Soldier butchered in street in Woolwich

[El Kabong]

Sure, the British didn't put a foot wrong in Iraq and merely provided water for the dehydrated people put at the mercy of insufferable U.N. sanctions being the heavenly types that we are.

You are the masters of police militarisation, the murderers of Bin Laden, torturers of Guantanamo and the main architects of Muslim grievances in the world and I am talking Bull? Of course I am to you when suggesting that we are the probable cause and that rule of law is a must.

The British went along with a lot of it and so it is logical to piece together invasions with occasional ethnic or religious disgruntlement.

You're late to this discussion the majority of Iraqi civilians killed during the war were killed by their own people in the Shia vs Sunni fighting.

[Gandalf]

Sure, the British didn't put a foot wrong in Iraq and merely provided water for the dehydrated people put at the mercy of insufferable U.N. sanctions being the heavenly types that we are.

You are the masters of police militarisation, the murderers of Bin Laden, torturers of Guantanamo and the main architects of Muslim grievances in the world and I am talking Bull? Of course I am to you when suggesting that we are the probable cause and that rule of law is a must.

The British went along with a lot of it and so it is logical to piece together invasions with occasional ethnic or religious disgruntlement.

You're late to this discussion the majority of Iraqi civilians killed during the war were killed by their own people in the Shia vs Sunni fighting.

So, ignore the fact that your nation along with poodle Britain invaded a nation after crippling them with sanctions for a decade, and then decided to strike while the iron was hot (or the people left depleted) and then want to say they killed each other. That is pretty nifty, Lyle. Classy.

[El Kabong]

So, ignore the fact that your nation along with poodle Britain invaded a nation after crippling them with sanctions for a decade, and then decided to strike while the iron was hot (or the people left depleted) and then want to say they killed each other. That is pretty nifty, Lyle. Classy.

What happened was the direct result of Saddam Hussein being stubborn. When the Police say "show me your hands" you put your hands up....Saddam didn't heed the warnings.

Sorry the Iraqi civilians got caught in a war zone, but it happens man, it happened in England during The Blitz, and all throughout the history of man. Why you don't directly condemn Obama for drone strikes which murder indiscriminantly is confusing to me, but hey.....YOU are miles....you ARE miles....and you do as you want and death to those who disagree with you

[Gandalf]

So, ignore the fact that your nation along with poodle Britain invaded a nation after crippling them with sanctions for a decade, and then decided to strike while the iron was hot (or the people left depleted) and then want to say they killed each other. That is pretty nifty, Lyle. Classy.

What happened was the direct result of Saddam Hussein being stubborn. When the Police say "show me your hands" you put your hands up....Saddam didn't heed the warnings.

Sorry the Iraqi civilians got caught in a war zone, but it happens man, it happened in England during The Blitz, and all throughout the history of man. Why you don't directly condemn Obama for drone strikes which murder indiscriminantly is confusing to me, but hey.....YOU are miles....you ARE miles....and you do as you want and death to those who disagree with you

What. Are. You. Gibbering. About.

You invaded a country in Iraq based on a LIE (an obvious one) and I have ALWAYS attacked Obama's drone attacks. This is where it gets silly, I am the person that has attacked drones more than anyone else here and suddenly I am not doing it enough and of course you are on about Obama. Just nuts. You are trying to deflect, but are doing so in a way that is too obvious and weak.

If I kill someone then there should be a trial and everything should be laid open, you would much rather just kill someone and hide the body. It is just Goodfella's silliness. It is too easy to just kill and forget about a trial because there is often a lot more than meets the eye and only those avoiding something want to sweep things under a rug.

The Bin Laden murderer did it just how you liked. I'm surprised he doesn't get even the occasional pass from a right wing thug like yourself.

[El Kabong]

What. Are. You. Gibbering. About.

You invaded a country in Iraq based on a LIE (an obvious one) and I have ALWAYS attacked Obama's drone attacks. This is where it gets silly, I am the person that has attacked drones more than anyone else here and suddenly I am not doing it enough and of course you are on about Obama. Just nuts. You are trying to deflect, but are doing so in a way that is too obvious and weak.

If I kill someone then there should be a trial and everything should be laid open, you would much rather just kill someone and hide the body. It is just Goodfella's silliness. It is too easy to just kill and forget about a trial because there is often a lot more than meets the eye and only those avoiding something want to sweep things under a rug.

The Bin Laden murderer did it just how you liked. I'm surprised he doesn't get even the occasional pass from a right wing thug like yourself.

Saddam Hussein's Defiance of United Nations Resolutions

Saddam Hussein knowingly and repeatedly violated the law......oh I'm sorry what were you saying recently about the UN saying it was an "illegal" war?

The Bin Laden mission was done well.....would have rather he been taken alive and worked over for information, but whatever what's done is done.

Now Anwar Al Awlaki and his son being murdered is something that irks me because despite what a total shitbag that guy was he was an American citizen and we all have the right to a fair trial.

As for the murderers of that British soldier, shoot....them....dead.....they had weapons and were threatening war, shoot them....problem solved.

[Gandalf]

These are tired arguments Lyle. If we tried to apply the same sanctions on Israel as on Iraq they would have failed. Israel violates a lot more than Saddam and yet Israel gets saved with the veto every time. Saddam was a calculacted attempt to weaken and invade. Just daft arguments and every time wilfully ignorant of very easy comparables.

[Beanz]

This thread has f*** all to do with Israel.

[El Kabong]

These are tired arguments Lyle. If we tried to apply the same sanctions on Israel as on Iraq they would have failed. Israel violates a lot more than Saddam and yet Israel gets saved with the veto every time. Saddam was a calculacted attempt to weaken and invade. Just daft arguments and every time wilfully ignorant of very easy comparables.

Israel is surrounded by Arab & Persian states which wish to see it wiped off the map....they defend their territory. You're the daft one

[Kirkland Laing]

What. Are. You. Gibbering. About.

You invaded a country in Iraq based on a LIE (an obvious one) and I have ALWAYS attacked Obama's drone attacks. This is where it gets silly, I am the person that has attacked drones more than anyone else here and suddenly I am not doing it enough and of course you are on about Obama. Just nuts. You are trying to deflect, but are doing so in a way that is too obvious and weak.

If I kill someone then there should be a trial and everything should be laid open, you would much rather just kill someone and hide the body. It is just Goodfella's silliness. It is too easy to just kill and forget about a trial because there is often a lot more than meets the eye and only those avoiding something want to sweep things under a rug.

The Bin Laden murderer did it just how you liked. I'm surprised he doesn't get even the occasional pass from a right wing thug like yourself.

Saddam Hussein's Defiance of United Nations Resolutions

Saddam Hussein knowingly and repeatedly violated the law......oh I'm sorry what were you saying recently about the UN saying it was an "illegal" war?

The Bin Laden mission was done well.....would have rather he been taken alive and worked over for information, but whatever what's done is done.

Now Anwar Al Awlaki and his son being murdered is something that irks me because despite what a total shitbag that guy was he was an American citizen and we all have the right to a fair trial.

As for the murderers of that British soldier, shoot....them....dead.....they had weapons and were threatening war, shoot them....problem solved.

I thought the UN was a joke that was irrelevant and we shouldn't take seriously about anything?

But hey, let's not quibble about abject hypocrisy over everything whenever it suits you. Let's say UN resolutions actually count for something and breaking them requires action to enforce them (although not in Israel's case, obviously.)

The problem you have here is that only George Bush believed that Saddam had broken UN resolutions and any kind of sanction was necessary. The rest of the world believed an entirly new UN resolution was needed to legitimise any military action against Iraq. And so did George Bush! Initially anyway, until it was clear he wasn't going to get one at which point he went against the wishes of most of the rest of the world and illegally invaded Iraq.

Tuesday, March 18, 2003 War looms as Bush issues final warning
By Dana Milbank and Mike Allen
Washington Post
WASHINGTON — President Bush vowed yesterday to attack Iraq with the "full force and might" of the U.S. military if Saddam Hussein does not flee within 48 hours, setting the nation on an almost certain course to war.



Bush delivered the ultimatum hours after his administration earlier in the day admitted failure in its months-long effort to win the blessing of the U.N. Security Council to forcibly disarm the Iraqi leader. The United Nations ordered its inspectors and humanitarian personnel out of Iraq, and Bush urged foreign nationals to leave the country immediately.


[...]


Earlier in the day, British and U.S. diplomats, facing certain defeat on the Security Council, withdrew a resolution that would have cleared the way for war. Though Bush on Sunday vowed another day of "working the phones," it quickly became clear that as many as 11 of 15 council members remained opposed and the effort was abandoned by 10 a.m.
The withdrawal of the resolution without a vote was a double climb-down for Bush. On Feb. 22, he had predicted victory at the United Nations, and on March 6 he said he wanted a vote regardless of the outcome.


[...]


Bush defiantly asserted a right to attack Iraq, even without sanction from the Security Council. "The United States of America has the sovereign authority to use force in assuring its own national security," he said. "The United States and our allies are authorized to use force in ridding Iraq of weapons of mass destruction. This is not a question of authority. It is a question of will."


http://the.honoluluadvertiser.com/article/2003/Mar/18/ln/ln11a.html




And don't forget this was all bullshit anyway. This was a war to get access to the world's second biggest oil reserve for US oil companies.


And it's that kind of thing that pisses Muslims off and causes them to bomb your skyscrapers, sporting events etc.

[Beanz]

Miles,Kirkland,Lyle,Vendettos,IamInuit,Andre, etc. Who the hell made two British born people spokesmen for Iraqi or Afghan civilians ? By their actions they have shown a breathtaking arrogance, self righteousness and callous ignorance of anyone's suffering and took it upon themselves to be the very embodiment of evil. They should bear the responsibility for what they have done, not innocent Muslims or British Citizens. They wanted to butcher an unarmed man to death on the streets and in doing so should have forfeited any right to a voice. Trying to imply that their predictions of a war on British streets between scum like them and everybody else is imminent or in some way justifiable is playing right into their hands. They are a shitstain on the arsehole of history not a turning point or a call to arms. Common criminals,and murdering scum nothing more.

[0james0]

There have been many occasions when I've thought the death penalty would be appropriate though.

[El Kabong]

If people want to die as martyrs we should oblige them.

How is it everyone else in the world seems to be able to get along with everyone else but the hardcore Muslims just don't want any part of it?

[imp]

If people want to die as martyrs we should oblige them.

How is it everyone else in the world seems to be able to get along with everyone else but the hardcore Muslims just don't want any part of it?

Sad but true.

The thing with religon is the interpretation of things.

Everyone on this forum could read the bible and interpret it a different way.

In the same way some seem to read the quran and interprete things that result in the things we see today.

Somewhere along the line someone is lying as no God would justify these actions.

[Andre]

Miles,Kirkland,Lyle,Vendettos,IamInuit,Andre, etc. Who the hell made two British born people spokesmen for Iraqi or Afghan civilians ? By their actions they have shown a breathtaking arrogance, self righteousness and callous ignorance of anyone's suffering and took it upon themselves to be the very embodiment of evil. They should bear the responsibility for what they have done, not innocent Muslims or British Citizens. They wanted to butcher an unarmed man to death on the streets and in doing so should have forfeited any right to a voice. Trying to imply that their predictions of a war on British streets between scum like them and everybody else is imminent or in some way justifiable is playing right into their hands. They are a shitstain on the arsehole of history not a turning point or a call to arms. Common criminals,and murdering scum nothing more.

I agree mate and I have never said innocent Muslims need to bear the responsibility or pay for their actions that is taking what Im suggesting to an extreme and what you are trying to wage (peace for the innocent) to another.

What Im saying is they (the Muslims) need to address this problem themselves within their own Mosques. We cant do that legally.

Honestly Greenbeanz we all know exactly where this is being taught from dont we?

I think its time to nip it in the seed right where it is being placed into these young mens hearts and minds?

You know who put the idea in their heads and so do I.

They are who the Muslim community need to go after and they need to excommunicate them totally.

Then those types cant hide in between the innocent ones.

[Master]

These are murderers who killed an innocent man, forget anything else, this should not be lost in any political debate.