Just wondered what you guys think? It would be another good name on Froch's record..
I'd Pick froch for a late K.O. I thought Hopkins had Pavlik in some serious trouble in there fight..
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Just wondered what you guys think? It would be another good name on Froch's record..
I'd Pick froch for a late K.O. I thought Hopkins had Pavlik in some serious trouble in there fight..
It's a 'pick em' but I'd lean towards Pavlik
Think even Froch has a chance to out box rinse & repeat Pavlik,but Kellys long straight power could get to Froch late.Not many dimensions to pick from in that one ;D.
I think I'd go for Pavlik, neither of them are that technically sound but I just reckon Froch would get hit too many times. Pavlik's chin is still proven whereas there's now doubts over Carl's, although I guess you could argue Pavlik may not have been in with a bigger puncher than Froch.
It would be a total slugfest and a great fight, I'd expect Pavlik to win by KO in the last third. But it depends which Kelly and which Carl come to the ring I guess.
Froch's probably sturdier but could Pavlik miss a right hand? And he'd be more consistent with it than Taylor, much more. I'd go with Pavlik although he could get KO'd.
Quote:
Originally Posted by clintuk
Sorry this is absurd. How is Pavliks chin more proven than Froch's when they were both floored by the same guy?
And Pavlik was hurt far more than Froch was, he barely made it out of the third round.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by clintuk
Sorry this is absurd. How is Pavliks chin more proven than Froch's when they were both floored by the same guy?
And Pavlik was hurt far more than Froch was, he barely made it out of the third round.
agree that was a very strange comment
Id lean towards pavliks power getting the better of frochs style.
Froch-Bute = now theres a fight id like to see!!!!
Ok, I realise that sounds silly, but I just meant in the way that he's been hit more times by more world class opposition than Froch has and more often than not has still come out on top. Carl can't, at the moment, claim to have taken on the opposition Pavlik has. But it'd still be a very competitive fight I reckon, if there's any way it can happen at the moment with Abraham pulling at Pavlik.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by clintuk
Sorry this is absurd. How is Pavliks chin more proven than Froch's when they were both floored by the same guy?
And Pavlik was hurt far more than Froch was, he barely made it out of the third round.
Quote:
Originally Posted by clintukOk, I realise that sounds silly, but I just meant in the way that he's been hit more times by more world class opposition than Froch has and more often than not has still come out on top. Carl can't, at the moment, claim to have taken on the opposition Pavlik has. But it'd still be a very competitive fight I reckon, if there's any way it can happen at the moment with Abraham pulling at Pavlik.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by clintuk
Sorry this is absurd. How is Pavliks chin more proven than Froch's when they were both floored by the same guy?
And Pavlik was hurt far more than Froch was, he barely made it out of the third round.
opposition...NO
But an unbeaten pascal hit him with half a dozen monster shots and he took those as well as walking through taylors hook and overhands in the last round to insure he got he`s off!!
Pavlik.
Froch is tailor-made for him. Porous defense and susecptible to the over hand right.
[quote=hattonthehammer;722105
opposition...NO
But an unbeaten pascal hit him with half a dozen monster shots and he took those as well as walking through taylors hook and overhands in the last round to insure he got he`s off!![/quote]
You know what, you're right, I'm havin' an off day I think. One o those think before you speak moments. I'd still go for Kelly late round KO though.
Pavlik could make Froch look like Roy Jones. ;D
Good fight. Think Froch would prove to be too big and strong. Although he'd have to deal with Pavlik's righthand - not a cert.
Pick em for me..
Kelly can and would def land that right all night long though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by smashup
Froch struggled with taylors power often and despite out working him kept having to work on the back foot because of jermain.
Pavlik would give froch nightmares and would throw 8-10 combos that would do a lot of damage.
Kelly is also a much more intelligent fighter than taylor
that alone is a bit of an absurd comment, seeing how Froch barely made it out of the 3rd himself, at least Pavlik was dropped early on in the round and managed to survive to then go on and stop Taylor, Froch had bout 30 seconds left in the round and Taylor didn't jump on himQuote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by clintuk
Sorry this is absurd. How is Pavliks chin more proven than Froch's when they were both floored by the same guy?
And Pavlik was hurt far more than Froch was, he barely made it out of the third round.
i'd say it's the type of fight that either man can win, Froch and Pavlik alike are both open to the right hand, but mostly overhand rights, neither man really has an overhand right, i'd give Froch the slight edge cause he has a good upper and he could land it on Pavlik while in close, but i'd have to gie Pavlik the slight edge in power and accuracy
Whoever lands the first powershot that the other guy doesn't see coming. I have no doubt that Froch can spark Pavlik, but I'm also sure Pavlik can spark Froch. Both men are great finishers. Not that Pavlik has great defense, but it's better than Froch's. Froch is the bigger man. It's pretty much a pickem.
Pavlik by ko.Pavlik will work behind a solid jab then a straight right that will hit Froch all night.
Be a exciting fight but Froch will get finished off this time if he gets hurt as Pavlik is a much better finisher than Taylor.
This is a bit of a pick'em fight for me. Although Froch would be big for him, and we all saw how much he failed against a bigger guy in hopkins, I think Pavlik would land straight shots all night on Froch, and would probably throw alot more shots than Taylor.
Further, Froch definately has the power to stop him before the mid rounds though as Pavlik is one of the most stand up straight, no movement kind of guys out there so he wouldn't be hard to hit and nowhere near as hard to pin down as Taylor was. This will be a fun fight if it comes off, and probably more a battle of will and toe to toe punches rather than a boxing match for the purists.
Would love to see this fight. Although would like to see Froch beat a couple of genuine Super Mids....
Pavlik has a big right hand. Thudding, lethal power. He has a 90% KO ratio.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesthat alone is a bit of an absurd comment, seeing how Froch barely made it out of the 3rd himself, at least Pavlik was dropped early on in the round and managed to survive to then go on and stop Taylor, Froch had bout 30 seconds left in the round and Taylor didn't jump on himQuote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by clintuk
Sorry this is absurd. How is Pavliks chin more proven than Froch's when they were both floored by the same guy?
And Pavlik was hurt far more than Froch was, he barely made it out of the third round.
i'd say it's the type of fight that either man can win, Froch and Pavlik alike are both open to the right hand, but mostly overhand rights, neither man really has an overhand right, i'd give Froch the slight edge cause he has a good upper and he could land it on Pavlik while in close, but i'd have to gie Pavlik the slight edge in power and accuracy
Is froch really the bigger man? Pavlik is definitely taller, and has the reach advantage.. Are we talking bigger as in who has the broader shoulders? lol.. I'd say if anything they are pretty even, if not Kelly being bigger.. Froch is just way more ripped.. As far as power goes, no doubt in my mind that Kelly can bang at 168.. he was a KO machine at 160.Quote:
Originally Posted by RozzySean
Pavlik has a big STRAIGHT right hand, he shoots it down the pipe, Taylor was landing the OVERHAND right, Pavlik doesn't really have an overhand rightQuote:
Originally Posted by RantcatratPavlik has a big right hand. Thudding, lethal power. He has a 90% KO ratio.Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTerribleMoralesthat alone is a bit of an absurd comment, seeing how Froch barely made it out of the 3rd himself, at least Pavlik was dropped early on in the round and managed to survive to then go on and stop Taylor, Froch had bout 30 seconds left in the round and Taylor didn't jump on himQuote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo
i'd say it's the type of fight that either man can win, Froch and Pavlik alike are both open to the right hand, but mostly overhand rights, neither man really has an overhand right, i'd give Froch the slight edge cause he has a good upper and he could land it on Pavlik while in close, but i'd have to gie Pavlik the slight edge in power and accuracy
Froch
I thought Froch looked like the much bigger man against Taylor. Pavlik looked taller and longer than Taylor, but he didn't look like the much bigger man. I believe Kelly is taller, but I think the reach is about the same. I feel like Froch is a little thicker. He's not bigger my much.Quote:
Originally Posted by RP33Is froch really the bigger man? Pavlik is definitely taller, and has the reach advantage.. Are we talking bigger as in who has the broader shoulders? lol.. I'd say if anything they are pretty even, if not Kelly being bigger.. Froch is just way more ripped.. As far as power goes, no doubt in my mind that Kelly can bang at 168.. he was a KO machine at 160.Quote:
Originally Posted by RozzySean
If I were Froch's team I would keep him out of the ring with Pavlik unless the money is off the charts good. I don't think it would be. I don't see that as a PPV card. It's just a really good, very desirable HBO Championship Boxing card. If Ward beats Miranda, Froch will probably fight Ward next, maybe Allen Green. If he can't pull of Bute, those are pretty good options.
Well have to go with Pavlik think he is a better version of Froch. Chins in my book are the same on both to me but i would have to give advantge to Kelly in Power and better def i mean he was picking alot of Taylor shot off. Some people are going to say why i would think Pavlik hits harder well look at the ko differents in there fights i mean Pavlik just knocks the guys out cold and sure he did not do it in the rematch wit Taylor but i thought he won that fight pretty solid and hell Taylor might beat Froch in a rematch. Pretty much comes down to i think that Pavlik while land first and also i that if Pavlik can pick off Taylors shots then he can pick off Froches shots as well.
Whichever one of them decides to go out and get a good trainer who can teach them how to use their feet properly will win the fight. I think that would more likely be Pavlik because Arum is keen to get Loew out of the way.
Froch took complete advantage of Taylor not being able to finish the fight on his feet. Pavlik on the other hand would not gass out like that, perhaps even get stronger as the fight progressed.
Hopkins had Pavlik in trouble because Hopkins is a defensive mastermind and countered at the right times. Froch is not like Hopkins.Quote:
Originally Posted by gudnite vienna
Mate, forget the level of opposition. Obviously that's a factor when it comes to assessing relative boxing skill etc but when it comes to getting hit on the chin the power in the punch is more important than the guy's boxrec page.Quote:
Originally Posted by clintukOk, I realise that sounds silly, but I just meant in the way that he's been hit more times by more world class opposition than Froch has and more often than not has still come out on top. Carl can't, at the moment, claim to have taken on the opposition Pavlik has. But it'd still be a very competitive fight I reckon, if there's any way it can happen at the moment with Abraham pulling at Pavlik.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboQuote:
Originally Posted by clintuk
Sorry this is absurd. How is Pavliks chin more proven than Froch's when they were both floored by the same guy?
And Pavlik was hurt far more than Froch was, he barely made it out of the third round.
Watch his fights and look at the punches that hit him. :)
Froch's problem is that we've got too good an idea of how good his chin is... the fucker blocks punches with his chin half the time.
Like I've said, fair enough when talking about his boxing skill and future prospects obviously the guy's records are going to come into it but you just have to look at the bloke to see that his chin is at worst solid and that he's extremely well conditioned (and fuck me he needs to be!!) and not boxrec.
And yeah Rozzy, Froch looked bigger. Much thicker legs (Taylor's calves looked almost non existent compared to Froch) and a much wider back span.
Good post, Froch has got all of the physical attributes to be the man at SMW but if he wants to maintain his success/have any type of longevity at this level he needs someone who can tighten his style up and give him a bit more ring generalship.Quote:
Originally Posted by JazMerkin
I don't know how well Pavlik would do at 168, I don't think he's the same fighter above 160. It'd be a hell of a fight though and another close one.
I would probably go with Pavlick on this one as he doesn't seem to blow out later as a fight progresses. BHOP was all wriong style wise for him and as a result he looked terrible . Him and Froch would be more of a slugfest and I would have Pavlick edging it. I would expect a couple of knock downs on the way too.
Froch showed what he was made of coming back the way he did and has gained more repect from some , myself included.
Someone mentioned the physical size of Froch and yes he does look much bigger, Pavlick doesn't look much but musculature doesn't always amount to being stronger, as for JT calf muscles it's well known that black athletes do not generally have good calves, look at Tysons and his small ankles !!
It is an interesting fight. My fist question would be how Kelly could handle the weight. In both his fights above 160, he seemed out of sorts and did not seem to have the confidence he enjoys at 160. That could be just a coincidence though as Hopkins was brilliant that night and Taylor 2 seemed determined to stay out of harms way.
If Pavlik came in strong and confident, Froch would have to walk through Pavlik's straight shots to land his looping ones. Could Froch withstand it? Hard to say but from what I have seen, guys that Pavlik can hit pretty much always go down.
I would favor Pavlik by ko, be a great fight though!!!
Pavlik couldn't hit hopkins because hopkins was way faster than pavlik and has an elite defence. Froch doesn't have an elite defence and it remains to be seen if froch has more speed than pavlik. Pavlik will land almost every punch he throws at froch and the only hope froch has is the one big bomb like he landed on taylor.
Pick em fight,pure and simple,Froch showed against Taylor he has heart and A world class chin,and he is durable as hell,that Was A Dam good fighter Froch was in ther with Saturday,and personally I would favor Taylor in A re-match,....as far as Pavilik goes,....?...I dont Know?
The problem with Pavilik is he is dreadfully slow,...I mean Froch is no speed demon either,so I would expect the fight to quickly become A War!...Bombs landing all over the place!
Both Guy`s have Granite chins,...I mean look at the shots that Pavilik got caught with in the first Taylor fight that resulted in the knock down....Fuk!...watching that in slo-mo was insane!..those were some crazy good shots!...Personally I think Pavilik is A better style match-up for Froch than Taylor is,in the end if I had to make A Pick,I would tip Pavilik,based solely on the fact that He has fought A higher level of Comp,......But this is A pick-em in my book......I would like to see Froch give Taylor A RE-MATCH.
Froch would find this fight easier than Taylor. Froch is slow and Taylor is fast and it was his speed that did Froch all night. His footwork stumped Froch too. Taylor looked a class act for most the fight.
Pavlik isnt fast and doesnt use his feet well. and fights in straight lines right infront of you.
But if Froch is lookin to have no defence again hed get KO,d. He got lucky big time against Taylor and its the very basics of the sport that were lettin him down.
If Froch can relax and hold a higher gaurd i think hed do better against Pavlik and Bute than he did against Taylor. Kessler would destroy them all though IMO.
It's a close fight but i give the edge to Pavlik.
Neither guy is a defense wizard but at least Pavlik tries to block punches.
Froch can't go walking through punchers like Pavlik.
Tyson had 28-30inch thighs and 18inch calves thats not smallQuote:
Originally Posted by jamiebhoy
If pavlik hit froch half as much as taylor did he'd wake up on the plane back home wondering where his belt went.
That's what i meant, as far as the bold line goes..Quote:
Originally Posted by jamiebhoy
Just because Froch is ripped to shreds and Kelly looks like he doesn't have any muscle on him doesn't mean much.. To say Froch is the "bigger guy" could mean a lot of things.. To say he is the "bigger puncher" i do not agree with.. They both hit very hard, and i couldn't pick who has more power.. But what i do know is that Kelly is good at blocking punches, where Froch keeps his front hand very low, and even though Pavlik is slow, he goes to the body and mixes it up enough to catch Froch often with his big straight right.. I would love to see this fight..
This idea could have it's own thread, but i think time and time again we forget that power and determination alone cannot win fights on a constant basis.. Pavlik was just shown this.. When you have a champ of Pavlik/Froch's style, there is no secret on how to beat them, or what style of fighter can beat them.. Froch is tailor made for Calzaghe, in the same respect that Pavlik was tailor made for Hopkins.. A slower puncher who walks forward, versus VERY sound technical fighters..
This is why i would favor Kessler over Froch.. Kessler plays hit and not get hit, where Pavlik doesn't mind taking a shot if he's trying to land a bomb.. Would be a hell of a scrap..
It's a very good match up IMO. Only way I see it happening soon is if Kelly's camp are confident it would be an easy night going through the non-existent guard. I think there set on going through the Abraham route first though.
If Kelly could regain the mindset he had against Miranda of tucking in his chin and absorb everything which comes while dishing out more, I could see him winning. But I have an incling that Carl is a bit stronger and it would be a close fight.