Agree or disagree?
Granted its too early to make a final call on Manny or Floyd, but IMO you should agree.
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Agree or disagree?
Granted its too early to make a final call on Manny or Floyd, but IMO you should agree.
Not sure.
I was thinking tonight that he may have now eclipsed Roy Jones acomplishments, because he's shown he's the better master of boxing. When Jones physical skills declined he was shot. B Hop is such a good technician that even at 46 he can outbox prime guys.
I would rate Manny above him right now though, he's been on a tear up through 10 weight classes.
Floyd, I really think his legacy will be hurt if he doesn't fight Manny, much than Manny's will be.
Manny is the tougher call IMO (and full disclosure I'm a big fan of Manny and Bernard, Floyd not so much).
But I'm leaning towards Hopkins over both. Definitely over Floyd. The weight jump is the big advantage for Manny.
I do think Bernard has passed Roy.
Yeah Floyds career has really gone out like a wet match lately, unless he fights Manny his ending will leave a sour taste I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by OumaFan
Hopkins definitely has done something amazing for an old guy, but in absolute sense I'm not sure beating Pascal by razor thin decision is equal to just literally battering and dominating guys like Cotto, Margarito and Mosley that Manny has done lately.
B Hop is winning some and losing some against very good opposition, Manny is beating the snot out of his, and way above his natural fighting weight. That to me is more impressive as no other fighter in history has done that.
He is a master boxer for sure. I dont know where his legacy stands but the man needs to be recognised as one of the best technical boxers ever. Alot of guys fight on because they believe they have the speed and power to compete, IMO Bhop has lost both but he continues to win because he is so tactical and his technique is great. Good onya BHOP !!!
The important thing to remember is that Hopkins is 46. I bet Manny isn't doing what Hopkins is doing at 46. And I hate this talk of Manny fighting outside of his weight class. The guy weighs in above 140, the guy IS a WW. Forget all this "if he boiled down he could make 135 easy" talk, we simply don't know that, but what we do know is that Manny weighs in at WW and fights other WW's.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboYeah Floyds career has really gone out like a wet match lately, unless he fights Manny his ending will leave a sour taste I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by OumaFan
Hopkins definitely has done something amazing for an old guy, but in absolute sense I'm not sure beating Pascal by razor thin decision is equal to just literally battering and dominating guys like Cotto, Margarito and Mosley that Manny has done lately.
B Hop is winning some and losing some against very good opposition, Manny is beating the snot out of his, and way above his natural fighting weight. That to me is more impressive as no other fighter in history has done that.
As for the greatness thing, they are all pretty great. I don't know which is greater, but Floyd's recent lack of anything does leave a sour taste.
Well now given that he's the oldest to win the title and his MW reign. Yeah he's definitely above floyd as it stands. Floyd is possibly going to be the greatest disappointment in terms of wasting away his prime. Right now I think Manny is maybe equal with Bernard.
For me, floyd would have to beat Manny, then beat a serious 154 or 160 champ to pass BHOP
This is the real problem of arguing legacy across eras and weight classes, same as p4p discussions, in close situations there is no clear answer. Hopkins career doesn't have too many weight classes but there is a significant jump from middle to light heavy and I think he was Ring champ in both. His 20 defenses or whatever it was at middle weight is an amazing accomplishment as well. Manny rise through the weight classes is stunning but completely different. I have a hard time distinguishing one fighter over the other in legacy for Hopkins and Manny, but both are far ahead of Floyd. I believe Mayweather to have the potential to be ahead of both but he has sat back too much in his prime, unless he turns out to have the longevity of Hopkins, I doubt he will do anything/enough in the future to surpass the two other legacies as they are today.
He had a great performance tonight. This is most exciting fight I've seen from him by far, type of fight I and the mast majority like to see. I say if Bernard had this warrior/fire in him, he would have ko'ed the cowboy but who knows. And I wouldn't say he is historically greater than Manny or Floyd right now , that's retarded.
Pac and Floyd need to get there crap figured out. Compromise on these issues or whatever.
Pac will always have the "drug test" lingering over him shall he keep avoiding it. Pac fans are the only ones who are blind to this.
Floyd will always have the "ducking" lingering over him and most don't care either way. Floyd can't be seriously spoke about in any forum or discussion because Pactards will be the first to jump on him. It's what they specialize in. Anything to get the heat off the test Pac won't take.
Pac and Floyd are behind BHop It takes more then a resume of weight drained has beens. And it takes more then an undefeated record. See there Pactards I see it from both view.
BHop as of now is higher I believe. He never dodged anyone. He never cherry picked like Roy.
I think there's a distinction between "greater" and "better", in the historical sense. I would argue that both Bernard and Manny are "greater" than Floyd legacy wise but I think Floyd is the most talented fighter of my lifetime. A bit of a waste of talent to this point though.
Must be why he fought those blown up WWs....Quote:
Originally Posted by mafiajoey
Ouch.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherMust be why he fought those blown up WWs....Quote:
Originally Posted by mafiajoey
Right now? I have BHOP over Floyd and behind Manny.
But things aren't over,
Yeah but that's not fair. He fought welters after he'd whacked out the entire 160 division. By 2001 what middle was he supposed to fight instead of Tito for instance?Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherMust be why he fought those blown up WWs....Quote:
Originally Posted by mafiajoey
How about moving up, like most in history tend to do.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiYeah but that's not fair. He fought welters after he'd whacked out the entire 160 division. By 2001 what middle was he supposed to fight instead of Tito for instance?Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherMust be why he fought those blown up WWs....Quote:
Originally Posted by mafiajoey
Because that's NOT what most in history have done. These sorts of violent weight movements are a recent phenomenon and a function of two things. 17 divisions instead of eight and as thin a talent pool as the sport has seen for 50 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherHow about moving up, like most in history tend to do.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiYeah but that's not fair. He fought welters after he'd whacked out the entire 160 division. By 2001 what middle was he supposed to fight instead of Tito for instance?Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherMust be why he fought those blown up WWs....Quote:
Originally Posted by mafiajoey
As far as moving up goes? You may have heard about a fight in Montreal tonight?
You asked about 2001.. And in Bhop's era moving up in weight was and is fairly common. Surely he'd know, seeing as how his best wins came against fighters smaller than him. And if we really want to dissect this thing, his win against Tarver, Tarver was clearly weight drained from dropping the weight from filming that Rocky movie. Which only leaves a win over Pascal. Whoopty dooo..Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiBecause that's NOT what most in history have done. These sorts of violent weight movements are a recent phenomenon and a function of two things. 17 divisions instead of eight and as thin a talent pool as the sport has seen for 50 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherHow about moving up, like most in history tend to do.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiYeah but that's not fair. He fought welters after he'd whacked out the entire 160 division. By 2001 what middle was he supposed to fight instead of Tito for instance?Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherMust be why he fought those blown up WWs....Quote:
Originally Posted by mafiajoey
As far as moving up goes? You may have heard about a fight in Montreal tonight?
Honestly, I think his legacy pales in comparison to Pacquiao's. Hopkins feats are impressive because of his age, but I don't think they come close to what Pacquiao has done.
Floyd is more of a mystery. He has the skills to literally be the greatest boxer of all time, but his resume (relatively speaking) is mediocre for a fighter of his level.
The idea that tonight can EVER be referred to as a Whoopty doo is just a sign of a staggering lack of historical perspective.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherYou asked about 2001.. And in Bhop's era moving up in weight was and is fairly common. Surely he'd know, seeing as how his best wins came against fighters smaller than him. And if we really want to dissect this thing, his win against Tarver, Tarver was clearly weight drained from dropping the weight from filming that Rocky movie. Which only leaves a win over Pascal. Whoopty dooo..Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiBecause that's NOT what most in history have done. These sorts of violent weight movements are a recent phenomenon and a function of two things. 17 divisions instead of eight and as thin a talent pool as the sport has seen for 50 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherHow about moving up, like most in history tend to do.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiYeah but that's not fair. He fought welters after he'd whacked out the entire 160 division. By 2001 what middle was he supposed to fight instead of Tito for instance?Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherMust be why he fought those blown up WWs....Quote:
Originally Posted by mafiajoey
As far as moving up goes? You may have heard about a fight in Montreal tonight?
I don't think Floyd is a mystery at all. I think one can fairly say the gap between the quality of his God-given talents and his accomplishments is as large, or larger than any fighter in history.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
He is the anti-Carmen Basilio/Vito Antuofuermo
Yeah, mystery is probably the wrong word. An enigma perhaps? I just honestly think that he has the skills to literally be remembered as the best fighter ever (or at least be in the discussion), but while his early resume is quite strong he has absolutely pissed away his legacy in the past half-decade. Skill-wise, he's miles ahead of Hopkins, but he doesn't have the same desire that the old man does and I'd have him well behind at this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiI don't think Floyd is a mystery at all. I think one can fairly say the gap between the quality of his God-given talents and his accomplishments is as large, or larger than any fighter in history.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
He is the anti-Carmen Basilio/Vito Antuofuermo
I still don't think Hopkins comes anywhere close to Pacquiao though.
There's no lack of anything. I acknowledged what hopkins has done in another thread already. Just not going to get all hyperbolic about it like most do right after the fights. It's like after a fighter that someone is supporting wins, they come right to forum for some "after sex i love you" talk.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiThe idea that tonight can EVER be referred to as a Whoopty doo is just a sign of a staggering lack of historical perspective.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherYou asked about 2001.. And in Bhop's era moving up in weight was and is fairly common. Surely he'd know, seeing as how his best wins came against fighters smaller than him. And if we really want to dissect this thing, his win against Tarver, Tarver was clearly weight drained from dropping the weight from filming that Rocky movie. Which only leaves a win over Pascal. Whoopty dooo..Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiBecause that's NOT what most in history have done. These sorts of violent weight movements are a recent phenomenon and a function of two things. 17 divisions instead of eight and as thin a talent pool as the sport has seen for 50 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherHow about moving up, like most in history tend to do.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiYeah but that's not fair. He fought welters after he'd whacked out the entire 160 division. By 2001 what middle was he supposed to fight instead of Tito for instance?Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherMust be why he fought those blown up WWs....Quote:
Originally Posted by mafiajoey
As far as moving up goes? You may have heard about a fight in Montreal tonight?
The bold is why Floyd infuriates me. See I suspect his looniest, least rational fans are probably correct that he could have fought guys like Johnston and Spadafora and Casamyor and Kosta and HaTTON (AT 140) and Cotto and Margarito and Popo and Shane (when it mattered) and Manny and have beaten them all. I want to see greatness fully tested. But it isn't what Floyd wants and it is his life.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHYeah, mystery is probably the wrong word. An enigma perhaps? I just honestly think that he has the skills to literally be remembered as the best fighter ever (or at least be in the discussion), but while his early resume is quite strong he has absolutely pissed away his legacy in the past half-decade. Skill-wise, he's miles ahead of Hopkins, but he doesn't have the same desire that the old man does and I'd have him well behind at this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiI don't think Floyd is a mystery at all. I think one can fairly say the gap between the quality of his God-given talents and his accomplishments is as large, or larger than any fighter in history.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
He is the anti-Carmen Basilio/Vito Antuofuermo
I still don't think Hopkins comes anywhere close to Pacquiao though.
People's imaginations mean nothing. What happens, or doesn't, in the ring is everything.
There's a BROAD gap between hyperbole and woopety doo.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherThere's no lack of anything. I acknowledged what hopkins has done in another thread already. Just not going to get all hyperbolic about it like most do right after the fights. It's like after a fighter that someone is supporting wins, they come right to forum for some "after sex i love you" talk.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiThe idea that tonight can EVER be referred to as a Whoopty doo is just a sign of a staggering lack of historical perspective.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherYou asked about 2001.. And in Bhop's era moving up in weight was and is fairly common. Surely he'd know, seeing as how his best wins came against fighters smaller than him. And if we really want to dissect this thing, his win against Tarver, Tarver was clearly weight drained from dropping the weight from filming that Rocky movie. Which only leaves a win over Pascal. Whoopty dooo..Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiBecause that's NOT what most in history have done. These sorts of violent weight movements are a recent phenomenon and a function of two things. 17 divisions instead of eight and as thin a talent pool as the sport has seen for 50 years.Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherHow about moving up, like most in history tend to do.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiYeah but that's not fair. He fought welters after he'd whacked out the entire 160 division. By 2001 what middle was he supposed to fight instead of Tito for instance?Quote:
Originally Posted by JonesJrMayweatherMust be why he fought those blown up WWs....Quote:
Originally Posted by mafiajoey
As far as moving up goes? You may have heard about a fight in Montreal tonight?
Personally, I think Hopkins should travel to Russia to fight Jean Paul Gaultier.
The sad thing is that I think he would have beaten every fighter you listed. But, like Floyd has said for years, he fights for money, not glory. With that mind-set he'll always be taking the easiest route because his name alone will make him millions and he's able to keep fighting guys who are no real threat to his future earning power.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiThe bold is why Floyd infuriates me. See I suspect his looniest, least rational fans are probably correct that he could have fought guys like Johnston and Spadafora and Casamyor and Kosta and HaTTON (AT 140) and Cotto and Margarito and Popo and Shane (when it mattered) and Manny and have beaten them all. I want to see greatness fully tested. But it isn't what Floyd wants and it is his life.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHYeah, mystery is probably the wrong word. An enigma perhaps? I just honestly think that he has the skills to literally be remembered as the best fighter ever (or at least be in the discussion), but while his early resume is quite strong he has absolutely pissed away his legacy in the past half-decade. Skill-wise, he's miles ahead of Hopkins, but he doesn't have the same desire that the old man does and I'd have him well behind at this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiI don't think Floyd is a mystery at all. I think one can fairly say the gap between the quality of his God-given talents and his accomplishments is as large, or larger than any fighter in history.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
He is the anti-Carmen Basilio/Vito Antuofuermo
I still don't think Hopkins comes anywhere close to Pacquiao though.
People's imaginations mean nothing. What happens, or doesn't, in the ring is everything.
The funny thing is, I remember about 6 or 7 years ago, there was an interview where Lil' Floyd was discrediting what Bernard had achieved @ 160 saying something like ''Anyone can dominate just one division''.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiI don't think Floyd is a mystery at all. I think one can fairly say the gap between the quality of his God-given talents and his accomplishments is as large, or larger than any fighter in history.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
He is the anti-Carmen Basilio/Vito Antuofuermo
I remember thinking to myself, 'Why would a great fighter who is completely out of competition with another great fighter, make the effort to try and talk down a man's legacy like that?'
Anyway it's funny now though, that Bernard at 46, is still mastering his sport while Floyd is talking his own legacy down the toilet.
It's his life and if he can end up rich, healthy and personally satisfied? More power to him. I just wish real glory matterred to him a bit more.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHThe sad thing is that I think he would have beaten every fighter you listed. But, like Floyd has said for years, he fights for money, not glory. With that mind-set he'll always be taking the easiest route because his name alone will make him millions and he's able to keep fighting guys who are no real threat to his future earning power.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiThe bold is why Floyd infuriates me. See I suspect his looniest, least rational fans are probably correct that he could have fought guys like Johnston and Spadafora and Casamyor and Kosta and HaTTON (AT 140) and Cotto and Margarito and Popo and Shane (when it mattered) and Manny and have beaten them all. I want to see greatness fully tested. But it isn't what Floyd wants and it is his life.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHYeah, mystery is probably the wrong word. An enigma perhaps? I just honestly think that he has the skills to literally be remembered as the best fighter ever (or at least be in the discussion), but while his early resume is quite strong he has absolutely pissed away his legacy in the past half-decade. Skill-wise, he's miles ahead of Hopkins, but he doesn't have the same desire that the old man does and I'd have him well behind at this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiI don't think Floyd is a mystery at all. I think one can fairly say the gap between the quality of his God-given talents and his accomplishments is as large, or larger than any fighter in history.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
He is the anti-Carmen Basilio/Vito Antuofuermo
I still don't think Hopkins comes anywhere close to Pacquiao though.
People's imaginations mean nothing. What happens, or doesn't, in the ring is everything.
I do too. Like I said, I think his skill-set is amazing. However, speaking objectively I think he's clearly made the more intelligent decision. I'd much rather end up a millionaire with my mind intact and have people question my legacy than be Evander Holyfield.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiIt's his life and if he can end up rich, healthy and personally satisfied? More power to him. I just wish real glory matterred to him a bit more.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHThe sad thing is that I think he would have beaten every fighter you listed. But, like Floyd has said for years, he fights for money, not glory. With that mind-set he'll always be taking the easiest route because his name alone will make him millions and he's able to keep fighting guys who are no real threat to his future earning power.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiThe bold is why Floyd infuriates me. See I suspect his looniest, least rational fans are probably correct that he could have fought guys like Johnston and Spadafora and Casamyor and Kosta and HaTTON (AT 140) and Cotto and Margarito and Popo and Shane (when it mattered) and Manny and have beaten them all. I want to see greatness fully tested. But it isn't what Floyd wants and it is his life.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHYeah, mystery is probably the wrong word. An enigma perhaps? I just honestly think that he has the skills to literally be remembered as the best fighter ever (or at least be in the discussion), but while his early resume is quite strong he has absolutely pissed away his legacy in the past half-decade. Skill-wise, he's miles ahead of Hopkins, but he doesn't have the same desire that the old man does and I'd have him well behind at this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiI don't think Floyd is a mystery at all. I think one can fairly say the gap between the quality of his God-given talents and his accomplishments is as large, or larger than any fighter in history.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
He is the anti-Carmen Basilio/Vito Antuofuermo
I still don't think Hopkins comes anywhere close to Pacquiao though.
People's imaginations mean nothing. What happens, or doesn't, in the ring is everything.
Speaking of legacy and money, I think guys like Foreman, Hagler, Leonard has it all. Success inside and outside of the ring with rock solid credentials that can't be denied. Not to mentioned all 3 have their brains intact and aren't punch drunk.
In fact if I was a fighter, I would prefer to go out and leave the game like Hagler and Foreman. Both ended their careers with controversial losses and didn't stick around to get beat up by lesser fighters and both have gobs of cash in their accounts.
As far as right now is concerned bernard is the greatest fighter of our era, he passed roy because when it comes to ranking status, you don't look at who was better in their prime, you look at the resume, not the fight videos, and bernard by far has the best resume of our era, the guy continuously breaks records, manny and floyd aren't quite there yet
I agree Ouma. Two of them actually ply their trade and have a passion for the sport while one protects his golden goose egg of an "0", really don't know if his career is concluded or not? The reinvention of style and ring knowledge Ive seen of Hopkins from beginning of career to lastnight is amazing and a pleasure to see. I don't think Floyd has a thing on him, nattas!
LOL. Yup. I'm not sure the opinions of a bunch of boxing nerds should matter much in that equation.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHI do too. Like I said, I think his skill-set is amazing. However, speaking objectively I think he's clearly made the more intelligent decision. I'd much rather end up a millionaire with my mind intact and have people question my legacy than be Evander Holyfield.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiIt's his life and if he can end up rich, healthy and personally satisfied? More power to him. I just wish real glory matterred to him a bit more.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHThe sad thing is that I think he would have beaten every fighter you listed. But, like Floyd has said for years, he fights for money, not glory. With that mind-set he'll always be taking the easiest route because his name alone will make him millions and he's able to keep fighting guys who are no real threat to his future earning power.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiThe bold is why Floyd infuriates me. See I suspect his looniest, least rational fans are probably correct that he could have fought guys like Johnston and Spadafora and Casamyor and Kosta and HaTTON (AT 140) and Cotto and Margarito and Popo and Shane (when it mattered) and Manny and have beaten them all. I want to see greatness fully tested. But it isn't what Floyd wants and it is his life.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFHYeah, mystery is probably the wrong word. An enigma perhaps? I just honestly think that he has the skills to literally be remembered as the best fighter ever (or at least be in the discussion), but while his early resume is quite strong he has absolutely pissed away his legacy in the past half-decade. Skill-wise, he's miles ahead of Hopkins, but he doesn't have the same desire that the old man does and I'd have him well behind at this point.Quote:
Originally Posted by marbleheadmauiI don't think Floyd is a mystery at all. I think one can fairly say the gap between the quality of his God-given talents and his accomplishments is as large, or larger than any fighter in history.Quote:
Originally Posted by CFH
He is the anti-Carmen Basilio/Vito Antuofuermo
I still don't think Hopkins comes anywhere close to Pacquiao though.
People's imaginations mean nothing. What happens, or doesn't, in the ring is everything.
good point. with pbf being fresh and does not have much miles on him he might as well be doing a hopkins in the future.Quote:
Originally Posted by global
I think Bhop is great. But not Fighter Of The Decade type of greatness.
Yeah he's old. But he's a part time fighter.
Well in my own personal opinion, i think B-Hop should be rated higher. Because i don't think he's legitmately lost a fight since 1993, where as i think Manny Pacquiao lost twice to JMM.
I dunno Ice. Love Hopkins but Taylor ? I couldn't stand Hopkins in that 1st fight, late. He dogged it and I believe let a tko slip away. Arrogant pomp. Had him over Calzaghe slight but hey, Joe earned that one.Quote:
Originally Posted by ICB
Devils advocate souly here ha.
Ok, I disagree. Looking at lineal titles, Manny has 4, Floyd has 3, Bernard has 2. That's not the be all and end all, but I think the impressiveness of Bernard doing it at this age is colouring things a bit. Regardless of age are we really going to say that the opposition that he's beaten is better than that of Floyd or Manny? I don't believe it is. If you're going to discredit some of their wins for whatever reason, you can use the same reasoning to discredit B-Hop's.
I'll be clear, I rate Hopkins alongside them, but I also think it's very difficult to have any perspective on a fighter's career while they still fight. I believe Mayweather's career will look much better on reflection (see SRL's career), although if he doesn't fight Pacquiao than it will suffer possibly irreversibly. If he does & wins then he is sorted. The biggest risk to Pacquiao's legacy comes in his next fight. Lose to JMM & suddenly all the accusations about cherry-picking opponents will seem to be valid regardless of whether that is true. Hopkins age allows him the luxury of excusing a defeat such as if he loses to any of Dawson, Bute or Ward.
But the focus on Hopkins age ignores the feats that the other two have achieved. Pacquiao won a lineal world title while still a teenager. Mayweather won a lineal title just short of two years of turning professional. Those aren't common achievements.
Anyway, just my take on things.
Wait, you're the same guy who wants manny to fight marquez at 135 because you think it makes it a fair fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by milesThe important thing to remember is that Hopkins is 46. I bet Manny isn't doing what Hopkins is doing at 46. And I hate this talk of Manny fighting outside of his weight class. The guy weighs in above 140, the guy IS a WW. Forget all this "if he boiled down he could make 135 easy" talk, we simply don't know that, but what we do know is that Manny weighs in at WW and fights other WW's.Quote:
Originally Posted by BilboYeah Floyds career has really gone out like a wet match lately, unless he fights Manny his ending will leave a sour taste I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by OumaFan
Hopkins definitely has done something amazing for an old guy, but in absolute sense I'm not sure beating Pascal by razor thin decision is equal to just literally battering and dominating guys like Cotto, Margarito and Mosley that Manny has done lately.
B Hop is winning some and losing some against very good opposition, Manny is beating the snot out of his, and way above his natural fighting weight. That to me is more impressive as no other fighter in history has done that.
As for the greatness thing, they are all pretty great. I don't know which is greater, but Floyd's recent lack of anything does leave a sour taste.
Am I missing something here :confused: