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Watching UFC as a boxing fan
I have little or no interest in MMA but I have BT Vision and UFC 120 (I think) was on there so I had a quick look.
Now, there was a British fella with a mohawk fighting and he got hit with a swinging left (I think) hook and went down hard but there was then the unedifying sight of the the still vertical fighter jumping on his prone victim and punching him twice in the face whilst his head bounced off the canvas with each blow.
I've had no real grudge to bear with MMA (despite finding it quite dull) in the past, and perhaps I've become a little sensitive, but this struck me has being somewhat repugnant. Having watched Webb v Concepcion on Saturday and seen how a boxer is protected after a heavy shot (imagine if Webb had jumped on him and started smacking him about the head) I have decided that I have been correct in avoiding this unseemly circus.
Now, where is my smoking jacket?
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
GuyIncognito76
I have little or no interest in MMA but I have BT Vision and UFC 120 (I think) was on there so I had a quick look.
Now, there was a British fella with a mohawk fighting and he got hit with a swinging left (I think) hook and went down hard but there was then the unedifying sight of the the still vertical fighter jumping on his prone victim and punching him twice in the face whilst his head bounced off the canvas with each blow.
I've had no real grudge to bear with MMA (despite finding it quite dull) in the past, and perhaps I've become a little sensitive, but this struck me has being somewhat repugnant. Having watched Webb v Concepcion on Saturday and seen how a boxer is protected after a heavy shot (imagine if Webb had jumped on him and started smacking him about the head) I have decided that I have been correct in avoiding this unseemly circus.
Now, where is my smoking jacket?
Yeah that is a problem I have with MMA as well. I mean the guys know what they are signing up for, and as it stands now noone has died yet. For me though it is only a matter of time.
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Not only do I see it the same way, I actually own 2 smoking jackets.
I was more aghast at the mowhawked chap's lack of proper pugalistic defense which led to that KO. Poor form on his part and poor form on the other fellow's part for hitting him as he was out on the canvas.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
killersheep
Quote:
Originally Posted by
GuyIncognito76
I have little or no interest in MMA but I have BT Vision and UFC 120 (I think) was on there so I had a quick look.
Now, there was a British fella with a mohawk fighting and he got hit with a swinging left (I think) hook and went down hard but there was then the unedifying sight of the the still vertical fighter jumping on his prone victim and punching him twice in the face whilst his head bounced off the canvas with each blow.
I've had no real grudge to bear with MMA (despite finding it quite dull) in the past, and perhaps I've become a little sensitive, but this struck me has being somewhat repugnant. Having watched Webb v Concepcion on Saturday and seen how a boxer is protected after a heavy shot (imagine if Webb had jumped on him and started smacking him about the head) I have decided that I have been correct in avoiding this unseemly circus.
Now, where is my smoking jacket?
Yeah that is a problem I have with MMA as well. I mean the guys know what they are signing up for, and as it stands now noone has died yet. For me though it is only a matter of time.
Killer, just have a google of Michael Kirkham, he was an MMA fighter who most recently died. Just not a high profile one. He was pummelled on the floor while completely unconcious in a move which MMA people like to call Ground and Pound, it was sickening. This terrible brutality coupled with the fact that more often than not its boring as hell with two guys rolling around grappling each other that puts me right off. May try find myself a smoking jacket on ebay.
The way James Toney lost was further proof of a sport with many ugly and shoddy ways to go down. Poo!!!
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Kicking is also poor form...
As for where one can find a smoking jacket I suggest cordarounds, they have some decent ones.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
That was Dan Hardy my favorite UFC fighter :( I love boxing and MMA it depends on you as a person if you like fighting on a whole you should like MMA its as raw as you can get to a fighting sport. Boxing is one dimensional it isn't fighting its punching thats not real. MMA is everything mixed into one thats real, thats a fight. Any way these guys chose to do it they love the sport there in and get paid to get in shape and fight!?!? Thats why you don't hear them complaining about how brutal the sport is so what's the point in us doing it?
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
mma fighters get alot of stick for there boxing skills but the way i look at it is take the decathlon the athletes cant run as fast as the best 100 metre runners or throw as far as the best javalin throwers in the world but they do all 10 events.
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Boxing IS fighting from my viewpoint. I wouldn't dare kick someone or hit a downed opponent. Maybe I put myself at a disadvantage but that's the price I pay for having a certain amount of couth and not being some knuckle dragging savage
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Boxing IS fighting from my viewpoint. I wouldn't dare kick someone or hit a downed opponent. Maybe I put myself at a disadvantage but that's the price I pay for having a certain amount of couth and not being some knuckle dragging savage
i agree i have always been the same in street fights but that aint the way now adays
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
That was Dan Hardy my favorite UFC fighter :( I love boxing and MMA it depends on you as a person if you like fighting on a whole you should like MMA its as raw as you can get to a fighting sport. Boxing is one dimensional it isn't fighting its punching thats not real. MMA is everything mixed into one thats real, thats a fight. Any way these guys chose to do it they love the sport there in and get paid to get in shape and fight!?!? Thats why you don't hear them complaining about how brutal the sport is so what's the point in us doing it?
There's nothing remotely sporting about repeatedly punching an already unconscious bloke in the face. I think that's most people's gripe, aside from it being fairly dull.
I enjoyed the Bisping fight. That was exciting and sporting. A great combination. I enjoyed the knockout shot that was landed on Hardy, because imo he's a big mouthed silly twat. But even though i don't like him, it still wasn't good to see him pummelled twice whilst he was knocked out.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
i believe henderson said he enjoyed punching bisping when he was on the floor ko'd
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
this is from the thesun.co.uk
When (henderson) asked if he knew Bisping was unconscious before he landed the final strike, Henderson smiled and said: "Normally I'm not that way in fights.
"I know if the guy's out, I tend to stop. I hit him hard but I got that last blow in just to shut him up a little bit."
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Drago
this is from the thesun.co.uk
When (henderson) asked if he knew Bisping was unconscious before he landed the final strike, Henderson smiled and said: "Normally I'm not that way in fights.
"I know if the guy's out, I tend to stop. I hit him hard but I got that last blow in just to shut him up a little bit."
I remember that. Half serves Bisping right for circling onto Henderson's right hand all night. But it was well uncalled for.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
That was Dan Hardy my favorite UFC fighter :( I love boxing and MMA it depends on you as a person if you like fighting on a whole you should like MMA its as raw as you can get to a fighting sport. Boxing is one dimensional it isn't fighting its punching thats not real. MMA is everything mixed into one thats real, thats a fight. Any way these guys chose to do it they love the sport there in and get paid to get in shape and fight!?!? Thats why you don't hear them complaining about how brutal the sport is so what's the point in us doing it?
As I said those guys know what they're signing up for, they should have the freedom to put themselves in that position of danger if they choose.
I am not surprised that I was wrong when I stated that noone had died. That's fine that people follow MMA, not my cup of tea, and I expect more deaths to come.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Cage fighting and the like just ain't my thing. But i can see how so many do like it. I dont watch kickboxing or karate either for all that matters. I've been to a couple of the events out here, and found that it's more about walking around and acting tough than it is actually watching the fights but to each thier own.
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Obviously I prefer boxing, MMA fights are so hit and miss, either good or boring as hell. I never really see any middle.
The last MMA fight I watched was the Alex Reid fight, which I only watched because I expected it to be a farce, but that was pretty good. Mainly I suppose because they were stood up most the night actually fighting and not cuddling on the floor making man love.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Boxing IS fighting from my viewpoint. I wouldn't dare kick someone or hit a downed opponent. Maybe I put myself at a disadvantage but that's the price I pay for having a certain amount of couth and not being some knuckle dragging savage
Boxing is but an aspect of fighting its a small part of stand up. So you mean to say if you were in a fight with someone and they got close to you so punches would be almost ineffective you would use a knee or elbow? If someone had kicked you when you were down then you got the chance to do so back to them you would turn it down? Why your view of MMA fighters is so low is beyond me. There are people out there would say to men in a ring punching each other is idiotic but thats because they don't understand the sport and you obviously don't understand MMA.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ono
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
That was Dan Hardy my favorite UFC fighter :( I love boxing and MMA it depends on you as a person if you like fighting on a whole you should like MMA its as raw as you can get to a fighting sport. Boxing is one dimensional it isn't fighting its punching thats not real. MMA is everything mixed into one thats real, thats a fight. Any way these guys chose to do it they love the sport there in and get paid to get in shape and fight!?!? Thats why you don't hear them complaining about how brutal the sport is so what's the point in us doing it?
There's nothing remotely sporting about repeatedly punching an already unconscious bloke in the face. I think that's most people's gripe, aside from it being fairly dull.
I enjoyed the Bisping fight. That was exciting and sporting. A great combination. I enjoyed the knockout shot that was landed on Hardy, because imo he's a big mouthed silly twat. But even though i don't like him, it still wasn't good to see him pummelled twice whilst he was knocked out.
If we go by that then theres nothing sporting in seeing a fighter get dominated for 12 rounds so he is hospitalized or a late stoppage causing damage to a fighter. Its a joke that BOXING fans can just dismiss a sport because its so brutal! And boxing isnt? Also Its dull because you don't appreciate it and highly likely you don't understand half of it for example the ground game or up against the fence in the clinch.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Boxing IS fighting from my viewpoint. I wouldn't dare kick someone or hit a downed opponent. Maybe I put myself at a disadvantage but that's the price I pay for having a certain amount of couth and not being some knuckle dragging savage
Boxing is but an aspect of fighting its a small part of stand up. So you mean to say if you were in a fight with someone and they got close to you so punches would be almost ineffective you would use a knee or elbow? If someone had kicked you when you were down then you got the chance to do so back to them you would turn it down? Why your view of MMA fighters is so low is beyond me. There are people out there would say to men in a ring punching each other is idiotic but thats because they don't understand the sport and you obviously don't understand MMA.
Matty nothing personal but this is a dumb argument. First of all, MMA isn't real fighting. Real fighting is real fighting, where literally anything happens. No setting people up for a guillotine or anything like that, no weapons, people wear gloves etc. It's a sport, that's why it has rules. Boxing is also a sport, it's why it has rules. They're both fighting sports but to argue one is better because it is 'more like fighting' is dumb because neither of them are actual no holds barred fighting. Also, boxing is just one part of MMA standup like Joe ROgan says. Most MMA fighters, even ones with a boxing base style, have completely ignored some very basic boxing fundamentals like good head movement and other things. Secondly, boxing is a sport with it's own set of rules that have been very successful. Boxing is a specialty, it takes years and years perfecting your boxing while someone can go into MMA with knowledge of only one discipline and take a few years to round out their skills and beat anybody. What's really harder? It's hard to say. MMA and boxing need to stop being compared, also I don't like MMA simply because so much of the standup is reminiscent to watching a Toughman competition. It's just not appealing.
However, as far as the strikes while downed being dangerous, they definitely are and Bisping got the worst of it by Henderson BUT it's still safer then boxing. Boxing gives you a standing 8 to collect yourself and go get on your feet to take punishment when really you shouldn't be. At least when you're out in MMA, you can take 2-3 shots max. In boxing you can take hundreds of more shots when in MMA you would have been stopped the first or second time you got hit cleanly and hurt.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
It's a bit unfair to say people aren't understanding it because they think it is boring. What is there to really understand about the ground game? They get on the ground and wrestle around for a dominant position and wait the round out, bludgeon the opponent or try to use a choke or submission to make them quit. I wouldn't agree with someone who says that those things take no skill but that has no bearing on whether or not I want to watch it. I think it is a bit of a joke to assume not enjoying something equals not understanding it.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ono
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
That was Dan Hardy my favorite UFC fighter :( I love boxing and MMA it depends on you as a person if you like fighting on a whole you should like MMA its as raw as you can get to a fighting sport. Boxing is one dimensional it isn't fighting its punching thats not real. MMA is everything mixed into one thats real, thats a fight. Any way these guys chose to do it they love the sport there in and get paid to get in shape and fight!?!? Thats why you don't hear them complaining about how brutal the sport is so what's the point in us doing it?
There's nothing remotely sporting about repeatedly punching an already unconscious bloke in the face. I think that's most people's gripe, aside from it being fairly dull.
I enjoyed the Bisping fight. That was exciting and sporting. A great combination. I enjoyed the knockout shot that was landed on Hardy, because imo he's a big mouthed silly twat. But even though i don't like him, it still wasn't good to see him pummelled twice whilst he was knocked out.
If we go by that then theres nothing sporting in seeing a fighter get dominated for 12 rounds so he is hospitalized or a late stoppage causing damage to a fighter. Its a joke that BOXING fans can just dismiss a sport because its so brutal! And boxing isnt? Also Its dull because you don't appreciate it and highly likely you don't understand half of it for example the ground game or up against the fence in the clinch.
I agree, but when a fighter is getting dominated (in boxing), he can actually still defend himself. He can also choose to quit, and the referee and his corner can also pull him out. On rare occasions where this doesn't happen, you have to point the finger at the referee and/or the fighter's corner - not the sport.
When a fighter is getting pounded in the face whilst he's unconscious, and that smug wanker Joe Rogan is creaming himself over it, the unconscious fighter has no choice but to take the punishment. The sad part is how eager Condit was to 'ground and pound' an all ready clearly knocked out Dan Hardy. Same with the Henderson - Bisping fight. What's even sadder is the little asbo fuckers in the 'Tap Out' t-shirts in the crowd giving it the gang signs, delighted that they've finally found a sport that represents them as a person.
Utter cringe worthy.
As for the 'not understanding it', see Global's post. Pretty much sums up my feelings.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Boxing IS fighting from my viewpoint. I wouldn't dare kick someone or hit a downed opponent. Maybe I put myself at a disadvantage but that's the price I pay for having a certain amount of couth and not being some knuckle dragging savage
Boxing is but an aspect of fighting its a small part of stand up. So you mean to say if you were in a fight with someone and they got close to you so punches would be almost ineffective you would use a knee or elbow? If someone had kicked you when you were down then you got the chance to do so back to them you would turn it down? Why your view of MMA fighters is so low is beyond me. There are people out there would say to men in a ring punching each other is idiotic but thats because they don't understand the sport and you obviously don't understand MMA.
If I can't whup someone's ass with just my two fists then I don't deserve to win. That's the way I look at it, I may be old school, but I'm from the line of thinking that #1 I don't fight without reason #2 if I whip someone's ass in a fight the fight ends there and its settled and I'll go buy the poor guy a beer and #3 I can take losing without resorting to trying to kill someone or calling the cops.
All this extra bullshit is life threatening and unnecessary. If you were in a street fight and someone KO'd you would you want them to help you back up or get in a few more shots and leave you for dead?
People have no manners these days!
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I fully understand it, I just don't appreciate it. I do like a good scrap of any kind, any sport. But a love boxing because of the art.
MMA is more raw, but the lack of rules can lead to boring struggles for love. Barely moving for ages, just holding a grip on someone. Just doesn't excite me.
That's not to say boxing doesn't have it's dire fights. I'm not even gonna name them, don't need to. But as with any sports it's not always thrills.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
There is a terrible misconception that MMA is more dangerous than boxing. This is completely false. Yes, there are times when MMA can be barbaric.
But think about this: what would have happened if the Hardy (the Brit with the Mohawk the original poster mentioned) bout would have been a boxing match? After having his brain rattled, he would have been given a 10 count to get up. He would have made the count, and depending on his recovery time, he could have suffered another several minutes (or rounds) of blows to the head.
Although the MMA fininsh looks more brutal and even cowardly, the fallen fighter was better off taking the one or two extra punches on the ground. Those ground punches are not nearly as hard as a standing punch, A) because you can't put your whole body into it and B) because fighters hold back because if they miss, it means a broken hand on the mat.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
A good example of this is the last Macarenelli fight. A concussed, hurt Macarenelli was given his 10 count so he could get to his feet, only to take several more brutal haymakers. In MMA, the fight would have been stopped when he was first dropped.
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If you're on the ground in some kind of wrestling hold and your opponent has a free hand with which he pummels you with repeatedly the ref can't tell you're hurt until your body goes limp at which time an MMA fighter amps up the aggression and gets in 3-4 more good whacks before the fight is over.
More safe huh?
Enzo got asked if he was OK before he came to scratch, he answered in the affirmative. He was given an out and he nor his corner took it.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Beanflicker
There is a terrible misconception that MMA is more dangerous than boxing. This is completely false. Yes, there are times when MMA can be barbaric.
But think about this: what would have happened if the Hardy (the Brit with the Mohawk the original poster mentioned) bout would have been a boxing match? After having his brain rattled, he would have been given a 10 count to get up. He would have made the count, and depending on his recovery time, he could have suffered another several minutes (or rounds) of blows to the head.
Although the MMA fininsh looks more brutal and even cowardly, the fallen fighter was better off taking the one or two extra punches on the ground. Those ground punches are not nearly as hard as a standing punch, A) because you can't put your whole body into it and B) because fighters hold back because if they miss, it means a broken hand on the mat.
Don't agree with the last bit. Seen it on many occasion where a fighter has literally jumped up into the air to ensure his full body weight comes down on the face of the fallen.
Half agree with the rest, although in Boxing there is that break which allows the referee to judge if a fighter is capable of carrying on. What happened with Enzo Mac is talked about because it is so rare.
I can't see the argument for saying Hardy would have got back up to take more punishment. No sane referee would have let him continue. He was in a bad way.
With that said, i do think that MMA is probably a little safer than Boxing, but again that is more of a gut feeling based on exactly fuck all.
However it's not just the cowardice with hitting an unconscious man, it's the fact that 'ground and pound' is a celebrated aspect of the sport, and Joe Rogan and his cronies coo over it like an excited kid on Christmas Day. I don't see that aspect in Boxing. When there's a bad knockout, more often than not, the attention turns to the injured fighter, and his well-being takes over. I don't see that in the UFC. The more avid fans might see it, but i just don't.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
ono
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Beanflicker
There is a terrible misconception that MMA is more dangerous than boxing. This is completely false. Yes, there are times when MMA can be barbaric.
But think about this: what would have happened if the Hardy (the Brit with the Mohawk the original poster mentioned) bout would have been a boxing match? After having his brain rattled, he would have been given a 10 count to get up. He would have made the count, and depending on his recovery time, he could have suffered another several minutes (or rounds) of blows to the head.
Although the MMA fininsh looks more brutal and even cowardly, the fallen fighter was better off taking the one or two extra punches on the ground. Those ground punches are not nearly as hard as a standing punch, A) because you can't put your whole body into it and B) because fighters hold back because if they miss, it means a broken hand on the mat.
Don't agree with the last bit. Seen it on many occasion where a fighter has literally jumped up into the air to ensure his full body weight comes down on the face of the fallen.
Half agree with the rest, although in Boxing there is that break which allows the referee to judge if a fighter is capable of carrying on. What happened with Enzo Mac is talked about because it is so rare.
I can't see the argument for saying Hardy would have got back up to take more punishment. No sane referee would have let him continue. He was in a bad way.
With that said, i do think that MMA is probably a little safer than Boxing, but again that is more of a gut feeling based on exactly fuck all.
However it's not just the cowardice with hitting an unconscious man, it's the fact that 'ground and pound' is a celebrated aspect of the sport, and Joe Rogan and his cronies coo over it like an excited kid on Christmas Day. I don't see that aspect in Boxing. When there's a bad knockout, more often than not, the attention turns to the injured fighter, and his well-being takes over. I don't see that in the UFC. The more avid fans might see it, but i just don't.
Although... There has been a valid argument recently(ish) that commented on the difference in both visible damage (like cuts and bruises) caused by MMA style mits and undetectable damage (like brain haemorrhaging) damage caused by a 10oz gloves.
I know that came across as abit lame... I know 10oz gloves don't directly cause brain haemorrhaging but the argument states that the prolonged (and ironically, more sufferable) beating that a fighter can take from 10oz gloves, puts them at a greater risk of sustaining greater internal damage.
In effect, it's safer to have your lights put out, than to have your brain repeatedly rattled.
Or something like that anyway... :rolleyes:
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Oh, and then there's the idea that because your hands are more protected in Boxing gloves bla bla bla
You don't have deaths in boxing from spectacular one punch KO's . Fortunately, those victims got lucky :-\
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
amat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Boxing IS fighting from my viewpoint. I wouldn't dare kick someone or hit a downed opponent. Maybe I put myself at a disadvantage but that's the price I pay for having a certain amount of couth and not being some knuckle dragging savage
Boxing is but an aspect of fighting its a small part of stand up. So you mean to say if you were in a fight with someone and they got close to you so punches would be almost ineffective you would use a knee or elbow? If someone had kicked you when you were down then you got the chance to do so back to them you would turn it down? Why your view of MMA fighters is so low is beyond me. There are people out there would say to men in a ring punching each other is idiotic but thats because they don't understand the sport and you obviously don't understand MMA.
Matty nothing personal but this is a dumb argument. First of all, MMA isn't real fighting. Real fighting is real fighting, where literally anything happens. No setting people up for a guillotine or anything like that, no weapons, people wear gloves etc. It's a sport, that's why it has rules. Boxing is also a sport, it's why it has rules. They're both fighting sports but to argue one is better because it is 'more like fighting' is dumb because neither of them are actual no holds barred fighting. Also, boxing is just one part of MMA standup like Joe ROgan says. Most MMA fighters, even ones with a boxing base style, have completely ignored some very basic boxing fundamentals like good head movement and other things. Secondly, boxing is a sport with it's own set of rules that have been very successful
. Boxing is a specialty, it takes years and years perfecting your boxing while someone can go into MMA with knowledge of only one discipline and take a few years to round out their skills and beat anybody. What's really harder? It's hard to say. MMA and boxing need to stop being compared, also I don't like MMA simply because so much of the standup is reminiscent to watching a Toughman competition. It's just not appealing.
However, as far as the strikes while downed being dangerous, they definitely are and Bisping got the worst of it by Henderson BUT it's still safer then boxing. Boxing gives you a standing 8 to collect yourself and go get on your feet to take punishment when really you shouldn't be. At least when you're out in MMA, you can take 2-3 shots max. In boxing you can take hundreds of more shots when in MMA you would have been stopped the first or second time you got hit cleanly and hurt.
What I bolded is an unfair argument.
Even when MMA fighters go into it with knowledge of only one discipline it is usually a discipline they spent years perfecting which could have been just as hard to craft as boxing is. You can't say that boxing takes years to perfect but is harder then someone who goes into MMA with knowledge of a discipline(whether it be wrestling, striking, or jujitsu) it is usually a discipline they took years crafting whether it be as a child or since high school through college and they are usually in a high division of what they practiced. So if you wanted to get technical MMA would be harder, because in boxing you would have to only focus on that, in MMA you'd have to focus on your striking, and you'd have to focus on your wrestling and you'd have to focus on your jujitsu.
And to say they only spent years on one "aspect" of MMA to moderate success somehow making boxing harder to do, it's no less harder then crafting wrestling skills or jujitsu skills over years. And even people that craft their boxing for years don't know everything. I could say a boxer could know only how to fight at range and have a knockout punch and go on to have moderate success against other boxers that may have been in it longer than them, but they may have no knowledge whatsoever on how to fight on the inside but they get away with it for a while. Boxing isn't harder than MMA nor vice versa, and its an unfair argument to say "well you can go into mma with knowledge of one discipline and do well, but in boxing you have to take years to craft it to be successful." That one discipline in mma they have a knowledge of is usually one crafted over years. So you can't make that argument on which is harder through that.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by
amat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Boxing IS fighting from my viewpoint. I wouldn't dare kick someone or hit a downed opponent. Maybe I put myself at a disadvantage but that's the price I pay for having a certain amount of couth and not being some knuckle dragging savage
Boxing is but an aspect of fighting its a small part of stand up. So you mean to say if you were in a fight with someone and they got close to you so punches would be almost ineffective you would use a knee or elbow? If someone had kicked you when you were down then you got the chance to do so back to them you would turn it down? Why your view of MMA fighters is so low is beyond me. There are people out there would say to men in a ring punching each other is idiotic but thats because they don't understand the sport and you obviously don't understand MMA.
Matty nothing personal but this is a dumb argument. First of all, MMA isn't real fighting. Real fighting is real fighting, where literally anything happens. No setting people up for a guillotine or anything like that, no weapons, people wear gloves etc. It's a sport, that's why it has rules. Boxing is also a sport, it's why it has rules. They're both fighting sports but to argue one is better because it is 'more like fighting' is dumb because neither of them are actual no holds barred fighting. Also, boxing is just one part of MMA standup like Joe ROgan says. Most MMA fighters, even ones with a boxing base style, have completely ignored some very basic boxing fundamentals like good head movement and other things. Secondly, boxing is a sport with it's own set of rules that have been very successful
. Boxing is a specialty, it takes years and years perfecting your boxing while someone can go into MMA with knowledge of only one discipline and take a few years to round out their skills and beat anybody. What's really harder? It's hard to say. MMA and boxing need to stop being compared, also I don't like MMA simply because so much of the standup is reminiscent to watching a Toughman competition. It's just not appealing.
However, as far as the strikes while downed being dangerous, they definitely are and Bisping got the worst of it by Henderson BUT it's still safer then boxing. Boxing gives you a standing 8 to collect yourself and go get on your feet to take punishment when really you shouldn't be. At least when you're out in MMA, you can take 2-3 shots max. In boxing you can take hundreds of more shots when in MMA you would have been stopped the first or second time you got hit cleanly and hurt.
What I bolded is an unfair argument.
Even when MMA fighters go into it with knowledge of only one discipline it is usually a discipline they spent years perfecting which could have been just as hard to craft as boxing is. You can't say that boxing takes years to perfect but is harder then someone who goes into MMA with knowledge of a discipline(whether it be wrestling, striking, or jujitsu) it is usually a discipline they took years crafting whether it be as a child or since high school through college and they are usually in a high division of what they practiced. So if you wanted to get technical MMA would be harder, because in boxing you would have to only focus on that, in MMA you'd have to focus on your striking, and you'd have to focus on your wrestling and you'd have to focus on your jujitsu.
And to say they only spent years on one "aspect" of MMA to moderate success somehow making boxing harder to do, it's no less harder then crafting wrestling skills or jujitsu skills over years. And even people that craft their boxing for years don't know everything. I could say a boxer could know only how to fight at range and have a knockout punch and go on to have moderate success against other boxers that may have been in it longer than them, but they may have no knowledge whatsoever on how to fight on the inside but they get away with it for a while. Boxing isn't harder than MMA nor vice versa, and its an unfair argument to say "well you can go into mma with knowledge of one discipline and do well, but in boxing you have to take years to craft it to be successful." That one discipline in mma they have a knowledge of is usually one crafted over years. So you can't make that argument on which is harder through that.
Why didn't you keep bolding to where he said
Quote:
It's hard to say. MMA and boxing need to stop being compared
Which means you simply repeated what he said.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
The guy has his own channel on Youtube, he obviously has a lot to say, regardless ;D
Speaking of Youtube, where's Bigragu at these days ???
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
killersheep
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by
amat
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Boxing IS fighting from my viewpoint. I wouldn't dare kick someone or hit a downed opponent. Maybe I put myself at a disadvantage but that's the price I pay for having a certain amount of couth and not being some knuckle dragging savage
Boxing is but an aspect of fighting its a small part of stand up. So you mean to say if you were in a fight with someone and they got close to you so punches would be almost ineffective you would use a knee or elbow? If someone had kicked you when you were down then you got the chance to do so back to them you would turn it down? Why your view of MMA fighters is so low is beyond me. There are people out there would say to men in a ring punching each other is idiotic but thats because they don't understand the sport and you obviously don't understand MMA.
Matty nothing personal but this is a dumb argument. First of all, MMA isn't real fighting. Real fighting is real fighting, where literally anything happens. No setting people up for a guillotine or anything like that, no weapons, people wear gloves etc. It's a sport, that's why it has rules. Boxing is also a sport, it's why it has rules. They're both fighting sports but to argue one is better because it is 'more like fighting' is dumb because neither of them are actual no holds barred fighting. Also, boxing is just one part of MMA standup like Joe ROgan says. Most MMA fighters, even ones with a boxing base style, have completely ignored some very basic boxing fundamentals like good head movement and other things. Secondly, boxing is a sport with it's own set of rules that have been very successful
. Boxing is a specialty, it takes years and years perfecting your boxing while someone can go into MMA with knowledge of only one discipline and take a few years to round out their skills and beat anybody. What's really harder? It's hard to say. MMA and boxing need to stop being compared, also I don't like MMA simply because so much of the standup is reminiscent to watching a Toughman competition. It's just not appealing.
However, as far as the strikes while downed being dangerous, they definitely are and Bisping got the worst of it by Henderson BUT it's still safer then boxing. Boxing gives you a standing 8 to collect yourself and go get on your feet to take punishment when really you shouldn't be. At least when you're out in MMA, you can take 2-3 shots max. In boxing you can take hundreds of more shots when in MMA you would have been stopped the first or second time you got hit cleanly and hurt.
What I bolded is an unfair argument.
Even when MMA fighters go into it with knowledge of only one discipline it is usually a discipline they spent years perfecting which could have been just as hard to craft as boxing is. You can't say that boxing takes years to perfect but is harder then someone who goes into MMA with knowledge of a discipline(whether it be wrestling, striking, or jujitsu) it is usually a discipline they took years crafting whether it be as a child or since high school through college and they are usually in a high division of what they practiced. So if you wanted to get technical MMA would be harder, because in boxing you would have to only focus on that, in MMA you'd have to focus on your striking, and you'd have to focus on your wrestling and you'd have to focus on your jujitsu.
And to say they only spent years on one "aspect" of MMA to moderate success somehow making boxing harder to do, it's no less harder then crafting wrestling skills or jujitsu skills over years. And even people that craft their boxing for years don't know everything. I could say a boxer could know only how to fight at range and have a knockout punch and go on to have moderate success against other boxers that may have been in it longer than them, but they may have no knowledge whatsoever on how to fight on the inside but they get away with it for a while. Boxing isn't harder than MMA nor vice versa, and its an unfair argument to say "well you can go into mma with knowledge of one discipline and do well, but in boxing you have to take years to craft it to be successful." That one discipline in mma they have a knowledge of is usually one crafted over years. So you can't make that argument on which is harder through that.
Why didn't you keep bolding to where he said
Quote:
It's hard to say. MMA and boxing need to stop being compared
Which means you simply repeated what he said.
Pretty much but I went into detail about why it's an unfair argument to say that boxing is harder than MMA. Since it's an argument that there's a lot of, I agree that it needs to stop being compared, but at the same time I wanted to go into detail as to why it isn't a fair argument, nothing wrong with that is there.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Killersheep is right, learn to read Majesty. You're not refuting me because I never made any assertion that boxing was harder then MMA. In fact, the next sentence after the one you made clear stressed that.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
amat
Killersheep is right, learn to read Majesty. You're not refuting me because I never made any assertion that boxing was harder then MMA. In fact, the next sentence after the one you made clear stressed that.
You should as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Pretty much but I went into detail about why it's an unfair argument to say that boxing is harder than MMA. Since it's an argument that there's a lot of, I agree that it needs to stop being compared, but at the same time I wanted to go into detail as to why it isn't a fair argument, nothing wrong with that is there.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by
amat
Killersheep is right, learn to read Majesty. You're not refuting me because I never made any assertion that boxing was harder then MMA. In fact, the next sentence after the one you made clear stressed that.
You should as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Pretty much but I went into detail about why it's an unfair argument to say that boxing is harder than MMA. Since it's an argument that there's a lot of, I agree that it needs to stop being compared, but at the same time I wanted to go into detail as to why it isn't a fair argument, nothing wrong with that is there.
He said learn to read damn it!
;D
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
El Kabong
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Quote:
Originally Posted by
amat
Killersheep is right, learn to read Majesty. You're not refuting me because I never made any assertion that boxing was harder then MMA. In fact, the next sentence after the one you made clear stressed that.
You should as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Majesty
Pretty much but I went into detail about why it's an unfair argument to say that boxing is harder than MMA. Since it's an argument that there's a lot of, I agree that it needs to stop being compared, but at the same time I wanted to go into detail as to why it isn't a fair argument, nothing wrong with that is there.
He said learn to read damn it!
;D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dstmQm1ZUoA
Appropriate since ill be getting this for the gf soon.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
mattboxingfan
That was Dan Hardy my favorite UFC fighter :( I love boxing and MMA it depends on you as a person if you like fighting on a whole you should like MMA its as raw as you can get to a fighting sport. Boxing is one dimensional it isn't fighting its punching thats not real. MMA is everything mixed into one thats real, thats a fight. Any way these guys chose to do it they love the sport there in and get paid to get in shape and fight!?!? Thats why you don't hear them complaining about how brutal the sport is so what's the point in us doing it?
Wtf?
You come out with some of the oddest statements.
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
OK then as KS pointed out in his other thread that this keeps kicking over here when clicking on it so I am going to make this a 2 for 1 post....
Boxing IMO is the superior sport and I will take a boxing match over 10 MMA bouts anyday of the week....MMA though is more like fighting you would come across on the street with a little more organization to it so it does have its appeal and I do watch it often...Guys like AS, GSP, BJ Penn (Beofre he faded) etc are masters of what they do and make it look like the art form it is ment to be but in such a scientific smooth way due to their superior ability...
Now with that being said....
IMO Bute swhould fight the winner of AA/Froch next.....Unless Ward can manage to sign ASAP...If he can not get either of those 2 bouts....Try the WBO champion Si&^%$#@@ from Germany (Can spell the guys name for shit so excuse the marks not meant to be insert for any ill fated cure words on the fighter)....After becoming the owner of 2 belts fight Pascal after he faces off with Hopkins (Who Pascal should beat if he gets a fair shake on the cards)
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Re: Watching UFC as a boxing fan
I honestly like MMA. I'll admit however, some of the matches are boring, but a lot of them are quite interesting to watch. Whereas boxing is just one martial art form, MMA has a variety of different martial art forms you learn how to utilize, as well as learn how to defend against. It could actually be quite interesting to watch how an opponent fuses together boxing and wrestling to defeat someone who fights using judo and brazilian jujitsu.
