Prime jones....

[El Kabong]

Any time in the 2000's you say?!?!? Well you feel free to be as wrong as you like but when Calzaghe was fighting the likes of Tocker Pudwill and Kabary Salem RJJ was still in his pomp.

But hey, you think how you want to, that's fine.

[IamInuit]

[QUOTE=El Kabong;1110990]James Toney was a great fighter from 160 to cruiserweight and he even showed some promise at heavyweight. The point is RJJ toyed with him in his prime, and that's not an easy thing to do.

I don't think that its a given that Ali beats a prime Tyson because he beat Liston or Foreman because Tyson fought nothing like either of them. I think the prime mid eighties Tyson beats both of those guys and believe me I was never a fan of Mike Tyson. Tyson had some of the best footwork of any hev I have ever seen for a crunching stalker and was extremely fast and compact with both hands along with Langford like power from either side. In addition I do not recall better head movement by a heavyweight in boxing history. Both Cooper and Frazier landed a hook that came from the parking lot and dropped him. As good a chin as Ali had, its simply not a given that he could withstand the onslaught.

Foreman would rape Tyson and I'm not so certain Liston wouldn't beat him either. Floyd Patterson had the Tyson style and Ali had what trouble with him

The first 3-4 rounds would be very risky for ali. Thats why i was not totally convinced it would be a walk in the park for ali.

I don't agree. Patterson's style was not like Tysons at all and Tyson was twice as fast, hit harder and would not be dissuaded by Ali's jab. Beating Patterson has very little to do with a Tyson fight and Tyson would not have been raped by Foreman either. Foreman got pimp slapped by Jimmy Young and barely made it out of the Lyle fight. Foreman was slow, threw tree chopping punches that were telegraphed and at many times with palms open (see Ali fight). Against Tyson he would feel like he was in with a crowd.

And I'm not saying Tyson would beat Ali. I'm saying its not a forgone conclusion that he would not.

[imp]

What part of 30lbs of muscle loss dont you understand.?
Jones could have stayed at heavyweight but he wanted to make history by going down again and something had to give.
Whether tarver was a SOUTHPAW or not..jones was not and will never be the same fighter.

JC stayed at his weight like many great champions do, but the difference with RJJ is he wanted to achieve more and take more risks by fighting out of his WEIGHT CLASS.

Just think if RJJ stayed at light heavyweight for the rest of his career and then fought jonny nelson and glenn mccory at cruiserweight in blighty and then retired..lol. (Its a joke, we all know glen wasnt around then dont flame me)

From the comments posted there is great feedback for both of these fighters and they are both legends but in this case "george orwell" was right in that boxers are all equal but some boxers are more equal than others.

[imp]

Back of the net.