Andre ward vs GGG

[Beanflicker]

I agree with Beanz in that there is absolutely no motivation for him to move up and fight Ward until Ward comes and back reestablishes himself as the man at 168, because right now his career is still on hiatus and he's been stripped of his belts and ranking. And before he moves up, I'd like to see him clean out his division first, which includes unifying the titles (IMO Cotto will vacate the belt and go back to 154 as opposed to fighting GGG, so he'll probably have to do it against someone else). I'd still love to see him in there with Kid Chocolate and the winner of Lemieux/N'Dam.

I think he'd be better off trying to lure Froch into a fight personally.

[mikeeod]

Ward is a horrible style match up for GGG. I see Ward as the only guy under 175 who can beat GGG right now. I agree that GGG is not a large middleweight and would be best served to remain at 160 and below for the foreseeable future.

[Ron Swanson]

I agree with Beanz in that there is absolutely no motivation for him to move up and fight Ward until Ward comes and back reestablishes himself as the man at 168, because right now his career is still on hiatus and he's been stripped of his belts and ranking. And before he moves up, I'd like to see him clean out his division first, which includes unifying the titles (IMO Cotto will vacate the belt and go back to 154 as opposed to fighting GGG, so he'll probably have to do it against someone else). I'd still love to see him in there with Kid Chocolate and the winner of Lemieux/N'Dam.

I think he'd be better off trying to lure Froch into a fight personally.

You see what you're placing value on is belts? You have to see this don't you? Opponents matter, not belts.

Let me give you an example
Looking not at randomP4P lists but only year end Ring magazine P4P lists Floyd is scheduled to fight his 11th different opponent that was ranked in the top 10 at one point P4P.

GGG is only 5 years younger. He has not fought one man deserving of top 10 consideration. And you are not talking about him fighting a man deserving of top 10 consideration.

Floyd is scheduled to fight his 14th or 15th reigning champion. GGG has fought 0. I believe in this era when everyone has a championship only 2 of his opponents have ever even held a championship. Ouma who was washed up and 5 years removed from when he carried a belt in a lower class and Gaele who held a belt for about 5 minutes. I could be wrong about this there are so many trinket holders but the point remains.

The argument can be made "well Andre doesn't have a belt either". That is well and good but Andre has proven he can fight. Lee has not, Quillen has not, Cotto is not a middleweight. You're talking about him picking up another belt from another non champion.

Just answer this. What helps GGGs historical standing more, 5 more fights against unproven fighters or one fight against Ward?

[Primo Carnera]

I agree with Beanz in that there is absolutely no motivation for him to move up and fight Ward until Ward comes and back reestablishes himself as the man at 168, because right now his career is still on hiatus and he's been stripped of his belts and ranking. And before he moves up, I'd like to see him clean out his division first, which includes unifying the titles (IMO Cotto will vacate the belt and go back to 154 as opposed to fighting GGG, so he'll probably have to do it against someone else). I'd still love to see him in there with Kid Chocolate and the winner of Lemieux/N'Dam.

I think he'd be better off trying to lure Froch into a fight personally.

You see what you're placing value on is belts? You have to see this don't you? Opponents matter, not belts.

Let me give you an example
Looking not at randomP4P lists but only year end Ring magazine P4P lists Floyd is scheduled to fight his 11th different opponent that was ranked in the top 10 at one point P4P.

GGG is only 5 years younger. He has not fought one man deserving of top 10 consideration. And you are not talking about him fighting a man deserving of top 10 consideration.

Floyd is scheduled to fight his 14th or 15th reigning champion. GGG has fought 0. I believe in this era when everyone has a championship only 2 of his opponents have ever even held a championship. Ouma who was washed up and 5 years removed from when he carried a belt in a lower class and Gaele who held a belt for about 5 minutes. I could be wrong about this there are so many trinket holders but the point remains.

The argument can be made "well Andre doesn't have a belt either". That is well and good but Andre has proven he can fight. Lee has not, Quillen has not, Cotto is not a middleweight. You're talking about him picking up another belt from another non champion.

Just answer this. What helps GGGs historical standing more, 5 more fights against unproven fighters or one fight against Ward?

Ok. So say he fights Ward and beats Ward. what will people say? They'll say "Ward isn't the fighter he was" or "Ward was ring rusty". It's a lose-lose. Ward needs to re-establish himself.(btw what happened to this "Ward fighting March-April time and 3 more times this year bollocks!)
No opponent has been named , probably because he's finding it difficult to get a credible opponent who is not too dangerous. Forget about Ward-GGG for now. Ward has his own shit to sort out!
Ps. A bit harsh calling the likes of Geale and Murray unproven. If the other top MW's keep ducking him, what's he to do?

[Beanflicker]

Just answer this. What helps GGGs historical standing more, 5 more fights against unproven fighters or one fight against Ward?

You don't have to sell me on how useless belts are: I know. I often forget who holds what belt because it usually doesn't matter.

To be fair, the WBC MW Belt IS the linear championship and collecting all the belts is essentially cleaning out your division, even though everyone regards GGG as the #1 MW by a large stretch.

Yeah, a victory over Ward would be great for his legacy, but I don't see how I was wrong by asserting that Ward needs to come back and reassert himself before GGG would go up to fight him. Right now, Ward is unranked and has lost the position he fought so hard for (which now has seemingly fell back to Froch). If GGG fights Ward tomorrow and beats his ass, people will say "ohh I think Ward is washed up, the inactivity killed him, ect."

Conversely, if he lets Ward come back and reassert himself as the top 168lber and one of the p4p best in the world and THEN you go up and beat him, it improves your legacy ten-fold.

[Beanflicker]

There seem to be a lot of people who are accusing GGG of fighting soft opposition, but what can you do when guys won't get in the ring with you? You can't wait outside their house and fight them on the street, they actually need to agree to fight you.

[Beanz]

He should fight Abraham up at 168 and then Bundrage down at 154 whilst waiting for Cotto to retire and then come back to middleweight. He could knock both of those two out and make a big spalsh amongst boxing historians but it will not give him exposure and cash. He can't win can he?