Vasyl Lomachenko is P4P #1

[Fenster]

I thought I made it clear that I said "clear" as I based it on talent/skill/abilty more than records. Clearly I didn't make that clear ().

@Master - Brook weighed 160 like all Golovkin's other middleweight opponents. It's irrelevant though as you've stated Golovkin let him do better than the others.

If you believe it's illogical that fighters moving up in weight can't be tougher than men that already fight at the weight, I suggest you take a look back through the history of boxing. You will get the shock of your life mate.

Seriously, these fighters will blow your mind - start with a Filipino fella named Manny Pacquiao, Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hearns, De La Hoya, Ricky Burns, Duke McKenzie.

[Beanz]

I thought I made it clear that I said "clear" as I based it on talent/skill/abilty more than records. Clearly I didn't make that clear (). @Master - Brook weighed 160 like all Golovkin's other middleweight opponents. It's irrelevant though as you've stated Golovkin let him do better than the others.If you believe it's illogical that fighters moving up in weight can't be tougher than men that already fight at the weight, I suggest you take a look back through the history of boxing. You will get the shock of your life mate.Seriously, these fighters will blow your mind - start with a Filipino fella named Manny Pacquiao, Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hearns, De La Hoya, Ricky Burns, Duke McKenzie.

Never heard of em :-)

[Master]

I thought I made it clear that I said "clear" as I based it on talent/skill/abilty more than records. Clearly I didn't make that clear (). @Master - Brook weighed 160 like all Golovkin's other middleweight opponents. It's irrelevant though as you've stated Golovkin let him do better than the others.If you believe it's illogical that fighters moving up in weight can't be tougher than men that already fight at the weight, I suggest you take a look back through the history of boxing. You will get the shock of your life mate.Seriously, these fighters will blow your mind - start with a Filipino fella named Manny Pacquiao, Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hearns, De La Hoya, Ricky Burns, Duke McKenzie.

Never heard of em :-)

Brook does not compare to these fighters

[Gandalf]

I thought I made it clear that I said "clear" as I based it on talent/skill/abilty more than records. Clearly I didn't make that clear (). @Master - Brook weighed 160 like all Golovkin's other middleweight opponents. It's irrelevant though as you've stated Golovkin let him do better than the others.If you believe it's illogical that fighters moving up in weight can't be tougher than men that already fight at the weight, I suggest you take a look back through the history of boxing. You will get the shock of your life mate.Seriously, these fighters will blow your mind - start with a Filipino fella named Manny Pacquiao, Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hearns, De La Hoya, Ricky Burns, Duke McKenzie.

Never heard of em :-)

Brook does not compare to these fighters

Exactly, Brook went up and got beaten up then went down again. Pac, Leonard, and Duran went up and they were still demonic.

[Fenster]

I thought I made it clear that I said "clear" as I based it on talent/skill/abilty more than records. Clearly I didn't make that clear (). @Master - Brook weighed 160 like all Golovkin's other middleweight opponents. It's irrelevant though as you've stated Golovkin let him do better than the others.If you believe it's illogical that fighters moving up in weight can't be tougher than men that already fight at the weight, I suggest you take a look back through the history of boxing. You will get the shock of your life mate.Seriously, these fighters will blow your mind - start with a Filipino fella named Manny Pacquiao, Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hearns, De La Hoya, Ricky Burns, Duke McKenzie.

Never heard of em :-)

Brook does not compare to these fighters

Exactly, Brook went up and got beaten up then went down again. Pac, Leonard, and Duran went up and they were still demonic.

I never said Brook compares to those fighters. I helped Master understand the history of boxing.

Those fighters are an example of why it's NOT illogical for a fighter two weights below to be tougher than contenders/ex champions at the weight the champion fights at.

Hope this helps.

How can a fighter two weights below be tougher fight that contenders/ex champions at the weight the champion fights at?

Illogical, but if it keeps you happy to think it does, then so be it.

[Master]

No it does not help, you are in the wrong but will not admit that Brook was nothing compared to real middleweights he has faced.

[Gandalf]

No it does not help, you are in the wrong but will not admit that Brook was nothing compared to real middleweights he has faced.

You tell him Master. You will find that the die hard Mods cannot accept mistakes nor apologise. I hope you are dealing with them on the Mod board with suitable gusto.

[Fenster]

No it does not help, you are in the wrong but will not admit that Brook was nothing compared to real middleweights he has faced.

Only an imbecile could possibly think i'm wrong about this particular subject. I am the first person to admit i'm wrong when provided with evidence.

The only place i'm wrong is in your sawdust filled cranium.

In fact, I'll start a new thread, as this is about P4P.

[ryanman]

I thought I made it clear that I said "clear" as I based it on talent/skill/abilty more than records. Clearly I didn't make that clear (). @Master - Brook weighed 160 like all Golovkin's other middleweight opponents. It's irrelevant though as you've stated Golovkin let him do better than the others.If you believe it's illogical that fighters moving up in weight can't be tougher than men that already fight at the weight, I suggest you take a look back through the history of boxing. You will get the shock of your life mate.Seriously, these fighters will blow your mind - start with a Filipino fella named Manny Pacquiao, Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hearns, De La Hoya, Ricky Burns, Duke McKenzie.

Never heard of em :-)

+1 for classic Saddo humour.

[TitoFan]

Well I never heard of McKenzie, but that's probably my fault.

[ryanman]

Well I never heard of McKenzie, but that's probably my fault.

Never heard of the Duke Tito?

I'll give you that. But I know a wise ancient old timer () like you wouldn't entertain Kov banging out JC.

[TitoFan]

Well I never heard of McKenzie, but that's probably my fault.

Never heard of the Duke Tito?

I'll give you that. But I know a wise ancient old timer () like you wouldn't entertain Kov banging out JC.

Hey I can sympathize with how you guys feel about Joe. I cherish my own superheroes too.

[ryanman]

Well I never heard of McKenzie, but that's probably my fault.

Never heard of the Duke Tito?

I'll give you that. But I know a wise ancient old timer () like you wouldn't entertain Kov banging out JC.

Hey I can sympathize with how you guys feel about Joe. I cherish my own superheroes too.

Piffle. We don't need to do that. But there is no empirical evidence that Kov could bang out JC. Pure hyperbole.

[TitoFan]

I thought I made it clear that I said "clear" as I based it on talent/skill/abilty more than records. Clearly I didn't make that clear ().

@Master - Brook weighed 160 like all Golovkin's other middleweight opponents. It's irrelevant though as you've stated Golovkin let him do better than the others.

If you believe it's illogical that fighters moving up in weight can't be tougher than men that already fight at the weight, I suggest you take a look back through the history of boxing. You will get the shock of your life mate.

Seriously, these fighters will blow your mind - start with a Filipino fella named Manny Pacquiao, Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hearns, De La Hoya, Ricky Burns, Duke McKenzie.

All the fighters you mentioned, and you could include a few others as well, worked their way up through the weight divisions. Brook had fought exclusively at welter and jumped up to middleweight in one fell swoop to challenge one of the best MW's in history out of the blue. Big difference. Once he gets beaten he goes right back down. Again... big difference. Not taking anything away from the man. But it was a bad experiment gone wrong. Brook couldn't hurt GGG, and they both knew it.

[Fenster]

I thought I made it clear that I said "clear" as I based it on talent/skill/abilty more than records. Clearly I didn't make that clear ().

@Master - Brook weighed 160 like all Golovkin's other middleweight opponents. It's irrelevant though as you've stated Golovkin let him do better than the others.

If you believe it's illogical that fighters moving up in weight can't be tougher than men that already fight at the weight, I suggest you take a look back through the history of boxing. You will get the shock of your life mate.

Seriously, these fighters will blow your mind - start with a Filipino fella named Manny Pacquiao, Roberto Duran, Sugar Ray Leonard, Hearns, De La Hoya, Ricky Burns, Duke McKenzie.

All the fighters you mentioned, and you could include a few others as well, worked their way up through the weight divisions. Brook had fought exclusively at welter and jumped up to middleweight in one fell swoop to challenge one of the best MW's in history out of the blue. Big difference. Once he gets beaten he goes right back down. Again... big difference. Not taking anything away from the man. But it was a bad experiment gone wrong. Brook couldn't hurt GGG, and they both knew it.

I never said Brook compares to those fighters. I helped Master understand the history of boxing.

Those fighters are an example of why it's NOT illogical for a fighter two weights below to be tougher than contenders/ex champions at the weight the champion fights at.

How can a fighter two weights below be tougher fight that contenders/ex champions at the weight the champion fights at?

Illogical, but if it keeps you happy to think it does, then so be it.

I'm here to help.