Was Mahatma Gandhi a racist?

[Gandalf]

If race does not exist then why do my medical reports list me as caucasian? When police hunt a murder suspect I am sure they don't just say 'All murder suspects are mixed race'. They go on height, hair color, and RACE amongst other things. Race exists and it is silly to deny it. I don't think the Japanese mostly think of themselves as black or white though obvious exceptions exist of course as in the likes of Naomi Osaka who is tricking people really as it is her Mum's name and she can barely even speak Japanese.

[brocktonblockbust]

Race exists and there are differences between the races physically mentally intellectually Etc

And I don't know why we're not allowed to like whatever those attributes are and why we have to be labeled a word called racism

[TitoFan]

Such a HANGUP over the word "racism", for crying out loud.

Brock, saying you don't like black people's kinky hair is not racist.

Saying you don't like black people period because they're inferior to you IS racist.

WTH is so hard to understand about that?

Being racist is not the end of the world. It just denotes ignorance and unwarranted hate toward a group of people.



BTW, I also believe races exist. I don't understand the opposite argument. Races exist, ethnic backgrounds exist. But as humans mix more and more, differences will become blurred over time. Eventually that will probably be the only way to get rid of racism altogether...... when we're all so mixed up it'll just be one big pot of brownish, wavy-haired, lookalikes.

[TitoFan]

BTW, continuing to claim differences in intelligence due to races is racist, IMO. Just read a very good article about Eastern Asian culture and assimilation in the States, and it correctly states that the fact you have so many over-achieving students and professionals from Eastern Asia in the States, percentage-wise, is mainly due to parental influence and a push toward education in specific fields. It's not because their DNA somehow makes them smarter than other races. That is preposterous and ridiculous.

[Gandalf]

That is debatable Tito. I think the differences are real but the reasons aren't completely known. However, you are right there is a lot of focus on education. Many asian students have a firmer theoretical understanding of English grammar than the Brits do for example. They are better at maths and sciences. It's the same in all East Asian countries. Very smart people. IQ difference between races is factual and I don't think that is racist. It should be a kick up the bum to whites and blacks to sort themselves out and aspire hire. If me and Beanz can achieve distinctions in Masters or Undergraduate programmes despite warped childhoods then so can others. I don't feel inferior. It just makes me want to study harder. It can be a motivating force rather than a means for division. I've nothing against anybody of any color and especially if they are doing their best. It's all you can do. Plenty of smart people of every race out there, but the stats are what they are. Very few of us in any race are going to be Einsteinian anyway.

[Gandalf]

-5IQ miles....hire! 😃

[TitoFan]

That is debatable Tito. I think the differences are real but the reasons aren't completely known. However, you are right there is a lot of focus on education. Many asian students have a firmer theoretical understanding of English grammar than the Brits do for example. They are better at maths and sciences. It's the same in all East Asian countries. Very smart people. IQ difference between races is factual and I don't think that is racist. It should be a kick up the bum to whites and blacks to sort themselves out and aspire hire. If me and Beanz can achieve distinctions in Masters or Undergraduate programmes despite warped childhoods then so can others. I don't feel inferior. It just makes me want to study harder. It can be a motivating force rather than a means for division. I've nothing against anybody of any color and especially if they are doing their best. It's all you can do. Plenty of smart people of every race out there, but the stats are what they are. Very few of us in any race are going to be Einsteinian anyway.

If my parents ingrain the importance of education in me, and pretty much encourage/force me to get a college degree, I'm naturally going to have more knowledge and do better at IQ tests than Joe Blow across the street whose parents were dope addicts and couldn't care less whether their son went to school or not. They'll tell him to be street-smart, and forget all this college nonsense. Multiply that times thousands and thousands, and some people will be making up generalities supposedly associated with racial DNA.

[brocktonblockbust]

]Tito with all due respect and little ginger aside that argument you just made about the bums across the street on drugs as opposed to other parents encouraging kids to go to college and be professional only makes sense when looking at a very small let's say microcosm/neighborhood or a city in a certain culture.

How about this my friend? How about the people in Congo or in Brazil as opposed to the people in Belgium or in Finland? How come the people in Belgium and Finland all have extremely high literacy and college degrees and the people in Congo and Brazil are peasant illiterate and ignorant?

are you saying that we cannot make the statement that the white people in Belgium and Finland had more sense let's say or had more Focus let's say on sending their kids to University and that the people in Brazil and in the Congo and in Cameroon and in Malawi and in Angola did not have the same intelligence? why didn't those people in Cameroon and in Congo for example build universities and take part in scientific and mathematical and philosophical establishment of educational institutions on par with Europe?

Can that all be just explained away by blaming white people? Hell there are some places in the world that white people believe it or not have not yet gone to to conquer or to colonize so what then would be the excuse for those native indigenous people who cannot now blame white people?

[TitoFan]

Brock it's not about blaming anyone, much less white people. It's when we try and assign blame where none is assignable that arguments fall apart. Break down my argument into its essence. It's not all encouraging parents vs non-encouraging ones. It's about circumstances. Surely you realize people from Belgium and Finland have more opportunities just being born than people (generally) in the Congo or Angola. Does that make them dumber or with lower IQ because they're black or African or whatever other label we want to assign to them? No. We're all born pretty much anatomically the same, but in various models. Some white... some black... some with round eyes... other with slanted ones. But we're born into circumstances, the reality of our lives. Then we have parental influence. Motumbo's parents over in Angola probably live meal to meal, and education for little Motumbo is the further thing from their minds, probably not having an education themselves. If Motumbo doesn't adequately pass an IQ test, it's not because he's black or from Angola. It's because of his living circumstances, since the day he was born. IQ tests are largely flawed. There's plenty of literature on that. They fail to take into account numerous factors, including the ability for some people to take tests and do well in them. I studied with brilliant people who did poorly on tests because taking tests was their Achilles heel.

Quit making everything about blame. I prefer to focus on the argument at hand.

[Beanz]

That is debatable Tito. I think the differences are real but the reasons aren't completely known. However, you are right there is a lot of focus on education. Many asian students have a firmer theoretical understanding of English grammar than the Brits do for example. They are better at maths and sciences. It's the same in all East Asian countries. Very smart people. IQ difference between races is factual and I don't think that is racist. It should be a kick up the bum to whites and blacks to sort themselves out and aspire hire. If me and Beanz can achieve distinctions in Masters or Undergraduate programmes despite warped childhoods then so can others. I don't feel inferior. It just makes me want to study harder. It can be a motivating force rather than a means for division. I've nothing against anybody of any color and especially if they are doing their best. It's all you can do. Plenty of smart people of every race out there, but the stats are what they are. Very few of us in any race are going to be Einsteinian anyway.

Thank you for acknowledging that I am not a complete thicko. Murray and Peterson etc love the idea that they are brave truth tellers that are not afraid of being unpopular or telling uncomfortable truths. They think it boosts their credibility but the reason the Bell Curve and other primitive racist studies fell out of the pubic consciousness was because they were soundly disproved by the scientific community. Putting it simply they can believe there are differences in IQ between 'races' but the Science say's NO. It is this obsession with order and wanting a 'God' figure to have neat little answers that leads them around the garden path.

"To end up with systematic genetic differences in intelligence between large, ancient populations, the selective forces driving those differences would need to have been enormous. What’s more, those forces would have to have acted across entire continents, with wildly different environments, and have been persistent over tens of thousands of years of tremendous cultural change. Such a scenario is not just speculative – I would argue it is inherently and deeply implausible.

The bottom line is this. While genetic variation may help to explain why one person is more intelligent than another, there are unlikely to be stable and systematic genetic differences that make one population more intelligent than the next."


https://www.theguardian.com/science/...s-are-unlikely

[brocktonblockbust]

on the contrary I CAN see how those conditions would vary so greatly and remain relatively constant over a very long period of time so as to have those kinds of great differences in general intelligence

[Beanz]

If race does not exist then why do my medical reports list me as caucasian? When police hunt a murder suspect I am sure they don't just say 'All murder suspects are mixed race'. They go on height, hair color, and RACE amongst other things. Race exists and it is silly to deny it. I don't think the Japanese mostly think of themselves as black or white though obvious exceptions exist of course as in the likes of Naomi Osaka who is tricking people really as it is her Mum's name and she can barely even speak Japanese.

Because it's a convenient way of supporting white privilege across the world. I jest but it really is convenience, it's a fuzzy way of dealing with things and that is how the world works. Seriously it's sounds mental, but the reality is the genetic distances found within a 'Race' are larger than the mean genetic distances between races.






It is quite clearly explained here


https://www.nationalgeographic.com/m...cience-africa/

[El Kabong]

Guys, race itself is a social construct....it's why literally ANYONE can give literally ANYONE ELSE a blood transfusion, an organ and/or bone marrow transplant....THEY want you to think race is a thing, but it's soooo not, neither is blood type or whatever matching human leukocyte antigen's is for pussies you just pay no mind to the social constructs and you fucking do it like a champ.


@TitoFan some cultures value education, some don't. Some cultures believe that their success honors their family and their shame shames the family and other cultures don't. Not all cultures are equal.

[brocktonblockbust]

#NotAllCultures......😒

[Beanz]

Guys, race itself is a social construct....it's why literally ANYONE can give literally ANYONE ELSE a blood transfusion, an organ and/or bone marrow transplant....THEY want you to think race is a thing, but it's soooo not, neither is blood type or whatever matching human leukocyte antigen's is for pussies you just pay no mind to the social constructs and you fucking do it like a champ.


@TitoFan some cultures value education, some don't. Some cultures believe that their success honors their family and their shame shames the family and other cultures don't. Not all cultures are equal.

This is just your way of justifying an invented narrative. It has nothing to do with Science, which is why you rather than address what i say, you constantly resort to inserting arguments i never made. If you think life is all about winning you are no better than an ape. What you feel is right and your feelings about 'race' mean fuck all. Facts Lyle.


'There is no necessary concordance between biological characteristics and culturally defined groups. On every continent, there are diverse populations that differ in language, economy, and culture. There is no national, religious, linguistic or cultural group or economic class that constitutes a race.'


http://physanth.org/about/position-s...-aspects-race/