Polls | AP Polls | Gallup Poll | Opinion Polls
Even Fox polls find majority support.
And SS is nor a Ponzi scheme. Like most insurance plans there is no direct connection between the dollar paid in and the benefit paid out, instead what you are buying is coverage, once your actual premium dollar is collected it belongs to the company, or in this case government. While the US government is currently drowning in debt SS is two trillion in credit and won't need any aditional funds until at least 2050 according to the CBO (and almost certainly not even then.)
And a video of a bunch of third-rate traders in a third rate exchange who would all be out of work if the government hadn't bailed their bankrupt firms out complaining about homeowners getting their mortgages renegotiated and the moral hazard of bailing undeserving people out is hilarious.
The stimulus is entirely necessary. Nobody else is spending and if the government doesn't the economy will go into a deflationary death spiral.
[quote=Lyle;688066][quote=Kirkland Laing;688046]How about we make a wager then, lets say 3rd quarter statistics show an improvemement of at least 1% in GDP and unemployment declines by at least 2%...........................Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Well Kirkland, I don't know what to tell you....go argue with Gallup not with me.
killersheep, I can't take that bet unless you know that the majority of that stimulus money won't be paid out until 2010.
[quote=killersheep;688082][quote=Lyle;688066]I wouldn't go making bets like that. All the stimulus will do id slow the rate of economic contraction/unemployment down a little. It'll be a success if the country doesn't tip into significant deflation, that's the measuring stick. In a couple of years if it's successful (no sure thing) conservatives will be telling us what a failure it was, unemployment kept rising/GDP kept falling etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
The economy is projected to contract about a trillion a year this year, next year and year after that. An $800 trillion stimulus even if it's respent 1.5 times as is hoped isn't going to plug half that hole, and then there are other factors which will also fuck up gdp/employment too to factor in. Plus about 40% of the stimulus is tax cuts which is wasted money. maybe only 25% of them will be spent, the rest saved.
Why are you so scared to tell us where you got those numbers from? Is it rushlimbaugh.com?Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
I am aware of this and I am still willing to wager on this, despite what Kirkland says this is my belief, nothing crazy how about a sigi bet If I win you puts "Obama was right" and if you win I will put "Obama was wrong."Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
Data for GDP will be pulled from
BEA National Economic Accounts
Most recent data is 4th quarter of 2008
GDP in Billions of current dollars is 14,264.6, the bet is that statistic will be 14,407.25 in the 3rd quarter of 2009
Data for unemployment will be pulled from
Employment Situation Summary
Most recent data from January 2009 and stands at 7.6%,
the bet is that statistic will be 5.6% by the end of September of 2009
Americans Support Stimulus, but Many Want Major ChangesQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
GALLUP MOTHER FUCKER
And yes I know it says the majority favor "A" stimulus bill but my focus is that the majority don't favor "OBAMA'S" stimulus plan
Sure killer, I'll take that bet
2 weeks on the sigi sound fair?Quote:
Originally Posted by LyleAmericans Support Stimulus, but Many Want Major ChangesQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
GALLUP MOTHER FUCKER
And yes I know it says the majority favor "A" stimulus bill but my focus is that the majority don't favor "OBAMA'S" stimulus plan
Sure killer, I'll take that bet
Ah, so that was before people knew the details of the final plan. Now that it's passed and they do a majority support it, even according to Fox news.Quote:
Originally Posted by LyleAmericans Support Stimulus, but Many Want Major ChangesQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
GALLUP MOTHER FUCKER
And yes I know it says the majority favor "A" stimulus bill but my focus is that the majority don't favor "OBAMA'S" stimulus plan
Sure killer, I'll take that bet
Quote:
Originally Posted by killersheep2 weeks on the sigi sound fair?Quote:
Originally Posted by LyleAmericans Support Stimulus, but Many Want Major ChangesQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
GALLUP MOTHER FUCKER
And yes I know it says the majority favor "A" stimulus bill but my focus is that the majority don't favor "OBAMA'S" stimulus plan
Sure killer, I'll take that bet
http://www.federalreserve.gov/releas...rrent/ipg1.gif
Look at the overcapacity, look at the underutilisation of existing capital stock. The graph looks the same for private investment, employment, you name it. Every number you need to come up in a few months to win your bet is falling off a cliff in the midst of the worst economic conditions for a hundred years. For god's sake don't take the bet, if Lyle is finally right about something we'll never hear the end of it.
HAHAHAHA....you think anyone knows what the hell is in that bill and given that you figure they still support it ....you are absolutely ridiculousQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
So if nobody knows what's in the bill you can't say either way whether people support it or not. But people now have a good idea of the makeup of the bill* and a majority support it.Quote:
Originally Posted by LyleHAHAHAHA....you think anyone knows what the hell is in that bill and given that you figure they still support it ....you are absolutely ridiculousQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
And I urge you not to take the bet with Killersheep. You're being given the opportunity of finally being right about something and it shouldn't happen. Even the most optimistic Obama plan supporters don't believe Obama will be anywhere near as effective as Killersheep does. You're being allowed to be right at long last about something by default, through no effort of your own, and it isn't right. You continue to make incorrect arguments and claims day after day and the fact that you're consistently wrong about everything you argue and claim doesn't seem to stop this or even make you think about or rethink your beliefs. Finally being right about something will only embolden you. God knows where this could end.
*Because they read the papers, something you should consider trying. You'll find that you're able to argue your points much more effectively if they're backed up by facts and evidence. Of course if you ever do start using facts and evidence in your arguments you'll end up agreeing with me and not disagreeing on the occasions when you start using them.
The Infallible One strikes again!Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Talking Points Memo | Grandstanding Jindal
Jindal rejects $98 million in stimulus spending - Breaking News from New Orleans - Times-Picayune - NOLA.com
I cant help but laugh,Bobby's real name is Piyush,and people ripped on Obama for calling himself Barry when he was youngerQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingThe Infallible One strikes again!Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Talking Points Memo | Grandstanding Jindal
Jindal rejects $98 million in stimulus spending - Breaking News from New Orleans - Times-Picayune - NOLA.com
Jindal rejected that money because of the fact they wanted to make the changes to the unemployment benefits permenant which would cause states to have to raise taxes to pay for the cost when the federal money stopped coming.....pretty wise choice in my view
But oddly he took more then he rejectedQuote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
El Grando Stando
Again, you could try reading the paper before you go and get it wrong again :Quote:
Originally Posted by Lyle
A senior aide to Landrieu agreed that the state would have to change the law to take advantage of the windfall but said the change would not have to be permanent. Instead, the Legislature could write the new law with a "sunset provision" so it expires when the federal stimulus dollars run out.
Jindal rejects $98 million in stimulus spending - Breaking News from New Orleans - Times-Picayune - NOLA.com
It's just grandstanding.
LOL at the Republicans rising stars, now you've got two clowns, as if Palin wasn't enough you've got Jindal now who's a bit peadophilish. Just a bit.
What an idiot though, fucking hell. His rationale that Katrina showed that big government was wrong was stupid even for a Republican. And then you've got the creepy factor, what a candidate.
I am greatly enjoying watching the Republicans knock on the door of the dustbin of history. Implode fuckers.
Have fun taking your victory lap now fellas....when things start falling apart on your side it's going to hurt. I doubt the democrats will control Congress for much longer. They have already reclaimed the moniker "spendacrats"....it's only a matter of time before the people turn on them again
Yep because the people are dying for small government and tax cuts for the rich.
Of course anyone with half a brain could see that Republicans are not so much about spending less, just about tax cuts for the rich.
We just have to continue boxing them off, keep them in the south, let the nutjobs, survivalists, racists and Rush Limbaugh (not that I seperate him from the first and third group) vote for true conservatives and we will box the Republicans into the South just like the Democrats were in the years before the Civil War.
Has anybody seen this Right Wronged documentary on HBO? Granted its done by Pelosi's daughter so of course its got an agenda but its borderline scary, actually it is scary. Sick fucks.
Kind of funny too though. This redneck at a Nascar event breaking down into tears, literally bawling ;D because we've elected a black guy to be President. What has this country come to, tears, LOL.
Its amazing what these people will say on camera, even if you don't recognize the name Pelosi.
Anyway, I don't think very many people at all realize what bad shape were in. We have definitely not hit bottom yet, thanks Republicans. I'm antagonizing Lyle now ;D But its true.
Whichever party is in power, their followers have a way of pushing their limits and it usually gets to a point that turns off the majority.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfgCEzhYVDg
There's some truth to that but what are the Republicans offering Lyle, seriously. Government is bad, government is corrupt, cut taxes :confused: People aren't interested right now. Even a lot of Republicans were embarrassed by Jindal's speech the other night and not because of the Kenneth the Page factor, just because he has no ideas, he just falls back on cliched Republican bullshit that people just aren't interested in. Earmarks? Earmarks aren't a big deal in the grand scheme of things. The Republicans are on the brink, just look at the clowns leading the party. Compare Palin and Jindal to Obama. Fuck sake its not even a fair contest. The Republicans would be best off with Pawlenty, at least he sounds like he graduated from high school and he's not from the South or Alaska.
Oumafan, the people are having a hangover from Republican leadership 1995-2006 in the Legislative Branch and 2001-2009 in the Executive Branch. People used to love Bill Clinton but at the end even hardcore liberals were taking shots at him....politicians just wear out their welcome after a period of time
Come on Lyle, sure there are political hangovers and then there is George Bush and the dogfood brand Republican party. It may just be a matter of degree but its a big difference.
the problem with Obama is he's not doing enough, the stimulus package should have been bigger, he's too much of a moderate, too worried about partisanship when Republicans aren't interested. Granted it doesn't hurt to make the Republicans look like the ones not interested in working together which may have been the idea all along.
I tend to agree with Bill Maher, it wouldn't hurt to hang a few bankers from the scaffolding of the stock exchange just to give people a scare. Other than that I don't know. Banks are going to fail, its just going to get worse.