The Brexit Thread

[walrus]

Damn with that load of horse jism he could take Nancy pelosi

[brocktonblockbust]

I'm going to watch his speech now.

[Master]

That was a good speech but still disagree but as long as they voted for article 50 then I am fine with them. The real negotiations start now.

[Beanz]

That was a good speech but still disagree but as long as they voted for article 50 then I am fine with them. The real negotiations start now.

That is how a democracy works. I have friends who voted for Brexit but the truth is that the very same remote abuse of power and machinations that people hated from the EU are still there with the Tories. They are not about to hand any control back to the British people they will use it as an excuse to divide further and have already given away much of that in bending over for America. Immigration the real issue may even go up but instead of Europeans with which we have traded, lived and bred with for thousands of years it will be those from further afeild with less in common. The weird thing is all the Yanks who are often descended from Europeans being so hostile towards Europe with all that it continues to give the world.

[Gandalf]

I am also still very much pro Brexit, but I'm discouraged by how it seems to be turning people more right wing. I think power is more easily changed with a smaller system and you obviously cannot let in everyone but people just don't seem to be very nice with this Trump/Brexit mentality. Instead of people turning towards a hopeful revolution with Corbyn it seems to be empowering dark forces who seem to relish selfishness, chaos and Thatcherism. I don't think I relate to it. It is not the purity that I was hoping for.

[Master]

That was a good speech but still disagree but as long as they voted for article 50 then I am fine with them. The real negotiations start now.

That is how a democracy works. I have friends who voted for Brexit but the truth is that the very same remote abuse of power and machinations that people hated from the EU are still there with the Tories. They are not about to hand any control back to the British people they will use it as an excuse to divide further and have already given away much of that in bending over for America. Immigration the real issue may even go up but instead of Europeans with which we have traded, lived and bred with for thousands of years it will be those from further afeild with less in common. The weird thing is all the Yanks who are often descended from Europeans being so hostile towards Europe with all that it continues to give the world.

We traded with Europe without the EU and we can get an amicable agreement with them within 2 years. Divorce is messy but can be done with all parties happy.

The rise in hate crime and right wing is not good and has brought out the worst in people.

[Beanz]

That was a good speech but still disagree but as long as they voted for article 50 then I am fine with them. The real negotiations start now.

That is how a democracy works. I have friends who voted for Brexit but the truth is that the very same remote abuse of power and machinations that people hated from the EU are still there with the Tories. They are not about to hand any control back to the British people they will use it as an excuse to divide further and have already given away much of that in bending over for America. Immigration the real issue may even go up but instead of Europeans with which we have traded, lived and bred with for thousands of years it will be those from further afeild with less in common. The weird thing is all the Yanks who are often descended from Europeans being so hostile towards Europe with all that it continues to give the world.

We traded with Europe without the EU and we can get an amicable agreement with them within 2 years. Divorce is messy but can be done with all parties happy.

The rise in hate crime and right wing is not good and has brought out the worst in people.

I hope so but like you say it will never be on the same good terms as we had and so financially we will suffer. This desire to be closer to America than France, Germany, Spain, The Netherlands, Italy , Sweden, etc is also a bit weird. These are where we have come from and what we have most in common, with not America which is still in it's infancy. Universities, Scientists etc are overwhelmingly for remaining and this is ignored as though nothing good ever came out of the EU. Whatever is wrong with the bureaucratic distance of the institution it has actually been crucial in fostering new understandings. It has helped so much to advance knowledge and cooperation. On a personal level for my family the impact is huge but all the pro Brexit people seem to be worried about is how it supposedly affects jobs, though tellingly, hardly ever their own jobs. So my half brothers and sisters Mother is German and has helped move the field she works in forward in this country, and of course their grandparents, uncles etc are in Germany.There are thousands of families like this in the UK whose travel arrangements, pensions etc will now be thrown into chaos. They also spent a long time growing up in Cyprus, and my younger half brother still carries out his academic work there. His partner is from Belgium, but she is doing her masters here, while he is doing his PHD in Cyprus. This helps all countries involved but the practicalities of things like that happening after Brexit are incredibly complicated and make it unlikely.

I get the dangers of multinational corporations and super governments but we are being persuaded that Isolationism is some kind of positive and feasible way to live in a modern interconnected world. Well it isn't. That is dreaming and being airy fairy. The British Empire has gone and throwing our weight around will not work anymore. This must be the first time we have willingly left somewhere without being revolted against by the natives that we oppressed. It's 2017 and people want to return to 1817.

[Gandalf]

There is no reason why Britain cannot be a successful nation on its own terms though. Other small nations do it very well. Iceland looks like a perfect model and they were saddled with overseas debt and the people resisted and the system evolved for the betterment of the people there. In a way I really wish Greece would do the same as they are only ever going to be slaves in the EU. Somehow the people still have faith in the EU, but the inability to control their own finances is crippling them. The UK still has its own currency and as a smaller country it can set the course it wants. However, in saying that people need to understand that a Tory led financialist/neo liberal system is only going to destroy the country in the long run. If people would just see past the hate and give Corbyn a chance, then progress could be made. There is a lot of money there, but it is in the hands of a few. The UK is a country that historically has been able to innovate too and already has a high base when it comes to quality of learning and research. The only reason the UK wouldn't continue to do well in these areas is if it decides to stop funding them. The UK has allowed the American model to infiltrate which has caused great harm and I do actually take it quite personally as well as I feel I am of the generation that really started to see the fallout of neo-liberal BS. It's about time things changed. I like these kids that are squatting in empty mansions in London, I like Bitcoin, I like people giving a middle finger to the system. Just in a way that can make a difference, that's why I am pro Brexit and want a political change. Let immigration go up when you are growing and things are more settled and just do it on your own terms so that ordinary people are not threatened.

[Dark Lord Al]

Swing and a miss.