Youre Victor Ortiz's trainer, whats your gameplan to beat Mayweather?

Righto people lets hear your ideas on beating Mayweather with Victors style and skills.

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Originally Posted by Snakey

Righto people lets hear your ideas on beating Mayweather with Victors style and skills.

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Ortiz just needs to believe that if he hits Mayweather he will hurt him. I think on 24/7 they said that everyone who has gotten in the ring with him has been knocked down - that's got to do a lot for the kid's self-belief. As long as that belief sticks with him for 11.5 rounds, he'll still believe he has a chance to win.

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Originally Posted by CFH

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Originally Posted by Snakey

Righto people lets hear your ideas on beating Mayweather with Victors style and skills.

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Ortiz just needs to believe that if he hits Mayweather he will hurt him. I think on 24/7 they said that everyone who has gotten in the ring with him has been knocked down - that's got to do a lot for the kid's self-belief. As long as that belief sticks with him for 11.5 rounds, he'll still believe he has a chance to win.

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I agree. I think Mayweathers defence has a huge effect on his opponents confidence levels. After something doesnt work a few times they just seem to give up or get stuck trying over and over.

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Originally Posted by CFH

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Originally Posted by Snakey

Righto people lets hear your ideas on beating Mayweather with Victors style and skills.

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Ortiz just needs to believe that if he hits Mayweather he will hurt him. I think on 24/7 they said that everyone who has gotten in the ring with him has been knocked down - that's got to do a lot for the kid's self-belief. As long as that belief sticks with him for 11.5 rounds, he'll still believe he has a chance to win.

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is that true? everyone he has fought has been down?

thats a pretty good record to have

push, bury your head into his chest and bang away to his body and even his hips occasionally, to take his legs away, hence not so much movement nor speed, then start to pick him off up top, in other words, don't let him breathe and just bully him

watch the first castillo/mayweather fight. mayweather lost!!!
study that MF and recreate and better it!!!

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

push, bury your head into his chest and bang away to his body and even his hips occasionally, to take his legs away, hence not so much movement nor speed, then start to pick him off up top, in other words, don't let him breathe and just bully him

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Yeah I agree with this to a degree. He needs to make it an ugly gritty fight IMO. I honestly don't think he will win but that would be my advice. Beat him up to the body, clinch, do anything to keep Floyd from getting in a groove and displaying his superior skill set

Mayweather is King at making you think... Making you doubt yourself. Ortiz HAS to present mindless aggression so that it may be perceived as relentless aggression. I don't think you can really plan for that sort of thing though, it's more about who you are???

But yeah, the longer you can go without doing the nunchuck shuffle, the better ;D

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Originally Posted by chinchekked

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

push, bury your head into his chest and bang away to his body and even his hips occasionally, to take his legs away, hence not so much movement nor speed, then start to pick him off up top, in other words, don't let him breathe and just bully him

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Yeah I agree with this to a degree. He needs to make it an ugly gritty fight IMO. I honestly don't think he will win but that would be my advice. Beat him up to the body, clinch, do anything to keep Floyd from getting in a groove and displaying his superior skill set

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Totally Agree and it is the only way really..can't think of anyone who would out fox Floyd with Boxing Skills and his defence is among the best i have personally ever seen.

You gotta hurt him then make every shot after count..Easier said than done tho..

Floyd really is different Gear and something v v special.

SSM did hurt him but Floyd came back and destroyed him.

That performance by Floyd from round 3 onwards was pretty f*cking special :cool:

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Originally Posted by smashup

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Originally Posted by chinchekked

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

push, bury your head into his chest and bang away to his body and even his hips occasionally, to take his legs away, hence not so much movement nor speed, then start to pick him off up top, in other words, don't let him breathe and just bully him

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Yeah I agree with this to a degree. He needs to make it an ugly gritty fight IMO. I honestly don't think he will win but that would be my advice. Beat him up to the body, clinch, do anything to keep Floyd from getting in a groove and displaying his superior skill set

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Totally Agree and it is the only way really..can't think of anyone who would out fox Floyd with Boxing Skills and his defence is among the best i have personally ever seen.

You gotta hurt him then make every shot after count..Easier said than done tho..

Floyd really is different Gear and something v v special.

SSM did hurt him but Floyd came back and destroyed him.

That performance by Floyd from round 3 onwards was pretty f*cking special :cool:

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Hatton and De La Hoya had success against Mayweather just by presuring him, Hatton didnt work when he had the opportunities too, like when he had Mayweathers back on the ropes and his head on his chest.

Mayweather is like Roy Jones in that the opponents get intimidated to work by the fear of opening themselves up to a counter. Whoever beats Mayweather is going to need to be able to work and have decent head movement. Ortiz is amongst about 3 or 4 people around Mayweathers weight right now that have the tools to give him a hard fight but I think that straight right is going to be too sharp for Ortiz to get past. If I were Ortiz trainer id do as others have already mentioned and just bully Floyd back and keep working. Not everything has to be powerfull but just dont give Floyd time to think.

I watched the Hatton fight again last night, he really did have Mayweather bothered for those first 6 rounds.

I think high intensity and lots of good foot movement. But it's hard to sustain that for 12 rounds.

Against Hatton, Mayweather just sucked it up and saved energy, coming on strong in the later rounds and being just as accurate.

I don't think Ortiz has the stamina to do it though. His defining win against Berto, he was blowing out of his ass when he won. Wild sluggish punches. He was on the verge of losing the fight.

I think Maweather has every chance to stop him from round 7 onwards.

Ortiz needs to just go for it early and pray.

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Originally Posted by 0james0

I watched the Hatton fight again last night, he really did have Mayweather bothered for those first 6 rounds.

I think high intensity and lots of good foot movement. But it's hard to sustain that for 12 rounds.

Against Hatton, Mayweather just sucked it up and saved energy, coming on strong in the later rounds and being just as accurate.

I don't think Ortiz has the stamina to do it though. His defining win against Berto, he was blowing out of his ass when he won. Wild sluggish punches. He was on the verge of losing the fight.

I think Maweather has every chance to stop him from round 7 onwards.

Ortiz needs to just go for it early and pray.

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Totally, Hatton was really in that fight until the point was docked. I don't think it was just that Mayweather was sucking it up, but also that Hatton became more sloppy and desperate when he realised he wasn't being given a fair crack by Cortez. And of course that is all she wrote. But Ortiz really doesn't have the style to pressure like Hatton nor keep up a ferocious and intense pace for 12 rounds.

If Ortiz fights like he did against Peterson he is dead meat. He must bring it to Mayweather and no coy attempts at trying to box with him.

In June 2005 I spoke to Arturo Gatti and Buddy McGirt on a conference call just before his fight with Floyd. I was working for a site called rabbitpunchboxing.com and was assigned to call in at that conference. Buddy and Arturo were saying the strategy they were going to beat Mayweather with was called "Hacoona Matata" whereby Gatti was going to try to hit Floyd right behind the left ear whenever he did that shoulder roll thing. Dont know why McGirt called it "Hacoona Matata" if thats slang for that part behind the ear or what. I spoke to Buddy first and then asked Arturo if it was true. He said yes, they were going to hit ANY AVAILABLE TARGET---hips, elbows, biceps, behind the ear, to try and inflict any kind of pain and slow him down. The problem was Floyd was so goddam fast, Gatti couldnt touch him anywhere, Hacoona Matata or anywhere else for that matter.

Now we're hearing Ortiz will try the same thing---hit any target legal or borderline-legal. I think despite the 6 years that have elapsed since Floyd's fight with Gatti, that Floyd hasnt really lost much speed if any, and that Ortiz will suffer the same fate as Arturo, who quit after 6. In fact Gatti had a better chin so Ortiz prob wont make it past 4 or 5 and will quit in the same fashion he quit against Maidana.

I don't think that pressing Mayweather and staying on him throwing punches is the way to beat him, generally because that is what he wants you to do. Throw punches that miss, get frustrated and throw more punches....all it does is make you easier to counter. Also, the advantage of being a southpaw is in the angles it creates. You give this away by being real close. I don't think that Ortiz punches that well close up- it seems to me that he needs some room.
I remember watching Mayweather/Judah, and Floyd didn't show me much, so far as his ability to attack a southpaw. He seemed to be limited, idea-wise, to jumping in behind lead right hands, then tying up. Ortiz can make his too-wide stance work for him, if he can entice Mayweather to lead, draw back to his left foot and counter. I don't belive that he is intelligent enough, boxing-wise, to fight Mayweather at his own game and win. He isn't that smart at trying to hit guys that don't want to get hit.
For years the 'book' on Toney was to get on him and keep punching and that got a lot of guys beat up. Same with Mayweather. The best shot is to make him lead, and Ortiz just ain't that smart.

i agree, the short right hook from Ortiz is his best hope catching floyd coming in, like zab caught floyd--actually knocked him down---but floyd is probably aware of that and so will fight cautiously in that sequence.

Positioning to throw punches and timing the punches right will be more effective than pressure alone.

Ortiz has the power to make the timing pay.

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Originally Posted by greynotsoold

I don't think that pressing Mayweather and staying on him throwing punches is the way to beat him, generally because that is what he wants you to do. Throw punches that miss, get frustrated and throw more punches....all it does is make you easier to counter. Also, the advantage of being a southpaw is in the angles it creates. You give this away by being real close. I don't think that Ortiz punches that well close up- it seems to me that he needs some room.
I remember watching Mayweather/Judah, and Floyd didn't show me much, so far as his ability to attack a southpaw. He seemed to be limited, idea-wise, to jumping in behind lead right hands, then tying up. Ortiz can make his too-wide stance work for him, if he can entice Mayweather to lead, draw back to his left foot and counter. I don't belive that he is intelligent enough, boxing-wise, to fight Mayweather at his own game and win. He isn't that smart at trying to hit guys that don't want to get hit.
For years the 'book' on Toney was to get on him and keep punching and that got a lot of guys beat up. Same with Mayweather. The best shot is to make him lead, and Ortiz just ain't that smart.

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I agree with this. People have continually tried to beat Mayweather with pressure and aggression, and it hasn't come close to working in about a decade now. I think it's important to try and take him out of his comfort zone, which is defending and countering. If that doesn't work, you can always switch gears and try coming after him.

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

push, bury your head into his chest and bang away to his body and even his hips occasionally, to take his legs away, hence not so much movement nor speed, then start to pick him off up top, in other words, don't let him breathe and just bully him

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Yeah, why not? Worked for Hatton. ;)

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Originally Posted by NuthaPug

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

push, bury your head into his chest and bang away to his body and even his hips occasionally, to take his legs away, hence not so much movement nor speed, then start to pick him off up top, in other words, don't let him breathe and just bully him

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Yeah, why not? Worked for Hatton. ;)

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Ortiz fights nothing like Hatton, plus he's an actual welterweight, maybe even a jr middleweight, so he's more physically built to fight the way i described

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

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Originally Posted by NuthaPug

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Originally Posted by ElTerribleMorales

push, bury your head into his chest and bang away to his body and even his hips occasionally, to take his legs away, hence not so much movement nor speed, then start to pick him off up top, in other words, don't let him breathe and just bully him

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Yeah, why not? Worked for Hatton. ;)

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Ortiz fights nothing like Hatton, plus he's an actual welterweight, maybe even a jr middleweight, so he's more physically built to fight the way i described

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Yes. I was being a bit facetious.

It will be interesting to see how size matters tonight. Looking forward to it.

Actually - looking for it! Not paying, so seeking a stream if you know of one.

Shit stoppage. I'm playing fight night for a bit.

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Originally Posted by Jimanuel Boogustus

Shit stoppage. I'm playing fight night for a bit.

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Yes, you might as well see a competative fight.