would he be a p4p king?
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would he be a p4p king?
Depends exactly what time, and what weight class he were in. PBF is not one of those guys like Castillo or Corrales who cuts a lot of weight, so I can see him fighting in these lower classes under the old rules.
At 130-135, I make PBF a slight underdog against Camacho and Chavez.
At 140, like-wise, I make him a slight underdog against Pryor.
At 147, there's a fairly decent sized list of guys I'd make the favorite over PBF.
Camacho flustered easily,I see him just leading him around the ring for a decisionQuote:
Originally Posted by Thread Stealer
Pryor hit so damned hard Id see that putting Floyd off his game
I thought Rosario beat Camacho and took him out of his game, but he was a sick puncher who made Camacho run like Forrest Gump. Mayweather is an accurate puncher, but not an especially powerful one, even at the lower weight classes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyCamacho flustered easily,I see him just leading him around the ring for a decisionQuote:
Originally Posted by Thread Stealer
Pryor hit so damned hard Id see that putting Floyd off his game
Pryor's workrate, pressure, and whirlwind style would give Mayweather (and just about any jr. welter) problems. It's more the constant activity that would bother Mayweather IMO than the power. Pryor could punch but it wasn't like he had freakish power.
Quote:
Originally Posted by canary
He would be dead
I think Floyd has better backword footwork then Rosario,he suckered Manfreddy constantlyId bet Macho falls for that,and when he gets flustered when he cant work a guy outQuote:
Originally Posted by Thread StealerI thought Rosario beat Camacho and took him out of his game, but he was a sick puncher who made Camacho run like Forrest Gump. Mayweather is an accurate puncher, but not an especially powerful one, even at the lower weight classes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyCamacho flustered easily,I see him just leading him around the ring for a decisionQuote:
Originally Posted by Thread Stealer
Pryor hit so damned hard Id see that putting Floyd off his game
Pryor's workrate, pressure, and whirlwind style would give Mayweather (and just about any jr. welter) problems. It's more the constant activity that would bother Mayweather IMO than the power. Pryor could punch but it wasn't like he had freakish power.
Pryor had evil power at that weight,I think if Floyd tasted it,he'd be worrying
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer MonkeyQuote:
Originally Posted by Thread StealerI thought Rosario beat Camacho and took him out of his game, but he was a sick puncher who made Camacho run like Forrest Gump. Mayweather is an accurate puncher, but not an especially powerful one, even at the lower weight classes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
Pryor's workrate, pressure, and whirlwind style would give Mayweather (and just about any jr. welter) problems. It's more the constant activity that would bother Mayweather IMO than the power. Pryor could punch but it wasn't like he had freakish power.
I think Floyd has better backword footwork then Rosario,he suckered Manfreddy constantlyId bet Macho falls for that,and when he gets flustered when he cant work a guy out
Pryor had evil power at that weight,I think if Floyd tasted it,he'd be worrying
DOnt get me wrong im no boxing historian, but i have seen my fair share of fights and a good amount of fighters. To me floyd is the smartest and most calm i have ever seen. he can make his opponenet do things that he do things that set up his own puncges and his denfense is definately the best ive ever seen. I have yet to see him get flustered or worryed. I have seen one or two of pryors fights so i dont really kno all that much about him but in my mind hed have to hit like ernie shavers to "worry" floyd.
No disparaging of Floyd,but Pryor had out of nowhere power,he'd give Camacho fits though
Floyd would beat Macho no doubt.
But at 130-135 out of the 80s i think Chavez beats him and Duran obliterates him. At 140 the Hawlk would stop him.
At 147 hearns would toast him and Leonard would punch him all over the ring.
I actually think Oscar, Tito and Mosley in their prime would beat him he just isnt busy enough.
I don't see this amazing power of Pryor that you're talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Trainer Monkey
When I think of freakish punchers, I think of fighters like Jackson, Foreman, Zarate, Gomez, Arguello, etc...
When I think of Pryor, I see him as a solid hitter with terrific workrate and activity, and who could swarm and punch from numerous and unusual angles. Against most of the guys that he stopped in title bouts, fighters like Cervantes, Arguello, Johnson, Kameda, etc....it was just the non-stop activity and avalanche of punches.
It wasn't one of those "oh damn, one punch totally changed the fight" type things or "this guy is getting messed up from every clean punch landing".
It was more like "how can I get away from all these shots, this guy never stops throwing??!!"
Pryor would likely beat him, but Floyd would have avoided him if he was fighting in that era.
For someone to say that Floyd would get knocked out by anyone, wouldn't they first have to see him get hurt by someone? I mean I saw him get outworked in Castillo I, but I have never seen him hurt.
^^^ i agree i have never seen him hurt, worried, flustered, or panicked. He has one recorded knockdown and it was because he broke his hand and accidentally let his knee touch the canvas but brought it right back up.
Not pound for pound king, but he would have been the No.1 Lightweight in the world.
You can bet he would have stayed put at Lightweight and cleared it, because stepping up was a formidable task.
Agreed but who were the Lightweight kings in the 80's?
It's true...he has never been truly hurt or knocked down...but then again...his resume isn't filled with highly dangerous opponents. Oscar was the closest he ever got to fighting a highly skilled fighter who could maybe hurt him. But Oscar wasn't exactly a young buck when they fought. Floyd is a great defensive fighter...no question. But how he would have fared against the likes of Duran, Hearns, or Hagler is a whole different question. Those fighters, along with guys like Pryor and Leonard, where in a whole different class than the guys Floyd has fought in his career. I'm not saying they would have knocked Floyd out...but i just don't think his resume should be a measuring stick for how would have fared aginst some of the all time greats.Quote:
Originally Posted by DAWGSWIN
Mayweather would have beaten Chavez or Camacho, Camacho wasn't as good as PBF in any way, and Chavez didn't do well against moves.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thread Stealer
I also see him beating Pryor because once against he is too quick, and too hard to hit.
I see Hearns giving Mayweather a lot of difficulties, but we don't know if Mayweather could handle Hearns' punch or not, if Mayweather can avoid Hearns' punches like he did against Oscar I see him winning, if he can't I see Hearns winning UD.
I think Hearns wins a 12 round fight, but Mayweather would win a 15 round fihgt against Hearns because of his great stamina and ability to fight so well late in a fight. I find Mayweather having an impossible time trying to out box Hearns from the outside, but I truly believe he would find a way to clsoe the gap, whether by going underneath Hearns' jab or using that right hand he used against Hatton. Regardless I think Floyd would fight a much more Pernell Whitaker type toe to toe fight with Hearns which basically how he fought Hearns, much less movement, standing there and relying on his speed and defensive skills.
I think Mayweather the hardest time with Duran or Leonard, Leonard can match Mayweather with speed, but he has the height advantage, but that would be a close fight with Leonard a favorite to many, and he has that great jab. The one thing I see Floyd being able to win is that those fast combinations would be useless against his defense, I think Leonard was easier to read in terms of what he was going to do, and Mayweather has the better defense. Instead of Leonard's power because he's a natural welterweight, I think its his jab alone that gives Mayweather all kinds of trouble. Leonard is close to as fast or as fast as Floyd at WW, and I think that PBF would have troubles with that jab because Leonard could cover so much distance to land it, and he knew how to use to so well on teh outisde(Like against Benitez), however PBF would adapt like Wilfred did, and I think this fight gets really interesting as it progresses. THis is Mayweather most difficult fight IMO.
I think DUran is a problem because he's a lot harder to hit then Chavez, he hits as hard as Chavez, when its comes to Floyd's power he is as hard to hurt as Chavez, and he was faster/better then Chavez. I think DUran had problems against Leonard in the second fihgt, but Floyd has never moved that much at welterweight, I think it would be a great fight off the ropes with Floyd fighting like he did against Hatton, but Duran doing better than Hatton offensively. I think this fight is a toss up.
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Originally Posted by zhubinIt's true...he has never been truly hurt or knocked down...but then again...his resume isn't filled with highly dangerous opponents. Oscar was the closest he ever got to fighting a highly skilled fighter who could maybe hurt him. But Oscar wasn't exactly a young buck when they fought. Floyd is a great defensive fighter...no question. But how he would have fared against the likes of Duran, Hearns, or Hagler is a whole different question. Those fighters, along with guys like Pryor and Leonard, where in a whole different class than the guys Floyd has fought in his career. I'm not saying they would have knocked Floyd out...but i just don't think his resume should be a measuring stick for how would have fared aginst some of the all time greats.Quote:
Originally Posted by DAWGSWIN
You can see Pryor was a better fighter than Castilllo and Corrales, but you can't deny their power. Castillo had a crazy KO record before he got older, and Corrales hit as hard as anyone I've seen in the lower weight categories. Oscar is undoubtably a great fighter, as great as Hearns, Pryor, etc. and a guy who could stand in there with Leonard and Duran and hold his own.
Lets for arguments sake drag his career back 20 years,which would put the 1980s in the 2000s if u get me?! Im a bit drunk but hey,I think this works.... Floyd was at 130/SFW 1976/1996 Who did he fight?? # 135/LW 1982/2002 Who did he fight?? # 140/LWW 1983/2003 Who did he fight?? # 147/WW 1985/2005 Who did he fight?? # 154/LMW 1987/2007 Who did he fight??#
If that doesn't work/cant be arsed! just picure him getting smashed round the Ring at whatever weight that takes your fancy by Duran,Benitez,Pryor,Hearns,Leonard,Chavez;D
I think too many guys on here are letting their dislike of Floyd cloud their judgement.
There is also a classic case of seeing older fighters with rose coloured glasses during this thread.
Some have said that Chavez would beat him easy. I doubt this, chavez had problems with slick fighters, and Floyd may be the slickest of all time.
As for Camacho, Floyd would have beat him wide UD.
Its true Pryor had great power, but he has to land on PBF to do any damage and that is far harder done than said. Pryor usually had more stamina than his opponents, but Floyd could match him there too.
Duran would be the toughest test at 135-140, but even the great Roberto Duran had his flaws. Floyd could easily frustrate him.
I know i'll get called names for this, but i believe Floyd would be a top 3 P4P guy at any era. Never before has a guy gone 38-0 against the type of fighters Floyd has beat and never really looked in big trouble. I daresay he beats anyone at 130 ever, would be competitive against any 135 or 140 pounder ever and may well be a top 10 147 fighter ever. If thats not good P4P credentials, what are.
I am not questioning Castillo and Corrales power. But neither was truly a great all around fighter. And neither was anywhere near as good as guys like Hearns, Pryor, or some of the other greats from the 70's and 80's. Skill wise...Oscar is by far the best fighter Floyd has faced. And as highly as i rank Oscar's skills...i just can't put him in the same category as some of the greats we have mentioned. With arguments like this...there really cannot be a definitive answer. Just a lot of "what ifs." I just personally have never seen Floyd against a truly great, prime fighter. Does that mean i don't think he could beat some of the past all time greats...no. It's just that his resume doesn't inspire supreme confidence in these match up. Just my opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethQuote:
Originally Posted by zhubinIt's true...he has never been truly hurt or knocked down...but then again...his resume isn't filled with highly dangerous opponents. Oscar was the closest he ever got to fighting a highly skilled fighter who could maybe hurt him. But Oscar wasn't exactly a young buck when they fought. Floyd is a great defensive fighter...no question. But how he would have fared against the likes of Duran, Hearns, or Hagler is a whole different question. Those fighters, along with guys like Pryor and Leonard, where in a whole different class than the guys Floyd has fought in his career. I'm not saying they would have knocked Floyd out...but i just don't think his resume should be a measuring stick for how would have fared aginst some of the all time greats.Quote:
Originally Posted by DAWGSWIN
You can see Pryor was a better fighter than Castilllo and Corrales, but you can't deny their power. Castillo had a crazy KO record before he got older, and Corrales hit as hard as anyone I've seen in the lower weight categories. Oscar is undoubtably a great fighter, as great as Hearns, Pryor, etc. and a guy who could stand in there with Leonard and Duran and hold his own.
@ 135
id take duran against floyd anytime. if castillo can hit floyd with clean shots, imagine what more somebody like duran could do at 135. if duran can close the gap to leonard at 147, what something special floyd has got to keep duran at bay? footwork, speed and jabs? loz. duran at 135 would swarm all over him.
@ 140
benitez is the guy. you cant outbox a master boxer in his home division. floyd has the grace and speed but benitez is simply much better than him in many respects. he can box and mix it up (even with bigger guys) when need be. benitez has all the tools to beat floyd: power, forward offense, non-stop aggression, speed, grace and top notch defensive abilities. its not even close imo
@ 147
benitez, duran, leonard, hearns. no way floyd could win any of these fights.
@154
forget it. those guys wins against him anytime by murder
Duran was finishing up at Lightweight. It's unlikely they would have crossed paths.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Chavez and Camacho would have been outclassed.
Sugar Shane Mosely came along in the early nineties....
had his first championship in 1994.
I would be rooting for JCC against Mayweather at Lightweight, and the greats above this weight Pryor, Hearns and Leonard would beat Mayweather if he decided to fight them. He probably would have settled for Comacho and Rosario, good but not great.
As would every other fighter you'll mention in the Floyd Mayweather Jr p4p era because he was better then them all :)Quote:
Originally Posted by PRIDE OF BOSTONQuote:
Originally Posted by canary
He would be dead
Also why does everyone bring up the Castillo fight? that wasn't mayweather at his best and I think we've all seen that and people just have to start admitting it.
The castillo fight has no relevance whatsoever anymore because we've seen Mayweather at what we feel is his peak and it wasn't against Castillo.
Don't short change Mayweather's ability because the fighters in the 80s are your more favorite or because they were tougher.
You should look at the styles of the fighters.
Most fans seem to have the misnomer that if they admit a fighter of this generation can beat a fighter in the past that they are saying that boxer of this generation is a better boxer, so they protect their favorites and throw them the people they don't care about a lot just to give them some credit.
Which is why I see people saying he couldn't beat Duran but are handing him camacho.
Mayweather would outbox Duran. Doesn't make him greater then Duran.
Mayweather would outbox Chavez.
Mayweather could beat Aaron Pryor because he wouldn't get drawn into a fight with him. Aaron was tough as nails and could take your best punch. But don't overrate one and underrate the other, Mayweather is one of the most gifted boxers of his time and is one of the top greatest fighters of his generation. The first being Roy Jones Jr. Mayweather is second on that list, no questions, and you don't get that kind of spot for nothing.
So don't discredit Mayweather because he isn't your cup of tea, the fact is he is one of the greatest boxers to ever grace the ring and he can hang with the 80s legends.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thread Stealer
Agree with the slight underdog against Camacho...Not that he is better then Chavez was but his style was one where Floyd would have to be the agressor and it was hard to pin Camacho down to hit him at that stage...IMO the bout with Chavez would be a toss up
Pryor KO's Floyd at 140...If Floyd tried to lay on the ropes and counter he would have been hospitalized
At 147 Leonard, Hearns both beat him
I dont know? Ray Mancini and who is my all time fav but Floyd would eat him up. Just like the Gatti fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Your an idiot, all these guys except Benitez you have validity in them beating Mayweather, but how you say it would happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by canary
1) Duran couldn't close the gap against Leonard when Leonard moved in their second fight which is partly why Duran QUIT. Mayweather is faster at lightweight then Leonard was at welterweight, he is harder hit then Leonard, DUran fights nothing like Castillo, and at lightweight he wasn't the same defensive fighter he became later on.
2) Benitez is not better then Floyd in any aspect except maybe punching power, Floyd has better speed, defensive abilities, stamina, offense, grace, balance, etc. Benitez was a great fighter, but he was a poor man's FLoyd Mayweather.
3) Hearns, Duran, And Leonard at WW are valid people to beat Mayweather: But there is an honest argument for Mayweather to beat any of them.
Hearns: Is impossible for a little man to outbox, but his inferior inside skills, and lack of stamina would be things Mayweather would take advantage of.
Leonard: IMO the best of the 80's is fast, hits pretty hard, but he is telegraphed on the outside, but Benitez, Duran, etc. weren't fast enough to take advantage of that, and his flurry would be useless against Mayweather because they wouldn't land quickly. I could easily see LEoanrd winning on points by being more active, and his jab is a nightmare for Mayweather, but he is redundant in what he does in the ring and Mayweather would figure it out and make it close.
Duran: Much better defensively by the time he reached the WW division, he honed his skills a lot more and he was a lot stronger by this point. I think he would try to fight the same fight he did against Leonard, and I honestly don't know how this fight goes. Hatton used a similar style against Mayweather, but despite HAtton being faster then DUran he is in no way Duran...
That being said Its impossible to say where Mayweather compares to these because he dominated the opponents he fought just as much if not more then Leonard, DUran, Hagler, Hearns, etc. defeated what I would consider the same level of opponents they fought.
Good post. Interesting to note that the two guys most likely to beat PBF from the 80's (Leonard, Hearns) were both started at 147 where PBF started at 130 so it is not really a fair comparison is it?Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethYour an idiot, all these guys except Benitez you have validity in them beating Mayweather, but how you say it would happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by canary
1) Duran couldn't close the gap against Leonard when Leonard moved in their second fight which is partly why Duran QUIT. Mayweather is faster at lightweight then Leonard was at welterweight, he is harder hit then Leonard, DUran fights nothing like Castillo, and at lightweight he wasn't the same defensive fighter he became later on.
2) Benitez is not better then Floyd in any aspect except maybe punching power, Floyd has better speed, defensive abilities, stamina, offense, grace, balance, etc. Benitez was a great fighter, but he was a poor man's FLoyd Mayweather.
3) Hearns, Duran, And Leonard at WW are valid people to beat Mayweather: But there is an honest argument for Mayweather to beat any of them.
Hearns: Is impossible for a little man to outbox, but his inferior inside skills, and lack of stamina would be things Mayweather would take advantage of.
Leonard: IMO the best of the 80's is fast, hits pretty hard, but he is telegraphed on the outside, but Benitez, Duran, etc. weren't fast enough to take advantage of that, and his flurry would be useless against Mayweather because they wouldn't land quickly. I could easily see LEoanrd winning on points by being more active, and his jab is a nightmare for Mayweather, but he is redundant in what he does in the ring and Mayweather would figure it out and make it close.
Duran: Much better defensively by the time he reached the WW division, he honed his skills a lot more and he was a lot stronger by this point. I think he would try to fight the same fight he did against Leonard, and I honestly don't know how this fight goes. Hatton used a similar style against Mayweather, but despite HAtton being faster then DUran he is in no way Duran...
That being said Its impossible to say where Mayweather compares to these because he dominated the opponents he fought just as much if not more then Leonard, DUran, Hagler, Hearns, etc. defeated what I would consider the same level of opponents they fought.
Floyd's opponents are no where near the level of fighters from 70's and 80's. As i have said before...the best fighter, BY FAR, that Floyd has fought...is a 35 year old Oscar. Guys like Duran, Leonard, Hearns, Hagler...fought each other at their primes.Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethYour an idiot, all these guys except Benitez you have validity in them beating Mayweather, but how you say it would happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by canary
1) Duran couldn't close the gap against Leonard when Leonard moved in their second fight which is partly why Duran QUIT. Mayweather is faster at lightweight then Leonard was at welterweight, he is harder hit then Leonard, DUran fights nothing like Castillo, and at lightweight he wasn't the same defensive fighter he became later on.
2) Benitez is not better then Floyd in any aspect except maybe punching power, Floyd has better speed, defensive abilities, stamina, offense, grace, balance, etc. Benitez was a great fighter, but he was a poor man's FLoyd Mayweather.
3) Hearns, Duran, And Leonard at WW are valid people to beat Mayweather: But there is an honest argument for Mayweather to beat any of them.
Hearns: Is impossible for a little man to outbox, but his inferior inside skills, and lack of stamina would be things Mayweather would take advantage of.
Leonard: IMO the best of the 80's is fast, hits pretty hard, but he is telegraphed on the outside, but Benitez, Duran, etc. weren't fast enough to take advantage of that, and his flurry would be useless against Mayweather because they wouldn't land quickly. I could easily see LEoanrd winning on points by being more active, and his jab is a nightmare for Mayweather, but he is redundant in what he does in the ring and Mayweather would figure it out and make it close.
Duran: Much better defensively by the time he reached the WW division, he honed his skills a lot more and he was a lot stronger by this point. I think he would try to fight the same fight he did against Leonard, and I honestly don't know how this fight goes. Hatton used a similar style against Mayweather, but despite HAtton being faster then DUran he is in no way Duran...
That being said Its impossible to say where Mayweather compares to these because he dominated the opponents he fought just as much if not more then Leonard, DUran, Hagler, Hearns, etc. defeated what I would consider the same level of opponents they fought.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zhubinFloyd's opponents are no where near the level of fighters from 70's and 80's. As i have said before...the best fighter, BY FAR, that Floyd has fought...is a 35 year old Oscar. Guys like Duran, Leonard, Hearns, Hagler...fought each other at their primes.Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethYour an idiot, all these guys except Benitez you have validity in them beating Mayweather, but how you say it would happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by canary
1) Duran couldn't close the gap against Leonard when Leonard moved in their second fight which is partly why Duran QUIT. Mayweather is faster at lightweight then Leonard was at welterweight, he is harder hit then Leonard, DUran fights nothing like Castillo, and at lightweight he wasn't the same defensive fighter he became later on.
2) Benitez is not better then Floyd in any aspect except maybe punching power, Floyd has better speed, defensive abilities, stamina, offense, grace, balance, etc. Benitez was a great fighter, but he was a poor man's FLoyd Mayweather.
3) Hearns, Duran, And Leonard at WW are valid people to beat Mayweather: But there is an honest argument for Mayweather to beat any of them.
Hearns: Is impossible for a little man to outbox, but his inferior inside skills, and lack of stamina would be things Mayweather would take advantage of.
Leonard: IMO the best of the 80's is fast, hits pretty hard, but he is telegraphed on the outside, but Benitez, Duran, etc. weren't fast enough to take advantage of that, and his flurry would be useless against Mayweather because they wouldn't land quickly. I could easily see LEoanrd winning on points by being more active, and his jab is a nightmare for Mayweather, but he is redundant in what he does in the ring and Mayweather would figure it out and make it close.
Duran: Much better defensively by the time he reached the WW division, he honed his skills a lot more and he was a lot stronger by this point. I think he would try to fight the same fight he did against Leonard, and I honestly don't know how this fight goes. Hatton used a similar style against Mayweather, but despite HAtton being faster then DUran he is in no way Duran...
That being said Its impossible to say where Mayweather compares to these because he dominated the opponents he fought just as much if not more then Leonard, DUran, Hagler, Hearns, etc. defeated what I would consider the same level of opponents they fought.
:rolleyes:
Good, mature response.Quote:
Originally Posted by eagleQuote:
Originally Posted by zhubinFloyd's opponents are no where near the level of fighters from 70's and 80's. As i have said before...the best fighter, BY FAR, that Floyd has fought...is a 35 year old Oscar. Guys like Duran, Leonard, Hearns, Hagler...fought each other at their primes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
:rolleyes:
It's a little unfair (and actually a compliment to Floyd) to compare Mayweather to guys like Hearns and Leonard.
Mayweather started at 130, and that was probably his best weight class. Mayweather's fourth weight class was 147, and unlike some other fighters, it wasn't a case where Mayweather was huge at 130 and 135 and didn't belong there. Guys back at 130 and 135 like Chico and Castillo were outweighing him by 10 pounds on fight night. Hearns and Leonard started at 147, and were successful at higher weight classes.
It's like holding it against Whitaker because he would likely lose to Hearns at 147, or McCallum or Norris at 154.
I agree to an extent. But that's exactly why i think he would have a tough time against those past all time greats. Guys like Hearns, Leonard, Hagler, Duran...where MUCH better fighters than anyone Floyd has ever faced. I have never said Floyd wouldn't stand a chance or even beat them...just saying his resume doesn't inspire confidence IMO.Quote:
Originally Posted by Thread Stealer
Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethYour an idiot, all these guys except Benitez you have validity in them beating Mayweather, but how you say it would happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by canary
1) Duran couldn't close the gap against Leonard when Leonard moved in their second fight which is partly why Duran QUIT. Mayweather is faster at lightweight then Leonard was at welterweight, he is harder hit then Leonard, DUran fights nothing like Castillo, and at lightweight he wasn't the same defensive fighter he became later on.
2) Benitez is not better then Floyd in any aspect except maybe punching power, Floyd has better speed, defensive abilities, stamina, offense, grace, balance, etc. Benitez was a great fighter, but he was a poor man's FLoyd Mayweather.
3) Hearns, Duran, And Leonard at WW are valid people to beat Mayweather: But there is an honest argument for Mayweather to beat any of them.
Hearns: Is impossible for a little man to outbox, but his inferior inside skills, and lack of stamina would be things Mayweather would take advantage of.
Leonard: IMO the best of the 80's is fast, hits pretty hard, but he is telegraphed on the outside, but Benitez, Duran, etc. weren't fast enough to take advantage of that, and his flurry would be useless against Mayweather because they wouldn't land quickly. I could easily see LEoanrd winning on points by being more active, and his jab is a nightmare for Mayweather, but he is redundant in what he does in the ring and Mayweather would figure it out and make it close.
Duran: Much better defensively by the time he reached the WW division, he honed his skills a lot more and he was a lot stronger by this point. I think he would try to fight the same fight he did against Leonard, and I honestly don't know how this fight goes. Hatton used a similar style against Mayweather, but despite HAtton being faster then DUran he is in no way Duran...
That being said Its impossible to say where Mayweather compares to these because he dominated the opponents he fought just as much if not more then Leonard, DUran, Hagler, Hearns, etc. defeated what I would consider the same level of opponents they fought.
Mayweather would not take the chance of getting witin hitting rang of Hearns to even attempt to outbox him on the inside....Leonard was a hell of a lot harder hitter then Floyd also...
Agreed on the Hatton Duran comparison at 147 but at 135 even with the lack of defense Duran beats Floyd...at 147 actually might pick Floyd but funny enough at 154 the version of Duran that beat Davey Moore beats Floyd...Not that Moore was a better fighter then Floyd in any way just that Duran seemed rejuvinated
Do you think the Duran that beat Leonard could not beat Mayweather at 147lb? I think Mayweather is a great at 135 and below but not above.
I have a very tough time picking Mayweather over the Duran in Montreal, or the one who beat Palomino.
Mayweather is a special fighter, so I think he'll have his moments and give Duran fits and be competitive, but as far as beating Duran?
I'd make Mayweather the underdog.
U continually compare Floyd to Hagler, Hearns and Leonard, all guys who started atleast at 147 and in haglers case 160. Floyd started at 130 and is much smaller than all these guys. The main reason they woud beat him is cos they are far bigger. If they were all the same size as Floyd it would tip the scales back in hi favour massively. Of the guys u named Duran is probably the only fair comparison cos he started in the small weights, and i'd give PBF a great chance v Duran cos he' frustrate Roberto even more than Leonard did.Quote:
Originally Posted by zhubinGood, mature response.Quote:
Originally Posted by eagleQuote:
Originally Posted by zhubin
:rolleyes:
This post asked would Floyd be the p4p king if he fought guys from the 80's. I understand that Floyd started at the lighter weight classes. But he obviously is now fighting as a welterweight...hence...in the 80's he would have faced (if he had the courage too) guys like Leonard and Hearns. He certainly could have faced Duran at the lighter weights...but Duran too could have gone up to Weleterweight. Hagler was 160. But i wouldn't have been shocked if he found a way to meet at a catch weight. After all, Floyd fought Oscar at 154. Also, if you are trying to say size is the only advantage guys like Hearns, Leonard, or Hagler had...i completely disagree. They where also ALL AROUND much better fighters than anyone Floyd has ever faced.Quote:
Originally Posted by eagleU continually compare Floyd to Hagler, Hearns and Leonard, all guys who started atleast at 147 and in haglers case 160. Floyd started at 130 and is much smaller than all these guys. The main reason they woud beat him is cos they are far bigger. If they were all the same size as Floyd it would tip the scales back in hi favour massively. Of the guys u named Duran is probably the only fair comparison cos he started in the small weights, and i'd give PBF a great chance v Duran cos he' frustrate Roberto even more than Leonard did.Quote:
Originally Posted by zhubinGood, mature response.Quote:
Originally Posted by eagle