Steve Collins vs Roy jones jr

[ross]

I dont know, there has to be a reason why they never fought, including Benn and Eubank. It cant just be everyone elses fault can it? Even Mike Tyson probably the most feared fighter of the last 30 years had people queuing to fight him for the purse. Same as any feared fighter. They generate money.

Unless its a high risk low reward fighter (Bika) but having Jones scalp would be high reward. I do think I remember he wasnt a really big money fighter back then though. He wasnt put on British tv until 96. I remember the first fight of his on British tv was the Bryant Brannon fight. Maybe there was just not enough money or interest involved for the likes of Benn and Eubank who were relatively big earners.

[IamInuit]

They were all at fault. Ego is a terrible disease. Nobody wanted to go to the others back yard. I've always felt a little robbed as a fan that none of those took place. Eubank at his peak would have been the toughest for Roy imo.

Thank God Leonard, Duran, Hagler, Hearns and Benitez never felt the same way.

[Bobthepen]

They were all at fault. Ego is a terrible disease. Nobody wanted to go to the others back yard. I've always felt a little robbed as a fan that none of those took place. Eubank at his peak would have been the toughest for Roy imo.

Thank God Leonard, Duran, Hagler, Hearns and Benitez never felt the same way.

As I said below, the fab four fought each other in round robins over a ten year period. Leonard waited years for Hagler to grow old. Had they had an 18 month window like Jones the fight would never have happened.
Also, I didn't see any of the fab four knocking down McCallum's door.

[ross]

Collins managed to get Benn out of retirement twice! Im sure if Jones wanted to add some of these names to his resume and put all the doubts to rest he could have tried the same.

In fact, if Collins had fought Calzaghe and got beaten I dont think he would have chased Jones. Eubank wouldnt have taken the Calzaghe fight and might have ended up being a title holder at light heav where Jones was and would have instantly become the biggest name opponent at light heavy.

[IamInuit]

They were all at fault. Ego is a terrible disease. Nobody wanted to go to the others back yard. I've always felt a little robbed as a fan that none of those took place. Eubank at his peak would have been the toughest for Roy imo.

Thank God Leonard, Duran, Hagler, Hearns and Benitez never felt the same way.

As I said below, the fab four fought each other in round robins over a ten year period. Leonard waited years for Hagler to grow old. Had they had an 18 month window like Jones the fight would never have happened.
Also, I didn't see any of the fab four knocking down McCallum's door.

Leonard fought Benitez late 1979 (end of Nov) and then fought Duran twice in six months starting in June 1980 and then again at the end of November. Then he fought Hearns 9 months later Sept 1981.
Hearns fought Benitez in 1982, Duran in 1984 and Hagler in 85. Duran fought Benitez in 82 and Hearns and Hagler in 83 and 84.

[Bobthepen]

They were all at fault. Ego is a terrible disease. Nobody wanted to go to the others back yard. I've always felt a little robbed as a fan that none of those took place. Eubank at his peak would have been the toughest for Roy imo.

Thank God Leonard, Duran, Hagler, Hearns and Benitez never felt the same way.

As I said below, the fab four fought each other in round robins over a ten year period. Leonard waited years for Hagler to grow old. Had they had an 18 month window like Jones the fight would never have happened.
Also, I didn't see any of the fab four knocking down McCallum's door.

Leonard fought Benitez late 1979 (end of Nov) and then fought Duran twice in six months starting in June 1980 and then again at the end of November. Then he fought Hearns 9 months later Sept 1981.
Hearns fought Benitez in 1982, Duran in 1984 and Hagler in 85. Duran fought Benitez in 82 and Hearns and Hagler in 83 and 84.

I included the hearns-leonard rematch. It's still a lot longer than 18 months.

[IamInuit]

They were all at fault. Ego is a terrible disease. Nobody wanted to go to the others back yard. I've always felt a little robbed as a fan that none of those took place. Eubank at his peak would have been the toughest for Roy imo.

Thank God Leonard, Duran, Hagler, Hearns and Benitez never felt the same way.

As I said below, the fab four fought each other in round robins over a ten year period. Leonard waited years for Hagler to grow old. Had they had an 18 month window like Jones the fight would never have happened.
Also, I didn't see any of the fab four knocking down McCallum's door.

Leonard fought Benitez late 1979 (end of Nov) and then fought Duran twice in six months starting in June 1980 and then again at the end of November. Then he fought Hearns 9 months later Sept 1981.
Hearns fought Benitez in 1982, Duran in 1984 and Hagler in 85. Duran fought Benitez in 82 and Hearns and Hagler in 83 and 84.

I included the hearns-leonard rematch. It's still a lot longer than 18 months.

And that's not long at all especially since they were all shuffling weight classes. I mean Floyd takes 18 months off after almost every fight.

[Nameless]

This fight is like trying to beat 2 dead horses at the same time.

Some people just won't see the signs and know when to stop.

[Bobthepen]

I dont know, there has to be a reason why they never fought, including Benn and Eubank. It cant just be everyone elses fault can it? Even Mike Tyson probably the most feared fighter of the last 30 years had people queuing to fight him for the purse. Same as any feared fighter. They generate money.

Unless its a high risk low reward fighter (Bika) but having Jones scalp would be high reward. I do think I remember he wasnt a really big money fighter back then though. He wasnt put on British tv until 96. I remember the first fight of his on British tv was the Bryant Brannon fight. Maybe there was just not enough money or interest involved for the likes of Benn and Eubank who were relatively big earners.

Jones made his super middle debut against Toney at the end of '94, and was testing the waters at light heavy by January '96
Eubank lost his title to Collins in early 95, then rematched Collins in late '95. Benn wanted easy paydays after McClellan in early '95, and lost his championship a year later.

I think it was as much a case of too small a window to sort these fights out.

[Spicoli]

I dont know, there has to be a reason why they never fought, including Benn and Eubank. It cant just be everyone elses fault can it? Even Mike Tyson probably the most feared fighter of the last 30 years had people queuing to fight him for the purse. Same as any feared fighter. They generate money.

Unless its a high risk low reward fighter (Bika) but having Jones scalp would be high reward. I do think I remember he wasnt a really big money fighter back then though. He wasnt put on British tv until 96. I remember the first fight of his on British tv was the Bryant Brannon fight. Maybe there was just not enough money or interest involved for the likes of Benn and Eubank who were relatively big earners.

Jones made his super middle debut against Toney at the end of '94, and was testing the waters at light heavy by January '96
Eubank lost his title to Collins in early 95, then rematched Collins in late '95. Benn wanted easy paydays after McClellan in early '95, and lost his championship a year later.

I think it was as much a case of too small a window to sort these fights out.

Thats pretty much true for Jones after Toney I'd say. When Benn was coming off the fight of his life Jones saw fit to ride a bloated HBO contract and beat up an obvious mis matched Pazienza and Thorton who was coming off an out and out robbery 'w' to a 50-50 Lenzie Morgan.

I do think there was a small window for Jones v Benn after McClellan. I remember reading articles in Ring and elsewhere where Benn called for it ( though saying it might be an uphill battle) and Jones saying basically...maybe later, but not right now.

I cannot get over the irony of Roy clamouring for relevance today by going overseas for paydays while back at the top he would hear nothing of it and literally yell that he wasn't being payed enough to take the risk. I wish he would retire and call fights from ringside.

[ross]

I dont know, there has to be a reason why they never fought, including Benn and Eubank. It cant just be everyone elses fault can it? Even Mike Tyson probably the most feared fighter of the last 30 years had people queuing to fight him for the purse. Same as any feared fighter. They generate money.

Unless its a high risk low reward fighter (Bika) but having Jones scalp would be high reward. I do think I remember he wasnt a really big money fighter back then though. He wasnt put on British tv until 96. I remember the first fight of his on British tv was the Bryant Brannon fight. Maybe there was just not enough money or interest involved for the likes of Benn and Eubank who were relatively big earners.

Jones made his super middle debut against Toney at the end of '94, and was testing the waters at light heavy by January '96
Eubank lost his title to Collins in early 95, then rematched Collins in late '95. Benn wanted easy paydays after McClellan in early '95, and lost his championship a year later.

I think it was as much a case of too small a window to sort these fights out.

Thats pretty much true for Jones after Toney I'd say. When Benn was coming off the fight of his life Jones saw fit to ride a bloated HBO contract and beat up an obvious mis matched Pazienza and Thorton who was coming off an out and out robbery 'w' to a 50-50 Lenzie Morgan.

I do think there was a small window for Jones v Benn after McClellan. I remember reading articles in Ring and elsewhere where Benn called for it ( though saying it might be an uphill battle) and Jones saying basically...maybe later, but not right now.

I cannot get over the irony of Roy clamouring for relevance today by going overseas for paydays while back at the top he would hear nothing of it and literally yell that he wasn't being payed enough to take the risk. I wish he would retire and call fights from ringside.

I remember in 96 (I think) the ring did a special feature on Mike Tyson where he had pictures with his white tigers and they asked him shit like would he fight Eric Esche (butter bean) and Mike basically laughed it off saying he knew him and he was a nice fellow. Then they asked him what he thought of Jones and that jones says there is no one for him to fight and I haven't seen this article since it came out but I remember almost word for word they quoted Mike as saying "that's not true at all, there's Nigel Benn" he even went on to say how he liked Benn as he reminded him of himself and that he'd give Jones a very hard fight. Benn beat McClellan who jones was shit scared to fight and although the McClellan fight took a lot out of Benn it did make him a massive name world wide. He was already known massively in america for going over and doing Barkley inside of a round, who then went on to push toney hard.

Jones was good but he was also flattered by the level of opposition.

[IamInuit]

Imo somewhere in the mid 80’s the idea of risk and reward began to change and I think Leonard pushed it off the plank when he came out of a 3 year hiatus and beat Hagler. Star power and the money derived from it for all concerned became more important then real legacy or taking the risk to get the reward. No need to. They then added PPV and boxing has been eroding ever since.

Collins, Eubank, Benn and Watson were Britain's Duran, Leonard, Hagler and Hearns and like them, they all fought each other save Watson/Collins and no doubt made millions. I’m not British but I cannot recall a better era of British boxing.

People keep saying Roy fought a bunch of tradesman well enlighten me on who he could have fought and why he never fought them.

[ross]

He could have fought all of them.

Does it matter when they fought? Collins has 2 wins over Benn after Benn retired. Why wasn't Jones trying to lure them out of retirement or tryi g to get those names on his record?

And here we go again with the "why should he". THe should have because he could have and now people don't regard him as high as he could have been.

Benn fought everyone and travelled. Eubank went to Germany and beat the undefeated Rochigiani.

[imp]

He could have fought all of them.

Does it matter when they fought? Collins has 2 wins over Benn after Benn retired. Why wasn't Jones trying to lure them out of retirement or tryi g to get those names on his record?

And here we go again with the "why should he". THe should have because he could have and now people don't regard him as high as he could have been.

Benn fought everyone and travelled. Eubank went to Germany and beat the undefeated Rochigiani.

Both eubank and benn mentioned from there own mouths they wouldnt be able to hang with jones.

Benn and eubank are british legends but please dont get it twisted.

Look how easy jones made hopkins and toney look..no one has ever done that against them.

[IamInuit]

That is where you are wrong. And they could have fought him. Explain to me how Roy is to blame at 160 for Benn and Watson or 168 for all four? They are all to blame and Roy held all the cards. You want to beat the man then go to his house and do it. Venue cannot be relevant and not relevant at the same time depending on which side you are on.