Hearns vs Trinidad

[mikeeod]

I think about this match up quite a bit, and have been all over the place on how I see it unfold. Both were large, dominant welters with impressive offensive arsenals in their respective primes. That being said, both had enough flaws that they were not unbeatable, especially when fighting fellow elite fighters.

Hearns was significantly taller than Tito, which was a factor that Tito rarely had to deal with. Tommy also was much faster and mobile in his prime (hand and feet), and was able to outbox master boxers like Ray Leonard and Wilfredo Benitez. The one punch power advantage belonged to Tommy thanks to his right hand (he had a great left hook as well), but his chinks in the armor were his chin and stamina.

Tito was a monster at 147, and during his best years was actually a solid boxer who had legitimate one punch power (people forget how solid Tito was before he fell in love with his punch). I would argue that Tito's left hook was only slightly less effective/menacing than Hearns's right hand, and I feel that Tito was a much more devastating body puncher than Tommy ever was. Tito had phenomenal stamina during his prime, and was the definition of relentless pressure, grinding down top notch competition, many times rising from a knockdown to do so. Tito was a notoriously slow starter, was thoroughly out boxed by Oscar, Hop, and Winky, and became a one dimensional pressure fighter who moved in straight lines forward and backward (little to no lateral movement).

Tommy came out of the gate looking to blow the other fighter out, where Tito took a few rounds to find his groove, so I can see and agree with everyone's point/prediction that Tito would visit the canvas early. That being said, Tito always got up from the knock downs scarier/more determined, and often broke his opponents mentally through hard punching and sustained pressure. Tommy definitely had the versatility, speed, and boxing skills to change tactics and box circles around Tito, developing a lead on the scorecards and winning a decision.

My question/dilemma now, is whether Tommy could sustain that pace and not wilt from Tito's pressure, body work, and punch. Some days I think Tito doesn't touch him, but often remember that welter Tito could counter effectively, and was a devastating body puncher. So, while I see Tommy standing a better chance to win, it isn't by that much and feel that Tito had the power to land one left hook to the body or head and change the outcome of the fight. Would've loved to see these two warriors share a ring.

[Master]

I think we can all agree that above welterweight Hearns is more likely the winner of the fights.

Welterweight 51% Hearns wins
Light Middle 60%
Middleweight 70%
Supermiddle 80%

(What is it with me and % today? )

[TitoFan]

I think about this match up quite a bit, and have been all over the place on how I see it unfold. Both were large, dominant welters with impressive offensive arsenals in their respective primes. That being said, both had enough flaws that they were not unbeatable, especially when fighting fellow elite fighters.

Hearns was significantly taller than Tito, which was a factor that Tito rarely had to deal with. Tommy also was much faster and mobile in his prime (hand and feet), and was able to outbox master boxers like Ray Leonard and Wilfredo Benitez. The one punch power advantage belonged to Tommy thanks to his right hand (he had a great left hook as well), but his chinks in the armor were his chin and stamina.

Tito was a monster at 147, and during his best years was actually a solid boxer who had legitimate one punch power (people forget how solid Tito was before he fell in love with his punch). I would argue that Tito's left hook was only slightly less effective/menacing than Hearns's right hand, and I feel that Tito was a much more devastating body puncher than Tommy ever was. Tito had phenomenal stamina during his prime, and was the definition of relentless pressure, grinding down top notch competition, many times rising from a knockdown to do so. Tito was a notoriously slow starter, was thoroughly out boxed by Oscar, Hop, and Winky, and became a one dimensional pressure fighter who moved in straight lines forward and backward (little to no lateral movement).

Tommy came out of the gate looking to blow the other fighter out, where Tito took a few rounds to find his groove, so I can see and agree with everyone's point/prediction that Tito would visit the canvas early. That being said, Tito always got up from the knock downs scarier/more determined, and often broke his opponents mentally through hard punching and sustained pressure. Tommy definitely had the versatility, speed, and boxing skills to change tactics and box circles around Tito, developing a lead on the scorecards and winning a decision.

My question/dilemma now, is whether Tommy could sustain that pace and not wilt from Tito's pressure, body work, and punch. Some days I think Tito doesn't touch him, but often remember that welter Tito could counter effectively, and was a devastating body puncher. So, while I see Tommy standing a better chance to win, it isn't by that much and feel that Tito had the power to land one left hook to the body or head and change the outcome of the fight. Would've loved to see these two warriors share a ring.

Great post with a lot of good points.

[TitoFan]

Hearns was much too tall for 147, whereas Trinidad was at his best between 147 and 154. Hearns feasted on much shorter guys, like Pipino Cuevas, for instance. But he was rail-thin and could be hurt to the body. Yes, people tend to forget about Trinidad's peak and some of the world-class opposition he destroyed.

I'm gonna follow Master's lead and use percentages.

Welterweight: Trinidad - 60%
Jr. Middleweight: 50/50
Middleweight: Hearns - 75%

[Mr140]

Hearns is going to make Tito look like a fool much like Oscar, Hopkins and Wright did. Tito could be out boxed his movement was not elite and could not adjust his game plan. As for Hearns chin he was stopped by Hagler and Blade who were huge hitters it took Leonard for ever to stop him.

[Master]

Hearns is going to make Tito look like a fool much like Oscar, Hopkins and Wright did. Tito could be out boxed his movement was not elite and could not adjust his game plan. As for Hearns chin he was stopped by Hagler and Blade who were huge hitters it took Leonard for ever to stop him.

Hearns was hurt many times in his career notably Roldan and Kitchen but fought back and won.

[Violent Demise]

Hearns beats Trinidad. Why? He was the better fighter

[TitoFan]

Hearns is going to make Tito look like a fool much like Oscar, Hopkins and Wright did. Tito could be out boxed his movement was not elite and could not adjust his game plan. As for Hearns chin he was stopped by Hagler and Blade who were huge hitters it took Leonard for ever to stop him.

At 147 Trinidad's body shots cave in Hearns. A left hook to the chin would just be the icing on the cake.
Leonard was not known for his power.

Now that you mention Oscar, however....
Oscar would be KO'ed inside 8 rounds by Hearns at 147.

[Mr140]

Hearns is going to make Tito look like a fool much like Oscar, Hopkins and Wright did. Tito could be out boxed his movement was not elite and could not adjust his game plan. As for Hearns chin he was stopped by Hagler and Blade who were huge hitters it took Leonard for ever to stop him.

At 147 Trinidad's body shots cave in Hearns. A left hook to the chin would just be the icing on the cake.
Leonard was not known for his power.

Now that you mention Oscar, however....
Oscar would be KO'ed inside 8 rounds by Hearns at 147.

Never said Oscar would win he just out boxed Tito and so would Hearns. Leonard had power at ww and he is miles ahead of tito when it comes to boxing his foot work makes tito look like a amateur. Took him for ever to find Hearns Tito getting a boxing lesson from hitman or put to sleep.

[Dark Lord Al]

Trinidad was also slow of foot , and his body shots ? Hearns was brutal to the body.
I just don't see Felix winning this one.

[TitoFan]

Hearns is going to make Tito look like a fool much like Oscar, Hopkins and Wright did. Tito could be out boxed his movement was not elite and could not adjust his game plan. As for Hearns chin he was stopped by Hagler and Blade who were huge hitters it took Leonard for ever to stop him.

At 147 Trinidad's body shots cave in Hearns. A left hook to the chin would just be the icing on the cake.
Leonard was not known for his power.

Now that you mention Oscar, however....
Oscar would be KO'ed inside 8 rounds by Hearns at 147.

Never said Oscar would win he just out boxed Tito and so would Hearns. Leonard had power at ww and he is miles ahead of tito when it comes to boxing his foot work makes tito look like a amateur. Took him for ever to find Hearns Tito getting a boxing lesson from hitman or put to sleep.

We'll never know will we. Consider that most of Hearns' victims at 147 were much shorter than him, and with a power deficit, although Pipino Cuevas was a fearsome puncher in his own right. Trinidad was a lot closer in height, something Hearns wasn't used to at 147. Hearns gave Leonard all sorts of problems, but it wasn't because he outboxed him. Few if any fighters could outbox Leonard. It was Hearns' power and reach that bothered Leonard. Hearns also used his jab very effectively. That being said, I don't see Hearns outboxing Trinidad by as much a margin as you say. Take that away and all that's left is Hearns' power vs. Trinidad's. Trinidad also had tremendous stamina and recuperative powers, something rarely mentioned here. No boxing lesson here. Trinidad takes out Hearns at 147 in the middle rounds at the latest.

[Sleepwalker]

Hearns is going to make Tito look like a fool much like Oscar, Hopkins and Wright did. Tito could be out boxed his movement was not elite and could not adjust his game plan. As for Hearns chin he was stopped by Hagler and Blade who were huge hitters it took Leonard for ever to stop him.

Leonard was not known for his power.
.

Oh yes he was. One of the hardest hitting Welters ever

[Mr140]

Hearns is going to make Tito look like a fool much like Oscar, Hopkins and Wright did. Tito could be out boxed his movement was not elite and could not adjust his game plan. As for Hearns chin he was stopped by Hagler and Blade who were huge hitters it took Leonard for ever to stop him.

Leonard was not known for his power.
.

Oh yes he was. One of the hardest hitting Welters ever

This right here makes me question how many fights he has seen of Leonard at ww. The guy had power but when he moved up he was more about boxing then going for the kill. Leonard could of maybe thrown harder punches against Hagler but it was pointless so Leonard did not.