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When this fight was first made many thought it was an easy fight for Floyd but now the opinions of who will win are becoming more divided but if Mayweather stops marquez surely this is a good result isn't it?? as this is the Man that many feel beat Pacquiao twice whats your opinions on how the win is rated if its a stoppage win?
I think most will still say that it is just Floyd beating a smaller guy. Pbf should win really, but if he wins by KO it will be dam impressive cos JMM is a tough guy.
If Mayweather wins by stoppage then I think it speaks volumes. But I seriously think he would be going tooth and nail to get a stoppage against JMM. But for the sake of argument, if PBF does stop JMM I am certain people will belittle it with the overstated size advantage. I guess JMM is too little for PBF but Pac isn't. Go figure. But I'm sure neither guy is an easy night for PBF, who is a miniature welterweight.
Considering size Marquez is alot closer to Mayweather than Pacquiao was to De La Hoya.
I'd rather see Mayweather lose to Marquez because I think Marquez makes a Better fight for Pacquiao.
So what happens if Mayweather beat Marquez? It is expected....
I know Mayweather is taller than Marquez,but what about reach advantage,if Mayweather has both then that'll be a major factor.Mayweather has the advantage on foot work and covering up really well.Marquez will test Mayweather when or if he cuts down the ring and corners Floyd.It would be impressive if Mayweather stops Marquez due to the fact that Marquez is game and as tough as old boots!Quote:
Originally Posted by Tysonbruno
If Floyd stops Marquez, you can't just chalk it up to Floyd beating a blown up lightweight, because Floyd hasn't been knocking many guys out for a long time. He went the distance with guys like Castillo, Sosa, Corley, Zab, etc.
If he stops Marquez, it'll have to be because Floyd fought a very good fight and landed a ton of clean punches.
I think Floyd chose Marquez because he believes he'll stop him. An impressive stoppage gets one up on Pac and bodes well for him in the negotiations for their fight.
I expect the natural size advantage to be quite noticeable once they're in the ring.
The opinions aren't becoming more divided. A vast majority of people believe PBF will dominate Marquez in this fight (my prediction for what it is worth is 9 rounds to 3 for PBF in a clear decision victory).Quote:
Originally Posted by Tysonbruno
A stoppage by cut won't be much more impressive than a decision victory. A hard knockout clearly would be impressive although a hard knockout of Pacquiao by Cotto would be more impressive.
PBF is a minature welterweight? Is that consensus? He is 30 (?) and has fought at welterweight for the last four years and his height and reach are definitely comparable to most top welterweights out there other than Pwill. Cotto is shorter and has less reach and Shane is the same height and has around the same reach. Berto same.Quote:
Originally Posted by blegit
There is a size advantage. It isn't overstated. In the same way Cotto possesses a size advantage over Pacquiao, which is one of the things that makes that fight interesting.
Pac and JMM are too little for PBF; PBF should be favored against either fighter. I agree neither fight is a gimme for PBF, but he should be favored.
Here is Eddie Mustapha Muhammad (Chad Dawson's Trainer) on the size disparity between PBF and Pacman:
prediction.
FLOYD VS. MANNY: “Without a doubt, that fight will happen. Pacman’s speed is too much for Miguel Cotto. He can outpoint Cotto just on speed. You can’t beat Manny throwing one jab at a time because he comes right over the top on you. It would take the Mayweather style to beat Manny. Floyd is a full fledged welterweight, he’s just too big for Manny. He will beat Pacquiao." - From the Examiner
he'll stop him. bet the house on it.
Nah, i'll give that a miss. I quite enjoy living in a house.Quote:
Originally Posted by jokaleras
I'm a big fan of Floyd/Jmm, but this fight is a total mismatch. Floyd's advantages over Marquez are talent, handspeed, footspeed, size, strength, height, youth and possibly reach.
Name me one thing that Marquez has over Floyd? There isn't one, unless you count being more active as one.
he will. you'll realize come fight night the gap in class. as skilled as jmm is.Quote:
Originally Posted by ryanman89Nah, i'll give that a miss. I quite enjoy living in a house.Quote:
Originally Posted by jokaleras
Just as a fun fact I found the heights of names in the WW division. Some of these guys haven't fought at Welter for a bit, but all have fought there within the last 3 years.
6'1"
Paul Williams
6'0"
Delvin Rodriguez
5'11"
Antonio Margarito
5'10"
Jesus Soto Karass
5'9"
Shane Mosley
Andre Berto
Kell Brook
Alfonso Gomez
Saul Alvarez
5'8"
Floyd Mayweather
Joshua Clottey
Isaac Hlatshwayo
5'7"
Juan Manuel Marquez
Miguel Cotto
Selcuk Aydin
Zab Judah
5'6"
Sebastian Andres Lujan
Heart. I still favor Floyd - he has entirely too many advantages - but heart is always an X factor in boxing.Quote:
Originally Posted by generalbulldog
I will surely be one to say that Floyd beat up a smaller man because he did. Marquez is fighting a man who fought a 154 at one point and the highest was 135 for Marquez that is a 19 pound difference. Not to mention Mayweather retired and probably walked around at 155 during retirement. Marquez has really nothing in his favor in this fight except the ability to recoop quickly and maybe maybe a slight edge in counterpunching. I sure as shit hope Marquez can pull this is out but my head says no way.
to be technical, floyd weighed 150 during the oscar fight fight.. maybe even less.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
Marquez is definitely a "smaller" guy when you look at the weight classes, but I wouldn't say Floyd is extremely significantly more powerfull than JMM..
Jmm knocked Pac down, KO'd Diaz, KO'd Casamayor all at 135..
Hatton was the first guy Floyd KO'd at WW.. someone with no defense.. and the last guy in the past four years..
While an academic point with the weight classes, when you look at reality, the strength difference isn't much of a discrepency.
Either i missed that or ur mistaken.Quote:
Originally Posted by RP33to be technical, floyd weighed 150 during the oscar fight fight.. maybe even less.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
Marquez is definitely a "smaller" guy when you look at the weight classes, but I wouldn't say Floyd is extremely significantly more powerfull than JMM..
Jmm knocked Pac down, KO'd Diaz, KO'd Casamayor all at 135..
Hatton was the first guy Floyd KO'd at WW.. someone with no defense.. and the last guy in the past four years..
While an academic point with the weight classes, when you look at reality, the strength difference isn't much of a discrepency.
yeah, i'm mistaken.. who am i thinking of, barerra?Quote:
Originally Posted by Manuel "Chubby" MedinaEither i missed that or ur mistaken.Quote:
Originally Posted by RP33to be technical, floyd weighed 150 during the oscar fight fight.. maybe even less.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fightfan
Marquez is definitely a "smaller" guy when you look at the weight classes, but I wouldn't say Floyd is extremely significantly more powerfull than JMM..
Jmm knocked Pac down, KO'd Diaz, KO'd Casamayor all at 135..
Hatton was the first guy Floyd KO'd at WW.. someone with no defense.. and the last guy in the past four years..
While an academic point with the weight classes, when you look at reality, the strength difference isn't much of a discrepency.
either way, point still stands.
Mayweather has every tool in the book to dominate a counter puncher like JMM... I will not be impressed if Mayweather beats JMM by decision. HOWEVER, if PBF does win by knockout i will give PBF his just dues... I hate PBF...
Side Note: As long as Pac faces the winner (pending the cotto fight results) i'm good....
I'll give him credit for a KO but it's what I'm expecting anyway.
If PBF KO's Marquez he deserves to earn the larger % of purse vs Pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kel
why? pac got the p4p when pbf retired, pac fought alot since then and pbf didnt do nothing.
if pbf Kos jmm he kod a guy with a one loss one draw record against pac. we can argue the same that pac also kod in a better fashion hatton.
pbf cant demand the larger purse cause he aint drawing crowds anymore.
going back to topic
i think jmm can handle pbf, i wish he can win. but its impossible for pbf to toy with jmm.
Mayweather hasn't dropped many fighters in his career. The ones he has been able to hand a beat down to in recent years are one dimensional, come forward brawlers...like Gatti and Hatton. Marquez is way too tough, skilled, and intelligent to simply be target practice for Floyd. Floyd's inactivity is my biggest concern...if he comes in rusty after a near two year layoff...Marquez will surprise him. But Floyd knows what is on the table...a future fight with Pac...and he knows Marquez is a great fighter...so i think he will be fully prepared. I have Floyd winning on points simply because he has too much speed and slickness for Marquez to handle.
I disagree. It should be 50-50 or Pac should get more money. It also depends on how Pac dispatches Cotto and the final numbers for both fights.Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingIf PBF KO's Marquez he deserves to earn the larger % of purse vs Pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kel
I agree. Floyd has too much speed and is too elusive for Marquez. I'd be very, very surprised if Marquez wins. I wouldn't be as surprised if Cotto beat Pacquiao.Quote:
Originally Posted by zhubin
My belief is the style to beat Floyd is a bigger boxer who either is equally fast or is a volume puncher (e.g. Pwill or SSM). Truthfully, that may not be enough to beat Floyd, but we've never seen him fight someone who possesses those characteristics. He's beat brawlers, counter punchers, and smaller fighters.
I thought this fight was easy to predict. Personally I think that Marquez would be Mayweather's most difficult fight.
The timing of Marquez is impeccable and his punching power is something not to be underestimated. If he was able to KO Casamayor and Diaz, I give him a 45% chance of hurting Mayweather.
If Marquez was able to withstood the onslaught of Pac, which proved too much for Hatton and DLH, then he could also withstand the punches of Mayweather.
IMO, I don't see Mayweather stopping Marquez. If he will be able to do it then he deserves a larger purse than Pac in case they meet.:cool:
Guess your not a total idiot.Quote:
Originally Posted by brucelee
Quote:
Originally Posted by Violent DemiseGuess your not (should be: you're not) a total idiot.Quote:
Originally Posted by brucelee
Thanks. I hope it's a compliment. To prove that I am not an idiot I have decided to edit your sentence.
No wonder you are fond of using one-liners. LOL. ;D;D;D
Easy, Pac is #1, JMM #2. Pac never Ko'd JMM. PBF remains undefeated ....Quote:
Originally Posted by mnmc10
Look at the mindset and skill level that Pac hand picks floundering foes:
David Diaz was awarded the title when Joel Casamayor, the champion at the time, was stripped of the title for signing to fight WBO champion Acelino Freitas rather than defend against him.
David Diaz -
3 foes prior to Pac fight. Ramon Montano, EM (an old washed up fighter, yet many felt EM won the fight). Jose Armando Santa Cruz a guy now 3 & 3 in his last 6 fights.
ODLH - weight drained cross dressing promoter -
An old Joke : 3 foes prior to Pac fight. Mayorga (another joke with no skill set) Forbes (journeyman) and he barely won. Mayweather - could have won but clearly could no longer pull the trigger and just had to throw more jabs to win.
Hatton -
Malagnaggi ( does not even posses the strength to even blow out a candle). Lazcano - entered he Hatton fight having lost in previous fight to Vivian Harris. Mayweather - made Hatton look like an amatuer ( witness funniest KO I have ever seen)
Cotto -
Joshua Clottey ( tough foe, Cotto did just enough to win , not impressive)
Michael Jennings - Little known with no impressive opponents on record , 34% KO %.
Margarito - Loss his heart that night. It was obvious in the Clottey fight he will never be the same.
So see how Pac has cherry picked his way to fame. Granted he has performed in ring. But Pac fight the wounded with a marquee name. EM fight one and JMM are the only opponents they have underestimated / miscalculated.
You can do this to all of Pac's foes after facing JMM in their 1st fight. They either lost their previous fight or one of their last three fights prior to entering the fight vs Pac..
JMM's is no murderers row either but slightly more impressive than Pac's.
This is why PBF deserves the larger purse, if and only he manages to KO JMM.
Pacman fills the arenas, Floyd doesn't. Pacman has the belt, Floyd doesn't.Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingIf PBF KO's Marquez he deserves to earn the larger % of purse vs Pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kel
So, yeah, I disagree there:)
Most boxing fans don't give a shit if Mayweather or Pac gets the larger purse, We just want to see the fight be made and hopefully it will be a good one.
I think it will be Mayweather vs Cotto in 2010 i don't think Pac can beat Cotto the weight thing with Cotto concerns me but if he comes down right i think he will be to big and strong for pac i think he has bitten off to much this time.
How do we judge this though? Based on the numbers of their upcoming fights? It takes 2 to tangle & 2 to sell tickets. Pacquiao and Cotto are going to outdraw Mayweather & Marquez simply because Marquez isn't as big a name as the other guys.Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessPacman fills the arenas, Floyd doesn't. So, yeah, I disagree there:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxingIf PBF KO's Marquez he deserves to earn the larger % of purse vs Pac.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kel
The only fair way to measure who draws more is put them both against the same opponents and see which fights sell. Luckily we have 2 fights to give us the numbers but it seems alot of people choose to look away from those facts in black & white.;) We can measure how well Mayweather/Marquez sells in contrast to how Pacquiao/Marquez sold, right?
If we both have Ferraris to race but mine has stone wheels, you'll win every time. 2 marquee names vs 1 marquee name & 1 underrated name...It's an unfair way to measure.
I agree. Cotto may beat Pacquiao. The fight's at 145, right? If so, the weight doesn't concern me at all. The only thing that concerns me that is that Freddie Roach wanted this fight and it has been proven he knows what Pacquiao can and can't handle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tysonbruno
You really think PBF will fight Cotto?
For me, logic says this is right.....Quote:
Originally Posted by Tysonbruno
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV VVVV
http://www.saddoboxing.com/boxingfor...re-garden.html
Mayweather outpoints Marquez.
Manny beats Cotto.
Floyd beats Manny.
The only big venue Mayweather filled was when he fought against DLH and once again, it was mainly because of DLH. No matter where he goes, Pacman fills the arenas and drag a huge amount of money generated by the PPV, even when he's not fighting against the best of the best of the best. It takes 2 to dance tango but often, you come to see one of the two dancers. THe guy has talent but is not that charismatic neither has an attractive style for most of the fans plus it is more than common that the belt holder gets a bigger piece of the pie, especially when the champion is a superstar and not a cinderella man.Quote:
Originally Posted by knodaledgeHow do we judge this though? Based on the numbers of their upcoming fights? It takes 2 to tangle & 2 to sell tickets. Pacquiao and Cotto are going to outdraw Mayweather & Marquez simply because Marquez isn't as big a name as the other guys.Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessPacman fills the arenas, Floyd doesn't. So, yeah, I disagree there:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxing
The only fair way to measure who draws more is put them both against the same opponents and see which fights sell. Luckily we have 2 fights to give us the numbers but it seems alot of people choose to look away from those facts in black & white.;) We can measure how well Mayweather/Marquez sells in contrast to how Pacquiao/Marquez sold, right?
If we both have Ferraris to race but mine has stone wheels, you'll win every time. 2 marquee names vs 1 marquee name & 1 underrated name...It's an unfair way to measure.
False. He has sold out all of his shows in Michigan (his home state) against Carlos Rios, Emanuel Augustus, Carlos Hernandez & Philip Ndou. I believe that the Gatti, Judah & Hatton fights were also all sold out, not sure about Corrales though.Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessThe only big venue Mayweather filled was when he fought against DLH and once again, it was mainly because of DLH. No matter where he goes, Pacman fills the arenas and drag a huge amount of money generated by the PPV, even when he's not fighting against the best of the best of the best. It takes 2 to dance tango but often, you come to see one of the two dancers. THe guy has talent but is not that charismatic neither has an attractive style for most of the fans plus it is more than common that the belt holder gets a bigger piece of the pie, especially when the champion is a superstar and not a cinderella man.Quote:
Originally Posted by knodaledgeHow do we judge this though? Based on the numbers of their upcoming fights? It takes 2 to tangle & 2 to sell tickets. Pacquiao and Cotto are going to outdraw Mayweather & Marquez simply because Marquez isn't as big a name as the other guys.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nameless
The only fair way to measure who draws more is put them both against the same opponents and see which fights sell. Luckily we have 2 fights to give us the numbers but it seems alot of people choose to look away from those facts in black & white.;) We can measure how well Mayweather/Marquez sells in contrast to how Pacquiao/Marquez sold, right?
If we both have Ferraris to race but mine has stone wheels, you'll win every time. 2 marquee names vs 1 marquee name & 1 underrated name...It's an unfair way to measure.
Marquez is a marquee name. If he doesn't count as a marquee name then i guess there are only 2 'marquee' names in boxing.Quote:
Originally Posted by knodaledgeHow do we judge this though? Based on the numbers of their upcoming fights? It takes 2 to tangle & 2 to sell tickets. Pacquiao and Cotto are going to outdraw Mayweather & Marquez simply because Marquez isn't as big a name as the other guys.Quote:
Originally Posted by NamelessPacman fills the arenas, Floyd doesn't. So, yeah, I disagree there:)Quote:
Originally Posted by Addicted to_boxing
The only fair way to measure who draws more is put them both against the same opponents and see which fights sell. Luckily we have 2 fights to give us the numbers but it seems alot of people choose to look away from those facts in black & white.;) We can measure how well Mayweather/Marquez sells in contrast to how Pacquiao/Marquez sold, right?
If we both have Ferraris to race but mine has stone wheels, you'll win every time. 2 marquee names vs 1 marquee name & 1 underrated name...It's an unfair way to measure.
Marquez marquee marquee Marquez! Both of them words now look like gibberish to me!;D
Very well put bruceleeQuote:
Originally Posted by brucelee