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Forget about being flat footed. Both of these guys are boxer punchers so of course they are going to fight flat footed. Bertos problems came from direction. Same thing happened with Collazo. He moved like he was fighting another orthodox fighter. His corner amounted to be a group of crickets in the mid day sun. Next time pay the janitor 50 grand to be your trainer.
I saw ortiz on his toes. I have yet to see Berto on his toes his entire televised career.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuit
How can you move properly when you are on your heels. that is berto's problem
The fact that Tony Morgan didn't tell Berto's brother to shut the fuck up says that Berto should move elsewhere. I think the criticism of Berto has been way over the top. He was likely concussed from the 1st round on & apparently broke his hand in the 2nd, yet he fought through to the final bell & gave a decent showing. I had it 114-111 for Ortiz in the end, and although the ref was too involved he wasn't as bad as some are making out, I agreed with the points deduction, but I thought Ortiz deserved the extra KD. For everyone complaining about holding & Berto turning his head, Victor was coming in using his head, hence him having to turn it. I've no problem with any of that, fighters will bend the rules as much as they can, but I think it's unfair to criticize a fighter for fouling to nullify his opponent's fouls.
I think Berto would really benefit form Ronnie Shields or Manny Steward. He needs to get with someone who can get him make the most of what he's got.
FOTY so far for me though (much higher skill level than Marquez-Concepcion), it was thrilling and congratulations to Ortiz, I'm glad that he proved me right (yes go back & read my input in the Ortiz is a quiter thread).
Bullshit what? Aaron Snowell did jack crap in that fight...granted Tyson wasn't listening anyway but hell the least he could do is ACT like a trainer that gives a damnQuote:
Originally Posted by Hulkbullshit !Quote:
Originally Posted by el kabong
Definately agree with that. Berto's brother should have been told to shut the fuck up before the fight started, never mind during the fight, so on that, I'd say the correct communication between them isn't there.Quote:
Originally Posted by JazMerkin
I'm calling bullshit on you saying you were not surprised at all by the result Mr. Know it all.Quote:
Originally Posted by El KabongBullshit what? Aaron Snowell did jack crap in that fight...granted Tyson wasn't listening anyway but hell the least he could do is ACT like a trainer that gives a damnQuote:
Originally Posted by Hulkbullshit !Quote:
Originally Posted by el kabong
We were all surprised by what a great great fight it was, and most of us were quite shocked Ortiz won.
Worst instructions ever were Pepe Correra to Lennox, "go out and knock out this bum" at the interval of round 1. :)
....hey man, check my posts...just prior to the bout happening I said "I think Ortiz wins by stoppage" or something to that effect.Quote:
Originally Posted by HulkI'm calling bullshit on you saying you were not surprised at all by the result Mr. Know it all.Quote:
Originally Posted by El KabongBullshit what? Aaron Snowell did jack crap in that fight...granted Tyson wasn't listening anyway but hell the least he could do is ACT like a trainer that gives a damnQuote:
Originally Posted by Hulkbullshit !Quote:
Originally Posted by el kabong
We were all surprised by what a great great fight it was, and most of us were quite shocked Ortiz won.
It's very easy to tell when a corner is being carried by the talent of their fighter rather than the skills of the trainer. Because when that fighter gets in trouble the corner doesn't know what to do. I swore I was gonna change the channel if I heard his corner say "It's so simple." or "when you box its so beautiful, thats all you got to do" Then he'd go out there and lose a round trying to box he'd go back to his corner and it was "that was beautiful, see when you box its easy. Just keep doing that." It's times like that I wish Manny was in his corner doing this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mn4pTT3WkHo
or this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g0gAolHBuws
Bertos corner was too existant if anything. In the middle of a fight listening to one guy is hard enough. But having four or five people including your promoter barking orders at you is just plain retarded. His trainer and only his trainer should've been in control of that corner. They seem to have that guy there as a figure and his family there yelling over the poor guy. He wasn't given bad advice by the guy who was supposed to be giving it. It was the hundred other or so assholes in between rounds causing the problems
Absolutely right...a good working corner should have 1 at most 3 people talking and that would be #1 The Head Trainer #2 The fighter and #3 if need be a translator as in the case with Povetkin and Atlas.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mar
The less people talking the better and great trainers know that sometimes you talk and sometimes you listen, fighters can give information that sometimes you wouldn't understand or see unless you were in the ring. Trainers are also there to amp up or chill out a fighter...some guys fight good when they are emotionally charged up and others don't
Semantics really because too existent equals nonexistent in this case.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mar
Seeing chaos like that always makes me second guess cameras in the corner, at least the in your face fashion. Swear half the time guys are putting on shows for it, spinning a good light etc. Don't think it would have made Bertos more professional but certainly has to put 100% focus on the fighter unravling before everyones eyes.
Berto needs a major change in all concerned if he's going to regroup and reclaim, tip of the iceberg I think.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spicoli
Exactly.
Not only were they all giving him bad or pedestrian advice but he had everybody yapping at him at the same. He must of felt like he was in the middle of a noise sandwich. His trainer should have taken charge and done what he is paid to do. It’s like he was worried about being fired if he dared to be a trainer. The first order of business would have been to tell everybody else to shut their pie-hole. Too many is the same as nobody.
i love roger mayweather...."kick his ass, box him, kick his ass."