Floyd's resume.

[mikeeod]

Ray Robinson: Beat in their prime Kid Gavilán (ATG/HOF), Lamotta (ATG/HOF), Basilio (ATG/HOF), Graziano, Fullmer (ATG/HOF), Fritzie Zivic, Paul Pender and a past his prime Henry Armstrong (ATG/HOF). Look at all of those PRIME ATG/HOFers on his resume.

Hearns: Get your point on age, but the guy had DESTROYED cuevas and every other fighter who got in the ring with him. Look at Tommy's performance in that fight and compare it to the non effort of Canelo in his vs Floyd. Tommy showed multi-dimensions and Canelo didn't show one. That is EXACTLY why I don't consider the Canelo fight a great win for Floyd.

I'd love for someone to explain to me how Graziano, Basilio, Fullmer, Pender, or even Lamotta were more skilled in the ring than guys like Hatton, Corrales, Castillo, De La Hoya, Mosley, ect. I want to hear specifically what they did in the ring that those guys couldn't.

Being in the HOF is a great honor, but it doesn't necessarily denote a specific high standard of skill. To insinuate that one fighter is a tougher opponent than another simply because he is in the HOF is a complete fallacy.

I want someone to explain to me how Gene Fullmer was a better fighter than Ricky Hatton.

I want someone to explain to me why a 34 year old Hank Armstrong is better than a 35 year old Manny Pacquiao.

When I bring this stuff up, everyone suddenly gets quiet. I'm not saying I'm this boxing genius who has all the right answers, but I've watched all these guys and formed my own opinions - right or wrong. If you want to just regurgitate the opinions of others or tell me stats of who is in the HOF, just save your time. If you want to have an actual discussion about it, let's go.

1. Gavilán/Corrales: Chico was a big puncher and solid fighter, but showed his limitations vs Castillo and Casameyor, neither of whom were great fighters. Kid Gavilán was the recognized top Welter and is an ATG/HOF (there are specific criteria for the HOF, do it is a good measuring stick for how good a boxer was/is). Gavilán was a master boxer who won multiple big fights and Chico wasn't as versatile in my opinion.

2. Basilio/Castillo: Basilio was one of the roughest, toughest fighters in history, just watch some of his footage and check his record out. Castillo turned into a solid lightweight champ, but didn't have the names on his resume that Basilio did. Basilio was a two division champ (when there was only one champ per weight and only 8 weight classes) and Castillo wasn't.

3. Hatton/Fullmer: once again, Fullmer was the larger man vs a past his prime Ray, Floyd was the larger man vs a Hatton who never performed well at 147. Other than Kostya, which was a rough/foul fest, Ricky never really beat a prime fighter of note. Once again, go look at Fullmers record and see the names he fought and beat.

Those are a few points, I could go on but I don't think you really are open to another point of view.

[mikeeod]

One more point I think is often ignored or downplayed by Floyd fans: pushing the limits for greatness. How many times has Floyd entered the ring with questions on his safety/ability to win (serious questions)? How many times wasn't Floyd the favorite to win?

Robinson vs Maxim
Armstrong vs Garcia
Ali vs Foreman, Liston
Holy vs Tyson
Hop vs Tito, Tarver, Pavilik...etc.
Pea vs JCC
Pac vs Oscar, Cotto, MAB, Morales
Shane vs Oscar
Oscar vs Tito, Hop
Leonard vs Hearns, Duran, Hagler

Floyd never pushed the limits when a guy was viewed as prime and at his best. Winks Wright. GGG. Margarito. Cotto. Mosely. Pac Man. Paul Williams. Now, not all of those fights were Floyd's fault, but the fact is he never fought those guys at their zenith/best. I think he beats most of them, and I don't necessarily blame him for not fighting the much larger Wright/GGG, but it illustrates a gap in his resume. Pea took on the much larger Julio Ceasar Vasquez at 154 because he craved a challenge. Robinson dared to be great, was winning vs Maxim but became exhausted. Even if Hagler had slipped, people were worried for Leonards life going into that fight. Foreman was a killer and Ali was past his best and a certain early K.O. Victim. You get the idea....