Who is next for Canelo?

[TitoFan]

Let's take your many questions individually.

wasn't canelo ranked number one at jr middleweight & a unified champ when he fought floyd?

You're a knowledgeable boxing fan. So it's safe to presume that you know that rankings don't always reflect merit or the deserving of a shot. Especially where joke orgs like the WBC (We Blow Canelo) are involved.

so guys like callum smith just laid down for canelo? why weren't they lying down for each other before canelo got there?

I'll answer your question with another question. Are you suggesting that Callum fought Canelo like he's fought other opponents before or since then?

firstly as i understand it, that was only a proposal not an actual contract or offer & we only have badou's word to go by. did badou counter with his own proposal or offer?

So the fact that it wasn't an actual contract makes it less shameful? The fact that it was only a proposal gets Ginger off the hook? Word of advice: If you ever consider lawyering, don't.

BTW, Badou's word is good enough for me. It was widely reported by credible news sources. Or are we to only believe those that are convenient for our arguments? Can't pick and choose.

Did Badou counter with his own proposal or offer? Yeah. Hopefully he told Canelo to shove it up his ass. Sounds like a good counter to me.

let's say badou weighed 200 for his fight prior to that proposal & we'll say canelo was 168 for convenience, that's roughly a 32 pound difference. so canelo was asking badou to drop twenty pounds & he would come up twelve pounds. again it was just a proposal, badou was not being forced into it & if we say it is all true then he was able to turn it down or counter. i don't know if there was a counter but we know badou turned down that proposal.

These get worse as they go along.

I can almost hear the fumbling around, grasping for straws. First you mumble something about weight differences, as if to minimize the embarrassment Ginger subjected himself to by making this ridiculous offer to Badou. Then you go with "well, Badou was not being forced into it." Damn... that's weak.

Like I said, keep you day job. Don't go into lawyering.

i guess you have to ask yourself do you respect miguel cotto or manny pacquiao for requesting catchweights from guys who were well less than 32 pounds above them in their previous fights? miguel had a 153 catchweight for the antonio margarito rematch although he weighed 154 in his previous fight & there was a jr middleweight belt on the line, he also had a 157 catchweight for daniel geale who only weighed five pounds more than miguel in their previous fights & there was a middleweight belt on the line. we can do manny but i think you get my point. besides canelo v badou never happened, miguel & manny's catchweight fights did

Your desperation comes full circle, as you bring up Cotto and Pacquiao. Once again, I'll preface by saying you're a knowledgeable boxing fan. So presumably you know the difference between catchweights of a few pounds, (which many boxers have done), versus a guy who habitually leaps up a division or two to pick off a weak or depleted "champion", with the only purpose of adding a meaningless trinket to his mantle.

Cotto never did that. Pacquiao never did that. I don't know of ANY fighter that has shamelessly sought out opponents way beyond their division, to try and grab a meaningless trinket. (And then go scurrying back to the safety of his own weight).

You can grasp at straws. You can look for obscure exceptions. You can twist words. You can reach for examples that aren't really relevant.

NOTHING... and I mean NOTHING... will change the fact that Ginger will always be looked at... not just by me... but by MANY boxing fans and experts... as a manufactured champion who always stacked the deck in his favor, had a major boxing org by the balls, got the nod on more than one questionable decision, reached for easy prey (avoiding real challenges), and just plain f*cked up boxing for a great many of us.

You don't see ANY other champion in any other division getting the hate that Canelo does. There must be a reason for that.

[TIC]

what guys were more deserving that canelo for floyd to fight at jr middleweight?

canelo made callum look basic because he was so much better. i can't blame canelo for that. if guys like callum were just lying down like you stated then why weren't they fighting each other before canelo moved back up?

it was just a proposal. no contract was sent. jack could have countered

badou wasn't being forced to do anything, he could have countered. you don't think 32 pounds is a big weight difference for guys outside of heavyweight? maybe badou could have countered with both guys giving up 16 pounds, badou dropping 16 & canelo moving up 16

canelo proposed the catchweight because there was a 32 pound weight difference between badou & his previous fights. manny & miguel were getting catchweights from guys who were only a few pounds above them in their previous fights. manny picked up a meaningless vacant trinket against antonio margarito with a catchweight. if badou had of countered with a 16 pound drop maybe canelo would have considered it

the rest of your post is just subjective

[TIC]

@TitoFan would you think it's reasonable for nonito donaire (i'm not comparing him to canelo or ages or points of their careers at the time just the weights here) after he lost to carl frampton at featherweight & went back to bantamweight after that to fight a guy at 150? do you think it would be reasonable for him to propose a catchweight of 130? & if the guy at 150 countered & said look i can't drop 20 pounds but what if we meet half way & i come down 16 pounds & you come up 16 pounds & we fight at 134 & do you think it would be reasonable for nonito to also propose a rehydration clause on the heavier guy?

[TitoFan]

@TitoFan would you think it's reasonable for nonito donaire (i'm not comparing him to canelo or ages or points of their careers at the time just the weights here) after he lost to carl frampton at featherweight & went back to bantamweight after that to fight a guy at 150? do you think it would be reasonable for him to propose a catchweight of 130? & if the guy at 150 countered & said look i can't drop 20 pounds but what if we meet half way & i come down 16 pounds & you come up 16 pounds & we fight at 134 & do you think it would be reasonable for nonito to also propose a rehydration clause on the heavier guy?

First, I'm glad you specified that you're not comparing Nonito to Canelo.

Second, this is strictly hypothetical right? It never happened.

Unless it actually did happen, I just don't see Nonito wanting to challenge a 150-pounder. Many reasons here. At the lower weights, the difference between divisions is smaller. The little guys (the elite ones) are very disciplined as to their weight, and don't normally entertain fantasies about jumping two divisions to grab a trinket. They'll move up a division and test the waters. If their skills translate into the higher division, they'll stay there. And so on and so forth.

So this hypothetical situation is very unlikely, and just wouldn't happen with the elite guys at the lower weights. If something like that occurred it would be a sham.

Odd you would pick Nonito for this example. He's one of my favorite fighters, and the antithesis of a Canelo. All business... got his 1st loss out of the way early... never shied away from a challenge... and didn't go for this diva B.S. Then again, you can say that for most elite fighters at the lower divisions.

[TIC]

@TitoFan would you think it's reasonable for nonito donaire (i'm not comparing him to canelo or ages or points of their careers at the time just the weights here) after he lost to carl frampton at featherweight & went back to bantamweight after that to fight a guy at 150? do you think it would be reasonable for him to propose a catchweight of 130? & if the guy at 150 countered & said look i can't drop 20 pounds but what if we meet half way & i come down 16 pounds & you come up 16 pounds & we fight at 134 & do you think it would be reasonable for nonito to also propose a rehydration clause on the heavier guy?

First, I'm glad you specified that you're not comparing Nonito to Canelo.

Second, this is strictly hypothetical right? It never happened.

Unless it actually did happen, I just don't see Nonito wanting to challenge a 150-pounder. Many reasons here. At the lower weights, the difference between divisions is smaller. The little guys (the elite ones) are very disciplined as to their weight, and don't normally entertain fantasies about jumping two divisions to grab a trinket. They'll move up a division and test the waters. If their skills translate into the higher division, they'll stay there. And so on and so forth.

So this hypothetical situation is very unlikely, and just wouldn't happen with the elite guys at the lower weights. If something like that occurred it would be a sham.

Odd you would pick Nonito for this example. He's one of my favorite fighters, and the antithesis of a Canelo. All business... got his 1st loss out of the way early... never shied away from a challenge... and didn't go for this diva B.S. Then again, you can say that for most elite fighters at the lower divisions.

as i said i'm just comparing the weights. i only used nonito because he was a fighter who went up & then came back down in weight similar to canelo in recent times. forget the fighters altogether. outside of heavyweight if fighter a was the star & wanted to fight a guy 32 pounds heavier than him from their previous fights & probably offer him a career high payday, do you think requesting he come up 12 pounds & fighter b come down 20 pounds is a reasonable starting point to propose for a catchweight? or do you think there shouldn't be a catchweight at all?

[TitoFan]

This is all a matter of preference. For my taste, I dislike fighters seeking matches with that much of a weight difference. We have weight divisions for a reason. A fighter going up several weight divisions is fine. Just do it naturally, and preferably one division at a time. You go up a division? Establish dominance at that division before seeking to continue going up. If you don't do this, you're whoring yourself out seeking meaningless trinkets, and ignoring deserving fighters around you. When fans lend credence to this shit, they're doing a disservice to the sport, IMO. If a fighter can climb one, two, three divisions throughout the course of his career, all the more power to him. But the hopscotch targeting of weak division champions, or asking much heavier champions to drain themselves... is contrary to the traditional and competitive nature of the sport. Again, my opinion.

[NoSavingByTheBell]

This is all a matter of preference. For my taste, I dislike fighters seeking matches with that much of a weight difference. We have weight divisions for a reason. A fighter going up several weight divisions is fine. Just do it naturally, and preferably one division at a time. You go up a division? Establish dominance at that division before seeking to continue going up. If you don't do this, you're whoring yourself out seeking meaningless trinkets, and ignoring deserving fighters around you. When fans lend credence to this shit, they're doing a disservice to the sport, IMO. If a fighter can climb one, two, three divisions throughout the course of his career, all the more power to him. But the hopscotch targeting of weak division champions, or asking much heavier champions to drain themselves... is contrary to the traditional and competitive nature of the sport. Again, my opinion.

"Whoring yourself out as Hopscotch Targeting"

by TitoFan

What a little whore
Hopscotch bitch
Simon says
Alvarez

Catchweight Clenbuteral
Tainted steak
Floyd and Biv whipped his ass
The Cinnamon Coddled Fake

[TIC]

let me rephrase the question. do you think it's reasonable for a fighter to propose that another fighter come down 20 pounds for a fight?

it's not like badou is the first fighter who would have had to drop 20 pounds from his previous fight weight. archie moore did more than that a couple of times in his career. roy jones jr dropped 18 pounds to come back down to fight antonio tarver. james toney dropped 31 pounds to come back down to cruiserweight & 25 pounds to fight earl butler, ossie ocasio dropped about 27 pounds, orlin norris did it a couple of times, glenn mccrory & others