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I will agree with you, Ouma that Lara should have done more. I think he did enough, but he clearly has the tools to do that little bit extra and should have. He out landed Alvarez, but you cannot play games in places like Las Mexico. Good call on Toney-Jirov. Now that is a fight.
You mean Las Manila ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
Yes, that's the one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingYou mean Las Manila ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
Seems to me everyone believes this was more of Lara losing this fight on his own then winning it ( Include me) The thing is in order to convincingly beat Canelo he opens himself to being beaten. Well we know now he has the skill but not the "Juevos" !!!Quote:
Originally Posted by GandalfYes, that's the one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingYou mean Las Manila ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
my prediction was; lara would win on points and outbox canelo easily, making him look foolish at times, BUT...canelo would get the nod because of his star power.
i didnt see the fight, how far off was I? im hearing different shit. maybe from someone who dont suck canelos balls??
You were pretty damn close. The same slags who championed Algeri for "outboxing" Provodnikov despite getting dropped twice are now jeering Lara for "running".Quote:
Originally Posted by #1FightFan
Everyone agrees Lara swept the first 3 n took the last 2 as well. Yet some think Canelo did enough to win.
It's hip to be square.
Chris Algeri dominated the fight by setting the pace, demonstrating superior ring generalship(in a very small ring), not being hit AND hitting Provodnikov. Algeri connected with 288 punches(of 993 thrown) and was effective in almost every round of the fight. Lara connected with a measly 107 punches(of 386 thrown) and spent several rounds literally running away from Canelo. It's a poor comparison unless you're trying to show how undeserving of the win Lara was.Quote:
Originally Posted by HulkYou were pretty damn close. The same slags who championed Algeri for "outboxing" Provodnikov despite getting dropped twice are now jeering Lara for "running".Quote:
Originally Posted by #1FightFan
Everyone agrees Lara swept the first 3 n took the last 2 as well. Yet some think Canelo did enough to win.
It's hip to be square.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GandalfI had it undeniably 3-0 Lara after 3. Then I scored the fourth for Canelo. Thereafter I was obstructed by technical issues, but judged the rounds as fairly as the means could merit. I definitely saw Canelo come on in the middle rounds, but Lara came back strongly. Not in a million years could I ever see a case for 117-111 unless it was a White House spokesperson or the North Korean national press. I think most people can make at least a case for a close fight, but I saw 6 rounds that were relatively easy to score in Lara's favour. Now if he didn't win any other rounds, then fine, a draw, or if you are against me, a close Canelo win, but no sane person would ever produce 117-111. That is Federal Reserve behavior. Martinez should go into banking where he can work for not just one dildo crazed cokehead, but a whole plethora of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by OumaFanNah. If you gave me 100 bucks I could write up a detailed, persuasive account of why each guy should have won that fight 117-111.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
There were almost zero dominant rounds. Alvarez won (and it wasn't by any means a robbery) without landing a single meaningful head shot.
You have a love affair for that fight. How many times have you jacked off to Toney-Jirov? lol Your comments made me first watch that fight like 5 years ago and you've referenced it like 10 times since. It's ok.Quote:
Originally Posted by OumaFan
I'm only offended because I'm about to rewatch Canelo-Lara.
Biggest cert of the week was this fight will have a disputed outcome. A styles fight all about what you like. Before the fight they should have just agreed to do what they did in the old days, if you're both still standing after 12 we'll call it a draw.
I'm always embarrassed for "boxing fans" when "running" comes up after a fight. All "running" is to them is an excuse to dismiss better work. 115-113 is acceptable either way, 114-114 is probably the right score. 117-111 is a f'n joke and anyone defending 117-111 is just as f'n ridiculous as that score.
Here's a good gif of the Kameda KO.
I think Lara did better work. Alvarez didn't even land 100 punches he played to Laras game and lost.
How many times have we heard over the past few weeks, "It's going to be a close fight." or "Lara has to win big, he will not win a close decision."Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingSeems to me everyone believes this was more of Lara losing this fight on his own then winning it ( Include me) The thing is in order to convincingly beat Canelo he opens himself to being beaten. Well we know now he has the skill but not the "Juevos" !!!Quote:
Originally Posted by GandalfYes, that's the one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingYou mean Las Manila ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Gandalf
Why didn't Lara engage a little more? why didn't Lara's corner scream at him to fight more? Why wouldn't a fighter, in the most important fight of his life, take a few more risks to ensure a victory? Did Lara and his corner think they had the fight in the bag? Those are the questions I'm interested in.
It was a close fight and I would have been satisfied with a draw or a close decision for either fighter. Where the hell the 117-111 score came from is beyond me.
I enjoyed the fight, I thought Canelo would be able to apply more pressure early and I thought Lara would fade a little more late.
The biggest mistake was Lara not engaging more, it's OK to retreat but you have to throw punches while you are retreating. Sliding along the ropes or forcing somebody to run you down while you continually reset, throw a few punches, and slide away again leaves a lot of people with a bad taste on their mouths.
I kept thinking throw more punches, throw more punches, then I started thinking I hope you lose you stupid fuck, for not throwing more punches. To say I was really into this fight is an understatement, I was pulling for Lara big time, but he didn't do enough. Man, a capital error!
I'm over 70, but you can go ahead and tell me I don't know shit about boxing.
Mares looked very tentative to me. If there ever was another perfect time for the Donaire-Mares fight, it's now. Both look passed it equally.
FromQuote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
The 3-4 rounds I saw of Mares he looked boring and a little flat.
He still has a ton of talent and can be champion again though.
Juanma cannot.
I agree, getting a couple of fights out of the way will do wonders for Mares!Quote:
Originally Posted by HulkFromQuote:
Originally Posted by Rantcatrat
The 3-4 rounds I saw of Mares he looked boring and a little flat.
He still has a ton of talent and can be champion again though.
Juanma cannot.
Lopez is done but he will probably fight some more anyway.
But we've been told by people on this site "only Canelos punches counted" so 117-111 makes perfect sense. Apparently Lara only threw jabs even though I distinctly remember him landing more hooks than Canelo landed head shots, those don't count. And I remember him snapping Canelos head around with lefts, but those don't count. And he landed body punches of his own, but those don't count. As long as they all don't count it's 117-111.Quote:
Originally Posted by Maravilla2012
Either guy close is good but all the ways fans find to dismiss what actually happened in the fight is infuriating.
Just rewatched the fight. Lara got robbed. Canelos corner telling him in the corner he needed the 12th that it was too close and he needed to push the action.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Maravilla2012
You know I'm not really all that upset about the decision. I thought it was close. I'm severely pissed off about the purchased guarantee and the fact that people actually expected Lara to fight like Alvarez and because he didn't he should lose. Saying the right man won and ignoring these two things just doesn't cut it for me. After all of these years these weekly charlatan cards are starting to turn me off of the sport. Its not even boxing anymore and is starting to move ever so closely to things like reality tv and fake wrestling.
The Lara should have.....line has me irked as well. All he had to do was do better than Canelo. Some think he did some think he didn't. But the suggestion he needed to change is offensive. People seem to want a homogenized version of the sport. All face first throwing bombs, everything else is wrong. The day there isn't variances I certainly won't watch.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitQuote:
Originally Posted by Maravilla2012
You know I'm not really all that upset about the decision. I thought it was close. I'm severely pissed off about the purchased guarantee and the fact that people actually expected Lara to fight like Alvarez and because he didn't he should lose. Saying the right man won and ignoring these two things just doesn't cut it for me. After all of these years these weekly charlatan cards are starting to turn me off of the sport. Its not even boxing anymore and is starting to move ever so closely to things like reality tv and fake wrestling.
According to Lara he had no respect for Alvarez. He said it was personal and was gonna dominate and stop him. Not only was he doing it for his family but to prove Alvarez didn't deserve the attention he was getting. I'm guessing some fans actually believed him. Stupid fansQuote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitQuote:
Originally Posted by Maravilla2012
You know I'm not really all that upset about the decision. I thought it was close. I'm severely pissed off about the purchased guarantee and the fact that people actually expected Lara to fight like Alvarez and because he didn't he should lose. Saying the right man won and ignoring these two things just doesn't cut it for me. After all of these years these weekly charlatan cards are starting to turn me off of the sport. Its not even boxing anymore and is starting to move ever so closely to things like reality tv and fake wrestling.
The fix was in and that's unfortunate because another judge may have given him the split anyway but the 9-3 card is simply mentally inept to the point where it had to be a fix. And that's what bugs me. They dont even try to hide it because the judges are never taken to task or vetted. Like the CJ Ross card in the Floyd/Alvarez fight calling it 114/114. All Alvarez has to do is finish standing and its a lock.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonThe Lara should have.....line has me irked as well. All he had to do was do better than Canelo. Some think he did some think he didn't. But the suggestion he needed to change is offensive. People seem to want a homogenized version of the sport. All face first throwing bombs, everything else is wrong. The day there isn't variances I certainly won't watch.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitQuote:
Originally Posted by Maravilla2012
You know I'm not really all that upset about the decision. I thought it was close. I'm severely pissed off about the purchased guarantee and the fact that people actually expected Lara to fight like Alvarez and because he didn't he should lose. Saying the right man won and ignoring these two things just doesn't cut it for me. After all of these years these weekly charlatan cards are starting to turn me off of the sport. Its not even boxing anymore and is starting to move ever so closely to things like reality tv and fake wrestling.
Well to be honest feel Canelo landed harder shots people really do not give body shots enough credit. I mean the punches landed were pretty closes depends how much you value jabs or power punches. There is a difference form boxing smart and running i mean Look what Trout and Mayweather did compared to lara not even the same thing. Also there were a lot close rounds i mean i could see either fighter getting that score because of how shit the rounds were. I mean what if Canelo ran as well be no fucking fight in there has to be a point in which it becomes to much. I think Canelo is doing just fine i mean i fell he deserved his wins in the Trout and Lara fights and lost Mayweather its not like he ducking anyone at all. I mean i like to see people score cards i go watch it again fell Canelo did enough to win it but i mean it was a close fucking fight as well with no real dominated rounds.
I had canelo edging it 8-4, not emotionally invested in either fighter. the rounds that lara won he did so with effective movement but I felt majority of the rounds he was running
I think this is manipulating what a lot of people like me are saying to the extreme. I love defensive wizardry. Watching Whitaker is like watching poetry in motion. Watching Lara is like watching a dancer. Yes he scored with some solid hooks, body shots, and straight lefts. Yes he whipped Canelo's head back several times. But a lot of times Lara would circle completely away, wait for Canelo to get catch up and set, then circle away again without throwing a single punch. It looks pretty, making Canelo look slow and befuddled, but this is boxing, not dancing. If he's really boxing at the high level you would have me believe, that pause where Canelo is stopped is the perfect time for some output.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonThe Lara should have.....line has me irked as well. All he had to do was do better than Canelo. Some think he did some think he didn't. But the suggestion he needed to change is offensive. People seem to want a homogenized version of the sport. All face first throwing bombs, everything else is wrong. The day there isn't variances I certainly won't watch.Quote:
Originally Posted by IamInuitQuote:
Originally Posted by Maravilla2012
You know I'm not really all that upset about the decision. I thought it was close. I'm severely pissed off about the purchased guarantee and the fact that people actually expected Lara to fight like Alvarez and because he didn't he should lose. Saying the right man won and ignoring these two things just doesn't cut it for me. After all of these years these weekly charlatan cards are starting to turn me off of the sport. Its not even boxing anymore and is starting to move ever so closely to things like reality tv and fake wrestling.
The final punch stats reveal that Canelo landed 88 power punches to 52 for Lara. Many of Lara's jabs were light and thrown while moving away. Lara only landed 10 more punches than Canelo... This is why Lara's performance was not considered dominant and why Canelo was awarded the win. Despite all Lara's "expert and superior" boxing skills, he only managed to land 10 more weak punches than Canelo and often spent 2 minutes per round running away not throwing at all. It's not about entertainment vs skill it's about effectiveness and effort. Canelo chased Lara hard for 12 rounds and scored 88 power punches. Lara ran away from Canelo for 12 rounds and only managed 10 more punches--demonstrating ineffective cowardice.