Champions chasing Challengers

[ruthless rocco]

hey don't get all worked up about it...

you seem to have a real problem with the idea of this guy getting 100 wins.
whats it to you? relax. have a good bowel movement...

we'll see how each fighter's careers go.

Worked up? You don't know me very well. Just pointing out the fact that Baby's record is a farce, is all. Nothing wrong with setting the record straight, right?

but that's common knowledge...

[TitoFan]

hey don't get all worked up about it...

you seem to have a real problem with the idea of this guy getting 100 wins.
whats it to you? relax. have a good bowel movement...

we'll see how each fighter's careers go.

Worked up? You don't know me very well. Just pointing out the fact that Baby's record is a farce, is all. Nothing wrong with setting the record straight, right?

but that's common knowledge...

Ok, so we agree.

[ruthless rocco]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

[TitoFan]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

Oh ok.... so we disagree.

I don't care to defend Martinez. He needs a couple of career-defining fights to establish his legacy, if there's going to be any.

As for Baby Chavez, if by "well managed" you mean protected from any fights that might endanger his precious little "0" in the loss column, to the point of ducking credible challengers. Then yeah..... the coddled little baby is well managed.

[ruthless rocco]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

Oh ok.... so we disagree.

I don't care to defend Martinez. He needs a couple of career-defining fights to establish his legacy, if there's going to be any.

As for Baby Chavez, if by "well managed" you mean protected from any fights that might endanger his precious little "0" in the loss column, to the point of ducking credible challengers. Then yeah..... the coddled little baby is well managed.

by well managed i mean he's made the most money with the least risk while upholding a brand name started by his dad.

that's the third element of the sweet science...the one people don't like to talk about: money.

the art of hitting and not being hit; while making as much money as possible.

[TitoFan]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

Oh ok.... so we disagree.

I don't care to defend Martinez. He needs a couple of career-defining fights to establish his legacy, if there's going to be any.

As for Baby Chavez, if by "well managed" you mean protected from any fights that might endanger his precious little "0" in the loss column, to the point of ducking credible challengers. Then yeah..... the coddled little baby is well managed.

by well managed i mean he's made the most money with the least risk while upholding a brand name started by his dad.

that's the third element of the sweet science...the one people don't like to talk about: money.

the art of hitting and not being hit; while making as much money as possible.

I can now see why we will always disagree.

I see boxing as a sport. A sport I've loved for a very long time. Long enough to have seen the best fighting the best. Long enough to have seen warriors in the ring, wanting to fight the best opponents available... and not giving a rat's ass about "brand names" (give me a frigging break), maintaining fake undefeated records, or wanting to bloat their bullshit records with bums.

You, on the other hand, admire "well managed" fighters with all the attributes you very well mentioned in your post. Nothing wrong with that...... to each his own.

We'll never agree.

[ruthless rocco]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

Oh ok.... so we disagree.

I don't care to defend Martinez. He needs a couple of career-defining fights to establish his legacy, if there's going to be any.

As for Baby Chavez, if by "well managed" you mean protected from any fights that might endanger his precious little "0" in the loss column, to the point of ducking credible challengers. Then yeah..... the coddled little baby is well managed.

by well managed i mean he's made the most money with the least risk while upholding a brand name started by his dad.

that's the third element of the sweet science...the one people don't like to talk about: money.

the art of hitting and not being hit; while making as much money as possible.

I can now see why we will always disagree.

I see boxing as a sport. A sport I've loved for a very long time. Long enough to have seen the best fighting the best. Long enough to have seen warriors in the ring, wanting to fight the best opponents available... and not giving a rat's ass about "brand names" (give me a frigging break), maintaining fake undefeated records, or wanting to bloat their bullshit records with bums.

You, on the other hand, admire "well managed" fighters with all the attributes you very well mentioned in your post. Nothing wrong with that...... to each his own.

We'll never agree.

i don't admire chavez jr. i'm just suggesting that you're naive if you think boxing is just about a fighter's glory. its about money and you're a fool if you believe otherwise.

as for people fighting bums... martinez fought a guy with a 1-7-2 record for his 40th fight! his 42nd fight was against 3-35-2! his 43rd fight was 14-4! his 44th fight: 14-10! his 45th 16-6! who has the padded record full of bums? martinez fought 10 times between 2005 and 2007... only 3 of those fighters had winning records.

besides, i'm suprised you're trying to take the moral high road here titofan... your namesake is a cheater who was caught red handed.

[Rantcatrat]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

where do you rank Martinez p4p?

who should he face to merit his worth?

[ruthless rocco]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

where do you rank Martinez p4p?

who should he face to merit his worth?

martinez doesn't belong in the top 10 p4p. he's not that good. knocking out b level domestic fighters, does make you p4p credible.

who should he face to merit his worth? that's the problem, he will lose when he faces someone who's a legitimate contender. he just happens to be in a weak division...but that doesn't prove his superiority. it just means he's top dog on top of a pile of shit.

[Rantcatrat]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

where do you rank Martinez p4p?

who should he face to merit his worth?

martinez doesn't belong in the top 10 p4p. he's not that good. knocking out b level domestic fighters, does make you p4p credible.

who should he face to merit his worth? that's the problem, he will lose when he faces someone who's a legitimate contender. he just happens to be in a weak division...but that doesn't prove his superiority. it just means he's top dog on top of a pile of shit.

you didn't answer the question. do you have a p4p list? if so, who would you rank above him p4p?

also, just to be clear, he's top dog in two divisions, junior middleweight and middleweight, they may be both be equally crappy in your book.

[Master]

What about Joe Louis chasing Max Schemelling to get his revenge when Joe was champion or Joe Frasier trying to get the fight on with Muhammad Ali in 1971.

Terry Norris trying to get a pay day against Oscar Dela Hoya.

[Galaxy]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

where do you rank Martinez p4p?

who should he face to merit his worth?

martinez doesn't belong in the top 10 p4p. he's not that good. knocking out b level domestic fighters, does make you p4p credible.

who should he face to merit his worth? that's the problem, he will lose when he faces someone who's a legitimate contender. he just happens to be in a weak division...but that doesn't prove his superiority. it just means he's top dog on top of a pile of shit.

You don't consider wins over Pavlik, Williams or Dzindziruk any good? Pavlik was the lineal champ. So he's already faced a legit test.

[ruthless rocco]

i doubt we agree...

i think martinez is massively overrated; whereas i find chavez jr to be well managed.

where do you rank Martinez p4p?

who should he face to merit his worth?

martinez doesn't belong in the top 10 p4p. he's not that good. knocking out b level domestic fighters, does make you p4p credible.

who should he face to merit his worth? that's the problem, he will lose when he faces someone who's a legitimate contender. he just happens to be in a weak division...but that doesn't prove his superiority. it just means he's top dog on top of a pile of shit.

You don't consider wins over Pavlik, Williams or Dzindziruk any good? Pavlik was the lineal champ. So he's already faced a legit test.

there's no denying martinez had a couple of spectacular wins (and a loss and a draw) against against a few of top level opponents a few years ago.

based on his most recent performances however, i believe he is slipping. he seems to lack focus...which hinders speed... which lessens power. i think his age is catching up with him. a person's athleticism only carries them so far in boxing. i don't believe he has the skill set to carry him when he no longer has his speed advantage. this loss of focus may also have to do with being a media darling...he's like a starlet now. everyone says he's so great... i think he's losing his drive.

we'll see how he fares in the future if and when he faces top level opposition again. because in his last two fights he performed what i feel to be poorly against some basic b level fighters. which i feel lessens his credibility in the P4P rankings.