How would a prime Tyson do against Vitali's height, awkward style, and iron chin?
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How would a prime Tyson do against Vitali's height, awkward style, and iron chin?
Neither fought anything remotely like the other in their primes, I could see just about any outcome here.
It's really hard to prepare for someone like Vitali. Not many men that size with his style and reflexes.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Feel like this is a really bad match up for Mike. Vitali was very durable and effective at fighting tall and using his height/reach to full advantage. Against Wlad I would give Mike the proverbial puncher's chance, but Vitali seems like he would bully Tyson and score the late stoppage. Mike would have some moments and Vitali would take some hellacious shots, but I don't see Tyson breaking his body down enough to land the head shots necessary to cut/stop Vitali.
Tough fight for both men... it's really a toss up for me! I'd probably go with Mike though. Maybe he'd fell Klitschko with a body shot.
I will vote for vitali, even though he was the more aggressive of the brothers he is still just as smart so I think you would see more leaning and pushing from vitali than he usually did and greatly frustrate tyson unti mike went mental and started doing silly stuff.
The key here is "Prime for Prime." I'm not saying it would be easy, but no matter how tough Vitali is , Tyson KO's him. I think Tyson was underrated, yes underrated as a technically gifted fighter. His head movement, the way he got inside guys much taller than him and his power/torque were amazingly freakish.
I'm sure a lot of people will think the longer it went , the more chance Tyson would gass it, but remember, we're talking Prime.
That was my take too, if you're talking both guys at their absolute peak Tyson on points isn't that unlikely imo. I don't think anyone could say he wouldn't be able to get inside and unload on Vitali fairly easily, it's not as if he wasn't tough as nails himself, it's a hard fight to call for sure.
Hard to disagree with any of these viewpoints. A classic battle for sure. I lean toward Vitali myself, only because of his durability. Tyson would land, but not necessarily take Vitali out with his punches. He'd have to get inside and would be sure to absorb some punches of his own from Vitali. It's basically a tossup, though, and I could see it going the other way.
Against Wlad, however... it's a whole 'nother story. Tyson crushes him inside 5 rounds.
Tough one.
Prime for prime Tyson hurts and stops him late after wearing him down.
Vitali didnt fight many half as good as Tyson.
I really like Mike and think he was a phenomenal fighter during his peak years in the sport. That being said, I think people tend to overrate him based off of how he looked against a pretty pathetic class of heavyweights (Pinklon Thomas, Tony Tubbs...etc.). It's not that those guys had no talent, they just all had that classic 80's party mentality going and didn't train after winning the title.
Vitali was always in shape, and he was a BIG man. You have to remember, Vitali was like 6'7", 240 and in single digits of body fat. Too damn big for Mike, who was 5'11", at best (seemed shorter when I saw him in person). Bonecrusher Smith, Razor Ruddock, Tony Tucker, and even Buster Douglas gave Mike tons of trouble, and none were as big or formidable as Vitali (Douglas was more fluid and the better boxer/more skilled fighter, in my opinion though).
Tyson had a HUGE punch and stylistically I think he matches up well with guys like Joe Fraizier, Ken Norton, Marciano...etc., he just doesn't seem to do well against large, durable, skilled fighters. I would have Mike stay away from guys like Lewis, Bowe, Foreman, Vitali, Evander...etc.
Vitali for me via mid - late round stoppage.
You lot are having a laugh?
Peak Tyson beats Vitali, probably on points, but taking a brutal beating.
Tyson was too fast and the speed of his combinations would cause damage to the much slower Vitali.
Tyson would have a relative easy time getting his combinations off on the bigger and slower fighter.
Tyson couldn't break down Boneclutcher Smith , Vitali is to strong for him and Tyson would not KO himQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
I never said Tyson would KO Vitali and Smith was just surviving and negative. Tyson won every round in that fight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Lord AlTyson couldn't break down Boneclutcher Smith , Vitali is to strong for him and Tyson would not KO himQuote:
Originally Posted by Master
Tyson lost every fight he was in , hit him back and he lost.
Tyson did not lose every fight he was in that he was hit back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al
Tyson did not hit back in every fight that he won in that he was hit.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterTyson did not lose every fight he was in that he was hit back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al
Tyson hit back every fighter that hit him back and won more than he lost.Quote:
Originally Posted by brocktonblockbustTyson did not hit back in every fight that he won in that he was hit.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterTyson did not lose every fight he was in that he was hit back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al
Prime gets blurry but Vitali stayed on his stool with Byrd. I honestly have to chuck the perceived weight advantage out there, jacked up arm or not and respect Vitali. But speed angles and power works his legs as much as his chin and late I see Vitali soaking up damage. If ever he looked "robotic" it would be trying to work in circles vs Tyson when distance collapses in the late rounds.
What are you saying? Who wins?Quote:
Originally Posted by Spicoli
Vitali is a worst match up for Tyson then Lewis is because at least with Lewis he can be chinned. Vitali was never even knocked to the ground in his boxing career his only loses were with a dislocated shoulder and a cut stopped fight he was winning before hand. Tyson great but he was king of beating the bums in his time as well his best win is a 38 year Holmes which is a good win but common on now. Vitali is not his brother he is even more awkward, has far more killer instinct and has most likely the best chin in hw history i say that because what champ has never been floored as a hw. Tyson has a lot of match ups he can win with atgs in prime but Vitali is just plain bad for him.
Tyson beat better fighters than Vitali did, it's not even close. Like it or not, Lewis and Byrd were surely his best opponents.
Fair enough but that doesn't mean automatically that Tyson would win. Vitali was a very skilled boxer, he could take a punch, he could deliver a punch, and he was something Mike Tyson hadn't seen before either.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Who the Hell knows what would happen had they fought in their primes. Who the fuck thought Buster Douglas would be the guy to beat Tyson?
Both fighters were hard hitters who were hard to hit themselves, they knocked out a lot of fighters between them, and they had great careers.
Wasn't saying it did mean that, as I said at first for me it's a pick em as they both had tools which could be too much for the other. Calling Tyson a bum beater doesn't make much of a case is all, and despite still being so young, it's pretty clear he wasn't in great form against Douglas.
Tyson looked like crap against Buster, very little head movement, prats in his corner and not in the best condition. It showed in his performance and he took a fearful beating from Douglas. That was not prime Tyson, the best Tyson would be between Berbick and Spinks.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
From there he went downhill.
The pressure fighter in general has a short prime even the greatest pressure fighters have short primes. Tyson's headmovement was great....not really similar to the defensive posture of Byrd...can't really say Vitali vs one would equal Vitali vs the other.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
Pressure fighters also struggle down the homestretch, they fade they always always fade unless their opponent fades first.
Mike Tyson, incredible fighter and for his style he was one of the very best of ALL-TIME
It's not as if Vitali had any business losing to Byrd either, I don't think anyone was trying to make a comparison in styles there. Longevity isn't in play either as the question was about their peak, although I'd say Tyson had more than just his style going against him on that.
How the fight would go late is kind of what makes this one so hard to call. Vitali is odd in that for a monster who knocked nearly everyone out, take a look at the few guys who did manage to go the distance with him, they sucked! Tyson also only went the distance a few times before he was clearly past it, against guys who fought to survive and at least one of them in Tucker being a big man and pretty good on the night.
;D :author:Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterWhat are you saying? Who wins?Quote:
Originally Posted by Spicoli
I think Tyson knocks him around in the late rounds for a tko or unam dec. win. If the head/height won't fall the body will be the alternate route. Massive respect for Vitali, just personally don't think he was fluid enough and defensively able to keep up late.
listenQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterTyson hit back every fighter that hit him back and won more than he lost.Quote:
Originally Posted by brocktonblockbustTyson did not hit back in every fight that he won in that he was hit.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterTyson did not lose every fight he was in that he was hit back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark Lord Al
Tyson was hit by everyone he hit back whether he won lost or not
Tyson best win was a 38 year old Holmes who did not fight for years, Spinks great lhw, Bruno good but lost most big fights and Rudock who came up short in all title fights. I would not say Tyson beat way better guys there better not by much though the 80's was about as bad as it is now. Vitali i think is just a really bad style for Tyson not even saying he is better Vitali just plain bad match up when it comes to the size and style they had.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Vitali was slow as Bruno and Tyson never had a problem with robotic fighters. Tyson would hit them with ease and move away before he received anything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140Tyson best win was a 38 year old Holmes who did not fight for years, Spinks great lhw, Bruno good but lost most big fights and Rudock who came up short in all title fights. I would not say Tyson beat way better guys there better not by much though the 80's was about as bad as it is now. Vitali i think is just a really bad style for Tyson not even saying he is better Vitali just plain bad match up when it comes to the size and style they had.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Bruno had a shit chin and also did not know what to do when he got hurt also would gas in his fights. Vitali is bigger, steel chin, gas tank for days and better at using his size. Vitali to me has never really had a fight were he was getting outclassed some reason being his opponents and others being because how the fights were stopped when he did lose. I am about 60 percent on the side of Vitali winning not mention he was great at defending his body.Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterVitali was slow as Bruno and Tyson never had a problem with robotic fighters. Tyson would hit them with ease and move away before he received anything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140Tyson best win was a 38 year old Holmes who did not fight for years, Spinks great lhw, Bruno good but lost most big fights and Rudock who came up short in all title fights. I would not say Tyson beat way better guys there better not by much though the 80's was about as bad as it is now. Vitali i think is just a really bad style for Tyson not even saying he is better Vitali just plain bad match up when it comes to the size and style they had.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Robotic? He was very awkward but not robotic at all Vitali was very athletic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Master
For as big as he was Vitali was surprisingly agile and difficult to hit clean...a few people caught him good (Lewis and Sanders), but he never ended 1 single solitary fight on the canvas.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140
I for the life of me have a very difficult time imagining these guys fighting. Their size difference, their style difference, it's just night and day.....it would be like Jack Johnson vs Floyd Patterson, just not really a pairing I would have ever imagined.
Bruno was lightning you dickQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterVitali was slow as Bruno and Tyson never had a problem with robotic fighters. Tyson would hit them with ease and move away before he received anything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140Tyson best win was a 38 year old Holmes who did not fight for years, Spinks great lhw, Bruno good but lost most big fights and Rudock who came up short in all title fights. I would not say Tyson beat way better guys there better not by much though the 80's was about as bad as it is now. Vitali i think is just a really bad style for Tyson not even saying he is better Vitali just plain bad match up when it comes to the size and style they had.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
If he was then Tyson was even faster.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Bruno was lightning you dickQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterVitali was slow as Bruno and Tyson never had a problem with robotic fighters. Tyson would hit them with ease and move away before he received anything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140Tyson best win was a 38 year old Holmes who did not fight for years, Spinks great lhw, Bruno good but lost most big fights and Rudock who came up short in all title fights. I would not say Tyson beat way better guys there better not by much though the 80's was about as bad as it is now. Vitali i think is just a really bad style for Tyson not even saying he is better Vitali just plain bad match up when it comes to the size and style they had.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterIf he was then Tyson was even faster.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Bruno was lightning you dickQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterVitali was slow as Bruno and Tyson never had a problem with robotic fighters. Tyson would hit them with ease and move away before he received anything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140Tyson best win was a 38 year old Holmes who did not fight for years, Spinks great lhw, Bruno good but lost most big fights and Rudock who came up short in all title fights. I would not say Tyson beat way better guys there better not by much though the 80's was about as bad as it is now. Vitali i think is just a really bad style for Tyson not even saying he is better Vitali just plain bad match up when it comes to the size and style they had.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
You're becoming too kind in your old age. ;D
Having someone claim Bruno was lightning is the sports equivalent of a lollypop pitch right down the middle of the plate, begging to be hammered over the center field wall.
If you do that with Vitali's best wins it makes him look considerably worse. Either guy could have won and we have no measuring stick, all I was saying.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140Tyson best win was a 38 year old Holmes who did not fight for years, Spinks great lhw, Bruno good but lost most big fights and Rudock who came up short in all title fights. I would not say Tyson beat way better guys there better not by much though the 80's was about as bad as it is now. Vitali i think is just a really bad style for Tyson not even saying he is better Vitali just plain bad match up when it comes to the size and style they had.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Tyson was fastQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterIf he was then Tyson was even faster.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Bruno was lightning you dickQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterVitali was slow as Bruno and Tyson never had a problem with robotic fighters. Tyson would hit them with ease and move away before he received anything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140Tyson best win was a 38 year old Holmes who did not fight for years, Spinks great lhw, Bruno good but lost most big fights and Rudock who came up short in all title fights. I would not say Tyson beat way better guys there better not by much though the 80's was about as bad as it is now. Vitali i think is just a really bad style for Tyson not even saying he is better Vitali just plain bad match up when it comes to the size and style they had.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking
Is that you posting, or Paul Kevin? 😂Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Tyson was fastQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterIf he was then Tyson was even faster.Quote:
Originally Posted by erics44Bruno was lightning you dickQuote:
Originally Posted by MasterVitali was slow as Bruno and Tyson never had a problem with robotic fighters. Tyson would hit them with ease and move away before he received anything back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr140Tyson best win was a 38 year old Holmes who did not fight for years, Spinks great lhw, Bruno good but lost most big fights and Rudock who came up short in all title fights. I would not say Tyson beat way better guys there better not by much though the 80's was about as bad as it is now. Vitali i think is just a really bad style for Tyson not even saying he is better Vitali just plain bad match up when it comes to the size and style they had.Quote:
Originally Posted by p4pking