Kirkland perhaps you would care to explain...

[El Kabong]

Stock holders can vote too buddy

[killersheep]

Stock holders can vote too buddy

Doesn't do you any good if the CEO is the majority share holder.

[El Kabong]

Doesn't do you any good if the CEO is the majority share holder.

Which is the case how often?

[Kirkland Laing]

Your evidence for making this claim?

A Gallup poll asked people if they wanted Obama's Stimulus Bill to pass...survey SAYS

38% said pass as proposed
37% said pass with MAJOR changes
17% said reject the plan
8% had no opinion


So if you break that down 54% (37% Major Changes and 17% Reject) of American's didn't want OBAMA'S Stimulus Bill passed



Killersheep, is more dependence on the Federal Government better or worse for you?

Where do you get these numbers from?

And how is social security a ponzi scheme?

[killersheep]

Doesn't do you any good if the CEO is the majority share holder.

Which is the case how often?

This is not easily accessable public information, Ken Lewis of Bank of America is an example, Steve Jobs of Apple is another. It is very common practice for an investment company to control the board, in a perfect world the board would contain equal members internally from the company, external experts and members that represent the investment firms. I am not about to go through the SEC filings of the S&P 500 and compare the investment firms that own majority shares and crossreference who's on the board and who's in the investment company.
Common sense right? the stakeholders that have the most to gain in terms of ownership have a say in the running of the business.

[El Kabong]

[quote=Kirkland Laing;688046][quote=Lyle;687884]

Your evidence for making this claim?
Where do you get these numbers from?

And how is social security a ponzi scheme?

GALLUP can't you read?

We pay into something and the early investors get paid off and I'm going to get stuck with el zilcho....it's the fucking definition of a Ponzi scheme.

Video - CNBC.com

[Kirkland Laing]

[quote=Lyle;688066][quote=Kirkland Laing;688046]

GALLUP can't you read?

We pay into something and the early investors get paid off and I'm going to get stuck with el zilcho....it's the fucking definition of a Ponzi scheme.

Video - CNBC.com

If you're not going to provide a source then there's no reason to believe those numbers are correct. Here's even Fox news :

Just over half of Americans — 51 percent — support the economic stimulus and spending plan passed by Congress last week and 40 percent oppose it.
Moreover, 58 percent think legislation was necessary — that's 24 percentage points higher than the 34 percent who think the economy would have improved on its own without government intervention.


FOXNews.com - FOX News Poll: Slim Majority Supports Stimulus - Polls | AP Polls | Gallup Poll | Opinion Polls


Even Fox polls find majority support.


And SS is nor a Ponzi scheme. Like most insurance plans there is no direct connection between the dollar paid in and the benefit paid out, instead what you are buying is coverage, once your actual premium dollar is collected it belongs to the company, or in this case government. While the US government is currently drowning in debt SS is two trillion in credit and won't need any aditional funds until at least 2050 according to the CBO (and almost certainly not even then.)


And a video of a bunch of third-rate traders in a third rate exchange who would all be out of work if the government hadn't bailed their bankrupt firms out complaining about homeowners getting their mortgages renegotiated and the moral hazard of bailing undeserving people out is hilarious.


The stimulus is entirely necessary. Nobody else is spending and if the government doesn't the economy will go into a deflationary death spiral.

[killersheep]

[quote=Lyle;688066][quote=Kirkland Laing;688046]

GALLUP can't you read?

We pay into something and the early investors get paid off and I'm going to get stuck with el zilcho....it's the fucking definition of a Ponzi scheme.

Video - CNBC.com

How about we make a wager then, lets say 3rd quarter statistics show an improvemement of at least 1% in GDP and unemployment declines by at least 2%...........................

[El Kabong]

Well Kirkland, I don't know what to tell you....go argue with Gallup not with me.


killersheep, I can't take that bet unless you know that the majority of that stimulus money won't be paid out until 2010.

[Kirkland Laing]

[quote=killersheep;688082][quote=Lyle;688066]

How about we make a wager then, lets say 3rd quarter statistics show an improvemement of at least 1% in GDP and unemployment declines by at least 2%...........................

I wouldn't go making bets like that. All the stimulus will do id slow the rate of economic contraction/unemployment down a little. It'll be a success if the country doesn't tip into significant deflation, that's the measuring stick. In a couple of years if it's successful (no sure thing) conservatives will be telling us what a failure it was, unemployment kept rising/GDP kept falling etc.

The economy is projected to contract about a trillion a year this year, next year and year after that. An $800 trillion stimulus even if it's respent 1.5 times as is hoped isn't going to plug half that hole, and then there are other factors which will also fuck up gdp/employment too to factor in. Plus about 40% of the stimulus is tax cuts which is wasted money. maybe only 25% of them will be spent, the rest saved.

[Kirkland Laing]

Well Kirkland, I don't know what to tell you....go argue with Gallup not with me.


killersheep, I can't take that bet unless you know that the majority of that stimulus money won't be paid out until 2010.

Why are you so scared to tell us where you got those numbers from? Is it rushlimbaugh.com?

[killersheep]

Well Kirkland, I don't know what to tell you....go argue with Gallup not with me.


killersheep, I can't take that bet unless you know that the majority of that stimulus money won't be paid out until 2010.

I am aware of this and I am still willing to wager on this, despite what Kirkland says this is my belief, nothing crazy how about a sigi bet If I win you puts "Obama was right" and if you win I will put "Obama was wrong."

[killersheep]

Data for GDP will be pulled from
BEA National Economic Accounts

Most recent data is 4th quarter of 2008
GDP in Billions of current dollars is 14,264.6, the bet is that statistic will be 14,407.25 in the 3rd quarter of 2009

Data for unemployment will be pulled from
Employment Situation Summary

Most recent data from January 2009 and stands at 7.6%,
the bet is that statistic will be 5.6% by the end of September of 2009

[El Kabong]

Why are you so scared to tell us where you got those numbers from? Is it rushlimbaugh.com?

Americans Support Stimulus, but Many Want Major Changes

GALLUP MOTHER FUCKER

And yes I know it says the majority favor "A" stimulus bill but my focus is that the majority don't favor "OBAMA'S" stimulus plan

Sure killer, I'll take that bet

[killersheep]

Why are you so scared to tell us where you got those numbers from? Is it rushlimbaugh.com?

Americans Support Stimulus, but Many Want Major Changes

GALLUP MOTHER FUCKER

And yes I know it says the majority favor "A" stimulus bill but my focus is that the majority don't favor "OBAMA'S" stimulus plan

Sure killer, I'll take that bet

2 weeks on the sigi sound fair?