Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
After watching (and recording) the live Primetime broadcast of Marquez vs Pac III, I subsequently got a hold of the HBO version. Funnily enough, in the HBO version, many of Marquez's key moments of the fight are distorted by the ref walking in the way, bad angles, etc - a few examples of this in the early-mid rounds. In fact, the HBO version commentators failed to mention many of Marquez's standout moments and praised and massaged every glancing shot and minor victory for Pacquiao.
At the end of the fight, the Primetime commentators seemed to think the decision was a no-brainer (much like everyone in attendance at the MGM Grand) in that Marquez had control of most of the fight. On the HBO version, Emanuel Steward just rambled on about how 'strong Pacquiao looks' (whatever that means - he obviously couldn't talk about an abundance of effective punches). Furthermore, some of the sound-bites of the crowd boo'ing at the end of the fight during Pac's interview seem to be edited in the HBO version, they're much quieter than the live Primetime broadcast (although to be fair, they claimed to be experiencing audio difficulties).
Does this all add up to the corruption in the sport being so ingrained that it is even apparent in the broadcasting, commentary and editing of the fight? We all know boxing is corrupt and dirty in many ways, but might the only way to save the sport (from the dollar) be to get rid of many of the 'old guard' of boxing (people like Dave Moretti, Glenn Trowbridge, Harold Lederman, etc) and the ridiculous number of governing bodies? Is the 'sport' already beyond saving?
I would be very interested to hear what some of you think.
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
funny What I saw was the exact opposite. Many of the commintator comments about Marquez came while Pacquiao was landing.
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
Flying Dutchman
funny What I saw was the exact opposite. Many of the commintator comments about Marquez came while Pacquiao was landing.
I know that we live in a cynical time where the author has long been dead and language can relay different interpretations... but really? If this is another Pactard just trying to muddy the waters, well.. at least have the sack to do it on your real account. Even as Marquez was unloading and landing punches on Pacquiao with his fists, the whole team was marveling at Pacquiao's footwork. HBO playing dirty for the Mexican fighter over their Filipino cash cow? ...I highly doubt it.
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheBranMan
I would be very interested to hear what some of you think.
Really? Somebody posted an opposite view as yours and you questioned whether he's a pactard and using a different account. Are you interested in finding out what the other's opinions are or do you just want people here to agree with your version?
You wrote that the HBO version is distorted by the ref walking in the way and bad angles. Do you think it's intentional considering that the broadcast is live? You might be knowledgeable than me with regards to this but how do they edit a live broadcast to favor them when the action is unpredictable?
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
InTheNeutralCorner
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheBranMan
I would be very interested to hear what some of you think.
Really? Somebody posted an opposite view as yours and you questioned whether he's a pactard and using a different account. Are you interested in finding out what the other's opinions are or do you just want people here to agree with your version?
You wrote that the HBO version is distorted by the ref walking in the way and bad angles. Do you think it's intentional considering that the broadcast is live? You might be knowledgeable than me with regards to this but how do they edit a live broadcast to favor them when the action is unpredictable?
The only reason that I questioned him about being a 'Pactard' is because he posted a one-liner trashing my view with no further justification, oh and he's only got 2 posts on the account: a reasonable assumption. If he had happened to disagree and started to have a serious debate with me (pref on his actual account), I'd never do such a thing.
Hurt feelings aside, you raise a good point about the HBO one being filmed live. Although I do have a background in electronics, I don't know how they film live TV, especially something like boxing where I'd assume they only have a certain number of cameras for all broadcasts. Does HBO generally edit between the live broadcast and a version that they replay? I'm just curious as to why there is such a vast difference between their version and the Primetime one.
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheBranMan
After watching (and recording) the live Primetime broadcast of Marquez vs Pac III, I subsequently got a hold of the HBO version. Funnily enough, in the HBO version, many of Marquez's key moments of the fight are distorted by the ref walking in the way, bad angles, etc - a few examples of this in the early-mid rounds. In fact, the HBO version commentators failed to mention many of Marquez's standout moments and praised and massaged every glancing shot and minor victory for Pacquiao.
At the end of the fight, the Primetime commentators seemed to think the decision was a no-brainer (much like everyone in attendance at the MGM Grand) in that Marquez had control of most of the fight. On the HBO version, Emanuel Steward just rambled on about how 'strong Pacquiao looks' (whatever that means - he obviously couldn't talk about an abundance of effective punches). Furthermore, some of the sound-bites of the crowd boo'ing at the end of the fight during Pac's interview seem to be edited in the HBO version, they're much quieter than the live Primetime broadcast (although to be fair, they claimed to be experiencing audio difficulties).
Does this all add up to the corruption in the sport being so ingrained that it is even apparent in the broadcasting, commentary and editing of the fight? We all know boxing is corrupt and dirty in many ways, but might the only way to save the sport (from the dollar) be to get rid of many of the 'old guard' of boxing (people like Dave Moretti, Glenn Trowbridge, Harold Lederman, etc) and the ridiculous number of governing bodies? Is the 'sport' already beyond saving?
I would be very interested to hear what some of you think.
I have it recorded and This was a non action fight for a Pac/Marquez fight, which is why I think the announcers had so much to say. Jim was jumping at any action to try had hype the dull action. What little Marquez generated as well as Pacquiao needed to be exzaggerated so they often talked over action without giving credit to either fighter landing counters. I have not idea what you are talking about in terms of fight view because I understand there is no other view of the fight other than the recorded HBO cameras. I understood other broadcasts just piggy back the HBO cameras and the only difference is the commentary.
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheBranMan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
InTheNeutralCorner
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheBranMan
I would be very interested to hear what some of you think.
Really? Somebody posted an opposite view as yours and you questioned whether he's a pactard and using a different account. Are you interested in finding out what the other's opinions are or do you just want people here to agree with your version?
You wrote that the HBO version is distorted by the ref walking in the way and bad angles. Do you think it's intentional considering that the broadcast is live? You might be knowledgeable than me with regards to this but how do they edit a live broadcast to favor them when the action is unpredictable?
The only reason that I questioned him about being a 'Pactard' is because he posted a one-liner trashing my view with no further justification, oh and he's only got 2 posts on the account: a reasonable assumption. If he had happened to disagree and started to have a serious debate with me (pref on his actual account), I'd never do such a thing.
Hurt feelings aside, you raise a good point about the HBO one being filmed live. Although I do have a background in electronics, I don't know how they film live TV, especially something like boxing where I'd assume they only have a certain number of cameras for all broadcasts. Does HBO generally edit between the live broadcast and a version that they replay? I'm just curious as to why there is such a vast difference between their version and the Primetime one.
The Pacquiao fans who thought he won have had no hesitation in saying so. None of them would use an alternate account to do so and insulting someone who only has a couple of posts for having a reasonable position isn't likely to make him, or any other lurker, post more in the future.
I thought Marquez won, but it was a close fight and I can understand why HBO called things the way they did.
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheBranMan
After watching (and recording) the live Primetime broadcast of Marquez vs Pac III, I subsequently got a hold of the HBO version. Funnily enough, in the HBO version, many of Marquez's key moments of the fight are distorted by the ref walking in the way, bad angles, etc - a few examples of this in the early-mid rounds. In fact, the HBO version commentators failed to mention many of Marquez's standout moments and praised and massaged every glancing shot and minor victory for Pacquiao.
At the end of the fight, the Primetime commentators seemed to think the decision was a no-brainer (much like everyone in attendance at the MGM Grand) in that Marquez had control of most of the fight. On the HBO version, Emanuel Steward just rambled on about how 'strong Pacquiao looks' (whatever that means - he obviously couldn't talk about an abundance of effective punches). Furthermore, some of the sound-bites of the crowd boo'ing at the end of the fight during Pac's interview seem to be edited in the HBO version, they're much quieter than the live Primetime broadcast (although to be fair, they claimed to be experiencing audio difficulties).
Does this all add up to the corruption in the sport being so ingrained that it is even apparent in the broadcasting, commentary and editing of the fight? We all know boxing is corrupt and dirty in many ways, but might the only way to save the sport (from the dollar) be to get rid of many of the 'old guard' of boxing (people like Dave Moretti, Glenn Trowbridge, Harold Lederman, etc) and the ridiculous number of governing bodies? Is the 'sport' already beyond saving?
I would be very interested to hear what some of you think.
It was pretty ridiculous, what annoyed me the most was Steward keep going on about how strong Manny Pacquiao looks, when he's not even doing anything. And don't even get me started on Harold Ledderman's scoring.
Didn't he have the 1st fight 115-110 for Manny Pacquiao ? and didn't he have JLC winning by 115-111 vs Floyd Mayweather Jr ? his scoring is very inconsistent.
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
honestly man this thread is a bit far fetched
to suggest that everytime marquez landed cleanly the HBO commentators missed it and thats why they scored it for pac
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
honestly man this thread is a bit far fetched
to suggest that everytime marquez landed cleanly the HBO commentators missed it and thats why they scored it for pac
I wasn't at all suggesting that the HBO commentators missed all of Marquez's offense. As ICB just clarified, I only said that their praising of Pac was above and beyond what was actually happening at the time.. and on the flip-side, they didn't speak up for a few key Marquez moments. That is all. It just begs to question.
Although maybe you're right - maybe this whole conspiracy web that I've mapped out is a bit far fetched.... how am I going to know without discussion?
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheBranMan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
honestly man this thread is a bit far fetched
to suggest that everytime marquez landed cleanly the HBO commentators missed it and thats why they scored it for pac
I wasn't at all suggesting that the HBO commentators missed all of Marquez's offense. As ICB just clarified, I only said that their praising of Pac was above and beyond what was actually happening at the time.. and on the flip-side, they didn't speak up for a few key Marquez moments. That is all. It just begs to question.
Although maybe you're right - maybe this whole conspiracy web that I've mapped out is a bit far fetched.... how am I going to know without discussion?
i watched the primetime version and i think it was opposite to what you are describing
pac would land and there would be little comment and marquez would land an equal punch and they would all ejaculate
there is no conspiracy, it was a very close fight, i thought pac won you didnt, and its reasonably evenly split, yes there is probably more for marquez but the split of opinion is a lot closer than the pro marquez mob are making out
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheBranMan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
honestly man this thread is a bit far fetched
to suggest that everytime marquez landed cleanly the HBO commentators missed it and thats why they scored it for pac
I wasn't at all suggesting that the HBO commentators missed all of Marquez's offense. As ICB just clarified, I only said that their praising of Pac was above and beyond what was actually happening at the time.. and on the flip-side, they didn't speak up for a few key Marquez moments. That is all. It just begs to question.
Although maybe you're right - maybe this whole conspiracy web that I've mapped out is a bit far fetched.... how am I going to know without discussion?
i watched the primetime version and i think it was opposite to what you are describing
pac would land and there would be little comment and marquez would land an equal punch and they would all ejaculate
there is no conspiracy, it was a very close fight, i thought pac won you didnt, and its reasonably evenly split, yes there is probably more for marquez but the split of opinion is a lot closer than the pro marquez mob are making out
You mean there is really two versions of the fight: HBO and Primetime. Just like fan johnny, I thought there is only the HBO broadcast and the rest just picks up on that broadcast but uses different commentators.
Where did they show the Primetime version?
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
InTheNeutralCorner
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
Quote:
Originally Posted by
TheBranMan
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
honestly man this thread is a bit far fetched
to suggest that everytime marquez landed cleanly the HBO commentators missed it and thats why they scored it for pac
I wasn't at all suggesting that the HBO commentators missed all of Marquez's offense. As ICB just clarified, I only said that their praising of Pac was above and beyond what was actually happening at the time.. and on the flip-side, they didn't speak up for a few key Marquez moments. That is all. It just begs to question.
Although maybe you're right - maybe this whole conspiracy web that I've mapped out is a bit far fetched.... how am I going to know without discussion?
i watched the primetime version and i think it was opposite to what you are describing
pac would land and there would be little comment and marquez would land an equal punch and they would all ejaculate
there is no conspiracy, it was a very close fight, i thought pac won you didnt, and its reasonably evenly split, yes there is probably more for marquez but the split of opinion is a lot closer than the pro marquez mob are making out
You mean there is really two versions of the fight: HBO and Primetime. Just like fan johnny,
I thought there is only the HBO broadcast and the rest just picks up on that broadcast but uses different commentators.
Where did they show the Primetime version?
on Primetime
you could watch the same fight commentated on by 10 different sets of commentators and get different angles on the fight and your opinion will no doubt be influence (not neccessarily swayed) by the commentating you are listening to
its not supprising that such a close fight was seen so differently by 2 different sets of commentators
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheNeutralCorner;1028491
You mean there is really two versions of the fight: HBO and Primetime. Just like fan johnny, [B
I thought there is only the HBO broadcast and the rest just picks up on that broadcast but uses different commentators. [/B]
Where did they show the Primetime version?
on Primetime
you could watch the same fight commentated on by 10 different sets of commentators and get different angles on the fight and your opinion will no doubt be influence (not neccessarily swayed) by the commentating you are listening to
its not supprising that such a close fight was seen so differently by 2 different sets of commentators
I mean which country? Was that Primetime also shown in the US?
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
InTheNeutralCorner
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheNeutralCorner;1028491
You mean there is really two versions of the fight: HBO and Primetime. Just like fan johnny, [B
I thought there is only the HBO broadcast and the rest just picks up on that broadcast but uses different commentators. [/B]
Where did they show the Primetime version?
on Primetime
you could watch the same fight commentated on by 10 different sets of commentators and get different angles on the fight and your opinion will no doubt be influence (not neccessarily swayed) by the commentating you are listening to
its not supprising that such a close fight was seen so differently by 2 different sets of commentators
I mean which country? Was that Primetime also shown in the US?
I'm pretty sure Primetime is in the UK.
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CFH
Quote:
Originally Posted by
InTheNeutralCorner
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheNeutralCorner;1028491
You mean there is really two versions of the fight: HBO and Primetime. Just like fan johnny, [B
I thought there is only the HBO broadcast and the rest just picks up on that broadcast but uses different commentators. [/B]
Where did they show the Primetime version?
on Primetime
you could watch the same fight commentated on by 10 different sets of commentators and get different angles on the fight and your opinion will no doubt be influence (not neccessarily swayed) by the commentating you are listening to
its not supprising that such a close fight was seen so differently by 2 different sets of commentators
I mean which country? Was that Primetime also shown in the US?
I'm pretty sure Primetime is in the UK.
It's the exact same HBO telecast view.
http://www.youtube.com/user/Original.../8/T_EpGRREqXg
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Quote:
Originally Posted by
fan johnny
Quote:
Originally Posted by
CFH
Quote:
Originally Posted by
InTheNeutralCorner
Quote:
Originally Posted by
erics44
Quote:
Originally Posted by InTheNeutralCorner;1028491
You mean there is really two versions of the fight: HBO and Primetime. Just like fan johnny, [B
I thought there is only the HBO broadcast and the rest just picks up on that broadcast but uses different commentators. [/B]
Where did they show the Primetime version?
on Primetime
you could watch the same fight commentated on by 10 different sets of commentators and get different angles on the fight and your opinion will no doubt be influence (not neccessarily swayed) by the commentating you are listening to
its not supprising that such a close fight was seen so differently by 2 different sets of commentators
I mean which country? Was that Primetime also shown in the US?
I'm pretty sure Primetime is in the UK.
It's the exact same HBO telecast view.
http://www.youtube.com/user/Original.../8/T_EpGRREqXg
so the HBO version is the same as the primetime version and someone was telling me they were pro pac?
this really is a mixed up fight
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Best thing to do is not listen to the commentators. Turn the volume down and watch the fight, then see how differently ya score to when ya listening to commentators.
As for camera angle, I cannot see how different it would be. Generally ya get 1/2 camera's ringside, invariably operated by the same broadcaster.
Re: Authenticy in broadcasting and scoring of boxing matches - example: JMM vs Pac
Someone like Many Steward is trying to do his part to promote and push the network fighter. It sounds odd, forced, fake, hollow, etc. because he's still a trainer trying to be analyst. Whereas merchant, lamps, kellerman, Ledderman have been practicing and honing their bull$h*t for a while. It always sounds more disappointing coming from Roy, Manny or someone who has actually been in boxing ring because we expect them to know better or speak the truth and not BS us on stuff like that.
I dont think the camera angles were deliberately orchestrated in anyway to sway opinion. The commentating is definitely skewed to preserve the cash inflow. Its only when they need to change things up that the commentators read some websites and borrow the fans cynicism for a fresh angle.... They flip flop back and forth on their own fighters as is convenient. Yes (network fighter) is so completely skillfull.. light years ahead of his competition. .. blah blah blah. BOOM.... and oh my god a vicious right hand from the young determined unheralded super underdog... etc etc.. has knocked out previously untouched.... blah blah This one will be talked about for years to come" ... next week.. the nobody with the lucky punch has got a 3 fight contract for HBO and everybodys already building him up and showing the lucky punch from 97 different angles... and theyre sending a camera crew to his ailing grandmothers house who hocked her oxygen tank for bail money so that he could make bail and continue his education and stay out of trouble or something....
Trainers and fighters are bad at selling... which is why they either shut the hell up .. or say the something retarded and completely out of left field at a press conference... they're used to leaving the selling to the promoters.
