Ray Robinson vs Floyd Maweather @ 147 or 154

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

For anybody talking about the weight, they probably walk around the same since there were same day weigh ins before. So the weight difference would be minimal

A lot of good points in this thread but I disagree with this.

If your talking about how things are against how things were, it's like apples and oranges. If Floyd fought in that era he'd likely be a slightly smaller guy not able to cut as much weight. If Ray was in this era, he'd likely be a naturally bigger guy able to cut more weight so either way Ray would be the naturally bigger guy.

[Beanflicker]

For anybody talking about the weight, they probably walk around the same since there were same day weigh ins before. So the weight difference would be minimal

A lot of good points in this thread but I disagree with this.

If your talking about how things are against how things were, it's like apples and oranges. If Floyd fought in that era he'd likely be a slightly smaller guy not able to cut as much weight. If Ray was in this era, he'd likely be a naturally bigger guy able to cut more weight so either way Ray would be the naturally bigger guy.

Yes without question Ray would be the bigger man in there.

Obviously in Sugar Ray you're talking about a guy who ended up at 160 and even fought at 175.

Floyd really isn't a a true WW because he doesn't really cut weight. In a lot of his WW fights he's weighed in at 147 and came to the ring at 147-150, while his opponent weighed in excess of 160 for the fight.

It's a fight that could go either way and it would be foolish to think that it would be an easy fight for either guy. I believe Floyd is the superior talent but in boxing it's not always the superior talent that wins the fight (case in point Lamotta beating SRR, or JCC and Maidana giving Floyd close fights).

[johnsebastianmiran]

When I was about eight years old in New Bedford Massachusetts there was always these Sunday outings where our parental units would stick us somewhere or with someone that knew how to entertain kids. Several of us watched boxing off these projector my friend's grandfather had. A few times the subject was Ray Robinson. I know it was a long time ago and suddenly everyone wanted to play baseball instead of watching fights period. It was a long time ago and you could make the case Ray was talented but Ray was tough as nails and Floyd is talented but Robinson was both hard and athletic. Robinson was much more experienced and most of his skills were picked up in action. There was an interview with an old Opponent of Ray's named Carmen Basilio who relieved Ray of his title and was forced to lose it in the rematch. In the Ring Magazine interview during the seventies he explained he had no like for Robinson and went on to say he didn't think Ray was talented the way everyone thought but he did say that Ray of all the boxers he ever knew, knew how and when to punch with an emphasis on how. Basilio was also well remembered by guys who passed up taking a piss after a bout with him. By the way I saw Floyd on television"s dancing with the stars and remembered Ray used to dance in clubs and television too and was paid for it. He wasn't memorable in that department but he was also hands on in everything in his lifetime.

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

@johnsebastianmiran I wanted to mention Ray being a better dancer but it would have came across as silly. You did it justice.

[imp]

Robinson would get exposed again as he has lost in the past.

We still dont know how to beat floyd.

[Master]

Robinson would get exposed again as he has lost in the past.

We still dont know how to beat floyd.

Robinson could have retired with a 0 very easily if he had to.

[powerpuncher]

I don't understand what is so hard to understand that Robinson wasn't a welter like it is today. He didn't rehydrate to 160. The time he lost to LaMotta, he weighed 144 while LaMotta weighed 160. He weighed in the same day. Floyd now, probably walked around at the same weight as a prime Robinson.

I could be wrong but somebody prove that Robinson walked around at 160 or so in between fights. He even said that he could have made 135 which shows that he wasn't that big.

[Master]

[Mr140]

When it comes to Floyd there are these fighters who i would pick over him 80 percent of the time and that is Leonard, Hearns, and Robinson. Leonard has faced a defensive fighter who was not as good as Floyd but he is close in Benitez and did very well even knocking him out. As for Floyd he has not been with a fighter that fights like Leonard or is close to him in skill also size is a huge factor. Hearns is a huge problem for Floyed i mean no one ever out boxed Hearns he had a huge reach and height advantage on Floyd not to mention the power to end him. Hearns shin is not granite but Floyd is not on the level of power of a Leonard, Hagler, of the blade really those guys power was another level and they were bigger dudes as well. Seen some of Robinson welter fights and his speed i feel is close to Mayweathers at welterweight but a lot of Robinson's prime is unrecorded but he was a lot bigger and his reach is up there as well plus he had the power to put people in a shell he could knock people out with weirdest punches as well. Anyhow these guys are true welterweight though so it really not that fair we should be talking about guys that were in 130-140 range would be more fair and make more sense. I mean we have all these great fighters we can make match ups with that weight class makes a lot more sense then this one i would think weight is a big issue and good guy with a size advantage can go a really long way man.

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

I think for me, the long and the short of it is that :

A) Floyd appears to have the more impressive list of opponents, although I seriously have to question if some most of those 'names' will stand the test of time (Hatton was a 'monster' less than 10 years ago).

B) Has generally had a more successful career. Although with more control, more weight classes, more belts, more bureaucracy, there is more room for a 'career'.

C) Neither fighter has faced anything like what the other guy offered.

D) I still think Ray was naturally a lot bigger than Floyd. Although is clearly slower than Floyd and not THAT powerful but crucially punched with a mean intent AND in combination! He was tough as nails, had a longer reach and an equal jab to Floyd and so think that he was well equipped to dismantle Floyd.

E) I think there have been MANY fighters over the years who have looked better than what Ray did back then. That's just the process of time tested teaching.

F) I don't belive Floyd's isn't currently a natural Welterweight. He is a consummate professional yet couldn't make 144 against Marquez. He has obviously grown over the years so was probably once a natural light welterweight. He was starving himself to make 130.

[Fenster]

Robinson had 130 wins before his 2nd loss. 1st loss he was outweighed by 15lbs to HOFer who he beat 5x in 6 fights.

[Beanflicker]

F) I don't belive Floyd's isn't currently a natural Welterweight. He is a consummate professional yet couldn't make 144 against Marquez. He has obviously grown over the years so was probably once a natural light welterweight. He was starving himself to make 130.

Look at his weights on fight night compared to his opponent's at WW.

Mayweather: 150
Ortiz: 164

Mayweather: 149
Baldomir: 162

Mayweather: 146 (same as official weigh-in weight)
Judah: 150

Mayweather: 148
Mitchell: 155

That's not a true WW. He really doesn't cut much weight. Most guys are going up 10-15lbs over their weight class the next day.

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

Doesn't or can't?

The facts point to both.