Terence Crawford- the best P4P in the sport today!

[Ron Swanson]

Also, I don’t have to speak about Spence’s offer to Crawford because Bob admitted he isn’t interested while saying they want it. It’s like people don’t actually pay attention to what Bob actually says. He says he wants to negotiate but he wants it fair to all networks. That is a huge roadblock. Negotiation stops before it starts. There is no fair negotiation between ESPN and Showtime/Fox because ESPN(Arum/Crawford) don’t have the budget to compete with Showtime/Fox(Haymon/Spence). If Arum really wanted the fight he would say they will negotiate with whoever will pay the most. That is so obviously how it should be done. When you aren’t willing to do it how it should be done you aren’t willing to do it. The rest is lip service and misdirection. Not sure how many times Arum needs to lie before people understand he’s a liar.

[TitoFan]

TBH Ron, I'm not ready to say Crawford is the best at this moment. Great win over Benavidez, which raises his stock in the p4p list, but too many other great fighters out there to make that call right now. Like the others, I just feel it's unfair to say Crawford is ducking Spence.... in my case because he just basically got to 147 and there's some good welters out there who should be lining up to fight Spence. Arum can say whatever he wants, but none of that should be put on the fighter. He answered the question correctly, IMO. When the time comes to call out Spence, he'll do it, or the other way around. And the fight will happen. What puzzles me is how Spence is being portrayed as an avoided monster off what is arguably a lesser resume than some of the other guys mentioned. Peterson and Brook are the names that stick out, and Brook had had his eye socket broken by GGG in the previous fight. I'm willing to cut Crawford a break until he shows me he's actually ducking somebody. From the list of guys mentioned in another post, I only know of one blatant ducker, but I'll abstain from that topic also.

[Ron Swanson]

Again, I’m not saying he is ducking him. I’m saying in a thread about Crawford being the best it’s easy to say but it’s hollow until he fights Spence.

I like Crawford. I’m not insulting him. I’m saying to show he is the best he needs Spence. This should not even be an argument it should be so clear.

I don’t doubt for a second Crawford is willing to fight Spence.

[Alpha]

Also, I don’t have to speak about Spence’s offer to Crawford because Bob admitted he isn’t interested while saying they want it. It’s like people don’t actually pay attention to what Bob actually says. He says he wants to negotiate but he wants it fair to all networks. That is a huge roadblock. Negotiation stops before it starts. There is no fair negotiation between ESPN and Showtime/Fox because ESPN(Arum/Crawford) don’t have the budget to compete with Showtime/Fox(Haymon/Spence). If Arum really wanted the fight he would say they will negotiate with whoever will pay the most. That is so obviously how it should be done. When you aren’t willing to do it how it should be done you aren’t willing to do it. The rest is lip service and misdirection. Not sure how many times Arum needs to lie before people understand he’s a liar.

You did the same song and dance about Loma vs Linares, and at the end of the day it got done.

Any boxing fan should know that talk is cheap. Paying attention to what anyone says outside the ring is pointless. What happens in the ring once the bell rings is all that matters.

In saying that at least Arum has presented some options, joint PPV, sharing fighters etc. What has team Spence/ Haymon/ PBC/ Showtime/ Fox mentioned so far?

You did say that Crawford isn't fighting Spence, which is true, newsflash: Spence ain't fighting Crawford either. Kind of makes the statement redundant.

Agree they will fight when the time is right, but like others have mentioned, Spence's record is far from stellar. If Thurman is still around, then he, in my opinion is the man to beat.

Haymon has most of the top guys at 147, so if anyone's to blame for Spence not getting the right fights, it's him.

If things go the norm, Spence will end up fighting Ugas. Crawford will fight his mando and things will go round and round until at least 2020. I hope I'm wrong and we can get this fight towards the end of next year.

[Ron Swanson]

Also, I don’t have to speak about Spence’s offer to Crawford because Bob admitted he isn’t interested while saying they want it. It’s like people don’t actually pay attention to what Bob actually says. He says he wants to negotiate but he wants it fair to all networks. That is a huge roadblock. Negotiation stops before it starts. There is no fair negotiation between ESPN and Showtime/Fox because ESPN(Arum/Crawford) don’t have the budget to compete with Showtime/Fox(Haymon/Spence). If Arum really wanted the fight he would say they will negotiate with whoever will pay the most. That is so obviously how it should be done. When you aren’t willing to do it how it should be done you aren’t willing to do it. The rest is lip service and misdirection. Not sure how many times Arum needs to lie before people understand he’s a liar.

You did the same song and dance about Loma vs Linares, and at the end of the day it got done.

Any boxing fan should know that talk is cheap. Paying attention to what anyone says outside the ring is pointless. What happens in the ring once the bell rings is all that matters.

In saying that at least Arum has presented some options, joint PPV, sharing fighters etc. What has team Spence/ Haymon/ PBC/ Showtime/ Fox mentioned so far?

You did say that Crawford isn't fighting Spence, which is true, newsflash: Spence ain't fighting Crawford either. Kind of makes the statement redundant.

Agree they will fight when the time is right, but like others have mentioned, Spence's record is far from stellar. If Thurman is still around, then he, in my opinion is the man to beat.

Haymon has most of the top guys at 147, so if anyone's to blame for Spence not getting the right fights, it's him.

If things go the norm, Spence will end up fighting Ugas. Crawford will fight his mando and things will go round and round until at least 2020. I hope I'm wrong and we can get this fight towards the end of next year.

Why say something that is redundant then say it is redundant. Of course Spence isn’t fighting Crawford. This is why I find it so peculiar people are up in arms I said Crawford isn’t fighting Spence. It’s a fact.

I could understand people being bothered if I said Crawford isn’t going to fight Spence but that’s a completely different statement and had nothing to do with what I was talking about. I was talking about the point of the thread saying Crawford is the best. As I said, easy to say when he isn’t fighting Spence.... when he does the thread will have proof or be refuted.

Edit- just looked back and saw I said when he won’t fight Spence. Poor wording on my part misrepresenting what I meant. This whole circle is actually my fault, my bad

[Primo Carnera]

Also, I don’t have to speak about Spence’s offer to Crawford because Bob admitted he isn’t interested while saying they want it. It’s like people don’t actually pay attention to what Bob actually says. He says he wants to negotiate but he wants it fair to all networks. That is a huge roadblock. Negotiation stops before it starts. There is no fair negotiation between ESPN and Showtime/Fox because ESPN(Arum/Crawford) don’t have the budget to compete with Showtime/Fox(Haymon/Spence). If Arum really wanted the fight he would say they will negotiate with whoever will pay the most. That is so obviously how it should be done. When you aren’t willing to do it how it should be done you aren’t willing to do it. The rest is lip service and misdirection. Not sure how many times Arum needs to lie before people understand he’s a liar.

and this is exactly why people come back at you . you half say something with a veiled criticism and then turn around and say "oh , I like him, I just want the fight made."
And then you go to and fro so much that you send out mixed messages as above.

[ykdadamaja]

Good contributions to this thread. But let us look at it in a Floyd Mayweather perspective- He had a HUGE gap in elite fighters after he fought Chico Corrales (RIP) and Oscar DLH- It wasn't until he beat Oscar that he was truly considered the best, and it was semi-best until Manny Pac lost to Morales and even then they still had Manny as a better fighter.

To me, if I had any sense, Floyd should have been ranked in the top spot over Mosely and Hopkins AND RJJ, ranked 1, 2 and 3 respectively, to be honest. But, such is life...

[El Kabong]

Good contributions to this thread. But let us look at it in a Floyd Mayweather perspective- He had a HUGE gap in elite fighters after he fought Chico Corrales (RIP) and Oscar DLH- It wasn't until he beat Oscar that he was truly considered the best, and it was semi-best until Manny Pac lost to Morales and even then they still had Manny as a better fighter.

To me, if I had any sense, Floyd should have been ranked in the top spot over Mosely and Hopkins AND RJJ, ranked 1, 2 and 3 respectively, to be honest. But, such is life...

I think the first fight vs Jose Luis Castillo hurt Floyd, but prior to that I was waiting for the guy to make a splash but in order to do that you've got to string fights together which are high profile. Had he EASILY handled JLC then he would have been there. That 1 fight placed doubts in a lot of people's minds, he certainly redeemed himself in the rematch even if he didn't stop him but after that who did he gun for? There were plenty of stud young fighters ready to go and I know he had title defenses to make so I understand "you can't fight them all" but to go from Augustus, Corrales, El Famoso, Jesus Chavez, JLC, JLC II to Sosa, Ndou, Corley, Bruseles, Gatti, Mitchell and then Zab Judah coming off of a loss....he didn't even get back on track until he fought Baldomir and although Baldomir deserved the fight for beating Zab and Gatti he was not going to test Floyd.


Where's Margarito? Where's Cotto at 140 or 147 (in that time frame)? Where's Williams? Where's Hatton at 140? Where was Acelino Freitas? Where are these guys?


Floyd is a great fighter, but he never threw caution to the wind and tossed himself willingly into the lion's den....smart on his part, but hell I guess better to leave the fans wanting more....although I don't want another bullshit exhibition bout like he had vs Conor, he could make money just doing those to be honest, but try and tell the boxing world that's a real fight...0-0-0 vs 49-0-0 ...yeah HORSE SHIT.



Oh and just so nobody misunderstands, I did LOVE that Floyd gave Gatti the opportunity, that was a real life Rocky moment. Floyd the Apollo Creed to Gatti's Rocky, only there was no storybook ending for Arturo RIP. Arturo had a dramatic career, up and down, up and down, it was nice that a throwback fighter like him got a chance to shine in the spotlight. Floyd was simply too good for any version of Arturo.

[Alpha]

Good contributions to this thread. But let us look at it in a Floyd Mayweather perspective- He had a HUGE gap in elite fighters after he fought Chico Corrales (RIP) and Oscar DLH- It wasn't until he beat Oscar that he was truly considered the best, and it was semi-best until Manny Pac lost to Morales and even then they still had Manny as a better fighter.

To me, if I had any sense, Floyd should have been ranked in the top spot over Mosely and Hopkins AND RJJ, ranked 1, 2 and 3 respectively, to be honest. But, such is life...

I think the first fight vs Jose Luis Castillo hurt Floyd, but prior to that I was waiting for the guy to make a splash but in order to do that you've got to string fights together which are high profile. Had he EASILY handled JLC then he would have been there. That 1 fight placed doubts in a lot of people's minds, he certainly redeemed himself in the rematch even if he didn't stop him but after that who did he gun for? There were plenty of stud young fighters ready to go and I know he had title defenses to make so I understand "you can't fight them all" but to go from Augustus, Corrales, El Famoso, Jesus Chavez, JLC, JLC II to Sosa, Ndou, Corley, Bruseles, Gatti, Mitchell and then Zab Judah coming off of a loss....he didn't even get back on track until he fought Baldomir and although Baldomir deserved the fight for beating Zab and Gatti he was not going to test Floyd.


Where's Margarito? Where's Cotto at 140 or 147 (in that time frame)? Where's Williams? Where's Hatton at 140? Where was Acelino Freitas? Where are these guys?


Floyd is a great fighter, but he never threw caution to the wind and tossed himself willingly into the lion's den....smart on his part, but hell I guess better to leave the fans wanting more....although I don't want another bullshit exhibition bout like he had vs Conor, he could make money just doing those to be honest, but try and tell the boxing world that's a real fight...0-0-0 vs 49-0-0 ...yeah HORSE SHIT.



Oh and just so nobody misunderstands, I did LOVE that Floyd gave Gatti the opportunity, that was a real life Rocky moment. Floyd the Apollo Creed to Gatti's Rocky, only there was no storybook ending for Arturo RIP. Arturo had a dramatic career, up and down, up and down, it was nice that a throwback fighter like him got a chance to shine in the spotlight. Floyd was simply too good for any version of Arturo.

Agree with this, you forgot Tszyu tho.

[Spicoli]

I'm split. I don't think Crawfords list of opponents matches Loma. But I honestly think Crawford is more diverse with a better arsenal.

[Alpha]

Fight did big viewing numbers, which is great to hear.

[mikeeod]

I'm split. I don't think Crawfords list of opponents matches Loma. But I honestly think Crawford is more diverse with a better arsenal.

Not trolling or making this a right/wrong debate, because I think this is all subjective, just curious as to who you think Crawford beat that is as good as Linares and Walters. To me both of those guys are very tough in their own way. Linares is a hell of a technician in the ring, rangy, good power, great experience...etc., while Walters is a beast. He had a shaky performance right before Loma, so I can see how people would rank him a little lower, but the guy is an animal in the ring and Loma toyed with him and made him quit. Rigo was too small for Loma, but he is a great fighter also. Don’t give Loma as much credit due to the size difference.