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Anybody roughly the same size as him who can punch could beat him. When there were good heavyweights to fight he stayed in Germany and made money. I just don't think he's worth getting excited about. And it's not because he's a pretend German either, if he was any good I'd like him, but I honestly think he's rubbish, unexciting, etc.
OK please explain how Wladimir can fix the current heavyweight division??? He's just one man he can't fight against himself dude.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
David Haye has to prove himself and THEN maybe we can talk but right now Wlad is THE dominant fighter in the division. He beat Sam Peter BEFORE Sam had any losses that has to count for something. He beat Chris Byrd twice and both times he beat Chris Byrd he was one of the longest reigning title holders having defended several times vs guys just as big as Wladimir. Wlad also avenged his loss vs Lamon Brewster and had Corrie Sanders actually trained and beaten the 14-5-1 Osborne Machi-whaddy MAYBE Wlad would avenge that loss as well.
Right now there are not contenders OTHER than the punks who hold the other two belts and Wlad would hand them their asses as well.
I'm not sayign Wlad is the greatest of all time I am saying he's hands down the best right now and honestly right now the division isn't totally horrible it's the same as ever: no consistency, no big fights being made, and no complete fighters......which is why Lewis, Tyson, and Holyfield were able to stick around for so long and honestly I see Wlad being much the same, Even if (and that's a BIG if) a great heavyweight comes along, Wlad will still be able to win vs everyone else.
Kirkland you have flaws in your argument, you don't give credit where credit is due and even in HYPOTHETICAL situations you weasle out ways to try and rob Wladimir of any true legacy whatsoever. Sure Wlad got beat early in his career and he's been KO'd 3 times but hell show me a fighter sho either hasn't lost at all or has come back from losses to be stronger and better than before.....the only guys ARE THE BEST.
Lennox Lewis got knocked the fuck out vs McCall and Rahman and those guys were no world beaters. Mike Tyson lost to Buster motherfucking Douglas and Holyfield got TKO'd by a fucking supermiddleweight so don't fucking complain to me about Wlad losing when he was 22 years old.
Your argument is flawed, it's MORE biased than mine which borders on impossible and you're stubborn to boot. Congrats you got the hat trick.
I wouldn't get excited if he could fight himself. Watching one glass-jawed Frankenstein paw and jab some inevitably smaller guy for twelve rounds is bad enough but watching two of them would be torture.
Your problem is that you're relentlessly wrong about everything.
It's either you or me buddy and honestly your argument is hella weakQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
I think Haye is an idiot, he just looked like a moron standing on that escalator looking up at Wladimir Klitschko.
I loved how Wlad said I can't fight you now I'm fighting my IBF mandatory challenger Tony Thompson, and Haye is like 'ok next' and Wlad is like 'the I must take on Alexander Povetkin the winner of the elimination tournament to fight me.
It was starting to sound like that speech in Life of Brian about what the Romans have ever done for us.
Haye is like 'Ok after you've fought Tony Thompson and Alexander Povetkin will you fight me?.
Wlad is like 'Then I am fighting a rematch against Sam Peter for a chance to become the first fighter to unify the heavyweight division since Lennox Lewis.
Poor David cries, 'Ok so after you've fought Tony Thompson, Alexander Povetkin and Sam Peter to unify the heavyweight division THEN will you fight me?
:rolleyes:
Run along David you made a complete ass of yourself ;D
I'm not sure David Haye will be a good heavyweight. He might make Vlad look rock-jawed. But he'll be in some exciting fights. You can't say the same about Vlad.
OK Lyle. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by LyleIt's either you or me buddy and honestly your argument is hella weakQuote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
For some reason I can easily picture Haye behind Wlad at the super market with a loaf of bread in his hand begging to Wlad "Please fight me, Wlad"Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
Well in your efforts to discredit ONE heavyweight you have ended up trying to discredit them all even ones who haven't even fought in the division yet....that seems to me to be a little bit of a stretch.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Did Mike Tyson have anyone great on his record during his reign??? A scared Michael Spinks, an old Larry Holmes,....Trevor Berbick?? Pinklon Thomas??? FRANK BRUNO???....but you like him because he was fun to watch....so I take it you don't watch much boxing :rolleyes: . Wlad throws punches, he is able to inflict damage AND utilize his natural advantages of size and strength and what more could you ask for as a professional fighter??? You want him to talk trash like James Toney or just go for broke in every fight and not use strategy at all????
What you ask of Wladimir is either #1 ignorant from a strategic standpoint or #2 impossible for Wlad to do because he doesn't choose the people that are in the division and he can't make his opponents fight any better than what they do.
So yeah YOU are 100% wrong in this case....you can be a Haye fan and cheer him on and everything but denying Wlad his credit will come back and bite you in the ass because if Haye beats Wlad and Wlad is as big of a bum as you make him out to be then what the fuck has Haye proven???? And if you just like the way Haye fights then go watch the fucking gypsies fight...because it's fun
Haye at heavyweight may make Vlad look iron-chinned. But he'll be exciting, not Vlad-like. He may lose to Solis again but in every fight he'll be entertaining.Quote:
Originally Posted by LyleWell in your efforts to discredit ONE heavyweight you have ended up trying to discredit them all even ones who haven't even fought in the division yet....that seems to me to be a little bit of a stretch.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Did Mike Tyson have anyone great on his record during his reign??? A scared Michael Spinks, an old Larry Holmes,....Trevor Berbick?? Pinklon Thomas??? FRANK BRUNO???....but you like him because he was fun to watch....so I take it you don't watch much boxing :rolleyes: . Wlad throws punches, he is able to inflict damage AND utilize his natural advantages of size and strength and what more could you ask for as a professional fighter??? You want him to talk trash like James Toney or just go for broke in every fight and not use strategy at all????
What you ask of Wladimir is either #1 ignorant from a strategic standpoint or #2 impossible for Wlad to do because he doesn't choose the people that are in the division and he can't make his opponents fight any better than what they do.
So yeah YOU are 100% wrong in this case....you can be a Haye fan and cheer him on and everything but denying Wlad his credit will come back and bite you in the ass because if Haye beats Wlad and Wlad is as big of a bum as you make him out to be then what the fuck has Haye proven???? And if you just like the way Haye fights then go watch the fucking gypsies fight...because it's fun
Lyle, there are two fighters.
One guy has a truly epic physical presence. He's extremely tall, heavy and athletic, with exceptional athleticism for such a big guy. Yet since he discovered that his jaw is made out of glass he fights in a style that makes John Ruiz entertaining. He managed his career in a way that made Frank Warren seem like a reckless risk-taker and only due to the tragic decline in the heavyweight division since the 1970s is he even seen as world-class.
The other fighter has less height and reach than the first guy and naturally weighs considerably less than the first fighter. But his style of fighting is exciting and he has lots of power married to exceptional athleticism, and he's willing to move up a weight class and fight the best fighter in the world at that level straight away.
Which of these guys is most worth supporting? Which is it most natural to be a fan of?
Or look it at another way. One guy is intelligent, respectful, articulate and an ambassador for the sport of boxing, the other is a complete tool. Which of these guys is most worth supporting? Which is it most natural to be a fan of?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
David Haye did well in the cruiserweight division but hell it's in a weaker state than the hw division has ever been. In the hw division, I think Haye will find out the hard way that he is a legend in his own mind and that's before he can fight his way to Wlad.;)
....maybe it's worth siding with the humble down to earth Doctor who supports tons of charities and has made something of himself in AND outside the ring.
Oh another loudmouthed boxer full of bravado....my where ever on Earth did they find him???
If he's respectful and a great ambassador for boxing but a glass-jawed gunshy bore and the other guy is a tool but actually wants to fight and is exciting when he does fight then I think it's obvious which guy any boxing fan would choose.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboOr look it at another way. One guy is intelligent, respectful, articulate and an ambassador for the sport of boxing, the other is a complete tool. Which of these guys is most worth supporting? Which is it most natural to be a fan of?Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland Laing
Nobody liked Mike Tyson because he was a great ambassador for boxing.