Not GGG bashing but...

[Gandalf]

Canelo is already a great and currently P4P top five with just about every reputable historian/publication/"expert" and genuine boxing fan on the planet. Why? These people are judging him purely on his boxing career, with a neutral mind and without outside influences. He's beat/fought more top names than anyone apart from Manny. Fact.

However, Beanz is right, if you read forums like this you'd think he was a useless hype job. Why? Simply the fact most fans can't separate their emotion and bias when assessing fighters.

I swear you are trolling. Many have him with 5 losses on his resume and he has not beaten a top fighter convincingly. He is overrated because of those decisions. If he is top 5 then what does that make GGG who as good as he is is still in the words of Calzaghe somewhat 'one dimensional'. Canelo lost both times. Canelo doesn't stay in a division and prove himself, he doesn't rematch fights beyond GGG, and so there are many question marks. He was beaten easily by Mayweather who went night and day with Maidana. He was outboxed by Khan, by Lara, by GGG. He took on an ancient Mosley and Cotto. It is smoke and mirrors. There is no emotion in pointing these things out.

That is where people say overrated when they hear comments like yours, Fenster. Sure he is slick and has handspeed, but he seldom sustains it to win a clean decision unless it is to stop chinny Khan or Fielding.

Hopefully Kovalev is not battle weary and lands that jab on the button and a few mean leads. Now that is emotion as I like Kovalev and think he has been stiffed GGG style himself.

[Fenster]

Canelo is already a great and currently P4P top five with just about every reputable historian/publication/"expert" and genuine boxing fan on the planet. Why? These people are judging him purely on his boxing career, with a neutral mind and without outside influences. He's beat/fought more top names than anyone apart from Manny. Fact.

However, Beanz is right, if you read forums like this you'd think he was a useless hype job. Why? Simply the fact most fans can't separate their emotion and bias when assessing fighters.

I swear you are trolling. Many have him with 5 losses on his resume and he has not beaten a top fighter convincingly. He is overrated because of those decisions. If he is top 5 then what does that make GGG who as good as he is is still in the words of Calzaghe somewhat 'one dimensional'. Canelo lost both times. Canelo doesn't stay in a division and prove himself, he doesn't rematch fights beyond GGG, and so there are many question marks. He was beaten easily by Mayweather who went night and day with Maidana. He was outboxed by Khan, by Lara, by GGG. He took on an ancient Mosley and Cotto. It is smoke and mirrors. There is no emotion in pointing these things out.

That is where people say overrated when they hear comments like yours, Fenster. Sure he is slick and has handspeed, but he seldom sustains it to win a clean decision unless it is to stop chinny Khan or Fielding.

Hopefully Kovalev is not battle weary and lands that jab on the button and a few mean leads. Now that is emotion as I like Kovalev and think he has been stiffed GGG style himself.

Funk me, couldn't make it up. Thanks for proving my point.

Your post is utterly cringeworthy - "beaten easily by Mayweather who struggled with Maidana"......"outboxed by Khan".... "Cotto and Mosley don't count".... "Lara robbed".... It is biased childish stuff. Childish.

Seriously, dudes, it doesn't get more embarrassing than using a loss to Floyd as a put-down. Come on...

[Gandalf]

Canelo is already a great and currently P4P top five with just about every reputable historian/publication/"expert" and genuine boxing fan on the planet. Why? These people are judging him purely on his boxing career, with a neutral mind and without outside influences. He's beat/fought more top names than anyone apart from Manny. Fact.

However, Beanz is right, if you read forums like this you'd think he was a useless hype job. Why? Simply the fact most fans can't separate their emotion and bias when assessing fighters.

I swear you are trolling. Many have him with 5 losses on his resume and he has not beaten a top fighter convincingly. He is overrated because of those decisions. If he is top 5 then what does that make GGG who as good as he is is still in the words of Calzaghe somewhat 'one dimensional'. Canelo lost both times. Canelo doesn't stay in a division and prove himself, he doesn't rematch fights beyond GGG, and so there are many question marks. He was beaten easily by Mayweather who went night and day with Maidana. He was outboxed by Khan, by Lara, by GGG. He took on an ancient Mosley and Cotto. It is smoke and mirrors. There is no emotion in pointing these things out.

That is where people say overrated when they hear comments like yours, Fenster. Sure he is slick and has handspeed, but he seldom sustains it to win a clean decision unless it is to stop chinny Khan or Fielding.

Hopefully Kovalev is not battle weary and lands that jab on the button and a few mean leads. Now that is emotion as I like Kovalev and think he has been stiffed GGG style himself.

Funk me, couldn't make it up. Thanks for proving my point.

Your post is utterly cringeworthy - "beaten easily by Mayweather who struggled with Maidana"......"outboxed by Khan".... "Cotto and Mosley don't count".... "Lara robbed".... It is biased childish stuff. Childish.

Seriously, dudes, it doesn't get more embarrassing than using a loss to Floyd as a put-down. Come on...

I have just watched Khan/Alvarez and seen a 2 division smaller guy just win 4 rounds on the trot. GGG tried that trick against Brook (less small) and didn't find himself in such a hole. An ATG does not lose as many rounds as Alvarez does. The ATG is a Calzaghe or a Jones or even early Mayweather type who wins effortlessly and at will.

Can you imagine a Calzaghe in against Canelo? There are levels in boxing and Canelo is not on that level of adaptability, intelligence, or skill. He would be fun against certain champions, but he isn't a great by any means. He's a drugged up Baldomir squeaking his way through losses and then these other fights like Fielding, Smith, Angulo, Kirkland.

It is trollish to even consider him an ATG. He has no decisive significant wins due to his strange stamina issues despite being in his 20's. He is OVERRATED.

[Fenster]

Canelo is already a great and currently P4P top five with just about every reputable historian/publication/"expert" and genuine boxing fan on the planet. Why? These people are judging him purely on his boxing career, with a neutral mind and without outside influences. He's beat/fought more top names than anyone apart from Manny. Fact.

However, Beanz is right, if you read forums like this you'd think he was a useless hype job. Why? Simply the fact most fans can't separate their emotion and bias when assessing fighters.

I swear you are trolling. Many have him with 5 losses on his resume and he has not beaten a top fighter convincingly. He is overrated because of those decisions. If he is top 5 then what does that make GGG who as good as he is is still in the words of Calzaghe somewhat 'one dimensional'. Canelo lost both times. Canelo doesn't stay in a division and prove himself, he doesn't rematch fights beyond GGG, and so there are many question marks. He was beaten easily by Mayweather who went night and day with Maidana. He was outboxed by Khan, by Lara, by GGG. He took on an ancient Mosley and Cotto. It is smoke and mirrors. There is no emotion in pointing these things out.

That is where people say overrated when they hear comments like yours, Fenster. Sure he is slick and has handspeed, but he seldom sustains it to win a clean decision unless it is to stop chinny Khan or Fielding.

Hopefully Kovalev is not battle weary and lands that jab on the button and a few mean leads. Now that is emotion as I like Kovalev and think he has been stiffed GGG style himself.

Funk me, couldn't make it up. Thanks for proving my point.

Your post is utterly cringeworthy - "beaten easily by Mayweather who struggled with Maidana"......"outboxed by Khan".... "Cotto and Mosley don't count".... "Lara robbed".... It is biased childish stuff. Childish.

Seriously, dudes, it doesn't get more embarrassing than using a loss to Floyd as a put-down. Come on...

I have just watched Khan/Alvarez and seen a 2 division smaller guy just win 4 rounds on the trot. GGG tried that trick against Brook (less small) and didn't find himself in such a hole. An ATG does not lose as many rounds as Alvarez does. The ATG is a Calzaghe or a Jones or even early Mayweather type who wins effortlessly and at will.

Can you imagine a Calzaghe in against Canelo? There are levels in boxing and Canelo is not on that level of adaptability, intelligence, or skill. He would be fun against certain champions, but he isn't a great by any means. He's a drugged up Baldomir squeaking his way through losses and then these other fights like Fielding, Smith, Angulo, Kirkland.

It is trollish to even consider him an ATG. He has no decisive significant wins due to his strange stamina issues despite being in his 20's. He is OVERRATED.

The very point I made is growing stronger and stronger with your every post.

[Gandalf]

You are making a case on victories that you know yourself did not happen despite them being on the record books. You also seem to ignore how easily he tends to be outboxed. It is just not the hallmark of an ATG. It would be like Mayweather losing the first 4 rounds to Marquez. And it was wrong to make that fight and miss the weight too.

I make the case that he is a competent fighter. His main attrbutes being durability and having good handspeed and movement. However, he is hardly ATG.

Manny is a much better fighter and despite his close mid career fights gave nearly everyone a chance to do it again. Canelo gets a gift and is never to be seen again.