Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
IamInuit
Quote:
Originally Posted by
p4pking
Why would this remotely affect the fight, like Stevenson was under the impression the guy liked/respected him or something? If another black fighter did the same thing it would just have been funny, Ali called Foreman a gorilla when he didn't look nearly as much like one as Stevenson does. Uploading a picture in bad taste, and even being a racist, isn't quite as scummy as pimping women imo, but each their own.
Seriously? We have all been saying and the circumstances point us to it that prior to this, Adonis was looking for a way out of the fight. Now Kovalev provides it for him by playing the race card internationally with pictures FFS. The Michael camp will run with this and so will Haymon. At a kids birthday party yet. Did he buy the kid that shirt and does that kid go wonder around Russia with it? So its systemic then?
Anyway here is a translation. The English is a little broken because its a direct one but I'm sure it will explain the thoughts of those effected adequately.
Quote:
A photo with a stupid and disgusting text. Sergey Kovalev posing with a young boy wearing a t-shirt with a picture of a monkey. And Kovalev, thick and ignorant, adds a sentence ". Adonis looks good"
When Georges Laraque saw the photo on the Twitter account Kovalev, his blood has a beat and strongly written Kovalev, "Hey! Do you realize that it's racist you throw in public? "
A few minutes later, Kovalev withdrew the photo. But the damage was already done.
Fans and other people had already sent the photo and racist comments to other curious.
And yesterday morning, Georges Laraque, which led sixty Haitians for a street hockey world championship with a visit to the "fabulous" Winnebago Jean-Charles Lajoie, sent me the picture and leave me a call " No, but you must be stupid! Should you be thick! "Hammered" Big George ".
STEVENSON MEXICO CITY
In Mexico City, where he met the leaders of the WBC, which honored by giving a luxury watch him Adonis Stevenson had been briefed by Laracque of what had happened. George had sent the photo and had spoken to him, "Adonis, you negotiate with these people, must know to whom you to do," said Laraque.
In the following minutes, Stevenson had already answered Kovalev: "You're a racist and you're stupid! If you want to fight, hits above the waist. Boxing is not a discrimination case, "responded the WBC champion. Adding that instead of using a child for his racism, it would be better to face off in the ring.
Later, Stevenson added: "All I have to say is that Kovalev is really con," he wrote to me when I met Impact players to their hotel.
This kind of aggression is well known to many soccer players. Gentlemen like Patrice Bernier played in countries where racism is expressed even roughly. We launch bananas on the field, screaming profanities. Most young people are often upset, veterans know that only education, perhaps, may end up changing things. "Kovalev is Russian. In addition, it depends on what region it originates. Several players have had problems with racism in Russia. When I played in Germany, my wife was taking German lessons with other wives of players. Including Russians. And when they learned that my wife was married to a Black, they could not hide their surprise. I do not want to generalize, but that's what happened, "said Bernier during a casual conversation in the lobby of the hotel yesterday afternoon.
When we say that a new travel fast, Yvon Michel arrived in Port-au-Prince when he texted me, "Kovalev is a fool."
It does not surprise me. It has been several times that Michael argues that journalists and fans were fooled by Kovalev during the fight against Jean Pascal. When I later joined on the terrace of his hotel, he epilogue on the subject. "What he did was stupid. This is a great lack of judgment. But you will discover how Sergey Kovalev is petty and narrow-minded. I'm not sure that people will find the friendly long time, "said Michel.
The developer meets with President of Haiti today to finalize the details of the battle presented to Port-au-Prince on 27 or 29 June featuring Stevenson in a title defense.
COSTLY MISTAKE
This stupid blunder Kovalev could be costly. For a Russian champion like him, money is not necessarily in the United States. While GYM, Eye of the Tiger Management and InterBox developed an extraordinary market boxing in Quebec.
If Kathy Duva and HBO absolutely want to avoid confrontation against Adonis Stevenson and especially Al Haymon, they will need a basic market to sell tickets and collect dollars from Canadian and Quebec television.
But Quebec do not much racist ... and serious companies are cautious about the idea of investing in someone capable of such poor judgment.
But what Sergey Kovalev he have thought?
Be quite the bill though eh. Racist vs Rapist.
New nicknames for these two ?
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Damn, first I heard of this. Not cool having the kid involved either. I liked Kov in the interviews I've seen with him, he seemed like a decent guy. Leave the stupid stuff alone and fight.
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Indeed double standards.
Well, I hardly think that Ali was using 'gorilla' to mock Frazier's colour.
Kovalev is pointing at a monkey calling it Stevenson because Stevenson is black. That's clear.
Ali was calling Frazier a gorilla because he saw him as gorilla-like. Not to insult Frazier because of the colour of his skin. That wouldn't make much sense.
I might add that yeah Stevenson is also a dick. And I agree that although it's in bad taste I too want them to fight and will judge them in the ring. Just making the case that Ali calling Frazier a gorilla is not a logical comparison.
Clay called Frazier a gorilla and wore a shirt saying that , Kovalev's son wore a shirt with a monkey on the front and indicated it was Stevenson , I fail to see the difference.
I personally don't find either instances offensive , bad taste yes , stupid yes , remember most boxers are not very smart , so this shit happens, we don't have to agree but it happens.
Well the difference would simply be that Kovalev (although we can't say for sure) was calling him a monkey because Stevenson is black, whereas Ali was referring to Frazier as a Gorilla not because he was black but because he was Gorilla like. Logic tells me that Ali was not mocking Frazier for the colour of his skin. Thus one would be racist and one would be just insulting. Simple.
Anyhow, I accept what Beanflicker said that we can't even be sure in what way Kovalev meant it so do agree with you that this is by-the-by.
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Indeed double standards.
Well, I hardly think that Ali was using 'gorilla' to mock Frazier's colour.
Kovalev is pointing at a monkey calling it Stevenson because Stevenson is black. That's clear.
Ali was calling Frazier a gorilla because he saw him as gorilla-like. Not to insult Frazier because of the colour of his skin. That wouldn't make much sense.
I might add that yeah Stevenson is also a dick. And I agree that although it's in bad taste I too want them to fight and will judge them in the ring. Just making the case that Ali calling Frazier a gorilla is not a logical comparison.
Clay called Frazier a gorilla and wore a shirt saying that , Kovalev's son wore a shirt with a monkey on the front and indicated it was Stevenson , I fail to see the difference.
I personally don't find either instances offensive , bad taste yes , stupid yes , remember most boxers are not very smart , so this shit happens, we don't have to agree but it happens.
Well the difference would simply be that Kovalev (although we can't say for sure) was calling him a monkey because Stevenson is black, whereas Ali was referring to Frazier as a Gorilla not because he was black but because he was Gorilla like. Logic tells me that Ali was not mocking Frazier for the colour of his skin. Thus one would be racist and one would be just insulting. Simple.
Anyhow, I accept what Beanflicker said that we can't even be sure in what way Kovalev meant it so do agree with you that this is by-the-by.
Ali made many comments about the tone of Fraziers skin calling him purple etc. Anyway, I don't see the two having much to do with each other. Whole thing is strange.
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Indeed double standards.
Well, I hardly think that Ali was using 'gorilla' to mock Frazier's colour.
Kovalev is pointing at a monkey calling it Stevenson because Stevenson is black. That's clear.
Ali was calling Frazier a gorilla because he saw him as gorilla-like. Not to insult Frazier because of the colour of his skin. That wouldn't make much sense.
I might add that yeah Stevenson is also a dick. And I agree that although it's in bad taste I too want them to fight and will judge them in the ring. Just making the case that Ali calling Frazier a gorilla is not a logical comparison.
Clay called Frazier a gorilla and wore a shirt saying that , Kovalev's son wore a shirt with a monkey on the front and indicated it was Stevenson , I fail to see the difference.
I personally don't find either instances offensive , bad taste yes , stupid yes , remember most boxers are not very smart , so this shit happens, we don't have to agree but it happens.
Well the difference would simply be that Kovalev (although we can't say for sure) was calling him a monkey because Stevenson is black, whereas Ali was
referring to Frazier as a Gorilla not because he was black but because he was Gorilla like. Logic tells me that Ali was not mocking Frazier for the colour of his skin. Thus one would be racist and one would be just insulting. Simple.
Anyhow, I accept what Beanflicker said that we can't even be sure in what way Kovalev meant it so do agree with you that this is by-the-by.
Do you think is Frazier was a white guy with similar style , Clay would have called him a gorilla ?
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Indeed double standards.
Well, I hardly think that Ali was using 'gorilla' to mock Frazier's colour.
Kovalev is pointing at a monkey calling it Stevenson because Stevenson is black. That's clear.
Ali was calling Frazier a gorilla because he saw him as gorilla-like. Not to insult Frazier because of the colour of his skin. That wouldn't make much sense.
I might add that yeah Stevenson is also a dick. And I agree that although it's in bad taste I too want them to fight and will judge them in the ring. Just making the case that Ali calling Frazier a gorilla is not a logical comparison.
Clay called Frazier a gorilla and wore a shirt saying that , Kovalev's son wore a shirt with a monkey on the front and indicated it was Stevenson , I fail to see the difference.
I personally don't find either instances offensive , bad taste yes , stupid yes , remember most boxers are not very smart , so this shit happens, we don't have to agree but it happens.
Well the difference would simply be that Kovalev (although we can't say for sure) was calling him a monkey because Stevenson is black, whereas Ali was
referring to Frazier as a Gorilla not because he was black but because he was Gorilla like. Logic tells me that Ali was not mocking Frazier for the colour of his skin. Thus one would be racist and one would be just insulting. Simple.
Anyhow, I accept what Beanflicker said that we can't even be sure in what way Kovalev meant it so do agree with you that this is by-the-by.
Do you think is Frazier was a white guy with similar style , Clay would have called him a gorilla ?
Interesting point to be fair. Honestly - I don't know.
Either way I think Ali was a prick in his dealings with Frazier and that Kovalev is also a prick.
Personally I'll look forward to the fight, not really caring who wins, then look forward to Beterbiev wiping them both out. :cool:
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ryanman
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Indeed double standards.
Well, I hardly think that Ali was using 'gorilla' to mock Frazier's colour.
Kovalev is pointing at a monkey calling it Stevenson because Stevenson is black. That's clear.
Ali was calling Frazier a gorilla because he saw him as gorilla-like. Not to insult Frazier because of the colour of his skin. That wouldn't make much sense.
I might add that yeah Stevenson is also a dick. And I agree that although it's in bad taste I too want them to fight and will judge them in the ring. Just making the case that Ali calling Frazier a gorilla is not a logical comparison.
Clay called Frazier a gorilla and wore a shirt saying that , Kovalev's son wore a shirt with a monkey on the front and indicated it was Stevenson , I fail to see the difference.
I personally don't find either instances offensive , bad taste yes , stupid yes , remember most boxers are not very smart , so this shit happens, we don't have to agree but it happens.
Well the difference would simply be that Kovalev (although we can't say for sure) was calling him a monkey because Stevenson is black, whereas Ali was
referring to Frazier as a Gorilla not because he was black but because he was Gorilla like. Logic tells me that Ali was not mocking Frazier for the colour of his skin. Thus one would be racist and one would be just insulting. Simple.
Anyhow, I accept what Beanflicker said that we can't even be sure in what way Kovalev meant it so do agree with you that this is by-the-by.
Do you think is Frazier was a white guy with similar style , Clay would have called him a gorilla ?
Interesting point to be fair. Honestly - I don't know.
Either way I think Ali was a prick in his dealings with Frazier and that Kovalev is also a prick.
Personally I'll look forward to the fight, not really caring who wins, then look forward to Beterbiev wiping them both out. :cool:
These are my thoughts exactly , why bother to think how it was ment , it was stupid.
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
I agree with those who said we cant be sure due to cultural differences. Its the natural inclination for the US to project our opinions and interpretations on others. In some European countries, presenting the index finger is the same as presenting the middle finger in the US. Here is means i'm number one. In Japan looking someone in the eye, is taken as being confrontational while here it can be a signal of being honest and forthcoming. Bowing is a sign of respect there and over here its a signal of being subservient or relenting power or control. ... The fact is the minute someone said something he took it down, so he may have been embarrassed about it afterwards or maybe he is racist. I could very well be that in choice between the two Kovalev would have much rather preferred a t-shirt that had a chicken wearing boxing gloves. I'll with hold my opinion till I hear all the facts.
As for what was done before with Ali and frasier, there is also a subcultural discriminatory history between light skinned and dark skinned blacks. In times of slavery, it was often that light skinned slaves were chosen as servants and house workers while darker skinned slaved were forced to work in the fields which sometimes cause discord between the two as subclasses became evident due to association with white master issues/ denying of ones roots and other issues occurred. That's a whole other conversation in itself. Just providing a little background.
There have been other fighters like hopkins who swore he'd never lose to a "white boy". There was no confusion about what he meant. Racist? yes. Deliberate? yes. Honest? or did he really respect certain white fighters but just tried to be inflammatory and get someone off their game... You decide.
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
corvette
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Silkeyjoe
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Vendettos
Too much will be read into this.
it could have been any animal on the shirt but it happened to be a monkey.
But when Ali did it, it was funny, right?
Double standards for sure , Clay punched a toy gorilla in the ring claiming it was Joe , that's why I said judge them in the ring not outside, the bottom line is who fucking cares.
Ali used race to sell fights a lot of which I found very distasteful, particularly asking Wepner to call him a nigger on tv and when he refused to do so tell everyone he called him it anyway. Ali probably was a racist back then but I guess its forgiven given the times he lived in.
I couldnt read the article but while the picture is distasteful I dont really see it as making him a racist? Surely calling Stevenson a piece of shit is just as much grounds to call him a racist as this photo is?
Stop hiding behind Ali.
Ya'll were quick to call Floyd racist...and Hopkins.
Kovalev has been pulled to the side about this shit before...plus he has Black trainers and Kathy Duva is married to a BM.
Stevenson makes 4 x's more than Kovalev.
So who's the monkey;D
What do you mean hiding behind Ali?
I never called Floyd a racist, hes a prick, but never really noticed anything regarding race coming from him. Hopkins is a racist, he has a chip on his shoulder regarding white people and thinks he doesnt get the recognition he deserves because hes black, yet hes got a point cz Floyd and RJJ got this recognition because of their skin color. Kov could be a racist, I dont know him, but comparing Stevenson to a monkey is not necessarily racist. Its not the same as comparing all black people to monkeys.
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
I just think now a days people throw around the word "racist" too easily. Intent is everything. You can't accidentally or unknowingly be a racist. Kovalev either intended it to be a racial attack, or he could have meant it to be a slam on his Adonis' looks and intelligence. Both are plausible, so why jump to either conclusion? Let the man speak before throwing around the word "racist", it just cheapens the word.
I live in predominantly white part of the world and insults like monkey and gorilla get thrown around all the time here by whites in reference to other whites.
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Silkeyjoe
Quote:
Originally Posted by
corvette
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Silkeyjoe
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Vendettos
Too much will be read into this.
it could have been any animal on the shirt but it happened to be a monkey.
But when Ali did it, it was funny, right?
Double standards for sure , Clay punched a toy gorilla in the ring claiming it was Joe , that's why I said judge them in the ring not outside, the bottom line is who fucking cares.
Ali used race to sell fights a lot of which I found very distasteful, particularly asking Wepner to call him a nigger on tv and when he refused to do so tell everyone he called him it anyway. Ali probably was a racist back then but I guess its forgiven given the times he lived in.
I couldnt read the article but while the picture is distasteful I dont really see it as making him a racist? Surely calling Stevenson a piece of shit is just as much grounds to call him a racist as this photo is?
Stop hiding behind Ali.
Ya'll were quick to call Floyd racist...and Hopkins.
Kovalev has been pulled to the side about this shit before...plus he has Black trainers and Kathy Duva is married to a BM.
Stevenson makes 4 x's more than Kovalev.
So who's the monkey;D
What do you mean hiding behind Ali?
I never called Floyd a racist, hes a prick, but never really noticed anything regarding race coming from him. Hopkins is a racist, he has a chip on his shoulder regarding white people and thinks he doesnt get the recognition he deserves because hes black, yet hes got a point cz Floyd and RJJ got this recognition because of their skin color. Kov could be a racist, I dont know him, but comparing Stevenson to a monkey is not necessarily racist. Its not the same as comparing all black people to monkeys.
Don't feed the trolls ;D
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Beanflicker
I just think now a days people throw around the word "racist" too easily. Intent is everything. You can't accidentally or unknowingly be a racist. Kovalev either intended it to be a racial attack, or he could have meant it to be a slam on his Adonis' looks and intelligence. Both are plausible, so why jump to either conclusion? Let the man speak before throwing around the word "racist", it just cheapens the word.
I live in predominantly white part of the world and insults like monkey and gorilla get thrown around all the time here by whites in reference to other whites.
If any of that bullshit your wrote is true,then why don't we see the same shit from other Russian fighters????
You jump to defend him when he's been pulled aside for this shit before.
Fonfara is from a white country....you don't see that from him.
Vlad and Vitali are from white countries...you don't see them acting like that.
Leo Santa Cruz is a bantamweight...and he's cashing bigger checks than Kovalev.
Kovalev is getting paid like a monkey;D
I'd be embarrassed to compare somebody that makes 4x's as much as I do to an Ape.
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Silkeyjoe
Quote:
Originally Posted by
corvette
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Silkeyjoe
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Dark Lord Al
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Vendettos
Too much will be read into this.
it could have been any animal on the shirt but it happened to be a monkey.
But when Ali did it, it was funny, right?
Double standards for sure , Clay punched a toy gorilla in the ring claiming it was Joe , that's why I said judge them in the ring not outside, the bottom line is who fucking cares.
Ali used race to sell fights a lot of which I found very distasteful, particularly asking Wepner to call him a nigger on tv and when he refused to do so tell everyone he called him it anyway. Ali probably was a racist back then but I guess its forgiven given the times he lived in.
I couldnt read the article but while the picture is distasteful I dont really see it as making him a racist? Surely calling Stevenson a piece of shit is just as much grounds to call him a racist as this photo is?
Stop hiding behind Ali.
Ya'll were quick to call Floyd racist...and Hopkins.
Kovalev has been pulled to the side about this shit before...plus he has Black trainers and Kathy Duva is married to a BM.
Stevenson makes 4 x's more than Kovalev.
So who's the monkey;D
What do you mean hiding behind Ali?
I never called Floyd a racist, hes a prick, but never really noticed anything regarding race coming from him. Hopkins is a racist, he has a chip on his shoulder regarding white people and thinks he doesnt get the recognition he deserves because hes black, yet hes got a point cz Floyd and RJJ got this recognition because of their skin color. Kov could be a racist, I dont know him, but comparing Stevenson to a monkey is not necessarily racist. Its not the same as comparing all black people to monkeys.
so...comparing Black people to gorillas is not the same as comparing them to monkeys.
What kind of b.s is that?
Kovalev is making a fool of himself and burning bridges he might need......meanwhile.....Stevenson is cashing checks Kovalev will never see the likes of.;D
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Kovalev has gone down in my estimation. I think he now lives in USA and needs to educate himself that racism is ignorant and not cool.
I still think he beats Stevenson.
Re: Not a good look for Kovalev
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Master
Kovalev has gone down in my estimation. I think he now lives in USA and needs to educate himself that racism is ignorant and not cool.
I still think he beats Stevenson.
He knows better...he's been told before...he just can't help himself.
You don't see other Russians/Ukranians acting like that.
I don't see him beating Stevenson.
Adonis has more punchers on his resume than Kovalev.
Cleverly...Hopkins..Silka...none of those guys can crack a box of girlscout cookies.
Hopkins took less to fight Kovalev...that outta' tell you something.
