where does that rate in the all time great pac performances??

Am asking this more out of curiosity than general knowledge.

Before saturday night however big a fan of manny i was i still had over riding concerns over certain things.

But saturday was an absoloutley flawless performance and i generally now believe that not only is manny now the greatest p4p boxer in the world, but good enough to actually become a world champion at 140 which is quite astonishing considering his original weight he started off at.

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Am asking this more out of curiosity than general knowledge.

Before saturday night however big a fan of manny i was i still had over riding concerns over certain things.

But saturday was an absoloutley flawless performance and i generally now believe that not only is manny now the greatest p4p boxer in the world, but good enough to actually become a world champion at 140 which is quite astonishing considering his original weight he started off at.

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Even though Diaz is a lesser opponent than Morales, Barrera, Marquez, i think its one of his best. Because he showed great boxing skills and used his right hand in a brilliant way.

It was a great fight, he looks better at 135 in my eyes. I never expected the KO. Did you know he is the first Asian fighter to win belts at 4 weight classes now? If he can win a belt at 140 it would be amazing and I think he could.

Any chance of rematching Marquez ?

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Am asking this more out of curiosity than general knowledge.

Before saturday night however big a fan of manny i was i still had over riding concerns over certain things.

But saturday was an absoloutley flawless performance and i generally now believe that not only is manny now the greatest p4p boxer in the world, but good enough to actually become a world champion at 140 which is quite astonishing considering his original weight he started off at.

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Even though Diaz is a lesser opponent than Morales, Barrera, Marquez, i think its one of his best. Because he showed great boxing skills and used his right hand in a brilliant way.

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Is there any of his earlier fights where he displays this kind of endless 12round raw aggression??

I always fought that 1st barrera fight was pacs most dominant display, but saturday night definetely topped that!!

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Originally Posted by Hughesd

Any chance of rematching Marquez ?

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Yes im sure it will happen if Marquez beats Casamayor.

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Am asking this more out of curiosity than general knowledge.

Before saturday night however big a fan of manny i was i still had over riding concerns over certain things.

But saturday was an absoloutley flawless performance and i generally now believe that not only is manny now the greatest p4p boxer in the world, but good enough to actually become a world champion at 140 which is quite astonishing considering his original weight he started off at.

---

Even though Diaz is a lesser opponent than Morales, Barrera, Marquez, i think its one of his best. Because he showed great boxing skills and used his right hand in a brilliant way.

---

Is there any of his earlier fights where he displays this kind of endless 12round raw aggression??

I always fought that 1st barrera fight was pacs most dominant display, but saturday night definetely topped that!!

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Manny Pacquiao has only gone 12 rounds 5 times, twice with Marquez, once with Barrera, once with Morales, once with Larios.

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

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Originally Posted by ICB

Even though Diaz is a lesser opponent than Morales, Barrera, Marquez, i think its one of his best. Because he showed great boxing skills and used his right hand in a brilliant way.

---

Is there any of his earlier fights where he displays this kind of endless 12round raw aggression??

I always fought that 1st barrera fight was pacs most dominant display, but saturday night definetely topped that!!

---

Manny Pacquiao has only gone 12 rounds 5 times, twice with Marquez, once with Barrera, once with Morales, once with Larios.

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Am i right in saying el terrible is the only one of those that has managed to outpoint him??

what a great great fight that was

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Is there any of his earlier fights where he displays this kind of endless 12round raw aggression??

I always fought that 1st barrera fight was pacs most dominant display, but saturday night definetely topped that!!

---

Manny Pacquiao has only gone 12 rounds 5 times, twice with Marquez, once with Barrera, once with Morales, once with Larios.

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Am i right in saying el terrible is the only one of those that has managed to outpoint him??

what a great great fight that was

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Yep your right Pacquiao's other losses were when he was really young, one was where he was weight drained and got KO'ed by a body shot that looked low to me, but IMO the only boxer who has ever had Pacquiao's number is Marquez, because he circles clockwise and forces Pacquiao to move in a direction which is against his natural power thus taking away his left hand which is his best weapon, and plus because Marquez has excellent timing and he is a counter puncher, he can beat Pacquiao's speed with timing ever heard of the old saying timing beats speed ?? plus he leads with straight right hands right down the pipe and throws left hooks to the body which is perfect against a Southpaw, all these little things are needed when fighting Southpaws and Marquez has got it down to a tee.

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

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Originally Posted by ICB

Manny Pacquiao has only gone 12 rounds 5 times, twice with Marquez, once with Barrera, once with Morales, once with Larios.

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Am i right in saying el terrible is the only one of those that has managed to outpoint him??

what a great great fight that was

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Yep your right Pacquiao's other losses were when he was really young, one was where he was weight drained and got KO'ed by a body shot that looked low to me, but IMO the only boxer who has ever had Pacquiao's number is Marquez, because he circles clockwise and forces Pacquiao to move in a direction which is against his natural power, and plus because he has excellent timing because he is a counter puncher, he can beat Pacquiao's speed with timing ever heard of the old saying timing beats speed ?? plus he leads with straight right hands right down the pipe and throws left hooks to the body, all these little things are needed when fighting Southpaws and Marquez has got it down to a tee.

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I had it 114-112 for marq in the 1st and 114-113 for marq in the 2nd.

The 1st fight in particular grinds my gears still, even with 3 knockdowns you can only ever score a round 10-7 and after that he must of won at least 8 of the remaining 11 rounds!!

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Am i right in saying el terrible is the only one of those that has managed to outpoint him??

what a great great fight that was

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Yep your right Pacquiao's other losses were when he was really young, one was where he was weight drained and got KO'ed by a body shot that looked low to me, but IMO the only boxer who has ever had Pacquiao's number is Marquez, because he circles clockwise and forces Pacquiao to move in a direction which is against his natural power, and plus because he has excellent timing because he is a counter puncher, he can beat Pacquiao's speed with timing ever heard of the old saying timing beats speed ?? plus he leads with straight right hands right down the pipe and throws left hooks to the body, all these little things are needed when fighting Southpaws and Marquez has got it down to a tee.

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I had it 114-112 for marq in the 1st and 114-113 for marq in the 2nd.

The 1st fight in particular grinds my gears still, even with 3 knockdowns you can only ever score a round 10-7 and after that he must of won at least 8 of the remaining 11 rounds!!

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Well i did score it a 10-6 round but i still had Marquez winning by 1 point, and i had him winning the 2nd fight by 1 point as well.

One of his greatest ever, maybe his best. When have we seen Manny utilize hooks and uppercuts so effectively. When have we seen him utilize his footspeed that well. Diaz was a quality opponent and Pac blew him out of the water. Total virtuoso performance.

;D

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Am asking this more out of curiosity than general knowledge.

Before saturday night however big a fan of manny i was i still had over riding concerns over certain things.

But saturday was an absoloutley flawless performance and i generally now believe that not only is manny now the greatest p4p boxer in the world, but good enough to actually become a world champion at 140 which is quite astonishing considering his original weight he started off at.

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THAT SIR IS THE TRUEST POST YOU HAVE EVER MADE.
HAVE SOME REP

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Am i right in saying el terrible is the only one of those that has managed to outpoint him??

what a great great fight that was

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Yep your right Pacquiao's other losses were when he was really young, one was where he was weight drained and got KO'ed by a body shot that looked low to me, but IMO the only boxer who has ever had Pacquiao's number is Marquez, because he circles clockwise and forces Pacquiao to move in a direction which is against his natural power, and plus because he has excellent timing because he is a counter puncher, he can beat Pacquiao's speed with timing ever heard of the old saying timing beats speed ?? plus he leads with straight right hands right down the pipe and throws left hooks to the body, all these little things are needed when fighting Southpaws and Marquez has got it down to a tee.

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I had it 114-112 for marq in the 1st and 114-113 for marq in the 2nd.

The 1st fight in particular grinds my gears still, even with 3 knockdowns you can only ever score a round 10-7 and after that he must of won at least 8 of the remaining 11 rounds!!

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The more I watch the second fight I can't see how people have Marquez winning, it was definitely a close fight, but compubox was BS in that fight, and Marquez didn't clearly win as many rounds as Pcaquaio in that fight. Same with the first fight NO WAY did Marquez win 8 of the 11 rounds. Watch them again. marquez wins the middle rounds in both fights then Pacquaio comes back late.

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

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Originally Posted by ICB

Yep your right Pacquiao's other losses were when he was really young, one was where he was weight drained and got KO'ed by a body shot that looked low to me, but IMO the only boxer who has ever had Pacquiao's number is Marquez, because he circles clockwise and forces Pacquiao to move in a direction which is against his natural power, and plus because he has excellent timing because he is a counter puncher, he can beat Pacquiao's speed with timing ever heard of the old saying timing beats speed ?? plus he leads with straight right hands right down the pipe and throws left hooks to the body, all these little things are needed when fighting Southpaws and Marquez has got it down to a tee.

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I had it 114-112 for marq in the 1st and 114-113 for marq in the 2nd.

The 1st fight in particular grinds my gears still, even with 3 knockdowns you can only ever score a round 10-7 and after that he must of won at least 8 of the remaining 11 rounds!!

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The more I watch the second fight I can't see how people have Marquez winning, it was definitely a close fight, but compubox was BS in that fight, and Marquez didn't clearly win as many rounds as Pcaquaio in that fight. Same with the first fight NO WAY did Marquez win 8 of the 11 rounds. Watch them again. marquez wins the middle rounds in both fights then Pacquaio comes back late.

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I thought Marquez swept the last 2 rounds in there 2nd fight.

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

I had it 114-112 for marq in the 1st and 114-113 for marq in the 2nd.

The 1st fight in particular grinds my gears still, even with 3 knockdowns you can only ever score a round 10-7 and after that he must of won at least 8 of the remaining 11 rounds!!

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The more I watch the second fight I can't see how people have Marquez winning, it was definitely a close fight, but compubox was BS in that fight, and Marquez didn't clearly win as many rounds as Pcaquaio in that fight. Same with the first fight NO WAY did Marquez win 8 of the 11 rounds. Watch them again. marquez wins the middle rounds in both fights then Pacquaio comes back late.

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I thought Marquez swept the last 2 rounds in there 2nd fight.

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As for the 11th Pacquaio clearly won it, He landed more left straights than Marquez landed straight rights, and Pacquaio landed a few counter right hooks, he controlled the action, he showed better defense to me.
But Marquez only won 3-4 of the middle rounds while Pacquaio dominated the begining and around the 8th or 9th

I also watched the first fight last night, and people who think Marquez got robbed in either of these fights have no idea what they are talking about. IMO he did not deserve the second fight, and the first fight was a little closer, but he didn't dominate even close to as many rounds as people are making it out to be. Even in having Pacquaio's number Marquez was still not quite Pacman's equal in the ring.

Dominating wasn't a good word, a lot of the rounds were competitive, but pacquaio started winning the roungs convincingly for me around 8 or 9 I can't remember I haven't see nthe fight in awhile

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by Taeth

The more I watch the second fight I can't see how people have Marquez winning, it was definitely a close fight, but compubox was BS in that fight, and Marquez didn't clearly win as many rounds as Pcaquaio in that fight. Same with the first fight NO WAY did Marquez win 8 of the 11 rounds. Watch them again. marquez wins the middle rounds in both fights then Pacquaio comes back late.

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I thought Marquez swept the last 2 rounds in there 2nd fight.

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As for the 11th Pacquaio clearly won it, He landed more left straights than Marquez landed straight rights, and Pacquaio landed a few counter right hooks, he controlled the action, he showed better defense to me.
But Marquez only won 3-4 of the middle rounds while Pacquaio dominated the begining and around the 8th or 9th

I also watched the first fight last night, and people who think Marquez got robbed in either of these fights have no idea what they are talking about. IMO he did not deserve the second fight, and the first fight was a little closer, but he didn't dominate even close to as many rounds as people are making it out to be. Even in having Pacquaio's number Marquez was still not quite Pacman's equal in the ring.

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I'll quickly watch the 11th round now.

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Originally Posted by ICB

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Originally Posted by Taeth

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Originally Posted by ICB

I thought Marquez swept the last 2 rounds in there 2nd fight.

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As for the 11th Pacquaio clearly won it, He landed more left straights than Marquez landed straight rights, and Pacquaio landed a few counter right hooks, he controlled the action, he showed better defense to me.
But Marquez only won 3-4 of the middle rounds while Pacquaio dominated the begining and around the 8th or 9th

I also watched the first fight last night, and people who think Marquez got robbed in either of these fights have no idea what they are talking about. IMO he did not deserve the second fight, and the first fight was a little closer, but he didn't dominate even close to as many rounds as people are making it out to be. Even in having Pacquaio's number Marquez was still not quite Pacman's equal in the ring.

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I'll quickly watch the 11th round now.

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So I must be right, huh? This is the round (11th) I've been telling you (ICB) to watch again, remember?

http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxingfor...tml#post498834

Pac clearly won it.

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Originally Posted by hattonthehammer

Am asking this more out of curiosity than general knowledge.

Before saturday night however big a fan of manny i was i still had over riding concerns over certain things.

But saturday was an absoloutley flawless performance and i generally now believe that not only is manny now the greatest p4p boxer in the world, but good enough to actually become a world champion at 140 which is quite astonishing considering his original weight he started off at.

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As far as skills set goes it's def. up there.

But the fact that the quality of opposition was not good knocks it down IMO.

I'll throw in my two cents on the Pacquiao vs Marquez fights.

I've watched the first fight approximately 6 times. I had Pacquiao winning once, Marquez winning once, and the rest of the time a draw. The second fight, I still score the same after having seen it three times, I have Pac winning by one point. The fact of the matter was, it was such an evenly fought match. Marquez had clearly won some rounds, also Pacquiao as well, but there were a couple of rounds that EASILY could've gone either way.

In regards to the Diaz fight in his all-time performances, the ones that stick out in my mind

Equally great performances between:
-Pacquiao vs Ledwaba: Having only trained for two weeks prior to the fight and COMPLETELY BATTERED a world champion sure was a thing of beauty. Also was his first HBO fight. With those things in mind, not exactly a recipe for success but he did somehow pull it off.

Pacquiao vs Diaz: Hopefully I remember the specifics of the fight, being that I was BLASTED before the fight started. Manny fought perfectly! He fought well being backed up, came forward, flurried, then got out of there, also countering with ease. Given Diaz isn't exactly all the skilled, I've never seen Manny fight such a calculated, disciplined fight. I'm used to seeing him press the action.

-Pacquiao vs Morales III: He was furious the whole way through and threw punches with incredible speed and power.

By far his best performance:
-Pacquiao vs Barrera I: He just completely applied the pressure and never let up. A perfect performance for his first big fight.

When it comes to knock outs, these two stand out:

The famous standing ktfo!
http://youtube.com/watch?v=lykODy0mKl4

And the uppercut from hell!
http://youtube.com/watch?v=qRtFcKZ8o6A

But complete performance my personal favorite would be these:

Versus the half filipin half australian Makelin, pac relentlessly broke this guys rib all fight long. IMO pac was at his most aggressive in this fight til Scott Makelins corner threw in the towel.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=qMbDoubd9gA&feature=related

The destruction of Ledwaba!
http://youtube.com/watch?v=aVhgiLMukIo

Pac in the undercard of lewis tyson, he made quick work of julio.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=HiUGEVTlSyM&feature=related

Versus Mabman, Pac was just too much.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=i_2ooXdcxLQ&feature=related

And Ofcourse ending the third in three!
http://youtube.com/watch?v=YT4KeEIfQpA&feature=related

Pac best performance will always be the destruction of Jorge Julio. A fighter who had only lost by decision before. And that was to top fights like Johnny Tapia and Junior Jones. Pac crushed him in 2.