Jack Johnson vs Gene Tunney

[Kev]

Bilbo, Newton was 300 years ahead of his time cc for the anology

Thanks Scrap cc returned , and coming from someone who was born contemporary with Newton that means a lot

[Chris Nagel]

By the way has anybody seen the Jack Johnson documentary? It's was really good, I can't remember who was the guy that taught him his finer points while he was in jail.

[Trainer Monkey]

By the way has anybody seen the Jack Johnson documentary? It's was really good, I can't remember who was the guy that taught him his finer points while he was in jail.

Which one?
I just watched one recently,but I cant remember the name of it

[Kev]

By the way has anybody seen the Jack Johnson documentary? It's was really good, I can't remember who was the guy that taught him his finer points while he was in jail.

Yes I have it on DVD, it's called Unforgivable Blackness and was directed by Ken Burns.

The guy you are referring to was Joe Choynski. He knocked Johnson out in a fight in which both were arrested and put in prison for a month or so. Choynski then trained Johnson whilst they were inside.

It's quite apt really that Choynski was a Jew (historically the most hated race/nation of peoples who have ever lived) seeing as no normal white man would have wanted to befriend a negro and many boxers refused to even fight them.

The climate of hate that Johnson lived in is just something you can't even imagine today. Even the papers were openly racist about Johnson.

[Mr140]

I believe that Tunney had tougher opposition then Jack johnson did and beat bigger names

[Trainer Monkey]

I believe that Tunney had tougher opposition then Jack johnson did and beat bigger names

Tunney didnt have to fight the audience,and the press,along with the fighter in front of him
There were riots after he beat Jeffries

[Majesty]

Didn't Jack Dempsey duck Jack Johnson

[Kev]

I believe that Tunney had tougher opposition then Jack johnson did and beat bigger names

Tunney didnt have to fight the audience,and the press,along with the fighter in front of him
There were riots after he beat Jeffries

Good point. Jack Johnson used to carry fighters for 15 rounds or so to ensure there was enough footage for the fights to be screened at the cinemas.

[Jimanuel Boogustus]

Oh come off it!

That smells of bedtime fairy tales!

[Trainer Monkey]

I believe that Tunney had tougher opposition then Jack johnson did and beat bigger names

Tunney didnt have to fight the audience,and the press,along with the fighter in front of him
There were riots after he beat Jeffries

Good point. Jack Johnson used to carry fighters for 15 rounds or so to ensure there was enough footage for the fights to be screened at the cinemas.

cc back,he probably doesnt lose to Willard if he hadnt punched himself out

[Majesty]

did Jack Dempsey duck Jack Johnson?

[Kev]

did Jack Dempsey duck Jack Johnson?

He refused to fight any black fighters

[Majesty]

did Jack Dempsey duck Jack Johnson?

He refused to fight any black fighters

Harry WIlls could have beat him.

[Chris Nagel]

By the way has anybody seen the Jack Johnson documentary? It's was really good, I can't remember who was the guy that taught him his finer points while he was in jail.

Yes I have it on DVD, it's called Unforgivable Blackness and was directed by Ken Burns.

The guy you are referring to was Joe Choynski. He knocked Johnson out in a fight in which both were arrested and put in prison for a month or so. Choynski then trained Johnson whilst they were inside.

It's quite apt really that Choynski was a Jew (historically the most hated race/nation of peoples who have ever lived) seeing as no normal white man would have wanted to befriend a negro and many boxers refused to even fight them.

The climate of hate that Johnson lived in is just something you can't even imagine today. Even the papers were openly racist about Johnson.

By the way has anybody seen the Jack Johnson documentary? It's was really good, I can't remember who was the guy that taught him his finer points while he was in jail.

Yes I have it on DVD, it's called Unforgivable Blackness and was directed by Ken Burns.

The guy you are referring to was Joe Choynski. He knocked Johnson out in a fight in which both were arrested and put in prison for a month or so. Choynski then trained Johnson whilst they were inside.

It's quite apt really that Choynski was a Jew (historically the most hated race/nation of peoples who have ever lived) seeing as no normal white man would have wanted to befriend a negro and many boxers refused to even fight them.

The climate of hate that Johnson lived in is just something you can't even imagine today. Even the papers were openly racist about Johnson.

Thanks for that Bilbo. Jack Johnson was a tough game fighter before he took in what he could learn from Choynski, he had to endure what a lot of black fighters had to go through, the battle royal, and crooked promoters, it's remarkable how he overcame it although he still had to do what he had to do. It could well be the reason why he was so rebellious by his nature, all the pressure and circumstances of the time.

[ICB]

I'm a big Jack Johnson fan and reckon he could win this. He did struggle to get motivated for fights though.

A motivated Johnson would have been trouble for any fighter in history imo.

Even Larry Holmes said that he felt the only fighter in history who he would have struggled to beat was Jack Johnson.

Well Holmes must of been being nice to Johnson because no way Holmes would of struggled with Johnson he has very old boxing style that wouldn't work in newer eras Tunney by decision.

Have you ever even watched Johnson fight? Most fighters couldn't even lay a glove on him.

He was at least 50 years ahead of his time. If he would have lived and fought in another era he would have mastered the current level of boxing knowledge and built upon it again.

Do you think if Gallileo or Newton lived today they would be crap scientists and have less understanding of physics than the average high school student?

Of course not, they would absorb all of today's knowledge and build upon it. They would have been brilliant visonaries in any era, and so would have Jack Johnson.

Nice point but im not sure if Intelligence and Athleticism go hand in hand?

Athleticism wasn't what made Johnson great, it was a masterful understanding of the sweet science of the defensive arts. No matter what era he would have fought in his intuitive understanding of boxing would have made him a nightmare for anybody to face.

How anyone could possibly think his style wouldn't be any good today is completely beyond me to honest

Can anyone seriously imagine Sam Peter, Oleg Maskaev, Shannon Briggs and the like having a F****** cool about how to unlock his defense? He'd make most of today's heavies look silly.

I'd fancy his chances against any fighter who ever lived.

When did i say in todays era ?? i clearly stated i was on about 90s 80s 70s ect.

And he would lose to the following

Larry Holmes
Mike Tyson
Muhammad Ali
Riddick Bowe
Lennox Lewis
Sonny Liston
George Foreman
Joe Louis