I think Tyson beats Joe Louis but Joe was the better champion because he showed consistency and a will to win when the odds were against him.
I think Tyson beats Joe Louis but Joe was the better champion because he showed consistency and a will to win when the odds were against him.
Do not let success go to your head and do not let failure get to your heart.
beanflicker or anyone else; Someone please enlighten me on the "new sciences" in sports and the more modern techniques in training that enables Tyson to beat any heavy before the 1960's (love to hear this)
Please elaborate on the "training sciense "stuff"" HA!!!! Can't wait to learn what Mike ate at the training table in the Catskills!!!Ray.
You cant simply narrow the scope and then broaden it depending on who the person is. The suggestion that there have only been two great heavyweights since WW2 is ridiculous and who cares whether some half wit punk names his pitbull after him or that Tyson was a dickhead? Guys like Liston, Ketchel, Benny Leonard, Walker and yes even Robinson to name but a few make Tyson look like a cub scout. And Joe Frazier and him really fought nothing alike at all unless you consider a hook conjoining their styles. A prime Mike Tyson would have been at the top of the pile in any era including Ali's. What he did or did not do outside the ring or how many people name their budgies after him is not a qualifier for his standing historically as a fighter.
i think it just lasted him for a while, after fame came, he discpline slipped and he kept beating guys only because of his strong foundation, i dont think , and this is purely opinion, that tyson was a complete project, i think he couldve develped further and possibly never have been beaten
I think the people overrating him do it far worse then the people underrating him. I mean you guys who are his fans say he it like number 1 heavyweight and only Ali beats him bit overboard. People underatting him say he is just out side the top ten because he lost all his big fights which is some what true and has facts to it because it happened. I think he is in the lower part of the ten he had good run which was short but got win over a older Larry who still did good things. The thing holds him back is he lost to Douglas while in his prime but took him lightly no excuse still lost, then lost his big fights with a way older Holyfeild with heart problems and Lewis who was also older then him. Then he went on to lose to cans before quitting on the ground which at that point i dont blame him the guy i forget who but he was not on the level.
I think he would beat anyone he lost to in his prime except one person. Holyfield.
Holyfield is the one person that would take all his punches and still out work Mike.
If you watch the second Holyfield Tyson fight, Tyson looked pretty good. I would almost say prime Tyson. I would love to have seen that fight play out. Holyfield would have won on points probably but none the less a good fight.
Not to mention Holyfield was head butting the sht outta Tyson. Im not saying Tyson should have bit his ear off but the ref should have took a point away at least. And with Holyfield head butting like he was, Tyson's dumbass (sorry Mike) was bound to do something stupid.
Who ever says Tyson is just an over rated puncher doesn't know the game. His headmovment is probably the best of all time.
That last round where Tyson went into fury mode, hurt Holyfield but he could not sustain it as a prime version would have. That would have been good to see.
Do not let success go to your head and do not let failure get to your heart.
Mater disagree when it comes to Tyson but you make some points and Holyfeild vs Tyson in there pump would of been something. But when Holyfield looked out he just come back like he was never hurt i say he still takes a close win with his head and holding when he needed to.
Could Holyfield have done it at Heavyweight without the juice?
When Holy was Cruiserweight Champ, the limit was 190 lbs, but Holyfield usually weighed in several lbs under at 186 lbs, 187, 188 lbs.
Holy wasn't sweating off lbs to make weight, he came in under, and he was like 25 years old at the time.
In April 1988, Holyfield scaled 190 lbs against Carlos DeLeon for his final Cruiserweight fight.
In Dec 1988, Holyfield scaled 212 lbs ripped against Pinklon Thomas.
Mr.Olympia legend Lee Haney was in charge of bulking up Holyfield back then.
Holyfield was a Great fighter, but how much did the steroids contribute? Steroids won't make a good fighter into a Great fighter, but I wonder how much did it contribute, and could he have done it at Heavyweight without the juice?
Roids can definitely be the difference between a good fighter and a great fighter. You take any fighter and give them extra strength, speed and stamina and they will go up a level at least. Especially if they are a smart fighter.
Holyfield would have been great anyway but it could have been the difference in some fights as much as I hate to say it. IF he used roids I would loose much respect for him and that hurts me bad cause I LOVE Hoyfield.
I say "if he used roids" and I hope im not just in denial.
It really makes you think tho, how many ATG's have used roids?
Tommy Morrison was a good fighter, certainly Top 5 out of about a thousand licensed Heavyweight boxers. He didn't have that little extra bit of talent that makes a man Top 3 instead of top 5, and Morrison was on steroids.
Plenty of guys in MMA have tested positive, and they were not the outstanding fighters.
EDIT:
"If he used roids",Of course he used them!
From about 1988 till now, for 25 years, he's used them!
Yet Holyfeild has never been tested positive for a fight so if he has for 25 years and has not been caught then i am sure ever pro who does not do blood testing is on them. I mean if your career on the line and you can get better why not i honestly think they should be legal because everyone is using anyway. I mean with no retirement plan might as well take what you can get because fans only like you when you win and forget you when you lose. So if your a fighter i can see it being pretty easy chose to make to be honest with you.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Bookmarks