Who won Calzaghe or Hopkins? Vote here.

[Gandalf]

Pugilistic - I believe the thing you are not taking into consideration is that a prime Bernard Hopkins was a middleweight. A prime Joe Calzaghe was a super middleweight. Hopkins' best wins in his prime were against smaller men. The Tito and Oscar fights were at 158 and 156 or are you referring to earlier? Maybe you are referring to p4p, which is all subjective anyway. Was Hopkins in his prime when RJJ beat him? My opinion is that between prime Roy/Bernard/Joe, on any given day, any of them could beat eachother. To be fair, it's a blemish on their records that they didn't face eachother in their primes. Scoreboard though: after the dust settled, only Joe is 2 & 0, Roy is 1 & 2, and Bernard is 1 & 2.

Exactly and a very important point. Hopkins best wins are over a bunch of tiny men who didn't belong anywhere near middleweight and then beyond more men who didn't belong at LHW. Hopkins is a lot of smoke and mirrors and he is canny and aware of that. He rarely chooses an opponent lightly.

Calzaghe was always bigger and only once Hopkins had moved up and adjusted was Calzaghe called upon and Hopkins was forced to resort to laying down to buy time against the workrate. The only thing I give Hopkins in his prime is more chance of being hurt and less laying on the canvas.

[erics44]

Pugilistic - I believe the thing you are not taking into consideration is that a prime Bernard Hopkins was a middleweight. A prime Joe Calzaghe was a super middleweight. Hopkins' best wins in his prime were against smaller men. The Tito and Oscar fights were at 158 and 156 or are you referring to earlier? Maybe you are referring to p4p, which is all subjective anyway. Was Hopkins in his prime when RJJ beat him? My opinion is that between prime Roy/Bernard/Joe, on any given day, any of them could beat eachother. To be fair, it's a blemish on their records that they didn't face eachother in their primes. Scoreboard though: after the dust settled, only Joe is 2 & 0, Roy is 1 & 2, and Bernard is 1 & 2.

Exactly and a very important point. Hopkins best wins are over a bunch of tiny men who didn't belong anywhere near middleweight and then beyond more men who didn't belong at LHW. Hopkins is a lot of smoke and mirrors and he is canny and aware of that. He rarely chooses an opponent lightly.

Calzaghe was always bigger and only once Hopkins had moved up and adjusted was Calzaghe called upon and Hopkins was forced to resort to laying down to buy time against the workrate. The only thing I give Hopkins in his prime is more chance of being hurt and less laying on the canvas.

hopkins best wins are probably after he moved up, pavlik, pascal, tarver, wright dont you think?

[Pugilistic]

i said earlier in his carear calazaghi didnt get put down, as his carear went on he started to go down a bit more

mitchell was the first to knock him over

IMO a younger hopkins may have faired better in their bout, also a younger calazaghi may have

Also IMO calazaghi may have settled earlier if the fight had been in britain and not given himself as much to do

However, hopkins has had some of his best wins around the time and since the calazaghi fight so he was definately not showing his age

I'm fully aware that Calzaghe had the ability to cause Hopkins problems. I just think a prime Hopkins would outbox him through 12 rounds.

Hopkins may of had good wins in his career at 40+ and was still in good for but It doesn't change the fact he was old and not as good as he used to be.

Hopkins performances over 40 have been up and down.

He looked great against Tarver, Pavlik and Pascal but looked terrible against Wright, Calzaghe and Jones.

Pugilistic - I believe the thing you are not taking into consideration is that a prime Bernard Hopkins was a middleweight. A prime Joe Calzaghe was a super middleweight. Hopkins' best wins in his prime were against smaller men. The Tito and Oscar fights were at 158 and 156 or are you referring to earlier? Maybe you are referring to p4p, which is all subjective anyway. Was Hopkins in his prime when RJJ beat him? My opinion is that between prime Roy/Bernard/Joe, on any given day, any of them could beat eachother. To be fair, it's a blemish on their records that they didn't face eachother in their primes. Scoreboard though: after the dust settled, only Joe is 2 & 0, Roy is 1 & 2, and Bernard is 1 & 2.

In regards to the Joe/Bernard fight, if Joe's punches were slaps, why didn't Bernard walk through them and control the pace?

I'm fully aware that both fighters dominated different weight classes. Hopkins was a big middleweight though, he could of easily have fitted in super middleweight without any problems.

Having watched loads of Hopkins fights, Hopkins prime began around 1997 and came to an end around 2003.

I appreciate your opinion regarding Calzaghe/Hopkins/Jones and i don't disagree with you. That's your opinion just like mine is Hopkins and Jones beat Joe and Jones beats Hopkins. At the end of the day, all those guys are ATG's and how people see their fights going is their opinion.

Bringing up how things ended up is irrelevant though considering Jones hadn't been the same since he beat Ruiz at heavyweight and Hopkins was good but not his best anymore. Joe wasn't a young guy himself age wise but he was close to his prime physically and mentally, more than both Jones and Hopkins anyway.

Regarding the Hopkins/Calzaghe fight, i never said Joe just slapped. He actually mixed in hard punches as well. I think those that say Joe slapped his way to a win are delusional. I remember Joe landing some good left hands down the stretch.

Exactly and a very important point. Hopkins best wins are over a bunch of tiny men who didn't belong anywhere near middleweight and then beyond more men who didn't belong at LHW. Hopkins is a lot of smoke and mirrors and he is canny and aware of that. He rarely chooses an opponent lightly.

Calzaghe was always bigger and only once Hopkins had moved up and adjusted was Calzaghe called upon and Hopkins was forced to resort to laying down to buy time against the workrate. The only thing I give Hopkins in his prime is more chance of being hurt and less laying on the canvas.

Trinidad and Oscar were not tiny men. These guys were fighting at 154 before the tried their luck at middleweight.

That's one weight division and only 6 pounds. your exaggerating on how small they are.

Trinidad proved he was a good middleweight by KOing Joppy something which Hopkins couldn't do even though he really tried too.

Trinidad was the favourite by about 6-1 and was supposed to KO Hopkins. Once Hopkins whipped his ass and sent him into retirement then people brought up the "weight" issue.

Oscar isn't a good win for Hopkins imo. he was simply a big money fight for Hopkins and Hopkins would of never turned that down, no fighter would.

Pavlik was a good win considering Hopkins was a big underdog and Pavlik was like Trinidad was supposed to KO Bhop.

Pavlik and Hopkins are basically the same size hence why only a year later Pavlik was struggling to make against Martinez.

Wright isn't a good win for Hopkins but a decent one considering Wright was the favourite.

Joe never had the power to hurt Hopkins. Hopkins hardly got hit let alone hurt. I can agree with the workrate to a certain extent but the power to hurt Hopkins is alot of doo doo.

Calzaghe had enough power to earn your respect but he never stopped anyone of any note similar to Hopkins.