Should transgenered people be allowed to box?

[Ron Swanson]

In short, a woman changes into a man and wants to fight men? It's her choice.

A man changes into a woman and wants to fight women? He's being forced onto opponents who want no part of it.

'Nough said.

In short you are sexist as hell. What about a person born where their gender is indistinguishable? That’s 1/60, what do you wish as the superior male to impose on them? Black, white, male, female, when we all stop imposing ourselves on those we view as different from us this world will be far better off.

I remember 10/12 years ago a huge debate on a different boxing site about if gay people should be allowed to adopt. Of course I was on the side that thinks children are better off growing up with love. But I was practically alone. The same debate now seems absurd now that the data is in. Transgender doesn’t mean deciding you are the other sex. There is years of living as the other sex, years of hormone replacement, and eventually surgery. They are women by every hormonal standard and hormones decide everything about us. Come back to this argument in 20 years and it will seem as stupid as the “should gays be able to adopt” argument. Let people be. Through all human history we judge one group then another and impose upon them. The Chinese, the Irish, the blacks, the gays(yes, I am deliberately using these terms) and afterward we are always “we shouldn’t have done that. Every, single, time. Stop falling into the same trap

[Dark Lord Al]

Let the WBA have a world silver interim WBA Trannies and Shemale Title.

[powerpuncher]

In short, a woman changes into a man and wants to fight men? It's her choice.

A man changes into a woman and wants to fight women? He's being forced onto opponents who want no part of it.

'Nough said.

In short you are sexist as hell. What about a person born where their gender is indistinguishable? That’s 1/60, what do you wish as the superior male to impose on them? Black, white, male, female, when we all stop imposing ourselves on those we view as different from us this world will be far better off.

I remember 10/12 years ago a huge debate on a different boxing site about if gay people should be allowed to adopt. Of course I was on the side that thinks children are better off growing up with love. But I was practically alone. The same debate now seems absurd now that the data is in. Transgender doesn’t mean deciding you are the other sex. There is years of living as the other sex, years of hormone replacement, and eventually surgery. They are women by every hormonal standard and hormones decide everything about us. Come back to this argument in 20 years and it will seem as stupid as the “should gays be able to adopt” argument. Let people be. Through all human history we judge one group then another and impose upon them. The Chinese, the Irish, the blacks, the gays(yes, I am deliberately using these terms) and afterward we are always “we shouldn’t have done that. Every, single, time. Stop falling into the same trap

This is much different than just being racist or sexist. This is about asking about an unfair advantage. For example, if a black man beats a white man in a race, nobody would call it cheating. If a man pretends to be a woman and races against a woman and wins, people would call it cheating because men are naturally more athletic in every way. That’s biology not sexist.

Now I know that there are many different situations when it comes to sex and gender. So I can understand an argument if hormone levels are essentially female but maybe you just have male parts. It’s a serious situation though when you have a woman who trains all of her life to win the Olympics and ends up losing to a “woman” that was born much more of a man than a woman. Also in combat sports, it becomes more dangerous. That’s why men and women don’t fight each other. It’s way too dangerous.

So don’t be one of those people who just call people sexist and don’t actually have a good argument for your name calling.

[TitoFan]

In short, a woman changes into a man and wants to fight men? It's her choice.

A man changes into a woman and wants to fight women? He's being forced onto opponents who want no part of it.

'Nough said.

In short you are sexist as hell. What about a person born where their gender is indistinguishable? That’s 1/60, what do you wish as the superior male to impose on them? Black, white, male, female, when we all stop imposing ourselves on those we view as different from us this world will be far better off.

I remember 10/12 years ago a huge debate on a different boxing site about if gay people should be allowed to adopt. Of course I was on the side that thinks children are better off growing up with love. But I was practically alone. The same debate now seems absurd now that the data is in. Transgender doesn’t mean deciding you are the other sex. There is years of living as the other sex, years of hormone replacement, and eventually surgery. They are women by every hormonal standard and hormones decide everything about us. Come back to this argument in 20 years and it will seem as stupid as the “should gays be able to adopt” argument. Let people be. Through all human history we judge one group then another and impose upon them. The Chinese, the Irish, the blacks, the gays(yes, I am deliberately using these terms) and afterward we are always “we shouldn’t have done that. Every, single, time. Stop falling into the same trap

This is much different than just being racist or sexist. This is about asking about an unfair advantage. For example, if a black man beats a white man in a race, nobody would call it cheating. If a man pretends to be a woman and races against a woman and wins, people would call it cheating because men are naturally more athletic in every way. That’s biology not sexist.

Now I know that there are many different situations when it comes to sex and gender. So I can understand an argument if hormone levels are essentially female but maybe you just have male parts. It’s a serious situation though when you have a woman who trains all of her life to win the Olympics and ends up losing to a “woman” that was born much more of a man than a woman. Also in combat sports, it becomes more dangerous. That’s why men and women don’t fight each other. It’s way too dangerous.

So don’t be one of those people who just call people sexist and don’t actually have a good argument for your name calling.

Ignorance rears its ugly head with the usual suspects chiming in. No hey..... let's allow objections to men beating up on women to be called "sexist." It remains the easy "go to" answer to everything. As usual, it's easier to applaud the blurred lines of society than to make a stand, no matter how unpopular. I made a clear distinction saying if a trans woman who becomes a man wants to fight men.... let her be. The other way around, IMO, and in the opinion of most people with a good set of values "assigned at birth", is wrong.

If we want to play the all high and mighty with this, why not just drop all pretenses and just let women and men fight each other in the ring. Heaven knows we need more examples of men beating up on women in society. No @powerpuncher ..... let's let the Ron's and the Beanzs and the Fensters of the world continue carrying their torch. As I've said time and again, it's much easier to adopt the "everything's ok" attitude and criticize others for taking a stance. Blurred lines? No problem. Who cares that we've already had instances of women getting severely injured in a ring or octagon by a trans male/female. Never mind the opinion of the very fighters themselves, whose opinions I already posted in a link above. No..... all that matters is that we're cool with everything.

[holmcall]

Hmm. I'm staying out of this one.

[TitoFan]

Ronica Jeffrey: Undefeated at 11-0, Ronica is set to compete for the interim WIBA super featherweight title in April.

“Honestly, I don’t think that they should compete against women, because at the end of the day, naturally you are a man, and its unfair for the woman to have to go against someone who is that physically stronger than them. If that’s the case, then we should have co-ed boxing, which we don’t, and that is for a reason. I have nothing against them, and if it’s that serious, then transgendered should go against transgendered."


Mary McGee: Mary is 20-1 and next steps in the ring in May where she will meet up with Holly Holm in a battle for the IBA light welterweight title. Follow Mary on Twitter @marymcgee2586.

“It’s not fair to put a man up against a women in any sport. Transgender or not, naturally men are stronger than women. In some cases a woman can beat the odds, but I don’t think that would be fair. I would never in my life step in the ring with a man. He, in a real fight, might hurt me real bad. If they want to do the sport, do it with men.”


Kaliesha West: At 16-1, the popular West is the IFBA super bantamweight title holder, as well as the WBO bantamweight champ. She can be followed on Twitter @KWildWildWest

“I do not support this! I study in the medical field and have been working at a prestigious medical center for 6 years now (Loma Linda University), and its simple anatomy and physiology. Men are NATURALLY stronger than women!!!! THIS IS WRONG IN SO MANY WAYS! Men have larger hearts and lungs, and their higher levels of testosterone cause them to produce greater amounts of red blood cells. I’ve studied this already, and these statements written EVERYWHERE in anatomy articles, books, or studies only reiterate what I just stated.

Men usually have greater upper body strength, build muscle easily, have thicker skin, bruise less easily and have a lower threshold of awareness of injuries to their extremities. Men are essentially built for physical confrontation and the use of force. Their joints are well suited for throwing objects. A man’s skull is almost always thicker and stronger than a women’s.

If this Shim wants to compete, TELL HER TO JOIN THE MEN’s LEAGUE!!!! OH, and I don’t want to hear about her hormonal pills she has been taking for her gender change, ESTROGEN CAN NOT CHANGE THE SIZE OF YOUR NATURAL SKELETON.”


Holly Lawson: Holly is the 4th ranked welterweight in the world. She currently has a record of 5-2. You can follow her on Twitter @lilbearlawson.

“I feel that if they want to allow transgendered women to compete with women, they might as well start sanctioning men and women to fight in their respective weight classes. I think regardless of the procedures which one undergoes in such a situation, genetically they are still male. With that said, I wouldn’t turn down a fight if my opponent was discovered to be transgendered. Boxing isn’t about brute strength, it’s a science and a chess match.”



Amanda Serrano: The WIBA featherweight champion sports an impressive 17-1 record. She returns to action in April against an opponent to be named. Follow her on Twitter @RealDealSerrano.

“I truly believe that if u were born a man, you’re always going to be stronger than a woman. My choice would be no. Just because the testosterone that men have is a big factor. Just saying.”



Maricela Cornejo: Maricela is quickly making a name for herself in the sport. The model/fighter has started her career with a 2-0 record, and next looks to be fighting on May 3 in Las Vegas.

“I am all for doing whatever makes you feel good. If you want to become a girl, then that is your decision. I don’t have a problem with it. But I don’t agree with it when it comes to fighting. If a transgender woman fights, they are going to be stronger than other women, so I don’t think it’s right. There are still advantages they are going to have from having previously been a man that no amount of drugs are going to erase.”




I should only have to post ONE of these. One would be more than sufficient. But here's a whole group of them. It's THEIR sport.

Last I checked, no one in the "Live and Let Live" sorority here was either female, a boxer, or ever had to fight a transgender male.

[powerpuncher]

Ronica Jeffrey: Undefeated at 11-0, Ronica is set to compete for the interim WIBA super featherweight title in April.

“Honestly, I don’t think that they should compete against women, because at the end of the day, naturally you are a man, and its unfair for the woman to have to go against someone who is that physically stronger than them. If that’s the case, then we should have co-ed boxing, which we don’t, and that is for a reason. I have nothing against them, and if it’s that serious, then transgendered should go against transgendered."


Mary McGee: Mary is 20-1 and next steps in the ring in May where she will meet up with Holly Holm in a battle for the IBA light welterweight title. Follow Mary on Twitter @marymcgee2586.

“It’s not fair to put a man up against a women in any sport. Transgender or not, naturally men are stronger than women. In some cases a woman can beat the odds, but I don’t think that would be fair. I would never in my life step in the ring with a man. He, in a real fight, might hurt me real bad. If they want to do the sport, do it with men.”


Kaliesha West: At 16-1, the popular West is the IFBA super bantamweight title holder, as well as the WBO bantamweight champ. She can be followed on Twitter @KWildWildWest

“I do not support this! I study in the medical field and have been working at a prestigious medical center for 6 years now (Loma Linda University), and its simple anatomy and physiology. Men are NATURALLY stronger than women!!!! THIS IS WRONG IN SO MANY WAYS! Men have larger hearts and lungs, and their higher levels of testosterone cause them to produce greater amounts of red blood cells. I’ve studied this already, and these statements written EVERYWHERE in anatomy articles, books, or studies only reiterate what I just stated.

Men usually have greater upper body strength, build muscle easily, have thicker skin, bruise less easily and have a lower threshold of awareness of injuries to their extremities. Men are essentially built for physical confrontation and the use of force. Their joints are well suited for throwing objects. A man’s skull is almost always thicker and stronger than a women’s.

If this Shim wants to compete, TELL HER TO JOIN THE MEN’s LEAGUE!!!! OH, and I don’t want to hear about her hormonal pills she has been taking for her gender change, ESTROGEN CAN NOT CHANGE THE SIZE OF YOUR NATURAL SKELETON.”


Holly Lawson: Holly is the 4th ranked welterweight in the world. She currently has a record of 5-2. You can follow her on Twitter @lilbearlawson.

“I feel that if they want to allow transgendered women to compete with women, they might as well start sanctioning men and women to fight in their respective weight classes. I think regardless of the procedures which one undergoes in such a situation, genetically they are still male. With that said, I wouldn’t turn down a fight if my opponent was discovered to be transgendered. Boxing isn’t about brute strength, it’s a science and a chess match.”



Amanda Serrano: The WIBA featherweight champion sports an impressive 17-1 record. She returns to action in April against an opponent to be named. Follow her on Twitter @RealDealSerrano.

“I truly believe that if u were born a man, you’re always going to be stronger than a woman. My choice would be no. Just because the testosterone that men have is a big factor. Just saying.”



Maricela Cornejo: Maricela is quickly making a name for herself in the sport. The model/fighter has started her career with a 2-0 record, and next looks to be fighting on May 3 in Las Vegas.

“I am all for doing whatever makes you feel good. If you want to become a girl, then that is your decision. I don’t have a problem with it. But I don’t agree with it when it comes to fighting. If a transgender woman fights, they are going to be stronger than other women, so I don’t think it’s right. There are still advantages they are going to have from having previously been a man that no amount of drugs are going to erase.”




I should only have to post ONE of these. One would be more than sufficient. But here's a whole group of them. It's THEIR sport.

Last I checked, no one in the "Live and Let Live" sorority here was either female, a boxer, or ever had to fight a transgender male.

But that’s not fair because you only took quotes from people who are sexist 😂

[TitoFan]

Ronica Jeffrey: Undefeated at 11-0, Ronica is set to compete for the interim WIBA super featherweight title in April.

“Honestly, I don’t think that they should compete against women, because at the end of the day, naturally you are a man, and its unfair for the woman to have to go against someone who is that physically stronger than them. If that’s the case, then we should have co-ed boxing, which we don’t, and that is for a reason. I have nothing against them, and if it’s that serious, then transgendered should go against transgendered."


Mary McGee: Mary is 20-1 and next steps in the ring in May where she will meet up with Holly Holm in a battle for the IBA light welterweight title. Follow Mary on Twitter @marymcgee2586.

“It’s not fair to put a man up against a women in any sport. Transgender or not, naturally men are stronger than women. In some cases a woman can beat the odds, but I don’t think that would be fair. I would never in my life step in the ring with a man. He, in a real fight, might hurt me real bad. If they want to do the sport, do it with men.”


Kaliesha West: At 16-1, the popular West is the IFBA super bantamweight title holder, as well as the WBO bantamweight champ. She can be followed on Twitter @KWildWildWest

“I do not support this! I study in the medical field and have been working at a prestigious medical center for 6 years now (Loma Linda University), and its simple anatomy and physiology. Men are NATURALLY stronger than women!!!! THIS IS WRONG IN SO MANY WAYS! Men have larger hearts and lungs, and their higher levels of testosterone cause them to produce greater amounts of red blood cells. I’ve studied this already, and these statements written EVERYWHERE in anatomy articles, books, or studies only reiterate what I just stated.

Men usually have greater upper body strength, build muscle easily, have thicker skin, bruise less easily and have a lower threshold of awareness of injuries to their extremities. Men are essentially built for physical confrontation and the use of force. Their joints are well suited for throwing objects. A man’s skull is almost always thicker and stronger than a women’s.

If this Shim wants to compete, TELL HER TO JOIN THE MEN’s LEAGUE!!!! OH, and I don’t want to hear about her hormonal pills she has been taking for her gender change, ESTROGEN CAN NOT CHANGE THE SIZE OF YOUR NATURAL SKELETON.”


Holly Lawson: Holly is the 4th ranked welterweight in the world. She currently has a record of 5-2. You can follow her on Twitter @lilbearlawson.

“I feel that if they want to allow transgendered women to compete with women, they might as well start sanctioning men and women to fight in their respective weight classes. I think regardless of the procedures which one undergoes in such a situation, genetically they are still male. With that said, I wouldn’t turn down a fight if my opponent was discovered to be transgendered. Boxing isn’t about brute strength, it’s a science and a chess match.”



Amanda Serrano: The WIBA featherweight champion sports an impressive 17-1 record. She returns to action in April against an opponent to be named. Follow her on Twitter @RealDealSerrano.

“I truly believe that if u were born a man, you’re always going to be stronger than a woman. My choice would be no. Just because the testosterone that men have is a big factor. Just saying.”



Maricela Cornejo: Maricela is quickly making a name for herself in the sport. The model/fighter has started her career with a 2-0 record, and next looks to be fighting on May 3 in Las Vegas.

“I am all for doing whatever makes you feel good. If you want to become a girl, then that is your decision. I don’t have a problem with it. But I don’t agree with it when it comes to fighting. If a transgender woman fights, they are going to be stronger than other women, so I don’t think it’s right. There are still advantages they are going to have from having previously been a man that no amount of drugs are going to erase.”




I should only have to post ONE of these. One would be more than sufficient. But here's a whole group of them. It's THEIR sport.

Last I checked, no one in the "Live and Let Live" sorority here was either female, a boxer, or ever had to fight a transgender male.

Read these AGAIN, Beanz. Tell me once again why your presumptions and Ron's "reasoned, sensible and nuanced points" are worth a hill of beans when stacked up against the opinions of women who actually have to step into the ring with transgender boxers. THEN... get back to me. In the meantime, keep your ignorant rants to yourself.

[Ron Swanson]

Ronica Jeffrey: Undefeated at 11-0, Ronica is set to compete for the interim WIBA super featherweight title in April.

“Honestly, I don’t think that they should compete against women, because at the end of the day, naturally you are a man, and its unfair for the woman to have to go against someone who is that physically stronger than them. If that’s the case, then we should have co-ed boxing, which we don’t, and that is for a reason. I have nothing against them, and if it’s that serious, then transgendered should go against transgendered."


Mary McGee: Mary is 20-1 and next steps in the ring in May where she will meet up with Holly Holm in a battle for the IBA light welterweight title. Follow Mary on Twitter @marymcgee2586.

“It’s not fair to put a man up against a women in any sport. Transgender or not, naturally men are stronger than women. In some cases a woman can beat the odds, but I don’t think that would be fair. I would never in my life step in the ring with a man. He, in a real fight, might hurt me real bad. If they want to do the sport, do it with men.”


Kaliesha West: At 16-1, the popular West is the IFBA super bantamweight title holder, as well as the WBO bantamweight champ. She can be followed on Twitter @KWildWildWest

“I do not support this! I study in the medical field and have been working at a prestigious medical center for 6 years now (Loma Linda University), and its simple anatomy and physiology. Men are NATURALLY stronger than women!!!! THIS IS WRONG IN SO MANY WAYS! Men have larger hearts and lungs, and their higher levels of testosterone cause them to produce greater amounts of red blood cells. I’ve studied this already, and these statements written EVERYWHERE in anatomy articles, books, or studies only reiterate what I just stated.

Men usually have greater upper body strength, build muscle easily, have thicker skin, bruise less easily and have a lower threshold of awareness of injuries to their extremities. Men are essentially built for physical confrontation and the use of force. Their joints are well suited for throwing objects. A man’s skull is almost always thicker and stronger than a women’s.

If this Shim wants to compete, TELL HER TO JOIN THE MEN’s LEAGUE!!!! OH, and I don’t want to hear about her hormonal pills she has been taking for her gender change, ESTROGEN CAN NOT CHANGE THE SIZE OF YOUR NATURAL SKELETON.”


Holly Lawson: Holly is the 4th ranked welterweight in the world. She currently has a record of 5-2. You can follow her on Twitter @lilbearlawson.

“I feel that if they want to allow transgendered women to compete with women, they might as well start sanctioning men and women to fight in their respective weight classes. I think regardless of the procedures which one undergoes in such a situation, genetically they are still male. With that said, I wouldn’t turn down a fight if my opponent was discovered to be transgendered. Boxing isn’t about brute strength, it’s a science and a chess match.”



Amanda Serrano: The WIBA featherweight champion sports an impressive 17-1 record. She returns to action in April against an opponent to be named. Follow her on Twitter @RealDealSerrano.

“I truly believe that if u were born a man, you’re always going to be stronger than a woman. My choice would be no. Just because the testosterone that men have is a big factor. Just saying.”



Maricela Cornejo: Maricela is quickly making a name for herself in the sport. The model/fighter has started her career with a 2-0 record, and next looks to be fighting on May 3 in Las Vegas.

“I am all for doing whatever makes you feel good. If you want to become a girl, then that is your decision. I don’t have a problem with it. But I don’t agree with it when it comes to fighting. If a transgender woman fights, they are going to be stronger than other women, so I don’t think it’s right. There are still advantages they are going to have from having previously been a man that no amount of drugs are going to erase.”




I should only have to post ONE of these. One would be more than sufficient. But here's a whole group of them. It's THEIR sport.

Last I checked, no one in the "Live and Let Live" sorority here was either female, a boxer, or ever had to fight a transgender male.

Read these AGAIN, Beanz. Tell me once again why your presumptions and Ron's "reasoned, sensible and nuanced points" are worth a hill of beans when stacked up against the opinions of women who actually have to step into the ring with transgender boxers. THEN... get back to me. In the meantime, keep your ignorant rants to yourself.

You’re still making a fake argument to excuse trying to steal someone’s rights. Notice not one of those quotes is about a woman being forced to fight a transgender woman. Find one of those and you will have a point. As is all you have is your bigotry. No boxer is forced to fight anyone, ever. But go back to your big book of bigotry for your morals. Steal people’s rights and claim morality.

[Fenster]

let's let the Ron's and the Beanzs and the Fensters of the world continue carrying their torch.

Show me where I posted before you wrote this?

If you can't, i'm willing to accept an apology and move on (i'll ignore the paranoia and lies).

[TitoFan]

let's let the Ron's and the Beanzs and the Fensters of the world continue carrying their torch.

Show me where I posted before you wrote this?

If you can't, i'm willing to accept an apology and move on (i'll ignore the paranoia and lies).

'Cause you don't have the same sensitive scabs on transgender that Beanz does? 'Cause you haven't devoted volumes of posts to ridicule the opinions of those of us who object to certain things regarding transgenderism? (This being one of them). Gimme a break and for god's sake be an adult about this. There's a history here. You gonna pretend otherwise? You and Beanz play tag wrestling on this and other subjects. By the way, you liked Swanson's post also.

What the f*ck is your major problem with me? Is it my deodorant?

BTW, did I mention how much your opinion means to me?

[Fenster]

let's let the Ron's and the Beanzs and the Fensters of the world continue carrying their torch.

Show me where I posted before you wrote this?

If you can't, i'm willing to accept an apology and move on (i'll ignore the paranoia and lies).

'Cause you don't have the same sensitive scabs on transgender that Beanz does? 'Cause you haven't devoted volumes of posts to ridicule the opinions of those of us who object to certain things regarding transgenderism? (This being one of them). Gimme a break and for god's sake be an adult about this. There's a history here. You gonna pretend otherwise? You and Beanz play tag wrestling on this and other subjects. By the way, you liked Swanson's post also.

What the f*ck is your major problem with me? Is it my deodorant?

BTW, did I mention how much your opinion means to me?

So no apology just more lies and paranoia and as I already noted you're the "victim." So, so predictable.

You don't care about my opinion but feel the need to invent it and monitor the posts I "like?" Seriously, get a grip. I "liked" Ron's post purely for his stance on gay adoption, that's all. My gawd, the paranoia.

[TitoFan]

let's let the Ron's and the Beanzs and the Fensters of the world continue carrying their torch.

Show me where I posted before you wrote this?

If you can't, i'm willing to accept an apology and move on (i'll ignore the paranoia and lies).

'Cause you don't have the same sensitive scabs on transgender that Beanz does? 'Cause you haven't devoted volumes of posts to ridicule the opinions of those of us who object to certain things regarding transgenderism? (This being one of them). Gimme a break and for god's sake be an adult about this. There's a history here. You gonna pretend otherwise? You and Beanz play tag wrestling on this and other subjects. By the way, you liked Swanson's post also.

What the f*ck is your major problem with me? Is it my deodorant?

BTW, did I mention how much your opinion means to me?

So no apology just more lies and paranoia and as I already noted you're the "victim." So, so predictable.

You don't care about my opinion but feel the need to invent it and monitor the posts I "like?" Seriously, get a grip. I "liked" Ron's post purely for his stance on gay adoption, that's all. My gawd, the paranoia.

No paranoia Fenster. Just a lot of experience arguing with you on other threads about the transgender issue. I don't invent your opinion either. You make it very clear. It's not your opinion I have a problem with. It's the way you go about tearing down other people's opinions. You may not notice it, but you do. He who's without sin cast the first stone and all that jazz.

No victim here, Fenster. Just clearing the air. I still don't know how my opinion that transgenders fighting women boxers could be a safety issue and I'm against it, got turned into "sexism". Put your dislike of me aside for a minute. Does that not strike you as just a little inaccurate? Again... call me a bully... opinionated... and all the names I'm sure you have on a list. But sexist? My god... enough with the homophobic accusations to be called sexist also.

News flash: Trying to protect women boxers is NOT sexist. Personal choice is fine. If a woman boxer doesn't mind facing a transgender who used to be a man... hell... go for it. But the majority don't. And if ever the situation arises that a woman champion has a transgender mandatory... chooses not to fight that opponent... and gets stripped (not that far-fetched)... then we'll be singing a different tune.

Predictability... victim playing... nobody here has a monopoly on any of this shit, Fenster.

Also, if it hasn't been made clear already, I'm not against those who want to change their gender. I personally don't agree with that... but I don't believe in preventing people from doing whatever they want to do with themselves. I just object it being done to children, and you may (or not) be interested in that one article where I posted about some women who feel victimized by others pressuring them to act on their child's transgender feelings.

The same arguments bring out the same vitriol from the same suspects, who predictably land on the same, opposite sides of the fence. Hey it's ok to have different opinions. I just wish for once we could all have a decent conversation without it going down the tubes.

[Ron Swanson]

In short, a woman changes into a man and wants to fight men? It's her choice.

A man changes into a woman and wants to fight women? He's being forced onto opponents who want no part of it.

'Nough said.

In short you are sexist as hell. What about a person born where their gender is indistinguishable? That’s 1/60, what do you wish as the superior male to impose on them? Black, white, male, female, when we all stop imposing ourselves on those we view as different from us this world will be far better off.

I remember 10/12 years ago a huge debate on a different boxing site about if gay people should be allowed to adopt. Of course I was on the side that thinks children are better off growing up with love. But I was practically alone. The same debate now seems absurd now that the data is in. Transgender doesn’t mean deciding you are the other sex. There is years of living as the other sex, years of hormone replacement, and eventually surgery. They are women by every hormonal standard and hormones decide everything about us. Come back to this argument in 20 years and it will seem as stupid as the “should gays be able to adopt” argument. Let people be. Through all human history we judge one group then another and impose upon them. The Chinese, the Irish, the blacks, the gays(yes, I am deliberately using these terms) and afterward we are always “we shouldn’t have done that. Every, single, time. Stop falling into the same trap

This is much different than just being racist or sexist. This is about asking about an unfair advantage. For example, if a black man beats a white man in a race, nobody would call it cheating. If a man pretends to be a woman and races against a woman and wins, people would call it cheating because men are naturally more athletic in every way. That’s biology not sexist.

Now I know that there are many different situations when it comes to sex and gender. So I can understand an argument if hormone levels are essentially female but maybe you just have male parts. It’s a serious situation though when you have a woman who trains all of her life to win the Olympics and ends up losing to a “woman” that was born much more of a man than a woman. Also in combat sports, it becomes more dangerous. That’s why men and women don’t fight each other. It’s way too dangerous.

So don’t be one of those people who just call people sexist and don’t actually have a good argument for your name calling.

He literally said it depends on sex, that is the definition of sexist.

What should be considered and is ignored in this is that no woman would be forced to fight a transgender woman, or more correctly another woman. But when you say “you can’t because...” someone is being forced. Someone is having their rights taken away. The simple and fair solution is let people decide who they want to fight and don’t want to fight. That couldn’t possibly be more obvious and if you return to this debate in 20 years it will be as obvious as it should be now.

[p4pking]

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