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Why doesn't 1 come up a few pounds, and one come down a few, for this incredible matchup? Isn't it worth the 10 or 15 million they would each get? Hell I would lose or gain 25 pounds for that kind of pizza dough! ;)
I think it would be a great fight. Could PBF take those straight left piercing down the middle lances that Pac seems to land at will?
At 147 PBF would flatten him. I highly doubt Floyd would fight at any other weight.
Its an interesting fight, its my belief Pacman is the closest person because of his offensive skills, being southpaw, and speed to beating Mayweather. However, if Mayweather figures out his rhythym then Pacquiao is screwed. I mean Marquez very quick and a good counter puncher, but he totally figured out how to nullify much of what Pacman is so successful at. Mayweather is bigger than Marquez probably hits a little harder, and is faster if he adapts then Manny is as good as done at any weight class.
I tend to agree, at 147 Pac would be a bit of a sitting duck, minus the "sitting". Still, if it took PBF 6 full rounds to trounce a slow and utterly outclassed Arturo Gatti, I can't see Pac faring any worse against Floyd. Therefore it would be at worst a UD for Floyd, I can't see any KO there, what about you?
PBF would beat Pac with clean and effecive counter punching.
It would be also kinda interesting to see Pac try to land those straight lefts against Floyd's peek-a-boo defense and rolling shoulder. He could actually make Pac miss nearly every shot, as I never saw Pac throw super-wide shots that, oddly, have a better chance of catching Floyd than straight predictable ones.
Pac would have to jump on him early like the 3 knockdown thing with Marquez, or if it goes into the middle to late rounds, Floyd would take him into deep waters. I don't think Pac would ever have to expend so much energy in any other fight than in a fight with Floyd.
Pac may just run out of gas by the 8th round, if Floyd decided to dance for the 1st 24 minutes and pot-shot.
Mayweather will make Pac run into all 4 corners before giving him a brutal KO:pQuote:
Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust
We already seen what PacMan could do to ODLH that Floyd was unable to do.Quote:
Originally Posted by brocktonblockbust
We have yet to see what PacMan can do to Hatton and I hope PacMan beats Hatton down in 6 ;D and again shows PBF how to beat a man.
But styles make fights and I think that PACMAN should he win, should stay at the 140 level for a minute and see if he can force PBF down. Right now Pacman is still on top and is considered the P4P champion and not PBF so, Floyd wont have the upper hand any more, Floyd if he wants to beat the new P4P champion, he will have to move down, but who knows, stranger things have happend and it looks as though everyone including myself is over looking Hatton. I can't wait for this to be over so we can move on and I do hope that the fans get their moneys worth and I believe it shall be so. Floyd at a higher weight class is so boring.
Seriously I don't understand why people think Mayweather-Pacquaio would even be competitive. I don't see Pac even beating the Manchester fag Ricky Hatton
I would have to take PBF on this one, I think he would just be too quick on the back foot and be able to turn Pac and make him miss. I do think that it would also be a pretty boring fight with PBF being completely defensive just in case he got caught and it ending a UD or possibly a late TKO if Pac got tired chasing him.
Doubt it's ever gonna happen though.
Watch Mayweather-Judah then get back to me. When Judah threw punches Mayweather was completely defensive and didn't throw punches. I am not saying MAyweather wouldn't have adapted because he did, but Judah always drops his workrate when punches are being thrown at him which is what happened, Pacquiao wouldn't. Sanders, Corley, and Judah all were southpaw and all landed on Mayweather with ease compared to orthodox fighters, none of them are as offensively gifted as Pacquiao.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Another factor which is the same with Floyd fighting Marquez is that he doesn't use size but speed to win fights, and he's 32 and has been inactive for over a year. I think Cotto doesn't have the speed to catch Mayweather, and Mayweather just pot shot him all night and as the night wore on might even stop Cotto. I don't think Mosley can fight at a distance well enough to beat Mayweather, I can see him being a legitimate threat but I Think Mayweather stays away and once against pot shots against Mosley and is too quick and too slick for Mosley to deal with him.
Well, I think you are wrong on this one Taeth. With Corley, he presented a lot of problems for elite fighters because he throws that right hook a lot and so it sets up everything else. He almost had Cotto out on his feet. With Judah, Judah used to spar with PBF so he already knew much about PBF. People you spar with are difficult to deal with it. And plus, Judah does have great power that you have to respect. And he is extremely fast and a bigger guy than Pac. What people aren't saying is that Pac is the one who has never seen anything like PBF. How will he react!? Hell, Pac hasn't even fought an elite fighter who uses movement. And this fighter is the best at it and is bigger. Pac has more to be concerned about than PBF. He fights the guys who come straight forward. Everyone seen how well it went for Morales when he fought a decent fighter who used movement. He nearly got shut out by Zahir Raheem. Raheem said he had harder sparring partners. Marquez would pose more problems to PBF than Pac. Pac doesn't take on all styles so he would be in a new world from the jump. How about we try to figure out how Pac would deal with PBF. There is no comparison.Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethWatch Mayweather-Judah then get back to me. When Judah threw punches Mayweather was completely defensive and didn't throw punches. I am not saying MAyweather wouldn't have adapted because he did, but Judah always drops his workrate when punches are being thrown at him which is what happened, Pacquiao wouldn't. Sanders, Corley, and Judah all were southpaw and all landed on Mayweather with ease compared to orthodox fighters, none of them are as offensively gifted as Pacquiao.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Another factor which is the same with Floyd fighting Marquez is that he doesn't use size but speed to win fights, and he's 32 and has been inactive for over a year. I think Cotto doesn't have the speed to catch Mayweather, and Mayweather just pot shot him all night and as the night wore on might even stop Cotto. I don't think Mosley can fight at a distance well enough to beat Mayweather, I can see him being a legitimate threat but I Think Mayweather stays away and once against pot shots against Mosley and is too quick and too slick for Mosley to deal with him.
I know you are all awaiting my profound wisdom....well here you go.
I really, really think PBF could beat Manny Pac.
I am not saying Pacquiao won't have problems with Floyd, but Corely was landing a lot of shots on Floyd not jsut the right hook ,and Manny has a good right hook. ALso in what way is Judah a lot bigger than Pacquiao he weighed in at about hte same size against Floyd as Pacquiao did against OScar. Their speed is pretty even, Judah doesn't have great power, its good, but I wouldn't say its significantly better than Pacman's if at all, he might have more power but, Manny has that ability hurt guys. I don't Manny is one of the guys who would have a lot of trouble with pure backwards movement, he is too good at improvising, I think he is very used to guys moving away from him which is why he sets up his cross so well with his right jab. He has more trouble with guys like Marquez who fake going back then come forward quickly and don't give Pacquiao the space to really get off his loaded cross which takes a lot of room to get off. All in all IMO its the speed that will be the biggest factor. Judah is extremely fast but he doesn't fights in spurts, and its different. Manny is more like Calzaghe in that his style has so much energy too it, he's in and out all the time, he throws a lot of punches(he replaces numbers a bit with more power) and he can do it for 12 rounds. Not only that but you hit him and he loves it and wants to hit you back. IMO he could overwhelm Mayweather who would prefer to not get hit than to counter you. I think it was the mexican in Marquez as much as his technical and physical gifts that made him so tough for Manny because he would take a punch to land a punch whereas Floyd will do it from time to time, but its not in his nature as much as it used to be at 130 and 135. You put that Floyd in with Pacquiao and he would destroy Manny, but now he far less aggressive, less combinations, less lateral movement, a lot more defense.Quote:
Originally Posted by blegitWell, I think you are wrong on this one Taeth. With Corley, he presented a lot of problems for elite fighters because he throws that right hook a lot and so it sets up everything else. He almost had Cotto out on his feet. With Judah, Judah used to spar with PBF so he already knew much about PBF. People you spar with are difficult to deal with it. And plus, Judah does have great power that you have to respect. And he is extremely fast and a bigger guy than Pac. What people aren't saying is that Pac is the one who has never seen anything like PBF. How will he react!? Hell, Pac hasn't even fought an elite fighter who uses movement. And this fighter is the best at it and is bigger. Pac has more to be concerned about than PBF. He fights the guys who come straight forward. Everyone seen how well it went for Morales when he fought a decent fighter who used movement. He nearly got shut out by Zahir Raheem. Raheem said he had harder sparring partners. Marquez would pose more problems to PBF than Pac. Pac doesn't take on all styles so he would be in a new world from the jump. How about we try to figure out how Pac would deal with PBF. There is no comparison.Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethWatch Mayweather-Judah then get back to me. When Judah threw punches Mayweather was completely defensive and didn't throw punches. I am not saying MAyweather wouldn't have adapted because he did, but Judah always drops his workrate when punches are being thrown at him which is what happened, Pacquiao wouldn't. Sanders, Corley, and Judah all were southpaw and all landed on Mayweather with ease compared to orthodox fighters, none of them are as offensively gifted as Pacquiao.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Another factor which is the same with Floyd fighting Marquez is that he doesn't use size but speed to win fights, and he's 32 and has been inactive for over a year. I think Cotto doesn't have the speed to catch Mayweather, and Mayweather just pot shot him all night and as the night wore on might even stop Cotto. I don't think Mosley can fight at a distance well enough to beat Mayweather, I can see him being a legitimate threat but I Think Mayweather stays away and once against pot shots against Mosley and is too quick and too slick for Mosley to deal with him.
Judah trained with Floyd during the Olympic tryouts to my knowledge, and when Mayweather was lighter he used to kick the shit out of Judah, but up at welterweight he slowed down quite a bit.
Floyd could win that one, no doubt about it. However, I could see Pacman just ramming him and with his super stamina and relentless punching create some damage, I remember the first FLoyd-Castillo and Castillo should have won, really. The second fight, Floyd won it but it was not a loopsided decision at all, it was a competitive fight, based on that and seeing how Oscar was close (in my opinion) to a draw, I could see arguments why Manny could make it as well, especially that he has the power bombs and the chaining punches to make it true. Well, it could go in both direction depending of the tempo of the fame, let's only hope we'll see it someday.
How was Mayweather Oscar close to a draw? At the very least Mayweather won by 4 rounds... and Oscar couldn't land anything. Castillo fought a close fight with Mayweather that could have gone either way, I ahve Mayweather winning it, but its valid to see JLC winning it, the second fight Floyd clearly won by a few rounds, and neither Oscar nor JLC fight like Pacman.
:vd: Mayweather-Judah was competitive for like 4 rounds. Whoa! Corley landed like one big shot against Mayweather. And like 4 or 5 other good shots in the 4th round. Other than that he was dominated. As for Sanders? :lolhaha: Some how I don't think Mayweather is the same fighter he was in his 2nd pro fight. I think he might of improved a little since than. Just when I thought i read it all. Why not just bring up Pac's early ko loses and use that as prooof that he's weak in the body?Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethWatch Mayweather-Judah then get back to me. When Judah threw punches Mayweather was completely defensive and didn't throw punches. I am not saying MAyweather wouldn't have adapted because he did, but Judah always drops his workrate when punches are being thrown at him which is what happened, Pacquiao wouldn't. Sanders, Corley, and Judah all were southpaw and all landed on Mayweather with ease compared to orthodox fighters, none of them are as offensively gifted as Pacquiao.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
You are argueing with me about Floyd even though you clearly haven't seen Mayweather-Corley or else you would know Corley landed more than one big shot, maybe you should actually watch that fight before you make comments. I am not saying Judah almost won against Mayweather, but when he threw punches Mayweather certainly wasn't landing anything, and Judah landed that left cross almost whenever he threw it which wasn't enough. Sanders landed like 50% on Mayweather, 2nd fight or not Sanders was terrible and after that fight Floyd Snr said Mayweather wouldn't fight another southpaw as a pro, and he didn't until Corley becauase his defensive style doesn't work against southpaws.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise:vd: Mayweather-Judah was competitive for like 4 rounds. Whoa! Corley landed like one big shot against Mayweather. And like 4 or 5 other good shots in the 4th round. Other than that he was dominated. As for Sanders? :lolhaha: Some how I don't think Mayweather is the same fighter he was in his 2nd pro fight. I think he might of improved a little since than. Just when I thought i read it all. Why not just bring up Pac's early ko loses and use that as prooof that he's weak in the body?Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethWatch Mayweather-Judah then get back to me. When Judah threw punches Mayweather was completely defensive and didn't throw punches. I am not saying MAyweather wouldn't have adapted because he did, but Judah always drops his workrate when punches are being thrown at him which is what happened, Pacquiao wouldn't. Sanders, Corley, and Judah all were southpaw and all landed on Mayweather with ease compared to orthodox fighters, none of them are as offensively gifted as Pacquiao.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Floyd is my favorite fighter in boxing, and second favorite all time behind Roy Jones jr, but I am not foolish enough to ignore the fact that he is bad against southpaws and he hasn't faced somebody as good as Pacquiao, he has faced Zab Judah who was as fast as Manny, but Zab doesn't throw punches, and he doesn't use movement, and he burns out mentally before half a fight is over. Him and Pacquiao are as different as night and day. Clearly we saw the speed difference between Manny and Oscar, and Oscar's speed made Floyd go on the defensive and Oscar was fast enough that Floyd was having a difficult time countering, I think him trying to counter Hatton or Oscar off the ropes and trying to counter Pacquiao are two completely different things. If Floyd stays on the ropes against Manny, he could be in a dire trouble. If he can keep the fight in the middle of the ring and keep on changing up the range between him and Pacman then he would likely win, maybe even dominate Manny.
Did Calzaghe land effectively on Hopkins? No, despite the fact that Hopkins landed almost all the clean, effective punches the judges still awarded the fight to Joe because of his higher workrate. Floyd could land all the good shots, but if Pacman throws a lot and makes Floyd look very defensive who knows how the fight will turn out. Floyd only got a split decision against Oscar even though he should have won nearly every round through good defense and clean effective punching.
It's symantics, but to do the subject justice, I think it should be hypothetically, "Could Pac beat PBF?"
Of course Floyd could defeat Pac Man-and easily too. Rarely does Floyd get hit in the face flush and although I believe Pac Man has the speed to do it, it will not be very easy. But let's not put Pac Man on such a high pedestal after beating the washed up Oscar. Pac Still has to deal with the very physical Hitman.
My question is how do Mosley and Cotto pose more difficult tasks for Mayweather? Mosley throws combinations, but these days their are more like Calzaghe's combinations and less like the ones Shane threw as a lightweight. He doesn't fight at the same speed as his body moves at which was evident against Cotto who beat him to the punch repeatedly. Miguel Cotto is a great fighter, but he has slow movement and Mayweather is Zab Judah or Paulie, he is a lot harder to hit, and he hits a lot harder than Paulie. We saw Floyd take Baldomir out of their fight in the first 4 rounds because its so frustrating to fight him, while Baldomir never lost hope against Judah because if you keep coming Zab will eventually fold. Once Mayweather doesn't use his tradional defense against southpaws, he has more of a peak-a-boo defense and Zab was able to split his guard with the left hand at will, not only that but Floyd is very squared up against southpaws so its easier for Pacquiao to land his right hook as well.
You bring up an interesting point, being that Mayweather-Judah was competitive for 4 rounds. I think that's the story for many of Judah's fights due to certain issues we won't discuss :) (the man can dance though), but his speed is what allowed it to be competitive I think. Pac would not lose focus and at 140 I think his speed would definitely be enough to catch Floyd on more than one occasion. PBF has shown us match after match that he can force a fighter to enter his safe little utopia where he picks them apart. I doubt Manny would get sucked into that so easy. Once again with the speed, head movement, and constant pressure he could really make this awkward. While I don't think Mayweather will choke under this kind of pressure, I still want to see it happen at least once in his career.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise:vd: Mayweather-Judah was competitive for like 4 rounds. Whoa! Corley landed like one big shot against Mayweather. And like 4 or 5 other good shots in the 4th round. Other than that he was dominated. As for Sanders? :lolhaha: Some how I don't think Mayweather is the same fighter he was in his 2nd pro fight. I think he might of improved a little since than. Just when I thought i read it all. Why not just bring up Pac's early ko loses and use that as prooof that he's weak in the body?Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethWatch Mayweather-Judah then get back to me. When Judah threw punches Mayweather was completely defensive and didn't throw punches. I am not saying MAyweather wouldn't have adapted because he did, but Judah always drops his workrate when punches are being thrown at him which is what happened, Pacquiao wouldn't. Sanders, Corley, and Judah all were southpaw and all landed on Mayweather with ease compared to orthodox fighters, none of them are as offensively gifted as Pacquiao.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
All that being said, if Manny's rhythm is figured out he's $#^$@%@
Why are we asking if floyd can beat pac ?? Of course he can and probably would, we should be asking if pac could beat floyd. We know pac can be beaten we've seen it more than once the same can't be same for mayweather. People are going to be shocked if hatton winds up beating pac and let's see how many will want to see pac fight floyd then. Every week it's someone new.
I think now after reading some great posts here on this thread that Floyd would have a tougher time with Pac by far than he had with Zab.
As far as Hatton goes, ANYTHING could happen and it wouldnt surprise me. I personally hope Ricky KO's Pac.
In the eyes of many Floyd was already beaten by Castillo in the 1st fight. I also saw Floyd's 2nd fight against a Southpaw. It's 4 rounder where Floyd look bad & the decision was booed. I thought Floyd just got a Draw in that fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mar
Then we talked about Judah winning in the 1st 4 rds against floyd. And now you can compare Floyd & Pac against a common opponents. Pac dominates & TKO DLH while Floyd just got SD. Then this coming Beatdown of Hatton. I'm sure Pac will stop Hatton much earlier than floyd.
I will not be surprise if Pac comes in as the slight Favorite against PBF.
I agree with Violent Demise on the Corley-Mayweather fight. I just dusted it off the shelf and it was only one big shot and that was pretty much it for Corley. Mayweather won that fight easy. Look, Pac is riding high right now, but Mayweather against the smaller Pac Man right now would be like child abuse. Mayweather can adjust in the middle of fights and he has never shown stamina issues. My money goes on Mayweather, though I cannot stand him and love Pac Man.Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethYou are argueing with me about Floyd even though you clearly haven't seen Mayweather-Corley or else you would know Corley landed more than one big shot, maybe you should actually watch that fight before you make comments. I am not saying Judah almost won against Mayweather, but when he threw punches Mayweather certainly wasn't landing anything, and Judah landed that left cross almost whenever he threw it which wasn't enough. Sanders landed like 50% on Mayweather, 2nd fight or not Sanders was terrible and after that fight Floyd Snr said Mayweather wouldn't fight another southpaw as a pro, and he didn't until Corley becauase his defensive style doesn't work against southpaws.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise:vd: Mayweather-Judah was competitive for like 4 rounds. Whoa! Corley landed like one big shot against Mayweather. And like 4 or 5 other good shots in the 4th round. Other than that he was dominated. As for Sanders? :lolhaha: Some how I don't think Mayweather is the same fighter he was in his 2nd pro fight. I think he might of improved a little since than. Just when I thought i read it all. Why not just bring up Pac's early ko loses and use that as prooof that he's weak in the body?Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Floyd is my favorite fighter in boxing, and second favorite all time behind Roy Jones jr, but I am not foolish enough to ignore the fact that he is bad against southpaws and he hasn't faced somebody as good as Pacquiao, he has faced Zab Judah who was as fast as Manny, but Zab doesn't throw punches, and he doesn't use movement, and he burns out mentally before half a fight is over. Him and Pacquiao are as different as night and day. Clearly we saw the speed difference between Manny and Oscar, and Oscar's speed made Floyd go on the defensive and Oscar was fast enough that Floyd was having a difficult time countering, I think him trying to counter Hatton or Oscar off the ropes and trying to counter Pacquiao are two completely different things. If Floyd stays on the ropes against Manny, he could be in a dire trouble. If he can keep the fight in the middle of the ring and keep on changing up the range between him and Pacman then he would likely win, maybe even dominate Manny.
Did Calzaghe land effectively on Hopkins? No, despite the fact that Hopkins landed almost all the clean, effective punches the judges still awarded the fight to Joe because of his higher workrate. Floyd could land all the good shots, but if Pacman throws a lot and makes Floyd look very defensive who knows how the fight will turn out. Floyd only got a split decision against Oscar even though he should have won nearly every round through good defense and clean effective punching.
yea Corley hit Floyd. but Floyd adapted and won the fight easily, and people tend to play down Corley's power, he can punch, Oscar Larios gave Pacquiao fits, and made it a competitive fight, it wasn't really lopsided like the scores may imply, i had Manny winning i think 8 rounds to 4 (plus the knockdowns, and remember Larios tends to be chinny) , and a lot of the rounds were hard fought rounds so it's not like Manny is untouchableQuote:
Originally Posted by TaethYou are argueing with me about Floyd even though you clearly haven't seen Mayweather-Corley or else you would know Corley landed more than one big shot, maybe you should actually watch that fight before you make comments. I am not saying Judah almost won against Mayweather, but when he threw punches Mayweather certainly wasn't landing anything, and Judah landed that left cross almost whenever he threw it which wasn't enough. Sanders landed like 50% on Mayweather, 2nd fight or not Sanders was terrible and after that fight Floyd Snr said Mayweather wouldn't fight another southpaw as a pro, and he didn't until Corley becauase his defensive style doesn't work against southpaws.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise:vd: Mayweather-Judah was competitive for like 4 rounds. Whoa! Corley landed like one big shot against Mayweather. And like 4 or 5 other good shots in the 4th round. Other than that he was dominated. As for Sanders? :lolhaha: Some how I don't think Mayweather is the same fighter he was in his 2nd pro fight. I think he might of improved a little since than. Just when I thought i read it all. Why not just bring up Pac's early ko loses and use that as prooof that he's weak in the body?Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Floyd is my favorite fighter in boxing, and second favorite all time behind Roy Jones jr, but I am not foolish enough to ignore the fact that he is bad against southpaws and he hasn't faced somebody as good as Pacquiao, he has faced Zab Judah who was as fast as Manny, but Zab doesn't throw punches, and he doesn't use movement, and he burns out mentally before half a fight is over. Him and Pacquiao are as different as night and day. Clearly we saw the speed difference between Manny and Oscar, and Oscar's speed made Floyd go on the defensive and Oscar was fast enough that Floyd was having a difficult time countering, I think him trying to counter Hatton or Oscar off the ropes and trying to counter Pacquiao are two completely different things. If Floyd stays on the ropes against Manny, he could be in a dire trouble. If he can keep the fight in the middle of the ring and keep on changing up the range between him and Pacman then he would likely win, maybe even dominate Manny.
Did Calzaghe land effectively on Hopkins? No, despite the fact that Hopkins landed almost all the clean, effective punches the judges still awarded the fight to Joe because of his higher workrate. Floyd could land all the good shots, but if Pacman throws a lot and makes Floyd look very defensive who knows how the fight will turn out. Floyd only got a split decision against Oscar even though he should have won nearly every round through good defense and clean effective punching.
Cotto and Mosley are REAL welterweights, and Cotto is in his prime, Manny can't even really be ranked or judged how he'll do at welter when he hasn't fought a live welter, he fought a weight drained shot DLH, it's not even a question on how the DLH that fought Quartey would have done against Manny, he would have put a gruesome beating on him, but time passes and that's not the fighter that was in the ring December, i think Manny can make the fight with Mayweather interesting, but if it happenes at 147 (where it most likely will) i think Mayweathers footspeed, power, and skill will be too much and he'll make Pacquiao look ordinaryQuote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Watching just the 4th round of Mayweather-Corley on YouTube doesn't count as watching the whole fight. Except for pockets of sucess Corley was dominated in the fight. And yes it matters that the Sanders fight was only his 2nd fight. Pro and AM's are almost 2 diffrent sports. Mayweather still was using a lot of AM style. Not to mention the fact he was also cut for the first time in that fight. Sanders was far from good. But he still a vet. Like i told you If your going to reach that far bring everything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethYou are argueing with me about Floyd even though you clearly haven't seen Mayweather-Corley or else you would know Corley landed more than one big shot, maybe you should actually watch that fight before you make comments. I am not saying Judah almost won against Mayweather, but when he threw punches Mayweather certainly wasn't landing anything, and Judah landed that left cross almost whenever he threw it which wasn't enough. Sanders landed like 50% on Mayweather, 2nd fight or not Sanders was terrible and after that fight Floyd Snr said Mayweather wouldn't fight another southpaw as a pro, and he didn't until Corley becauase his defensive style doesn't work against southpaws.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise:vd: Mayweather-Judah was competitive for like 4 rounds. Whoa! Corley landed like one big shot against Mayweather. And like 4 or 5 other good shots in the 4th round. Other than that he was dominated. As for Sanders? :lolhaha: Some how I don't think Mayweather is the same fighter he was in his 2nd pro fight. I think he might of improved a little since than. Just when I thought i read it all. Why not just bring up Pac's early ko loses and use that as prooof that he's weak in the body?Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Floyd is my favorite fighter in boxing, and second favorite all time behind Roy Jones jr, but I am not foolish enough to ignore the fact that he is bad against southpaws and he hasn't faced somebody as good as Pacquiao, he has faced Zab Judah who was as fast as Manny, but Zab doesn't throw punches, and he doesn't use movement, and he burns out mentally before half a fight is over. Him and Pacquiao are as different as night and day. Clearly we saw the speed difference between Manny and Oscar, and Oscar's speed made Floyd go on the defensive and Oscar was fast enough that Floyd was having a difficult time countering, I think him trying to counter Hatton or Oscar off the ropes and trying to counter Pacquiao are two completely different things. If Floyd stays on the ropes against Manny, he could be in a dire trouble. If he can keep the fight in the middle of the ring and keep on changing up the range between him and Pacman then he would likely win, maybe even dominate Manny.
Did Calzaghe land effectively on Hopkins? No, despite the fact that Hopkins landed almost all the clean, effective punches the judges still awarded the fight to Joe because of his higher workrate. Floyd could land all the good shots, but if Pacman throws a lot and makes Floyd look very defensive who knows how the fight will turn out. Floyd only got a split decision against Oscar even though he should have won nearly every round through good defense and clean effective punching.
exactly, if they wanna bring up Sanders then bring up Rustico Torrecampo and Medgoen SingsuratQuote:
Originally Posted by Violent DemiseWatching just the 4th round of Mayweather-Corley on YouTube doesn't count as watching the whole fight. Except for pockets of sucess Corley was dominated in the fight. And yes it matters that the Sanders fight was only his 2nd fight. Pro and AM's are almost 2 diffrent sports. Mayweather still was using a lot of AM style. Not to mention the fact he was also cut for the first time in that fight. Sanders was far from good. But he still a vet. Like i told you If your going to reach that far bring everything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by TaethYou are argueing with me about Floyd even though you clearly haven't seen Mayweather-Corley or else you would know Corley landed more than one big shot, maybe you should actually watch that fight before you make comments. I am not saying Judah almost won against Mayweather, but when he threw punches Mayweather certainly wasn't landing anything, and Judah landed that left cross almost whenever he threw it which wasn't enough. Sanders landed like 50% on Mayweather, 2nd fight or not Sanders was terrible and after that fight Floyd Snr said Mayweather wouldn't fight another southpaw as a pro, and he didn't until Corley becauase his defensive style doesn't work against southpaws.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Floyd is my favorite fighter in boxing, and second favorite all time behind Roy Jones jr, but I am not foolish enough to ignore the fact that he is bad against southpaws and he hasn't faced somebody as good as Pacquiao, he has faced Zab Judah who was as fast as Manny, but Zab doesn't throw punches, and he doesn't use movement, and he burns out mentally before half a fight is over. Him and Pacquiao are as different as night and day. Clearly we saw the speed difference between Manny and Oscar, and Oscar's speed made Floyd go on the defensive and Oscar was fast enough that Floyd was having a difficult time countering, I think him trying to counter Hatton or Oscar off the ropes and trying to counter Pacquiao are two completely different things. If Floyd stays on the ropes against Manny, he could be in a dire trouble. If he can keep the fight in the middle of the ring and keep on changing up the range between him and Pacman then he would likely win, maybe even dominate Manny.
Did Calzaghe land effectively on Hopkins? No, despite the fact that Hopkins landed almost all the clean, effective punches the judges still awarded the fight to Joe because of his higher workrate. Floyd could land all the good shots, but if Pacman throws a lot and makes Floyd look very defensive who knows how the fight will turn out. Floyd only got a split decision against Oscar even though he should have won nearly every round through good defense and clean effective punching.
I think Taeth has it right but I see the Pacman going to the body more. Roach has faced Mayweather before with Oscar so I think there is a factor there too. We'll just have to hope the fight comes about because that's really the only way we are going to know.
How can you measure how drained Oscar was? Manny never gave him the oppertunity to do anything. We don't know how the Oscar that fought Quartey would have done against Manny because Quartey isn't the same fighter Pacquiao is, Quartey fights like Winky Wright he's stationary, he has a great jab and left hook, but a poor right hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesyea Corley hit Floyd. but Floyd adapted and won the fight easily, and people tend to play down Corley's power, he can punch, Oscar Larios gave Pacquiao fits, and made it a competitive fight, it wasn't really lopsided like the scores may imply, i had Manny winning i think 8 rounds to 4 (plus the knockdowns, and remember Larios tends to be chinny) , and a lot of the rounds were hard fought rounds so it's not like Manny is untouchableQuote:
Originally Posted by TaethYou are argueing with me about Floyd even though you clearly haven't seen Mayweather-Corley or else you would know Corley landed more than one big shot, maybe you should actually watch that fight before you make comments. I am not saying Judah almost won against Mayweather, but when he threw punches Mayweather certainly wasn't landing anything, and Judah landed that left cross almost whenever he threw it which wasn't enough. Sanders landed like 50% on Mayweather, 2nd fight or not Sanders was terrible and after that fight Floyd Snr said Mayweather wouldn't fight another southpaw as a pro, and he didn't until Corley becauase his defensive style doesn't work against southpaws.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Floyd is my favorite fighter in boxing, and second favorite all time behind Roy Jones jr, but I am not foolish enough to ignore the fact that he is bad against southpaws and he hasn't faced somebody as good as Pacquiao, he has faced Zab Judah who was as fast as Manny, but Zab doesn't throw punches, and he doesn't use movement, and he burns out mentally before half a fight is over. Him and Pacquiao are as different as night and day. Clearly we saw the speed difference between Manny and Oscar, and Oscar's speed made Floyd go on the defensive and Oscar was fast enough that Floyd was having a difficult time countering, I think him trying to counter Hatton or Oscar off the ropes and trying to counter Pacquiao are two completely different things. If Floyd stays on the ropes against Manny, he could be in a dire trouble. If he can keep the fight in the middle of the ring and keep on changing up the range between him and Pacman then he would likely win, maybe even dominate Manny.
Did Calzaghe land effectively on Hopkins? No, despite the fact that Hopkins landed almost all the clean, effective punches the judges still awarded the fight to Joe because of his higher workrate. Floyd could land all the good shots, but if Pacman throws a lot and makes Floyd look very defensive who knows how the fight will turn out. Floyd only got a split decision against Oscar even though he should have won nearly every round through good defense and clean effective punching.
Cotto and Mosley are REAL welterweights, and Cotto is in his prime, Manny can't even really be ranked or judged how he'll do at welter when he hasn't fought a live welter, he fought a weight drained shot DLH, it's not even a question on how the DLH that fought Quartey would have done against Manny, he would have put a gruesome beating on him, but time passes and that's not the fighter that was in the ring December, i think Manny can make the fight with Mayweather interesting, but if it happenes at 147 (where it most likely will) i think Mayweathers footspeed, power, and skill will be too much and he'll make Pacquiao look ordinaryQuote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Also how did oyu ahve Oscar Larios winning four rounds against Manny? I can see that one roung that he hurt Manny, but most of hte rounds Manny clearly won.
I'm not saying I don't think Mayweather will win, but IMO he beats Cotto and Mosley a lot easier, they aren't as hungry as Manny, they aren't as fast, and they aren't southpaw.
I don't think Cotto and Mosley being real welterweights matters because fighting Mayweather is never about size, he knows how to handle bigger guys, and he doesn't impose himself physically on smaller guys.
I am not trying to say Corley was competitive with Mayweather, but that him being a southpaw made a guy of his caliber much more difficult than the same caliber of guy would have been as an orthodox fighter, and he landed punches in all the early rounds, once again I have no idea what people are watching. He was landing with more regularity than Oscar De La Hoya or Ricky Hatton who are both way better than him.
Also I can see Floyd making Pacquiao look stupid in certain circumstances, but if great boxers like Barrera and Marquez can sustain a boxer's edge on the modern version of Pacman then I think Floyd wouldn't be able to with all the ease in the world. I prefer Floyd ten times to Manny, but obviously I am saying this would be competitive for a reason. People way too often think size is the determinant factor, I can look back and see half the people on here think Gatti would beat Floyd. People have a set belief about who should be where in the sport and they won't budge an inch. PS I also think Hatton's style is worse for Manny than Floyd's, but that Floyd is much better at his style than Hatton and a much better and more adaptable athlete than Ricky.
Does Pac own Saddoboxing.com? Pac has a mountain in Ricky Hatton 1st which I think will be more entertaining then a PBF fight. If this fight ever happens and Manny gets by the Hitman then I'm going with Floyd by decision over the Pacman. I think Manny will have a good first few rounds and then will start getting countered with hooks and hard crosses all night long. It will be almost like the Zab Judah fight but I think Floyd will keep the pressure on and make Manny pay more dearly from round 6 to the end.
i get where you're coming from but the Oscar that fought Quartey didn't kill himself to make welter that does play a crucial role in the fight, he was in his prime, and he would of boxed Manny's ear's off, he wouldn't just simply try to rush in and throw pointless punches, the only thing he did against Manny, DLH managed to get Pacquiao on the ropes, but wasn't able to do anything when he did, if it were the prime young DLH who was active at welter he would have made Manny pay badly on the ropes, I agree that Pacquiao's will and his improved boxing ability will probably give Mayweather some probs for a couple rounds like Judah, but IMO he'll get figured out and easily beaten for a very clear UD or late stoppage, and back to the Larios fight, i had it 8 to 4, which is still a very clear win for Manny especially since Manny dropped him twice, but back to that, Larios hurt him, if Floyd connects with the hard accurate shots he's known for he can stop him, i don't see the same thing happening the other way aroundQuote:
Originally Posted by TaethHow can you measure how drained Oscar was? Manny never gave him the oppertunity to do anything. We don't know how the Oscar that fought Quartey would have done against Manny because Quartey isn't the same fighter Pacquiao is, Quartey fights like Winky Wright he's stationary, he has a great jab and left hook, but a poor right hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesyea Corley hit Floyd. but Floyd adapted and won the fight easily, and people tend to play down Corley's power, he can punch, Oscar Larios gave Pacquiao fits, and made it a competitive fight, it wasn't really lopsided like the scores may imply, i had Manny winning i think 8 rounds to 4 (plus the knockdowns, and remember Larios tends to be chinny) , and a lot of the rounds were hard fought rounds so it's not like Manny is untouchableQuote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Cotto and Mosley are REAL welterweights, and Cotto is in his prime, Manny can't even really be ranked or judged how he'll do at welter when he hasn't fought a live welter, he fought a weight drained shot DLH, it's not even a question on how the DLH that fought Quartey would have done against Manny, he would have put a gruesome beating on him, but time passes and that's not the fighter that was in the ring December, i think Manny can make the fight with Mayweather interesting, but if it happenes at 147 (where it most likely will) i think Mayweathers footspeed, power, and skill will be too much and he'll make Pacquiao look ordinaryQuote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Also how did oyu ahve Oscar Larios winning four rounds against Manny? I can see that one roung that he hurt Manny, but most of hte rounds Manny clearly won.
I'm not saying I don't think Mayweather will win, but IMO he beats Cotto and Mosley a lot easier, they aren't as hungry as Manny, they aren't as fast, and they aren't southpaw.
I don't think Cotto and Mosley being real welterweights matters because fighting Mayweather is never about size, he knows how to handle bigger guys, and he doesn't impose himself physically on smaller guys.
I am not trying to say Corley was competitive with Mayweather, but that him being a southpaw made a guy of his caliber much more difficult than the same caliber of guy would have been as an orthodox fighter, and he landed punches in all the early rounds, once again I have no idea what people are watching. He was landing with more regularity than Oscar De La Hoya or Ricky Hatton who are both way better than him.
Also I can see Floyd making Pacquiao look stupid in certain circumstances, but if great boxers like Barrera and Marquez can sustain a boxer's edge on the modern version of Pacman then I think Floyd wouldn't be able to with all the ease in the world. I prefer Floyd ten times to Manny, but obviously I am saying this would be competitive for a reason. People way too often think size is the determinant factor, I can look back and see half the people on here think Gatti would beat Floyd. People have a set belief about who should be where in the sport and they won't budge an inch. PS I also think Hatton's style is worse for Manny than Floyd's, but that Floyd is much better at his style than Hatton and a much better and more adaptable athlete than Ricky.
Didn't Judah knocked down Floyd?
I really don't know why boxing fans when a fighter beats another fighter out of their prime they say in their prime they'd have beat them.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesi get where you're coming from but the Oscar that fought Quartey didn't kill himself to make welter that does play a crucial role in the fight, he was in his prime, and he would of boxed Manny's ear's off, he wouldn't just simply try to rush in and throw pointless punches, the only thing he did against Manny, DLH managed to get Pacquiao on the ropes, but wasn't able to do anything when he did, if it were the prime young DLH who was active at welter he would have made Manny pay badly on the ropes, I agree that Pacquiao's will and his improved boxing ability will probably give Mayweather some probs for a couple rounds like Judah, but IMO he'll get figured out and easily beaten for a very clear UD or late stoppage, and back to the Larios fight, i had it 8 to 4, which is still a very clear win for Manny especially since Manny dropped him twice, but back to that, Larios hurt him, if Floyd connects with the hard accurate shots he's known for he can stop him, i don't see the same thing happening the other way aroundQuote:
Originally Posted by TaethHow can you measure how drained Oscar was? Manny never gave him the oppertunity to do anything. We don't know how the Oscar that fought Quartey would have done against Manny because Quartey isn't the same fighter Pacquiao is, Quartey fights like Winky Wright he's stationary, he has a great jab and left hook, but a poor right hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales
Also how did oyu ahve Oscar Larios winning four rounds against Manny? I can see that one roung that he hurt Manny, but most of hte rounds Manny clearly won.
I'm not saying I don't think Mayweather will win, but IMO he beats Cotto and Mosley a lot easier, they aren't as hungry as Manny, they aren't as fast, and they aren't southpaw.
I don't think Cotto and Mosley being real welterweights matters because fighting Mayweather is never about size, he knows how to handle bigger guys, and he doesn't impose himself physically on smaller guys.
I am not trying to say Corley was competitive with Mayweather, but that him being a southpaw made a guy of his caliber much more difficult than the same caliber of guy would have been as an orthodox fighter, and he landed punches in all the early rounds, once again I have no idea what people are watching. He was landing with more regularity than Oscar De La Hoya or Ricky Hatton who are both way better than him.
Also I can see Floyd making Pacquiao look stupid in certain circumstances, but if great boxers like Barrera and Marquez can sustain a boxer's edge on the modern version of Pacman then I think Floyd wouldn't be able to with all the ease in the world. I prefer Floyd ten times to Manny, but obviously I am saying this would be competitive for a reason. People way too often think size is the determinant factor, I can look back and see half the people on here think Gatti would beat Floyd. People have a set belief about who should be where in the sport and they won't budge an inch. PS I also think Hatton's style is worse for Manny than Floyd's, but that Floyd is much better at his style than Hatton and a much better and more adaptable athlete than Ricky.
Who is to say Oscar would have won if him and pacquiao fought prime for prime? Can't discredit Pacquiao's skills too. But I think it would have been an awesome fight to watch. But then again at 147 Oscar was a monster and Pacquiao isnt there naturally.
Whitaker prime for prime beats them both though ;)
that's the point i'm trying to make, and no doubt neither one of the two would have been able to touch WhitakerQuote:
Originally Posted by MajestyI really don't know why boxing fans when a fighter beats another fighter out of their prime they say in their prime they'd have beat them.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesi get where you're coming from but the Oscar that fought Quartey didn't kill himself to make welter that does play a crucial role in the fight, he was in his prime, and he would of boxed Manny's ear's off, he wouldn't just simply try to rush in and throw pointless punches, the only thing he did against Manny, DLH managed to get Pacquiao on the ropes, but wasn't able to do anything when he did, if it were the prime young DLH who was active at welter he would have made Manny pay badly on the ropes, I agree that Pacquiao's will and his improved boxing ability will probably give Mayweather some probs for a couple rounds like Judah, but IMO he'll get figured out and easily beaten for a very clear UD or late stoppage, and back to the Larios fight, i had it 8 to 4, which is still a very clear win for Manny especially since Manny dropped him twice, but back to that, Larios hurt him, if Floyd connects with the hard accurate shots he's known for he can stop him, i don't see the same thing happening the other way aroundQuote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Who is to say Oscar would have won if him and pacquiao fought prime for prime? Can't discredit Pacquiao's skills too. But I think it would have been an awesome fight to watch. But then again at 147 Oscar was a monster and Pacquiao isnt there naturally.
Whitaker prime for prime beats them both though ;)
Takes one to know one doesnt it Vd, so you must be a fag too. Seriosly VD you need to grow up, the same goes for miles too, both of you are disgrace to this forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent Demise
Full of hate and ignarance, you two must have been abused as children...
Could PBF beat Pac? <----- is that even a question?
How about in the fact Pac's own trainer called De La Hoya a "walking corpse" who couldn't pull the trigger any more and was done. Seriously if you think about it how much credit can you really even give Pac for beating Oscar when his own trainer says the fight would of never happened if Oscar was still a threat?Quote:
Originally Posted by Taeth
Once again how can you compare? We don't know how Whitaker would have done against guys faster than him like Floyd and Pacquiao. IMO I think Floyd is a better fighter than Whitaker, he's harder to hit, he's faster, he's got more a little more snap on his punches.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesthat's the point i'm trying to make, and no doubt neither one of the two would have been able to touch WhitakerQuote:
Originally Posted by MajestyI really don't know why boxing fans when a fighter beats another fighter out of their prime they say in their prime they'd have beat them.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales
Who is to say Oscar would have won if him and pacquiao fought prime for prime? Can't discredit Pacquiao's skills too. But I think it would have been an awesome fight to watch. But then again at 147 Oscar was a monster and Pacquiao isnt there naturally.
Whitaker prime for prime beats them both though ;)