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Great matchup!
Going off recent fights Canelo's in his absolute pomp now and was seriously impressive against Golovkin whereas Jacobs was a little flattered in that fight. I don't think Jacobs has the toes or stamina to prevent himself from being meticulously broken down.
Canelo KO.
A different test for Canelo which will give us more information to assess how good he really is at the highest level as a middleweight.
Jacobs will move more and has enough power to get Saul's respect. Canelo has slow feet so will have to draw Jacobs in.
I think it will go to points and a robbery will occur.
Gotta say as much as I want Jacobs to win I am inclined to agree with Fenners.
Canelo via KO.
You've gotta have Canelo as a favourite but i can see this being an out and out war.
I think Jacobs might just bum rush him from the start and go for an early KO.
Top fight
I see it 9-3 Jacobs and a UD for Canelo. Boxing sucks.
sorry if I'm being dim , but can somebody clarify the poll before I vote on it. I get beef lover and draw , but what's the difference between "Jug Holes" and "Fish Nets and Silverspoon" ??
WTF! I thought you was British? Well Italian/British?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Jug holes = ears
And everyone knows Oscar is Fishnets and Eddie is Silverpoon (the promoters).
So jug holes is Jacobs? Why would ODLH & Eddie be in the vote?Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterWTF! I thought you was British? Well Italian/British?Quote:
Originally Posted by Primo Carnera
Jug holes = ears
And everyone knows Oscar is Fishnets and Eddie is Silverpoon (the promoters).
I think Jacobs will win. Canelo has proven to be a good fighter, but I think stylistically Jacobs has too much movement for him. I think it will be around 8-4 or 7-5 for Jacobs with Canelo getting the decision. It will be another one of those fights where it’s possible to score the fight for Canelo but Jacobs won the fight on a majority of scorecards but the only judges who matter will give it to Canelo.
If Canelo KO’s Jacobs, that will be far and away his best win. Canelo won’t have the size advantage for once and will actually be fighting a solid opponent. Jacobs has also shown to have a decent chin. It’s not great by any means, but he doesn’t just fall over when he gets hit.
I think we are in for another bad decision unfortunately. But kudos to Canelo for taking this fight instead of GGG again. Now GGG needs to fight Charlo.
I don't think Alvarez will stop him. He'll do well to outpoint him and could lose but like others I think he'll get the decision. If Jacobs can fight at the level he was at against Golovkin he could outpoint the ginger.
If Jacobs decides to outbox Ginger, he'll win every round and then lose the judges' decision, like someone said earlier.
If he goes for the knockout, Ginger's chin will hold out better than Jacobs' and the unthinkable will happen. Ginger will knock him out and become Emperor of Boxing for Life.
Canelo KO.
Another good thing about this fight is it forces GGG to look elsewhere. Get over the two robberies, Gennady. There's other fish in the middleweight seas.
True, but he'll get sh-t for Brant or Andrade. Smith at 168?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
I would love to see him face Derevyanchenko, but along with Saunders it's high risk, low reward.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaTrue, but he'll get sh-t for Brant or Andrade. Smith at 168?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
I would love to see him face Derevyanchenko, but along with Saunders it's high risk, low reward.
How about Charlo? That seems the name that would get him the most $$$ of the three (vs Brant or Andrade). I don't know about him moving to 168. He's been cemented at middleweight for like forever... and at this age it seems unlikely he'd make a move up and be successful. Most elite 168-pounders I believe wreck him. Agree on Dere and Saunders being hi-risk, lo-reward. I'd go for Charlo if I was him.
Yea I wouldn't mind Charlo, but I feel he owes Korobov a rematch (doubt that happens tho).Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by AlphaTrue, but he'll get sh-t for Brant or Andrade. Smith at 168?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
I would love to see him face Derevyanchenko, but along with Saunders it's high risk, low reward.
How about Charlo? That seems the name that would get him the most $$$ of the three (vs Brant or Andrade). I don't know about him moving to 168. He's been cemented at middleweight for like forever... and at this age it seems unlikely he'd make a move up and be successful. Most elite 168-pounders I believe wreck him. Agree on Dere and Saunders being hi-risk, lo-reward. I'd go for Charlo if I was him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaYea I wouldn't mind Charlo, but I feel he owes Korobov a rematch (doubt that happens tho).Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by AlphaTrue, but he'll get sh-t for Brant or Andrade. Smith at 168?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
I would love to see him face Derevyanchenko, but along with Saunders it's high risk, low reward.
How about Charlo? That seems the name that would get him the most $$$ of the three (vs Brant or Andrade). I don't know about him moving to 168. He's been cemented at middleweight for like forever... and at this age it seems unlikely he'd make a move up and be successful. Most elite 168-pounders I believe wreck him. Agree on Dere and Saunders being hi-risk, lo-reward. I'd go for Charlo if I was him.
You're probably right on that, but I'm looking at it from the GGG age factor point of view. GGG will be 37 in a couple of months, and middleweight isn't like the heavies, where you can apparently fight into your 40's. The clock is ticking and GGG should be anxious to leave the Canelo fiascos in the rearview mirror. If he really wants one or two more big money fights before retiring, Charlo makes all the sense in the world. Charlo can always rematch Korobov later down the road.
I wouldn’t mind if he fought Andrade. Brant would be a big disappointment. I’m actually prepared for GGG to take an easy fight in hopes that he gets to fight the winner of Canelo and Jacobs. GGG probably won’t risk it against Charlo, Saunders, or Derevyanchenko. I hope he proves me wrong though.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaTrue, but he'll get sh-t for Brant or Andrade. Smith at 168?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
I would love to see him face Derevyanchenko, but along with Saunders it's high risk, low reward.
Why do you think that Canelo will KO Jacobs? Do you think that Jacobs is just past his prime so he won’t be able to get out of the way of shots? Or do you think he will just try to make it a fire fight and get caught? Or do you think that Canelo is just that good?Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha
This is what we all need and want. Credit to Canelo..that hurt my head..for the direction but hey that's what we should expect from all top tier fighters. But lets just hope all comes off as planned and no BS. I like Canelo right now but Danny has that straight punching down the middle speed size and pop that Canelo has not looked great against frankly. But chins :-X. Damn fine fight.
No I have said on here recently that Jacobs is arguably the #1 middleweight at the moment, so you won't get any excuses from me about Jacobs being past it, I do however feel Canelo has 'grown' ;D from strength to strength in recent years (there could be many arguments as to why this has happened), and he seems to improve as a fighter with each outing. Don't get me wrong, this is a dangerous fight for both guys, I just feel Canelo is at his peak, and has the tools to take Danny apart. Although I'm calling Canelo KO, I think it will be late in the fight, maybe around the 10th or 11th.Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncherWhy do you think that Canelo will KO Jacobs? Do you think that Jacobs is just past his prime so he won’t be able to get out of the way of shots? Or do you think he will just try to make it a fire fight and get caught? Or do you think that Canelo is just that good?Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha
Personally I think GGG needs to make a statement with his opponent choice, for me that would be Derevyanchenko. I would also be happy with Smith at 168.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by AlphaYea I wouldn't mind Charlo, but I feel he owes Korobov a rematch (doubt that happens tho).Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by AlphaTrue, but he'll get sh-t for Brant or Andrade. Smith at 168?Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFan
I would love to see him face Derevyanchenko, but along with Saunders it's high risk, low reward.
How about Charlo? That seems the name that would get him the most $$$ of the three (vs Brant or Andrade). I don't know about him moving to 168. He's been cemented at middleweight for like forever... and at this age it seems unlikely he'd make a move up and be successful. Most elite 168-pounders I believe wreck him. Agree on Dere and Saunders being hi-risk, lo-reward. I'd go for Charlo if I was him.
You're probably right on that, but I'm looking at it from the GGG age factor point of view. GGG will be 37 in a couple of months, and middleweight isn't like the heavies, where you can apparently fight into your 40's. The clock is ticking and GGG should be anxious to leave the Canelo fiascos in the rearview mirror. If he really wants one or two more big money fights before retiring, Charlo makes all the sense in the world. Charlo can always rematch Korobov later down the road.
I see it being close due to Jacob's movement but Canelo takes it on points and proves himself further as the top MW.
Hope so anyway.
Surely Draw and fishnet and Silver Spoon are the same thing?
Good work from alvarez fighting the best around. Jacobs looked to tire fairly badly v the Polish chap a couple of fights ago, pretty sure that will have given golden boy the motivation to take him on, risky move for him but if he's guaranteed the money from dazn this could work out great for us viewers...I suspect jacobs tires later on as he did v the pole (I rarely attempt to spell polish names:S), and couple that with alvarezs world class body attacks (fielding arms were getting pretty badly bruised from the assault in december) then I think jacobs is going to suffer a stoppage later on... he could certainly win though but I just think alvarez has improved a lot since that he first golovkin fight .
Jacobs by late TKO or KO.... 9, 10 or 11....
I was just thinking, Canelo can now take as much risk as he wants because he is locked in to a contract while making a ton of money. He can lose his next ten fights and he will still make his money. That’s the best situation a fighter can be in. He can take all the risk without having to risk his money.
Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
You'd think so, right? But as you said..... Canelo's locked into a contract where he's already guaranteed tons of money. Now he's in a win-win. His money is secure..... AND.... he doesn't have to abandon his "protect the 0" strategy. Putting Canelo and "risk" in the same sentence is pretty much of an oxymoron. Yeah, so he finally caved and agreed to face GGG when the pressure became too great for him to avoid it anymore, but how did he follow that up? By picking off easy prey Fielding with the added bonus of winning another useless division title. Kudos to him and his Marination Team for surprisingly agreeing to face Jacobs.... but don't expect Canelo to all of a sudden turn "risk-taker", the total opposite of how he's built his career.
But he can turn around a ton of hate if he starts fighting the best. If he beats Jacobs and then GGG convincingly then his career really takes a turn. Then if he could somehow start beating people at 168 he could solidify his position as an ATG. Fortunately for him though, he has nothing to lose because if he really goes for it and loses multiple fights, he still gets all of that money and be able to say he didn’t avoid the best. Basically the money allows him to face whoever he wants without any financial consequences.Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
You'd think so, right? But as you said..... Canelo's locked into a contract where he's already guaranteed tons of money. Now he's in a win-win. His money is secure..... AND.... he doesn't have to abandon his "protect the 0" strategy. Putting Canelo and "risk" in the same sentence is pretty much of an oxymoron. Yeah, so he finally caved and agreed to face GGG when the pressure became too great for him to avoid it anymore, but how did he follow that up? By picking off easy prey Fielding with the added bonus of winning another useless division title. Kudos to him and his Marination Team for surprisingly agreeing to face Jacobs.... but don't expect Canelo to all of a sudden turn "risk-taker", the total opposite of how he's built his career.
Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
I'm pretty certain the contract doesn't quite work like that, it's based on performance and ratings. So he can't fight 10 Rocky Fieldings to steal the money, because obviously the big names like Jacobs bring in the subscribers, and at the same time if he suffers a bunch of bad losses his drawing power disappears. It's worth hundreds of millions but not guaranteed.
Is it not guaranteed? Maybe it’s not, but I never heard anything that it wasn’tQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
I'm pretty certain the contract doesn't quite work like that, it's based on performance and ratings. So he can't fight 10 Rocky Fieldings to steal the money, because obviously the big names like Jacobs bring in the subscribers, and at the same time if he suffers a bunch of bad losses his drawing power disappears. It's worth hundreds of millions but not guaranteed.
I highly doubt they paid him $365 million to bank, let alone without any say in his competition, that would be insane. For one, the deal came with Oscar providing 12 shows a year (basically they signed the GB stable) and Canelo's pay is based on subscribers, so he can make more than $33 million per fight (the minimum divvy up).Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncherIs it not guaranteed? Maybe it’s not, but I never heard anything that it wasn’tQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
I'm pretty certain the contract doesn't quite work like that, it's based on performance and ratings. So he can't fight 10 Rocky Fieldings to steal the money, because obviously the big names like Jacobs bring in the subscribers, and at the same time if he suffers a bunch of bad losses his drawing power disappears. It's worth hundreds of millions but not guaranteed.
There's no way Canelo suffers a couple of bad losses then carries on banking $33 million per fight year after year against any Tom, Dick or Rocky. Just the same as there's no way he got that money without DAZN having the final say on his op. All networks have power over what matches they'll accept.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
I'm pretty certain the contract doesn't quite work like that, it's based on performance and ratings. So he can't fight 10 Rocky Fieldings to steal the money, because obviously the big names like Jacobs bring in the subscribers, and at the same time if he suffers a bunch of bad losses his drawing power disappears. It's worth hundreds of millions but not guaranteed.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brianma.../#6aebffde24ad
I don't get much into the contract side of boxing, but from it says here it would appear Canelo's minimum is guaranteed, regardless of opposition.
(from the article)
"Per a DAZN representative that I spoke to, the deal is worth a minimum of $365 million. Traditionally, Alvarez would be able to earn above and beyond his minimum purses based on pay-per-view buys and a percentage of the live gate from his fights. In this deal without a pay-per-view model, Alvarez will have other opportunities to earn above the base. There are escalators, but terms of those incentives were specified."
He can earn above that based on PPV and live gate numbers. Also, I don't think with Canelo you need "big names like Jacobs" to bring in subscribers. That assumption would apply to anyone else in boxing, but not Canelo. Canelo could literally fight Joe Blow dragged from the corner bar, and still bring in his own legion of loyal subscribers. Maybe if he did that like 5 or 6 times in a row, his fan base could foreseeably get a little restless..... but it's known fact that NOBODY in boxing gets as much slack as Canelo.
Yeah that's what I said about Canelo's deal. However, he doesn't have PPV anymore, that's the whole point, but he still needs to generate huge ratings (subscribers) to beat his minimum purse ($33 million).Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
I'm pretty certain the contract doesn't quite work like that, it's based on performance and ratings. So he can't fight 10 Rocky Fieldings to steal the money, because obviously the big names like Jacobs bring in the subscribers, and at the same time if he suffers a bunch of bad losses his drawing power disappears. It's worth hundreds of millions but not guaranteed.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brianma.../#6aebffde24ad
I don't get much into the contract side of boxing, but from it says here it would appear Canelo's minimum is guaranteed, regardless of opposition.
(from the article)
"Per a DAZN representative that I spoke to, the deal is worth a minimum of $365 million. Traditionally, Alvarez would be able to earn above and beyond his minimum purses based on pay-per-view buys and a percentage of the live gate from his fights. In this deal without a pay-per-view model, Alvarez will have other opportunities to earn above the base. There are escalators, but terms of those incentives were specified."
He can earn above that based on PPV and live gate numbers. Also, I don't think with Canelo you need "big names like Jacobs" to bring in subscribers. That assumption would apply to anyone else in boxing, but not Canelo. Canelo could literally fight Joe Blow dragged from the corner bar, and still bring in his own legion of loyal subscribers. Maybe if he did that like 5 or 6 times in a row, his fan base could foreseeably get a little restless..... but it's known fact that NOBODY in boxing gets as much slack as Canelo.
He'll be making a lot more for Jacobs than Fielding, like he made a lot more against Golovkin ($50 million+) than Liam Smith (both HBO PPV).
Nobody in the history of boxing can suffer bad losses yet maintain their stardom/ratings. Just look at the current Manny Pac? The PPV with Broner is estimated as a success with 400,000 buys, he used to consistently do a million.
Guys, to make my point more understandable, what if Canelo got a career ending injury in his next fight? Or fails to meet his 11 fight, 5 year, contract? If he has $365 million banked he could never fight again due to all sorts of circumstances, so it's a little more complex than they reveal in press releases.
If I managed Canelo we certainly wouldn't be fighting Jacobs with 9 fights left to honour :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by FensterYeah that's what I said about Canelo's deal. However, he doesn't have PPV anymore, that's the whole point, but he still needs to generate huge ratings (subscribers) to beat his minimum purse ($33 million).Quote:
Originally Posted by TitoFanQuote:
Originally Posted by FensterQuote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncher
I'm pretty certain the contract doesn't quite work like that, it's based on performance and ratings. So he can't fight 10 Rocky Fieldings to steal the money, because obviously the big names like Jacobs bring in the subscribers, and at the same time if he suffers a bunch of bad losses his drawing power disappears. It's worth hundreds of millions but not guaranteed.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/brianma.../#6aebffde24ad
I don't get much into the contract side of boxing, but from it says here it would appear Canelo's minimum is guaranteed, regardless of opposition.
(from the article)
"Per a DAZN representative that I spoke to, the deal is worth a minimum of $365 million. Traditionally, Alvarez would be able to earn above and beyond his minimum purses based on pay-per-view buys and a percentage of the live gate from his fights. In this deal without a pay-per-view model, Alvarez will have other opportunities to earn above the base. There are escalators, but terms of those incentives were specified."
He can earn above that based on PPV and live gate numbers. Also, I don't think with Canelo you need "big names like Jacobs" to bring in subscribers. That assumption would apply to anyone else in boxing, but not Canelo. Canelo could literally fight Joe Blow dragged from the corner bar, and still bring in his own legion of loyal subscribers. Maybe if he did that like 5 or 6 times in a row, his fan base could foreseeably get a little restless..... but it's known fact that NOBODY in boxing gets as much slack as Canelo.
He'll be making a lot more for Jacobs than Fielding, like he made a lot more against Golovkin ($50 million+) than Liam Smith (both HBO PPV).
Nobody in the history of boxing can suffer bad losses yet maintain their stardom/ratings. Just look at the current Manny Pac? The PPV with Broner is estimated as a success with 400,000 buys, he used to consistently do a million.
Personally I'd love to see the details of Canelo's contract. I can see the # of subscribers as being the driving force behind any incentives for him to exceed his base (which regardless is still a pretty good base). After all it does come down to money for both DAZN and Canelo. But I would've liked for there to be incentives based on opponents' rankings and such. I'm pretty sure there aren't any, which of course will allow Canelo a lot more slack than with rankings-based incentives.
In actuality, the fact that Canelo is financially set for life many times over with this contract, actually puts a damper on any incentives Canelo may have to fight top-flight, elite opposition on a consistent basis. Why should he? All we can hope for is the occasional "token prod" from the boxing orgs so that it seems like they're "forcing" him to face the best. Especially the WBC, which will protect Canelo's "legacy" and cash cow status.
This is correct. There's no way that money can be guaranteed in boxing. Promoters are not franchises like the Yankees with 81 guaranteed home games a year and guaranteed TV contracts. It's as guaranteed as Eddie Hearn's billion. If the numbers don't get made then there'll be escape clauses in the contracts. DAZN might not even exist in a couple of years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
Obviously if you can’t honor your contract (by injury for example), then you won’t get paid. I’m also sure that DAZN does have some say in who Canelo fights. I can’t imagine that DAZN made a contract with Canelo allowing him to fight bums.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingThis is correct. There's no way that money can be guaranteed in boxing. Promoters are not franchises like the Yankees with 81 guaranteed home games a year and guaranteed TV contracts. It's as guaranteed as Eddie Hearn's billion. If the numbers don't get made then there'll be escape clauses in the contracts. DAZN might not even exist in a couple of years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
As titofan pointed out though, if he does honor his contract, meaning that he fights who GBP and DAZN agree upon, I don’t see anything that says that if he keeps on losing that he goes below his minimum contract price. Maybe I’m wrong, but I would have to see where it says that he can make less from losing fights.
So my original point was that losing to Jacobs doesn’t affect his future earnings like it would for other fighters.
He'll have to win as well. Or at least remain an attraction. If he's not selling streaming subscriptions he's not going to get paid. The entire payment thing is predicated on him making DAZN a profit. They're not doing this in order to hand him hundreds of millions of dollars, they're doing it to make money. If the money isn't coming in there'll be endless escape clauses for them to end the deal, same as with Hearn and his billion dollar deal.Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncherObviously if you can’t honor your contract (by injury for example), then you won’t get paid. I’m also sure that DAZN does have some say in who Canelo fights. I can’t imagine that DAZN made a contract with Canelo allowing him to fight bums.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingThis is correct. There's no way that money can be guaranteed in boxing. Promoters are not franchises like the Yankees with 81 guaranteed home games a year and guaranteed TV contracts. It's as guaranteed as Eddie Hearn's billion. If the numbers don't get made then there'll be escape clauses in the contracts. DAZN might not even exist in a couple of years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
As titofan pointed out though, if he does honor his contract, meaning that he fights who GBP and DAZN agree upon, I don’t see anything that says that if he keeps on losing that he goes below his minimum contract price. Maybe I’m wrong, but I would have to see where it says that he can make less from losing fights.
So my original point was that losing to Jacobs doesn’t affect his future earnings like it would for other fighters.
Is that in the contract though? Like the amount of losses? Because that is the point of signing a contract. DAZN is hoping to make a huge profit off of Canelo and squeeze him for as much as he’s worth while Canelo is trying to get guaranteed money. Otherwise, what is a contract for if he loses to Jacobs and they just say “sorry, you lost and now we won’t honor your contract?”Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingHe'll have to win as well. Or at least remain an attraction. If he's not selling streaming subscriptions he's not going to get paid. The entire payment thing is predicated on him making DAZN a profit. They're not doing this in order to hand him hundreds of millions of dollars, they're doing it to make money. If the money isn't coming in there'll be endless escape clauses for them to end the deal, same as with Hearn and his billion dollar deal.Quote:
Originally Posted by powerpuncherObviously if you can’t honor your contract (by injury for example), then you won’t get paid. I’m also sure that DAZN does have some say in who Canelo fights. I can’t imagine that DAZN made a contract with Canelo allowing him to fight bums.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kirkland LaingThis is correct. There's no way that money can be guaranteed in boxing. Promoters are not franchises like the Yankees with 81 guaranteed home games a year and guaranteed TV contracts. It's as guaranteed as Eddie Hearn's billion. If the numbers don't get made then there'll be escape clauses in the contracts. DAZN might not even exist in a couple of years.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fenster
As titofan pointed out though, if he does honor his contract, meaning that he fights who GBP and DAZN agree upon, I don’t see anything that says that if he keeps on losing that he goes below his minimum contract price. Maybe I’m wrong, but I would have to see where it says that he can make less from losing fights.
So my original point was that losing to Jacobs doesn’t affect his future earnings like it would for other fighters.
A contract is signed and with that comes the risk that the person who signed the contract doesn’t make the money you hoped. Again, if someone can find me the part of the contract that gives DAZN an out of Canelo loses then I’ll believe you. Otherwise, I’ll assume it’s guaranteed.