Who is the next boxing superstar?

[ross]

He didn't fight Holyield until 10 years after he won his first title!

....and Evander Holyfield is still 2 years older than Tyson so your point?

Mike tyson was the heavyweight division from 86 to 90. No one has ever held all the titles together for as long since.

[El Kabong]

He didn't fight Holyield until 10 years after he won his first title!

....and Evander Holyfield is still 2 years older than Tyson so your point?

Mike tyson was the heavyweight division from 86 to 90. No one has ever held all the titles together for as long since.

Keep preaching your love of Tyson man, it doesn't change the reality of the situation which is A) He was in the right place at the right time and STILL couldn't hang on to success and B ) Lewis and Holyfield beat the fuck out of him...but if you'd rather compare him to OLD Holmes and Frank Bruno be my guest. I thought I was being kind to him by grouping him in with good company, but I guess you're right he wasn't even competitive vs Evander and Lennox so no reason to list him in there.

[ross]

He didn't fight Holyield until 10 years after he won his first title!

....and Evander Holyfield is still 2 years older than Tyson so your point?

Mike tyson was the heavyweight division from 86 to 90. No one has ever held all the titles together for as long since.

Keep preaching your love of Tyson man, it doesn't change the reality of the situation which is A) He was in the right place at the right time and STILL couldn't hang on to success and B ) Lewis and Holyfield beat the fuck out of him...but if you'd rather compare him to OLD Holmes and Frank Bruno be my guest. I thought I was being kind to him by grouping him in with good company, but I guess you're right he wasn't even competitive vs Evander and Lennox so no reason to list him in there.

It was Lewis and Holyfield who never owned the division. No one has since Tyson.

[mikeeod]

He didn't fight Holyield until 10 years after he won his first title!

....and Evander Holyfield is still 2 years older than Tyson so your point?

Mike tyson was the heavyweight division from 86 to 90. No one has ever held all the titles together for as long since.

Keep preaching your love of Tyson man, it doesn't change the reality of the situation which is A) He was in the right place at the right time and STILL couldn't hang on to success and B ) Lewis and Holyfield beat the fuck out of him...but if you'd rather compare him to OLD Holmes and Frank Bruno be my guest. I thought I was being kind to him by grouping him in with good company, but I guess you're right he wasn't even competitive vs Evander and Lennox so no reason to list him in there.

It was Lewis and Holyfield who never owned the division. No one has since Tyson.

How do you figure that Evander and Lennox never owned the division? Especially Lennox, that guy cleaned out the division when it was in much better shape than when Tyson was champ.

[ross]

He didn't fight Holyield until 10 years after he won his first title!

....and Evander Holyfield is still 2 years older than Tyson so your point?

Mike tyson was the heavyweight division from 86 to 90. No one has ever held all the titles together for as long since.

Keep preaching your love of Tyson man, it doesn't change the reality of the situation which is A) He was in the right place at the right time and STILL couldn't hang on to success and B ) Lewis and Holyfield beat the fuck out of him...but if you'd rather compare him to OLD Holmes and Frank Bruno be my guest. I thought I was being kind to him by grouping him in with good company, but I guess you're right he wasn't even competitive vs Evander and Lennox so no reason to list him in there.

It was Lewis and Holyfield who never owned the division. No one has since Tyson.

How do you figure that Evander and Lennox never owned the division? Especially Lennox, that guy cleaned out the division when it was in much better shape than when Tyson was champ.

When did either dominate the division as long as Tyson did?

Neither were good enough to be head and shoulders above the rest of the division.

Just because Mayweather is so much better than everyone else does not make it a weak era, just like Tyson was so gifted for a few years he was almost untouchable and had the media ranking him alongside Ali at the time. Neither Holyfield or Lewis have been thought of as highly during their short reigns.

Tyson wouldn't have lost to Moorer, Rahman or McCall. Your judging him on the bersion that was out of boxing for 4 years.

[smashup]

ANTHONY JOSHUA easy question to answer really.

[ykdadamaja]

ANTHONY JOSHUA easy question to answer really.

He doesn't excite me. He seems like a more effective clubber that's Frank Bruno-esque, or like a younger and more mobile Oliver McCall. Nothing sexy about him and his fight style, at all.

What he can do is WIN. And win he can.

Make no mistake, Wlad when he was younger, was helluva exciting. It was only when Wlad got old and started to be cautious with his chin is when he got boring as hell.

Deontay Wilder is EXCITING. A little provocative too. He sparks interest. Intrigue. Something more we have to see from Wilder- especially from the way he wins. He makes you feel that he can get into a few exciting scraps at HW.

Joshua doesn't give you that. Not at all.

[ross]

He didn't fight Holyield until 10 years after he won his first title!

....and Evander Holyfield is still 2 years older than Tyson so your point?

Mike tyson was the heavyweight division from 86 to 90. No one has ever held all the titles together for as long since.

Keep preaching your love of Tyson man, it doesn't change the reality of the situation which is A) He was in the right place at the right time and STILL couldn't hang on to success and B ) Lewis and Holyfield beat the fuck out of him...but if you'd rather compare him to OLD Holmes and Frank Bruno be my guest. I thought I was being kind to him by grouping him in with good company, but I guess you're right he wasn't even competitive vs Evander and Lennox so no reason to list him in there.

This gets said a lot. As if Tysons era of the late eighties was shit.

Tyson wiped the floor with Holmes. Holmes went on 4 years later to push Holyfield to a competitive 12 rounds.....

Holmes also beat Mercer clearly. The same Mercer who was robbed against Lewis.....

Basically, Tyson's left overs were too good for 90s fighters.

[mikeeod]

He didn't fight Holyield until 10 years after he won his first title!

....and Evander Holyfield is still 2 years older than Tyson so your point?

Mike tyson was the heavyweight division from 86 to 90. No one has ever held all the titles together for as long since.

Keep preaching your love of Tyson man, it doesn't change the reality of the situation which is A) He was in the right place at the right time and STILL couldn't hang on to success and B ) Lewis and Holyfield beat the fuck out of him...but if you'd rather compare him to OLD Holmes and Frank Bruno be my guest. I thought I was being kind to him by grouping him in with good company, but I guess you're right he wasn't even competitive vs Evander and Lennox so no reason to list him in there.

This gets said a lot. As if Tysons era of the late eighties was shit.

Tyson wiped the floor with Holmes. Holmes went on 4 years later to push Holyfield to a competitive 12 rounds.....

Holmes also beat Mercer clearly. The same Mercer who was robbed against Lewis.....

Basically, Tyson's left overs were too good for 90s fighters.

Tyson's era was shit. There just wasn't the depth with fat guys like Tubbs, Page, Witherspoon, limited guys like Smith, Tucker and Ruddock or has beens like Holmes and Spinks (who was also tiny). Say whatever you want to rationalize your admiration of Tyson, but the guy has only one win over a HOF heavyweight and that was a washed up Holmes. Spinks will be a HOFer, but not for what he did at heavy, just in case someone wanted to try and sharpshoot.
The 90's had Foreman, Evander, Lewis, Bowe, Tyson, the Klitschko brothers, Moorer, Byrd, Ibeabuchi...etc. No competition between the retreads Tyson feasted on and the depth and caliber during the 90's.

[tysonesque]

He didn't fight Holyield until 10 years after he won his first title!

....and Evander Holyfield is still 2 years older than Tyson so your point?

Mike tyson was the heavyweight division from 86 to 90. No one has ever held all the titles together for as long since.

Keep preaching your love of Tyson man, it doesn't change the reality of the situation which is A) He was in the right place at the right time and STILL couldn't hang on to success and B ) Lewis and Holyfield beat the fuck out of him...but if you'd rather compare him to OLD Holmes and Frank Bruno be my guest. I thought I was being kind to him by grouping him in with good company, but I guess you're right he wasn't even competitive vs Evander and Lennox so no reason to list him in there.

Holyfield's victory over Tyson is a semi-valid one, but Lewis beat the fat, washed up shell of what used to be Mike Tyson. Tyson went on to lose two of his next three fights to Williams and McBride for fook sake. That's the Tyson Lewis beat - the shot Mike Tyson. I can't believe people think Lewis' victory over him is a credible one.

The young, dedicated and focused 80s Tyson is a completely different proposition.

[El Kabong]

The young, dedicated and focused 80s Tyson is a completely different proposition.

You mean the Tyson that was fighting such dangerous foes as Mike Jameson, David Jaco, Sammy Scaff, Marvis Frazier, and Steve Zouski?

[tysonesque]

The young, dedicated and focused 80s Tyson is a completely different proposition.

You mean the Tyson that was fighting such dangerous foes as Mike Jameson, David Jaco, Sammy Scaff, Marvis Frazier, and Steve Zouski?

Oh dear.

Hell, let's throw Tyson's amateur opponents in there as well shall we? How far back in time are going? What about before he started boxing? He hadn't beaten anyone then!

I was (obviously) thinking of the Tyson who beat everyone he fought, including Holmes, Spinks, Biggs etc etc. But no, let's judge him on the guys he fought as an up and coming novice. That always how fighters are judged.

I mean that Ali guy was good, but who did he beat in his first ten fights? Overrated fraud!

[mikeeod]

The young, dedicated and focused 80s Tyson is a completely different proposition.

You mean the Tyson that was fighting such dangerous foes as Mike Jameson, David Jaco, Sammy Scaff, Marvis Frazier, and Steve Zouski?

Oh dear.

Hell, let's throw Tyson's amateur opponents in there as well shall we? How far back in time are going? What about before he started boxing? He hadn't beaten anyone then!

I was (obviously) thinking of the Tyson who beat everyone he fought, including Holmes, Spinks, Biggs etc etc. But no, let's judge him on the guys he fought as an up and coming novice. That always how fighters are judged.

I mean that Ali guy was good, but who did he beat in his first ten fights? Overrated fraud!

Can you expound on the "etc., etc.," I challenge you or anyone else on this forum to name elite, HOF level fighters that Tyson beat. Look at the three you named: Holmes was past his best and fighting without a tune up, Spinks who was a great light heavy but undersized at heavy n had beaten 3 other guys at the weight, and BIGGS. Tyrell Biggs?!? Here's a clue: when you are standing up for a guy's quality of opposition and you have to include Tyrell Biggs as one of his top 3 wins, don't send that post. I like Mike Tyson and I think he gets treated unfairly regarding his personal life, but zit is just a known fact that Mike feasted on a pathetic division. He never beat a prime fighter on the level of Evander, Bowe, Lewis, Wlad...etc.

[Master]

The young, dedicated and focused 80s Tyson is a completely different proposition.

You mean the Tyson that was fighting such dangerous foes as Mike Jameson, David Jaco, Sammy Scaff, Marvis Frazier, and Steve Zouski?

Oh dear.

Hell, let's throw Tyson's amateur opponents in there as well shall we? How far back in time are going? What about before he started boxing? He hadn't beaten anyone then!

I was (obviously) thinking of the Tyson who beat everyone he fought, including Holmes, Spinks, Biggs etc etc. But no, let's judge him on the guys he fought as an up and coming novice. That always how fighters are judged.

I mean that Ali guy was good, but who did he beat in his first ten fights? Overrated fraud!

Can you expound on the "etc., etc.," I challenge you or anyone else on this forum to name elite, HOF level fighters that Tyson beat. Look at the three you named: Holmes was past his best and fighting without a tune up, Spinks who was a great light heavy but undersized at heavy n had beaten 3 other guys at the weight, and BIGGS. Tyrell Biggs?!? Here's a clue: when you are standing up for a guy's quality of opposition and you have to include Tyrell Biggs as one of his top 3 wins, don't send that post. I like Mike Tyson and I think he gets treated unfairly regarding his personal life, but zit is just a known fact that Mike feasted on a pathetic division. He never beat a prime fighter on the level of Evander, Bowe, Lewis, Wlad...etc.

I know you say you are a Tyson fan and yet again I say to you he can only beat what is in front of him. What he did was smash these fighters and the way he beat them indicates that even a prime Holyfield (whenever that was), Wlad, Vlad, Lewis ect would at least been beaten. It was the way he did it, people can count on one hand the times he was hit hard. He was a superstar for a reason.

[ross]

The young, dedicated and focused 80s Tyson is a completely different proposition.

You mean the Tyson that was fighting such dangerous foes as Mike Jameson, David Jaco, Sammy Scaff, Marvis Frazier, and Steve Zouski?

Oh dear.

Hell, let's throw Tyson's amateur opponents in there as well shall we? How far back in time are going? What about before he started boxing? He hadn't beaten anyone then!

I was (obviously) thinking of the Tyson who beat everyone he fought, including Holmes, Spinks, Biggs etc etc. But no, let's judge him on the guys he fought as an up and coming novice. That always how fighters are judged.

I mean that Ali guy was good, but who did he beat in his first ten fights? Overrated fraud!

Can you expound on the "etc., etc.," I challenge you or anyone else on this forum to name elite, HOF level fighters that Tyson beat. Look at the three you named: Holmes was past his best and fighting without a tune up, Spinks who was a great light heavy but undersized at heavy n had beaten 3 other guys at the weight, and BIGGS. Tyrell Biggs?!? Here's a clue: when you are standing up for a guy's quality of opposition and you have to include Tyrell Biggs as one of his top 3 wins, don't send that post. I like Mike Tyson and I think he gets treated unfairly regarding his personal life, but zit is just a known fact that Mike feasted on a pathetic division. He never beat a prime fighter on the level of Evander, Bowe, Lewis, Wlad...etc.

You could easily pick holes over who they beat.

Which elite HOF fighters did Lewis beat? He drew with Holyfield and then got gifted a decision in the rematch. Struggled with Mercer and was very lucky to get the decision. Holmes won clearly against mercer. The same Holmes that Tyson smashed 4 years earlier. He got knocked out by mikes sparring partner the same sparring partner that again, Holmes should have got a decision over. he got knocked out by Rahman

Holyfield... Bowe? Who did Bowe beat? He got pushed to 12 rounds by a fighter that Mike bounced off the canvas

Bowe... Holyfield and no one else. He got battered by golota who Tyson made quit! He got taken rounds and hurt by Herbie Hide He was gifted a decision against Tubbs another old Tyson opponent who Mike wiped the floor with.

Now tell me the best wins each of those has and how its any better than anything Mike could have done.

Wlads best win? He's up there for longevity but he has no HOF stand out wins either. That shouldnt detract from his career because there was no one else good enough to beat him. (Has plenty of KO losses during his "prime" though.) Same as Mike in the eighties. He was too good. He didn't get dropped, or wobbled or draw, or gifted decisions. There was no dispute over who the best was and he avoided no one in the top ten.