Canelo now a free agent

[TitoFan]

Like who? I see Pascal in there but he's ancient and shop worn. Then again... that's how Canelo likes them.

Benavidez looks like the only true good option in there.

I guess you could mention Plant, but he probably couldn't hang with Canelo.

Canelo is fighting at 168. He isn’t going back down to 160. He also isn’t going to 175 for a beast like Beterbiev. Benavidez and Plant seem to be about the best at 168 so might as well fight them.

He went up to 175 for damaged, exposed Kovalev. Why won't he then go up for Beterbiev? Because he hasn't turned 40 yet?

The Kovalev fight was specifically for a belt. He already became a title holder at that weight so he has no need to go up there again.

And you applaud that practice... ok.

So Canelo, who it must be said started his pro career at 140, reached a comfort level at 154 but could easily fight at 160... a division to where he was first called out by GGG.

He postponed that fight for a couple of years on the grounds that he "wasn't a middleweight", until he was good and ready (and had fought JCC Jr. at 170)... and THEN moved up to 160 and had his couple of fights with Golovkin.

All of a sudden he grows into his frame and can go up and pick off Kovalev at 175. You know... for the belt.

So now he's flexible enough to move through three divisions: 160, 168, 175.

Jermall Charlo has called out Canelo and would be happy to meet him at 160... oh... but Canelo cannot "drain" himself to make 160.

So help me out here. Has Canelo pigeonholed himself into 168? Or is this "opponent-dependent"?

I'd probably understand a bit better if Canelo's team would release a set of conditions under which Canelo can go down to 160 or up to 175.

I think you misunderstand me. I’m not saying I agree with it. I’m saying that’s why he isn’t going back up to 175. He got the belt and he has no motivation to fight again at that weight. He most likely won’t be able to make 160 again. So 168 is what is left for him.

No, I understand you perfectly. It's just that I'm used to fighters wanting to conquer weight divisions they are perfectly suited to fight in. Let's not kid ourselves... Canelo is perfectly suited for 175 as well as 168. It's not even that much of a stretch for him to (cough) "starve" himself to make 160 again. Many an ATG has been through three weight divisions and more.

I can guarantee you that if Bambi were to miraculously be handed a belt at 175... Canelo would be fighting him the next day. I don't like fighters whose whole career is predicated on picking off the lame zebras from the herd all for the sake of more trinkets. It gets horribly old after a while.

So I get it. You feel he's got no motivation to go to 175 again, and can't make 160. I on the other hand, feel he could compete at 175 if he wasn't such an entitled diva... and he can make 160 all day long.
As long as there isn't a Charlo there calling him out.

[palmerq]

I don't think he is perfectly suited for 175, he's just too short and is probably a bit smaller weight wise.. 168 seems to be where he should be at this time, he's an acceptable height for there and can apparently make the weight.. Sure he can fight at 175 but I don't think you can say he's perfectly suited for there...

Of course there may come a time when he can't make 168 anymore and then I'd say his career is over as a top guy. Theres some good fights for him at 168, plant sounds like a good start.

[TitoFan]

I don't think he is perfectly suited for 175, he's just too short and is probably a bit smaller weight wise.. 168 seems to be where he should be at this time, he's an acceptable height for there and can apparently make the weight.. Sure he can fight at 175 but I don't think you can say he's perfectly suited for there...

Of course there may come a time when he can't make 168 anymore and then I'd say his career is over as a top guy. Theres some good fights for him at 168, plant sounds like a good start.

Here's a quote from DLH back when discussing rehydration clauses for Canelo's fight with Jacobs last year....

"A lot of people don’t realize that Canelo is the bigger guy,” De La Hoya said. “He’s smaller, but he’s thicker. He’s always been a guy with a thick neck, and thick legs. Canelo has always been the one to drop weight. Canelo walks around at 190, 185. So a lot of people will be very surprised when they step inside the ring and see the minimal difference in size,” De La Hoya said."


So we can talk about height if you want... and I'll bring up that Dwight Muhammad Qawi was a very successful light heavy at all of 5'7". Canelo's listed at 5'9". 'Nuff said.

Or... we can talk about how De La Hoya himself says that Canelo's walking around weight is around 185 to 190.

Either way... it doesn't matter. If Canelo saw fit to dart to 175 to pick off the damaged goods Kovalev to grab a trinket... he should be expected to fight others in the division who are only too happy to call him out.

[palmerq]

I don't rate de la Hoya as a very reliable source.

[TitoFan]

I don't rate de la Hoya as a very reliable source.

I don't either... but I have no problems believing that Canelo walks around at that weight.

[Kirkland Laing]

I wonder what Golovkin has to be thinking right now and did Dazn look at this as a three-piece all along.

Loads of known unknowns here. I think there'll be a clause in his contract saying that if he doesn't get the big payday with Alvarez he can walk. But will he want to in the current climate. He's not getting any younger. His contract money won't be guaranteed. How keen are DAZN to keep hold of him now that Alvarez has walked and what kind of escape clause do they have from the contract. Are they as big on boxing as they were when they signed those two.

[Spicoli]

I wonder what Golovkin has to be thinking right now and did Dazn look at this as a three-piece all along.

Loads of known unknowns here. I think there'll be a clause in his contract saying that if he doesn't get the big payday with Alvarez he can walk. But will he want to in the current climate. He's not getting any younger. His contract money won't be guaranteed. How keen are DAZN to keep hold of him now that Alvarez has walked and what kind of escape clause do they have from the contract. Are they as big on boxing as they were when they signed those two.

Be very interesting to see the aftermath. I respect the hell out of Golovkin but have always though he just sort of followed along with DAZN. I read that Andrades 'fight' with his welterweight fell through. Maybe Golovkin can give him the massive fight he believes he deserves. Then again being a free agent, can't Canelo opt for a one-done deal with Oscar and company or has that bridge completely gone up like the one over the River Kwai.

[Kirkland Laing]

I wonder what Golovkin has to be thinking right now and did Dazn look at this as a three-piece all along.

Loads of known unknowns here. I think there'll be a clause in his contract saying that if he doesn't get the big payday with Alvarez he can walk. But will he want to in the current climate. He's not getting any younger. His contract money won't be guaranteed. How keen are DAZN to keep hold of him now that Alvarez has walked and what kind of escape clause do they have from the contract. Are they as big on boxing as they were when they signed those two.

Be very interesting to see the aftermath. I respect the hell out of Golovkin but have always though he just sort of followed along with DAZN. I read that Andrades 'fight' with his welterweight fell through. Maybe Golovkin can give him the massive fight he believes he deserves. Then again being a free agent, can't Canelo opt for a one-done deal with Oscar and company or has that bridge completely gone up like the one over the River Kwai.

The number the media got for Golovkin's deal was north of a hundred million which was more than he'd made in his career even including the two Alvarez fights and was given to him at a point in his career when he's on the final stretch. They definitely overpaid significantly due to them having big designs on the boxing business.

I don't think that money was ever guaranteed. If the Alvarez contract wasn't, and it obviously wasn't because he'd never walk away from three hundred plus million guaranteed, then Golovkin's wasn't. So his future dpends a lot I think on just how invested DAZN still are in the boxing business and how Alvarez buggering off affects how they see Golovkin's commercial worth to them.

I'm sure if Alvarez offered Fishnets a deal that looked decent they'd snap his hand off. Without Alvarez Golden Boy are just a second tier promotional outfit on the west coast. Alvarez kept them in the big leagues after all their original stars retired and none of their prospects became PPV level. Maybe I'm forgetting somebody they have who is making money but now they're pretty much the west coast version of Main Events.

[powerpuncher]

I wonder what Golovkin has to be thinking right now and did Dazn look at this as a three-piece all along.

Loads of known unknowns here. I think there'll be a clause in his contract saying that if he doesn't get the big payday with Alvarez he can walk. But will he want to in the current climate. He's not getting any younger. His contract money won't be guaranteed. How keen are DAZN to keep hold of him now that Alvarez has walked and what kind of escape clause do they have from the contract. Are they as big on boxing as they were when they signed those two.

Be very interesting to see the aftermath. I respect the hell out of Golovkin but have always though he just sort of followed along with DAZN. I read that Andrades 'fight' with his welterweight fell through. Maybe Golovkin can give him the massive fight he believes he deserves. Then again being a free agent, can't Canelo opt for a one-done deal with Oscar and company or has that bridge completely gone up like the one over the River Kwai.

The number the media got for Golovkin's deal was north of a hundred million which was more than he'd made in his career even including the two Alvarez fights and was given to him at a point in his career when he's on the final stretch. They definitely overpaid significantly due to them having big designs on the boxing business.

I don't think that money was ever guaranteed. If the Alvarez contract wasn't, and it obviously wasn't because he'd never walk away from three hundred plus million guaranteed, then Golovkin's wasn't. So his future dpends a lot I think on just how invested DAZN still are in the boxing business and how Alvarez buggering off affects how they see Golovkin's commercial worth to them.

I'm sure if Alvarez offered Fishnets a deal that looked decent they'd snap his hand off. Without Alvarez Golden Boy are just a second tier promotional outfit on the west coast. Alvarez kept them in the big leagues after all their original stars retired and none of their prospects became PPV level. Maybe I'm forgetting somebody they have who is making money but now they're pretty much the west coast version of Main Events.

Golden boy promotions looked so promising years back when they were first starting out. They have proven to be a mess though and constantly have problems with their biggest names

[TitoFan]

Too much talk about contracts, clauses, money, and who owes what to who... particularly in boxing... makes my eyes glaze over eventually. It's a pet peeve of mine that I'll gladly discuss or get interested in finance and economics when talking about government or companies. But boxing?? Meh...

That being said, I shed no tears for DAZN. I see them as the greedy bastards who yanked boxing away from television, by first enticing everyone with cute little cheap deals... when everyone knew full well that at some point they'd lower the boom when the fish had been caught (us). Besides... nobody can sell me on watching fights streamed live, when I got so used to the fanfare accompanying major fights on HBO, Showtime, and the like. Old fashioned, I guess.

But damn it if... when boxing talk starts resembling the T-Mobile takeover of Sprint... I gradually tune it out until it's just white noise.

Regarding Canelo leaving Fishnets, yeah... it's a big blow. But like the spurned girlfriend, Oscar has Ryan Garcia to turn to and ease the pain.

[Spicoli]

Too much talk about contracts, clauses, money, and who owes what to who... particularly in boxing... makes my eyes glaze over eventually. It's a pet peeve of mine that I'll gladly discuss or get interested in finance and economics when talking about government or companies. But boxing?? Meh...

That being said, I shed no tears for DAZN. I see them as the greedy bastards who yanked boxing away from television, by first enticing everyone with cute little cheap deals... when everyone knew full well that at some point they'd lower the boom when the fish had been caught (us). Besides... nobody can sell me on watching fights streamed live, when I got so used to the fanfare accompanying major fights on HBO, Showtime, and the like. Old fashioned, I guess.

But damn it if... when boxing talk starts resembling the T-Mobile takeover of Sprint... I gradually tune it out until it's just white noise.

Regarding Canelo leaving Fishnets, yeah... it's a big blow. But like the spurned girlfriend, Oscar has Ryan Garcia to turn to and ease the pain.

Would have loved to be a fly on the wall when the news dropped a franchise was leaving them. They need to put some meat on the grill instead of milking the heffer with Saturday nights of Danny Jacobs v Gabe Rosado and Andrade v a TBA for a TBA . All I'm sayin is they better remind Joshua that rotund bubbly Andy Ruiz was a real incident when he stares across at Pulev next up. Stranger things have happened.

[Spicoli]

Has a massive lawsuit squabble with Oscar and DAZN among talk of Smith-Saunders bouts..becomes free agent..returns to DAZN for Smith. I believe Lydon said it best, ever get the feeling you've been cheated

[powerpuncher]

I wanted Plant more than Smith. Has Smith been training?

[TitoFan]

I wanted Plant more than Smith.

So did Canelo.

[powerpuncher]

It sounds like Plant said there wasn’t enough time to train. But I also heard rumors that there wasn’t enough time to market it well