America is gonna be ok, know what I'm sayin?

[Beanz]

Strangely, I am kind of in the middle on an issue such as this.

Sorry miles... you can't be in the middle. @Greenbeanz will accuse you of "keeping your options open" and "hedging your bets."

Aha!...the master baiter strikes again. Seems like a case of epic butthurt from yourself. Is it the fact that you don't have the right to cast an Electoral vote for the president that irks you so? Lyle I get, and Miles, because they are like the perfect foil for each other. VC seems to be independent and Kirkland likes to post lengthy but entirely one sided statistical analysis. Youngblood is clearly enjoying playing the agitator but you TitoFan seem to want to enjoy the fragrance of Miles whilst moaning about other posters using the like button? You want to appear to be the voice of reason whilst stating either the bleeding obvious or cherry picking your quotes and references as though only you can see the stupidity of one side whilst others are clearly ignorant of such things. Politics sucks a fact that you claim to recognise whilst never really nailing your own colours to the post, like a seasoned politician.

"Tin Hats!"

[Youngblood]

Youngblood is clearly enjoying playing the agitator.

When you're right, you're right.

[TitoFan]

Strangely, I am kind of in the middle on an issue such as this.

Sorry miles... you can't be in the middle. @Greenbeanz will accuse you of "keeping your options open" and "hedging your bets."

Aha!...the master baiter strikes again. Seems like a case of epic butthurt from yourself. Is it the fact that you don't have the right to cast an Electoral vote for the president that irks you so? Lyle I get, and Miles, because they are like the perfect foil for each other. VC seems to be independent and Kirkland likes to post lengthy but entirely one sided statistical analysis. Youngblood is clearly enjoying playing the agitator but you TitoFan seem to want to enjoy the fragrance of Miles whilst moaning about other posters using the like button? You want to appear to be the voice of reason whilst stating either the bleeding obvious or cherry picking your quotes and references as though only you can see the stupidity of one side whilst others are clearly ignorant of such things. Politics sucks a fact that you claim to recognise whilst never really nailing your own colours to the post, like a seasoned politician.

"Tin Hats!"

Don't get all huffy, grandpa. Just pointing out your blatant double-standards.

On the one hand, you butt into a Wlad thread you've previously not even glanced at, just to tell me "there's too much gray", in a kiss-ass defense of @El Kabong 's extremist views on Wlad. And in your "expert" (cough) boxing opinion, you stupidly say that having a non-extremist view (god or bum) on Wlad is, how did you put it?.... "keeping my options open" and "hedging my bets"?

Then on the other hand, you ignore @Gandalf 's middle ground stance on the entitlement mentality in America.

Which of course is the classic behaviour pattern of a kiss-ass, or brown-noser... whichever term you prefer. No big deal, grandpa. There's worse things in the world. You happen to be pretty good at kissing ass. To some people (not me, though), that is probably an admirable skill and trait.

[Gandalf]

Well, to be fair Greenbeanz is often on my case. I regard him and Lyle as fair chaps, but we all go to war on occasion and I don't think anyone gets an easy time of it. I set off on Lyle, Greenz goes after me and sometimes we all go after Titofan. It's a giant circle really.

Sometimes we all even agree on issues, but never all at the same time.

[TitoFan]

Well, to be fair Greenbeanz is often on my case. I regard him and Lyle as fair chaps, but we all go to war on occasion and I don't think anyone gets an easy time of it. I set off on Lyle, Greenz goes after me and sometimes we all go after Titofan. It's a giant circle really.

Sometimes we all even agree on issues, but never all at the same time.

Difference is... I know where Lyle stands. I don't agree with most of it, but we know what each believes (Lyle: anti-Obama, anti-gun control, etc, etc.... Me: anti-Romney, pro-gun control, etc, etc). We go at it pretty good, but mostly within the bounds of respect. With you, I've a few minor scraps... not entirely outlandish, given the amount of time we've been posting here.

With Grandpa... I just like poking holes in his kiss-ass, flowery speech ways. I just can't help myself. Maybe I'll be nicer to him as a New Year's resolution for 2013.

[El Kabong]

Back on topic here....$70,000 at the very least was wasted on the guy in the video. They SAY he's a "3rd year college student" but the reality of the situation is he more than likely can't read or write given the manner in which he conducts himself but people can and probably have picked him up to take him to vote and tell him which button to push for which candidate and sure people who defend using America's safety net as a hammock will take offense to that and accuse me of making things up, but I have seen it happen with my own eyes. If you think people aren't gaming the system then you're a simpleton and it's a whole hell of a lot more than just him, he's just a bright shining example of the "Dumb Masses" that never worked hard, never held any responsibility, never had to be held accountable, and will leech off of society and as you see in the video he feels no shame in leeching off of the government....he's a strong case for the Pro-Choice crowd.



And I'm glad @TitoFan finds all of my views to be "extremist"....what's extremist here? That I think people should EARN a living? Is that extreme

[TitoFan]

Back on topic here....$70,000 at the very least was wasted on the guy in the video. They SAY he's a "3rd year college student" but the reality of the situation is he more than likely can't read or write given the manner in which he conducts himself but people can and probably have picked him up to take him to vote and tell him which button to push for which candidate and sure people who defend using America's safety net as a hammock will take offense to that and accuse me of making things up, but I have seen it happen with my own eyes. If you think people aren't gaming the system then you're a simpleton and it's a whole hell of a lot more than just him, he's just a bright shining example of the "Dumb Masses" that never worked hard, never held any responsibility, never had to be held accountable, and will leech off of society and as you see in the video he feels no shame in leeching off of the government....he's a strong case for the Pro-Choice crowd.



And I'm glad @TitoFan finds all of my views to be "extremist"....what's extremist here? That I think people should EARN a living? Is that extreme

You generalize, @El Kabong. You think ALL minorities are leeches. You think ALL minorities want to be "hooked on government", to use your words. You think ALL minorities would rather live on handouts than having gainful employment.

You generalize. In contrast, VictorCharlie, who generally has the same political views as you, does not generalize. And knowledgeably speaks of minorites that are hard-working, and are not looking for handouts.

[El Kabong]

You generalize, @El Kabong. You think ALL minorities are leeches. You think ALL minorities want to be "hooked on government", to use your words. You think ALL minorities would rather live on handouts than having gainful employment.

You generalize. In contrast, VictorCharlie, who generally has the same political views as you, does not generalize. And knowledgeably speaks of minorites that are hard-working, and are not looking for handouts.

woah there partner #1 The DEMOCRATS want minorties hooked on government so they'll vote Democrat, that's not generalizing that's the hard and painful truth. #2 I don't think "all minorities are leeches" there are Conservative minorities, obviously they are not leeches. They believe in hard work will pay off and are willing to fight for that American Dream.

[Kirkland Laing]

Kirkland likes to post lengthy but entirely one sided statistical analysis.

It's one-sided because the facts have a strong liberal bias. But they are facts, not opinon. It's one -sided because that's the way it is. If you think there are facts and analysis pointing the other way be sure to point it out to me.

Anybody like to post the factual amount of US GDP that the US government spends on welfare programmes? Let's take 2012 as the year because this will really bump the number up from normal. The reason the number will be much higher than normal is because of the fact that there are a lot more people than usual drawing unemployment benefit due to the 2008 meltdown and slow recovery. Also the fact that about a third of the country now qualify for food stamps due to the shit economic conditions.

So anybody know how much the US government will spend in 2012? 1.7% of GDP, the same amount it spent in 1976. The same amount it's spending every year in Afghanistan and Iraq.

Spending on food and nutrition programmes is well under one percent of GDP. It isn't a rounding error, but it's nothing to get excited about.

Lyle, if you see poor unfortunate people like that every day and you're sick of dealing with them and illegals taking jobs and claiming welfare then my advice to you is to realise the American dream and make more money so that you can move to a nice neighbourhood where you don't come into contact with those people and the only illegals you see are the ones doing your yard.

[El Kabong]

I'm glad that @Kirkland Laing could take his precious time to come into my thread and be a condescending prick. That's always so very kind of you. You assume a great deal about me, what I do, what I think, and how I live, and seeing how your head is so far up your own ass you doubtless think yourself a great judge of me. Allow me to point out some flaws in your logic or rather lack there of. I work for my money, I pay my taxes, I see no issue in helping others out I do it on a far greater scale than you would believe and I do not want to pat myself on the back because of it. My reward is that people become self reliant and achieve their own version of the American Dream. What I do not appreciate is the entitlement culture which was perfectly shown in the video I posted but which you probably haven't watched because of your hardline "I don't watch videos" stance . The issue is not "What percentage of the GDP funds welfare programs" (and it's not only welfare programs, if you watched the video you would have known that) it is that perfectly fit, capable workers, LEARN to be lazy due to those programs. There's nothing wrong in giving a helping hand to a neighbor, but America's "Safety Net" has become a hammock to more than a few and it's money others could use better. Is it wrong for me to expect my fellow countrymen to work for their living the same way I work for mine? Is it wrong to call out a perfectly capable person for being lazy and having no shame of living off of my tax dollars? From your side I guess it is...and that is very sad that someone who claims to be so smart cannot understand the most simple aspects of behavioral psychology which no doubt are hard at work. The entitlement attitude breeds resentment as well as laziness.


"The facts have a strong liberal bias"....$15 Trillion spent on Welfare programs since Lyndon Johnson declared "War on Poverty" in 1964 and we're dangerously close to the poverty rate he started with. This is of course adding in that President Obama has increased funds to such programs by more than $193 Billlion per year. Ooooh and check out this little nugget Federal Welfare spending totals more than $14,848 for every poor man, woman, and child in this country.

http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/PA694.pdf

Yes of course you'll figure out some way to try and weasel out of a straightforward argument because there is 0 way to defend what the people in that video do, but you go right ahead and try.


Also I'd like to thank you for again inferring that I am a racist, I had thought we had settled that some time ago, but it seems you cannot keep from doing that and therefore I'll communicate with you no more after this.

[VictorCharlie]

Dude you linked a Cato article. He doesn't read those either.

[El Kabong]

Dude you linked a Cato article. He doesn't read those either.

(whispering) perhaps that's why he believes "facts have a strong liberal bias"

[Kirkland Laing]

I'm glad that @Kirkland Laing could take his precious time to come into my thread and be a condescending prick. That's always so very kind of you. You assume a great deal about me, what I do, what I think, and how I live, and seeing how your head is so far up your own ass you doubtless think yourself a great judge of me. Allow me to point out some flaws in your logic or rather lack there of. I work for my money, I pay my taxes, I see no issue in helping others out I do it on a far greater scale than you would believe and I do not want to pat myself on the back because of it. My reward is that people become self reliant and achieve their own version of the American Dream. What I do not appreciate is the entitlement culture which was perfectly shown in the video I posted but which you probably haven't watched because of your hardline "I don't watch videos" stance . The issue is not "What percentage of the GDP funds welfare programs" (and it's not only welfare programs, if you watched the video you would have known that) it is that perfectly fit, capable workers, LEARN to be lazy due to those programs. There's nothing wrong in giving a helping hand to a neighbor, but America's "Safety Net" has become a hammock to more than a few and it's money others could use better. Is it wrong for me to expect my fellow countrymen to work for their living the same way I work for mine? Is it wrong to call out a perfectly capable person for being lazy and having no shame of living off of my tax dollars? From your side I guess it is...and that is very sad that someone who claims to be so smart cannot understand the most simple aspects of behavioral psychology which no doubt are hard at work. The entitlement attitude breeds resentment as well as laziness.


"The facts have a strong liberal bias"....$15 Trillion spent on Welfare programs since Lyndon Johnson declared "War on Poverty" in 1964 and we're dangerously close to the poverty rate he started with. This is of course adding in that President Obama has increased funds to such programs by more than $193 Billlion per year. Ooooh and check out this little nugget Federal Welfare spending totals more than $14,848 for every poor man, woman, and child in this country.

http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/PA694.pdf

Yes of course you'll figure out some way to try and weasel out of a straightforward argument because there is 0 way to defend what the people in that video do, but you go right ahead and try.


Also I'd like to thank you for again inferring that I am a racist, I had thought we had settled that some time ago, but it seems you cannot keep from doing that and therefore I'll communicate with you no more after this.

Without bothering to click the link I can tell you that federal welfare number includes social security and medicare, two things that people pay into the system all their lives for. They're not the kind of welfare payments we're talking about here. Maybe if you actually read alittle about this stuff instead of getting enraged by a dumb video you'd occasionally be right about something. Maybe even try reading your own fucking links occasionally.

Let me explain why you and a lots of your compatriots are currently furious about the entitlemant culture and the huge government spending on it. Since 1980 America has been deregulating and ending oversight and supervision of business. This reached its apex in 2001 when the Bush administration just got the hell out of the way and let the financial industry regulate itself. This created the biggest financial system (not economic) boom in history and Republicans told us that surging stock markets and real estate prices was bringing us a whole new era of prosperity now that the dead hand of government regulation had been replaced by the invisible hand of capitalism.

A few short years later deregulation had worked so well that the financial industry had to go to the government to get them to bail out the system -- to the tune of over tqwenty trillion dollars in loans and guarantees -- to prevent the total meltdown of the financial system and the colapse of the economy. As soon as they got the money they spent a big chunk of it lobbying the government to not ask them for the money back but instead to pay for the bailout by cutting government social programmes, things that had nothing to do with the huge debt increase or deficit but had been targets of the right ever since they were introduced.

So now the media is giving you a fulls court press om the debt/deficit. It's being blamed on workshy scumbags to generate enough popular support among voters who know nothing to give the government cover to slash ss/medicare. They're selling you the debt problem the exact same way they sold you Saddam's fearsome WMD and what they're selling you is equally truthful. Try getting angry at the right people you fucking dummy.

[Gandalf]

Kirkland is bang on the money as usual. Americans should really be going after Wall Street, but instead would much rather listen to propaganda and turn upon themselves. America has no significant welfare state. What it does have though are hundreds of military bases around the world. You cannot justify those and at the same time decry welfare. Likewise, you cannot defend bailouts and then attack welfare.

You have to be consistent.

[El Kabong]

Did I defend bailouts? Did the Republicans defend bailouts? Wall Street is a boogey man to take the focus off of DC where real corruption happens and we're seeing it unfold right before our eyes.