NOW can we stop this disrespect on Crawford and put him at #1 at the P4P list? The disrespect was sickening, tbth...
I always felt Canelo had a lot to prove before he could have been placed at #1 p4p... But everyone serious in the game knew the #1 p4p is Terance Bud Crawford. Stop this disrespect on the man and put him #1...
1. Crawford
2. Spence
3. Fury
4. Inoue
5.... name the rest of the guys you like.
Fury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Anything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
The Independent’s pound-for-pound rankings
10. Dmitry Bivol (20-0, 11 knockouts)
Enters our list as of May 2022, following his stunning victory over Saul “Canelo” Alvarez. The Russian remained unbeaten and retained the WBA light-heavyweight title with that result, which he achieved by fighting on the front foot, picking his shots wisely, and almost doubling the output of his opponent. Bivol, 31, won by two points on all three judges’ scorecards, though the margins should have been much wider. A clinical showing that raises the Russian’s profile immensely and likely sets up a rematch with Canelo.
9. Shakur Stevenson (18-0, 9 KOs)
The unbeaten American enters our list following his clinic against Oscar Valdez at the end of April. Stevenson eased to a unanimous decision win against the Mexican, retaining the WBC and WBO super-featherweight titles as a result. At just 24 years old, the best is still ahead of Stevenson, who we expect will only climb our rankings.
8. Vasiliy Lomachenko (16-2, 11 KOs)
Was somewhat surprisingly beaten by our former No 10, Lopez, but the 34-year-old has bounced back with two straight wins – most recently against Richard Commey – to maintain his status as one of the best boxers in the world. The Ukrainian southpaw (one of two on this list...) saw off Jorge Linares in 2018 to become WBA lightweight champion and a three-weight title holder, before adding further belts with notable wins against the likes of Luke Campbell and Jose Pedraza.
7. Juan Francisco Estrada (42-3, 28 KOs)
The diminutive Mexican is a two-weight world champion, having obtained the WBA super-flyweight title with his split-decision victory over Roman Gonzalez in March 2021. That win saw Estrada, 31, avenge a 2012 defeat by “Chocolatito”, but its narrow nature meant the old rivals were set to rematch this March, until Estrada had to withdraw due to Covid symptoms. In any case, Estrada’s creative use of angles is one of his standout attributes, making him a fun watch each time out.
6. Tyson Fury (32-0-1, 23 KOs)
Has eclipsed Anthony Joshua as the household name in British boxing. Fury, 33, returned to the sport in 2018 after three years off due to a long struggle with his mental health. Since then, he has established himself as one of the greatest heavyweights of all time, dethroning Deontay Wilder to become WBC champion in the pair’s 2020 rematch, having controversially drawn with the American in their first clash, in 2018.
In October, Fury stopped Wilder for the second fight in a row to retain the belt, which he did again in April by knocking out Dillian Whyte with ease after outboxing his compatriot for the best part of six rounds. A creative fighter who has demonstrated remarkable resilience and heart in the ring, Fury previously held the WBA, WBO, IBF and IBO titles and looks destined to regain them and reign as undisputed champion in the future – as long as he does not commit to retriement.
5. Naoya Inoue (22-0, 19-0)
One of the lesser-known names on this list to the more casual fan, the Japanese does not lack in prowess what he may lack in profile. Inoue has the best stoppage percentage of any fighter on this list, part of what makes him such an exciting fighter to watch – along with his effortless evasiveness, brutal body attacks, and frightening level of output. At 28, the WBA and IBF bantamweight champion – who has also held titles in two other weight classes – has plenty left ahead of him.
4. Errol Spence Jr (28-0, 22 KOs)
The American has not been the most active fighter in recent years, but he has been slowly building a fine resume. Spence Jr holds impressive wins against the likes of Shawn Porter, Mikey Garcia, Danny Garcia and Carlos Ocampo. The southpaw stopped the latter, as well as notably finishing Kell Brook on the Briton’s home turf earlier in his career, and a cancelled clash with Manny Pacquiao would surely have built up Spence even further had it come to fruition.
Last time out, the 32-year-old beat Yordenis Ugas by brutalising the Cuban’s eye, collecting another welterweight belt and rising two spots in our rankings in the process. If he can increase his activity, Spence will likely only continue to climb here, especially if a long-awaited meeting with Terence Crawford comes to pass and Spence can win...
3. Saul “Canelo” Alvarez (57-2-2, 39 KOs)
In the nine years since loss to Floyd Mayweather, the Mexican has established himself as the face of boxing, with wins against Erislandy Lara, Miguel Cotto, Amir Khan, Gennadiy Golovkin, Daniel Jacobs, Billy Joe Saunders and many more of note. The effectiveness of the 31-year-old’s counter-punching, slickness of his head movement and beauty of his body work make him a joy to watch.
Detractors will point to Alvarez’s clenbuterol controversy in 2018 and the fact that a couple of his victories have come via controversial scorecards. Supporters will give more credence to Canelo’s admirable level of activity and the great number of formidable foes he has fought and beaten. His three victories in 2021 – all stoppages – saw him ultimately become boxing’s first ever undisputed super-middleweight champion. A title holder in four weight classes, the Mexican failed to add a second light-heavyweight title to his collection when he was outpointed by unbeaten Russian Dmitry Bivol in May 2022. That result, which surprised a number of fans, marked just the second defeat of Canelo’s professional career. Don’t be surprised if the ambitious Mexican goes for the rematch next time out.
2. Oleksandr Usyk (19-0, 13 KOs)
Reigned as undisputed cruiserweight champion before moving up to heavyweight, where he has since become WBO, WBA, IBF and IBO champion. The Ukrainian, 35 is undefeated and most recently outpointed Anthony Joshua with ease in London to gain those heavyweight titles. The southpaw, a former Olympic gold medalist, is as technical as they come in the heavier weight classes, making a possible match-up with Fury an intriguing prospect down the line – as long as Fury elects not to retire. Following Canelo’s defeat by Bivol, Usyk climbs from third to second in our list.
1. Terence Crawford (38-0, 29 KOs)
The WBO welterweight champion has one of the most impressive resumes in the sport, and it just keeps getting better. Four of the American’s last seven opponents were undefeated before facing him, and all seven were stopped by Crawford – who has a tremendous number of knockout and TKO victories to his name. Wins against big-name boxers Brook and Porter in Crawford’s last two outings have further enhanced the 34-year-old’s profile, especially his victory over the latter last time out. After Canelo’s loss to Bivol, Crawford moves up one place in our rankings to become our new No 1.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/sport/boxi...89095ceba14836
I can take this list.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Terence Crawford thinks he is the number one pound-for-pound boxer over Oleksandr Usuk after Saul ‘Canelo’ Alvarez lost to Dmitry Bivol
Terrence Crawford believes he is now the number one pound-for-pound fighter in the world after Saul ‘Canelo’ Alvarez lost to Dmitry Bivol.
Canelo came up short in his quest to begin conquering another division on Saturday night as he lost a unanimous decision to Bivol in Las Vegas.
Crawford, the WBO welterweight champion, is currently ranked third on The Ring’s pound-for-pound list with IBF, IBO, WBO and WBA (super) heavyweight champion Oleksandr Usyk ranked number two behind Canelo.
The American tweeted a couple times during the fight on Saturday and towards the latter stages, claimed: “It’s over with I don’t see him [knocking out] Bivol.”
Once Bivol secured the 115-113, 115-113, 115-113 victory, Crawford, who has 29 knockouts in his 38-fight unbeaten career, tweeted: “We know who #1 is now.”
His biggest victories to date have come against former world champions like Amir Khan, Kell Brook and Shawn Porter.
Crawford has also won world titles at lightweight and light welterweight making him a three-weight world champion.
The 34-year-old is desperately trying to make a fight with IBF, WBC, and WBA welterweight champion Errol Spence Jr – fifth on the pound-for-pound list – to unify the welterweight division.
Still, Canelo is the undisputed super-middleweight champion and is a four-weight world champion. The Mexican is 57-2-2 and in his last 14 fights, he’s faced a staggering 12 world champions in a variety of weight categories.
Alvarez has already said he will be activating the rematch clause to have another crack at Bivol as he remains undeterred in his pursuit of unifying another weight class.
Crawford needs the fight with Spence Jr to happen. It’s two great champions in their prime that would do a great deal for both of their legacies. Crawford’s case would get a lot stronger were he to win that fight.
Does Canelo losing weaken his claim to being the best pound-for-pound fighter? An unbeaten record is great, but it’s not all about that.
The quality of opponents overall and accomplishments in different weight classes – like being undisputed – are certainly factors too. One might argue nobody can rival Canelo in those departments.
https://talksport.com/sport/boxing/1...leksandr-usyk/
So I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
Ol p4p list subjectivity ;D. I try to boil it down to obvious boxing skill and IQ and the credible high level scalps a guy has. But honestly these lists are genuinely all over the place
Random things for me...I love Spence. But I've seen him in top 5'ish. I can't quite get my head around that but he has quality scalps
Also total division unification is a big notch on the belt.
Really don't put a lot of big stock in leap frogging weights for trinket grabs or running up number of defenses. I mean, Michalczewski had over 20 ? defenses you'll never see him on some atg p4p. Though maybe Roy could have at least given it a go with him..just maybe. ;D
P4P has become a marketing tag for the most part. A bit like "lineal" :-X
On a side note I've seen massive push for Shakur Stevenson on many. Improved fighter off first major high level scalp..respects to Herring. Shakur is the goods and very sound. But one fight does not make you sure fire elite like p4p imo. So there's that.
Love Estrada. Get's overlooked in spots but honestly...can any list be respected that includes Estrada but not Chocolatito? Arguably he holds two wins over him. But Estrada did unify with split dec. And he beat Wangek who beat Chocolatito twice. But look at the old man ffs..he's a step slower but near fighting at his absolute best, still a boxing craft master. I hate p4p lists
I'd say top so far
Usyk
Crawford
Inoue
Canelo
now it gets hard
Can't stand peoples P4P lists! Who give's a shit? Just make the Crawford-Spence fight and we'll get an answer to who's best in the division!
Easy!
canelo is still ahead of terence
P4P is possibly the worst of the myriad of lists. You only need to look at the justification for Fury's inclusion.
Household name. Mental health. Greatest heavyweights of all time?! Looks destined to regain them (other belts) and reign as undisputed champion.
Being a household name is very nice. Did Frank Bruno ever breach the P4P list? Overcoming mental demons. All power to him. The rest is pure speculation.
If he wasn't P4P in 2019 he shouldn't be now. Because he sincerely hasn't done anything since to elevate his position.
The best pound for pound boxer to me means the best fighter today who could beat anyone if they took their proportionate size, power, and stature and applied it to them taking on any other opponent at any other weight class.
The best pound for pound fighter would also have to be the best or undisputed at their weight and/or won titles at different weight classes.
Using this definition Tyson Fury would not even be considered.
I would not penalise Canelo for taking on someone at a higher weight but would penalise Spence for not proving he is the best at his own weight.
Crawford has won titles at the lower weights, but it is getting to the stage were he has had enough time to take on Spence.
Also just because Bivol beats Canelo he does not take his place, p4p does not work like that. Bivol needs to beat Beterbiev to be on the list.
1. Usyk
2. Canelo
3. Terrence Crawford
4. Naoya Inoue
5. Josh Taylor
6. Juan Francisco Estrada
7. Jermell Charlo
8. Lomachenko
9. Shakur Stevenson
10. George Kambosos Jr
josh shouldn't be on thereQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
Josh is undisputed at the weight and still remains undefeated. One bad fight should not take away all the good work he has done in his career.
One question. If Catterall was given the decision, would you still be ok with Josh Taylor at #5 ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
No, he would be down maybe even out of the top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraOne question. If Catterall was given the decision, would you still be ok with Josh Taylor at #5 ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
There you go.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterNo, he would be down maybe even out of the top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraOne question. If Catterall was given the decision, would you still be ok with Josh Taylor at #5 ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Next question, did you think Taylor beat Catterall?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterNo, he would be down maybe even out of the top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraOne question. If Catterall was given the decision, would you still be ok with Josh Taylor at #5 ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
i thought he lost to jack. not to pick on your list it is nowhere as bad as terence, errol & tyson but do you consider inactivity? el gallo has been out a minute & i thought he lost to chocolatitoQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
Catterall should have got the decision.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraNext question, did you think Taylor beat Catterall?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterNo, he would be down maybe even out of the top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraOne question. If Catterall was given the decision, would you still be ok with Josh Taylor at #5 ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Chocolatito should have got the decision.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICi thought he lost to jack. not to pick on your list it is nowhere as bad as terence, errol & tyson but do you consider inactivity? el gallo has been out a minute & i thought he lost to chocolatitoQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
You mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
Yeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
So you think Taylor lost his last fight, which , regardless of the decision, wouldn’t be particularly impressive.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterCatterall should have got the decision.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraNext question, did you think Taylor beat Catterall?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterNo, he would be down maybe even out of the top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraOne question. If Catterall was given the decision, would you still be ok with Josh Taylor at #5 ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Certainly not impressive enough to be called one of the 5 best boxers on the planet at any weight, wouldn’t you agree?
Look, I’ve written on here many times before, that P4P is a pathetic concept.
All it is good for is to work out the best 2 or 3 boxers on the planet. Start going any deeper than that and it borders on the ridiculous.
True, it is very subjective and can be open to supporting your favourite fighter's. Josh got very lucky and he could have been more humble but he is still the champion. I thought Golovkin beat Canelo twice but officially it was a draw and loss.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo you think Taylor lost his last fight, which , regardless of the decision, wouldn’t be particularly impressive.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterCatterall should have got the decision.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraNext question, did you think Taylor beat Catterall?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterNo, he would be down maybe even out of the top 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraOne question. If Catterall was given the decision, would you still be ok with Josh Taylor at #5 ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Certainly not impressive enough to be called one of the 5 best boxers on the planet at any weight, wouldn’t you agree?
Look, I’ve written on here many times before, that P4P is a pathetic concept.
All it is good for is to work out the best 2 or 3 boxers on the planet. Start going any deeper than that and it borders on the ridiculous.
I agree with you on Crawford.
you don't have oleksandr above terence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
No, of course not. Usyk is a Wonderful Boxer, with an amazing Amateur record. But it’s got to be judged on the pro career surely? And yes he hoovered up the CW Division with ease, but CW is a notoriously shallow division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICyou don't have oleksandr above terence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
And he’s beaten AJ.
To be honest, even if he beats AJ again, then Fury, I probably still wouldn’t have him at #1.
yes judged on pro career. oleksandr's run to unify was much tougher than terence's & he stepped up to the big men & won unified belts. i think inoue is even ahead of terenceQuote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraNo, of course not. Usyk is a Wonderful Boxer, with an amazing Amateur record. But it’s got to be judged on the pro career surely? And yes he hoovered up the CW Division with ease, but CW is a notoriously shallow division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICyou don't have oleksandr above terence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
And he’s beaten AJ.
To be honest, even if he beats AJ again, then Fury, I probably still wouldn’t have him at #1.
Spence is my favorite fighter but I have Bud, I think he’s more natural, I think he takes advantage of Spence pausing and thinking. Getting stuck in what he does rather than being fluid. But who knows, maybe Bud can’t take the physicality. That’s why they have to fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
I’ve long touted Inoue but he needs to learn to take his head off the platter or his chin will fail him sooner or later and it will be a sharp decline. Tuck that chin and maximize your abilities young man
I hope you’re right about Crawford, and fair comment about Inoue. But until he gets tagged, he’s very exciting to watch.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonSpence is my favorite fighter but I have Bud, I think he’s more natural, I think he takes advantage of Spence pausing and thinking. Getting stuck in what he does rather than being fluid. But who knows, maybe Bud can’t take the physicality. That’s why they have to fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
I’ve long touted Inoue but he needs to learn to take his head off the platter or his chin will fail him sooner or later and it will be a sharp decline. Tuck that chin and maximize your abilities young man
If Kambosos beats Haney then he should be on the list.
Usyk won the Olympic gold medal in 2012, he then won his first world title in his tenth fight, when he fought undefeated 26-0 Krzysztof Glowacki in Poland for his WBO belt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraNo, of course not. Usyk is a Wonderful Boxer, with an amazing Amateur record. But it’s got to be judged on the pro career surely? And yes he hoovered up the CW Division with ease, but CW is a notoriously shallow division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICyou don't have oleksandr above terence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
And he’s beaten AJ.
To be honest, even if he beats AJ again, then Fury, I probably still wouldn’t have him at #1.
After defending the WBO title three times, including the then undefeated heavyweight contender Michael Hunter, he won WBC belt against undefeated 23-0 Mairis Briedis in his hometown.
Usyk then wins the undisputed title in Russia, against undefeated 26-0 Murat Gassiev.
After that he beat and thankfully retired the great Tony Bellew who had just beaten David Haye twice.
The second greatest Cruiserweight ever.
So what?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterUsyk won the Olympic gold medal in 2012, he then won his first world title in his tenth fight, when he fought undefeated 26-0 Krzysztof Glowacki in Poland for his WBO belt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraNo, of course not. Usyk is a Wonderful Boxer, with an amazing Amateur record. But it’s got to be judged on the pro career surely? And yes he hoovered up the CW Division with ease, but CW is a notoriously shallow division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICyou don't have oleksandr above terence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
And he’s beaten AJ.
To be honest, even if he beats AJ again, then Fury, I probably still wouldn’t have him at #1.
After defending the WBO title three times, including the then undefeated heavyweight contender Michael Hunter, he won WBC belt against undefeated 23-0 Mairis Briedis in his hometown.
Usyk then wins the undisputed title in Russia, against undefeated 26-0 Murat Gassiev.
After that he beat and thankfully retired the great Tony Bellew who had just beaten David Haye twice.
The second greatest Cruiserweight ever.
so terence's record is very thinQuote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo what?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterUsyk won the Olympic gold medal in 2012, he then won his first world title in his tenth fight, when he fought undefeated 26-0 Krzysztof Glowacki in Poland for his WBO belt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraNo, of course not. Usyk is a Wonderful Boxer, with an amazing Amateur record. But it’s got to be judged on the pro career surely? And yes he hoovered up the CW Division with ease, but CW is a notoriously shallow division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICyou don't have oleksandr above terence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
And he’s beaten AJ.
To be honest, even if he beats AJ again, then Fury, I probably still wouldn’t have him at #1.
After defending the WBO title three times, including the then undefeated heavyweight contender Michael Hunter, he won WBC belt against undefeated 23-0 Mairis Briedis in his hometown.
Usyk then wins the undisputed title in Russia, against undefeated 26-0 Murat Gassiev.
After that he beat and thankfully retired the great Tony Bellew who had just beaten David Haye twice.
The second greatest Cruiserweight ever.
Gamboa, Postol , Beltran , Brook,Porter are better names AND better wins than Glowacki , Hunter, Gassiev , Bellew and Chisora.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICso terence's record is very thinQuote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo what?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterUsyk won the Olympic gold medal in 2012, he then won his first world title in his tenth fight, when he fought undefeated 26-0 Krzysztof Glowacki in Poland for his WBO belt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraNo, of course not. Usyk is a Wonderful Boxer, with an amazing Amateur record. But it’s got to be judged on the pro career surely? And yes he hoovered up the CW Division with ease, but CW is a notoriously shallow division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICyou don't have oleksandr above terence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
And he’s beaten AJ.
To be honest, even if he beats AJ again, then Fury, I probably still wouldn’t have him at #1.
After defending the WBO title three times, including the then undefeated heavyweight contender Michael Hunter, he won WBC belt against undefeated 23-0 Mairis Briedis in his hometown.
Usyk then wins the undisputed title in Russia, against undefeated 26-0 Murat Gassiev.
After that he beat and thankfully retired the great Tony Bellew who had just beaten David Haye twice.
The second greatest Cruiserweight ever.
yuriorkis was a smaller guy. i think viktor is a good win. raymundo was always on the fringe. kell was past it. shawn is a good win. i don't think they are better wins than mairis & aj. murat is a better win. terence has some good wins but oleksandr has fought better opponentsQuote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraGamboa, Postol , Beltran , Brook,Porter are better names AND better wins than Glowacki , Hunter, Gassiev , Bellew and Chisora.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICso terence's record is very thinQuote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo what?Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterUsyk won the Olympic gold medal in 2012, he then won his first world title in his tenth fight, when he fought undefeated 26-0 Krzysztof Glowacki in Poland for his WBO belt.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraNo, of course not. Usyk is a Wonderful Boxer, with an amazing Amateur record. But it’s got to be judged on the pro career surely? And yes he hoovered up the CW Division with ease, but CW is a notoriously shallow division.Quote:
Originally Posted by TICyou don't have oleksandr above terence?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraYeah exactly like, or maybe even do it over 4 divisions like Inoue. Like I said , Inoue is the only one that I possibly put above Bud, but it’s a 50/50 call.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron SwansonYou mean by doing something like winning 16 championship fights over 3 divisions including undisputed in 1 and about to fight for undisputed in another?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraSo I’m racist now, just because I don’t agree with you. :rolleyes: Crawford is one of my favourite current fighters, but Inoue has not been given the respect he deserves.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.
Crawford has been a victim of his previous promoter’s unprofessional work for him. But he signed the contract.
For the record, I believe Crawford is probably the best all round Boxer out there, but you have to create your legacy in the ring.
If Crawford fights and beats Spence (which I hope he does tbh) that settles everything.
You’ve said yourself along the lines of “ Spence would be favourite “ I can’t remember exactly what you said. But Crawford needs that fight to put his career right up there where it belongs.
I have absolutely no criticism of Crawford as a boxer whatsoever, just disappointed in his management choices over his career.
And he’s beaten AJ.
To be honest, even if he beats AJ again, then Fury, I probably still wouldn’t have him at #1.
After defending the WBO title three times, including the then undefeated heavyweight contender Michael Hunter, he won WBC belt against undefeated 23-0 Mairis Briedis in his hometown.
Usyk then wins the undisputed title in Russia, against undefeated 26-0 Murat Gassiev.
After that he beat and thankfully retired the great Tony Bellew who had just beaten David Haye twice.
The second greatest Cruiserweight ever.
I think p4p has become a festering cyst for so many fighters and fans. Really feels like it's cheapened and lost a great deal of any substance and big picture thinking. But of course we knew that when the Ring put Broner at #5 ;D. It's always been subjective but within less than a 1 month span it's a literal flavor of the month now. From 4-30 to 5-22 and then immediately see soooo many insisting Bivol, Stevenson and Charlo just waltz right on to it thus 3 other dropped right off.
They're going to need a bigger list.
you got it. just a bit of fun for me. all the talk around dmitry, shakur & charlo but no love for arturQuote:
Originally Posted by Spicoli
Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
No way is Inoue #5. I'd move him up to #1 and bump the rest down.
Anything other than Inoue as #1 is racist. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamajaAnything other than Crawford as #1 is racist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo CarneraFury at 3 ? He’s nowhere near it. He’s no different to many of the World champions in other divisions.Quote:
Originally Posted by ykdadamaja
Inoue is #1
Crawford needs to fight and beat Spence and that settles everything.