You will call me crazy, but I think Roy has one big fight available

[Taeth]

Why does he need to punch that much against Hopkins? Taylor punched like 300 times in the first fight against Hopkins? I think thats exactly why Hopkins is a good opponent for him, it actually measures their skill. I think he is shot in terms of physically hanging with guys that throw a lot of punches, but that isn't Hopkins anymore, minus the fight against Pavlik and Wright , but seriously for the last 10 years he hasn't foughten like that.

[intoccabile]

Why does he need to punch that much against Hopkins? Taylor punched like 300 times in the first fight against Hopkins? I think thats exactly why Hopkins is a good opponent for him, it actually measures their skill. I think he is shot in terms of physically hanging with guys that throw a lot of punches, but that isn't Hopkins anymore, minus the fight against Pavlik and Wright , but seriously for the last 10 years he hasn't foughten like that.

Did you watch Hopkins Pavlik? Bhop was the aggressor.
After Roys last performances and clearly showing that he can't handle any form of offense, do you think Bhop will show roy the respect he did in their first fight? l

He'd come out and kill that man.

[Taeth]

He wouldn't kill Roy... give me a break when was the last time Bernard stopped a real middleweight or larger? Tito wasn't, Oscar wasn't. I love Bernard, but don't get carried away, Bernard only was the aggressor in the last few rounds, the rest of the time it was Pavlik's forward movement that allowed Bernard to get largely as many punches off as he did, and Pavlik is way easier to hit than Roy.

Neither of them are what they once were, but Hopkins' style works better against the younger guys. He doesn't have that same tiger he had in his prime, which is why he isn't as good as in his prime. I still say it could be a close fight.

[intoccabile]

He wouldn't kill Roy... give me a break when was the last time Bernard stopped a real middleweight or larger? Tito wasn't, Oscar wasn't. I love Bernard, but don't get carried away, Bernard only was the aggressor in the last few rounds, the rest of the time it was Pavlik's forward movement that allowed Bernard to get largely as many punches off as he did, and Pavlik is way easier to hit than Roy.

Neither of them are what they once were, but Hopkins' style works better against the younger guys. He doesn't have that same tiger he had in his prime, which is why he isn't as good as in his prime. I still say it could be a close fight.

When was the last time Hopkins fought someone as shot as Roy?
Give me a break. Hopkins entire career right now is based on fighting the fight that is needed to beat his opponent. The blueprint on roy jones has been drawn 3 times already. Do you honestly think Hopkins will fight the same Respectful fight he fought against roy the first time? When they first fought hopkins had NO good opponents on his record. Roy was 21-0 and the first undefeated or legit competition he had faced. They both showed each other tremendous respect.

Hopkins won't succumb to that type of fight again. Get real man. Roy won't even punch anymore! Hopkins will KILL HIM. It's a figure of speech, by the way. Just like Hopkins KILLED kelly Pavlik and KILLED Antonio Tarver. Those were slaughters imo.

Don't assume I mean he's going to knock someone out when I say he will kill them.

[Taeth]

He won't, he isn't fast enough, Roy will be able to react if Bernard walks straight in, how many times have we heard that Bernard would step it up, and he didn't, he should have against Taylor in their second fight that was clear by the end of the first fight, but he didn't. At the very least if Bernard comes forward, Roy is blocking pretty much everything.

They both were different fighters when they first fought. Bernard also got respect from jones because he was a knockout puncher in his own right, and he was a lot faster back then.

[intoccabile]

He won't, he isn't fast enough, Roy will be able to react if Bernard walks straight in, how many times have we heard that Bernard would step it up, and he didn't, he should have against Taylor in their second fight that was clear by the end of the first fight, but he didn't. At the very least if Bernard comes forward, Roy is blocking pretty much everything.

They both were different fighters when they first fought. Bernard also got respect from jones because he was a knockout puncher in his own right, and he was a lot faster back then.

" Roy will be able to react if bernard walks straight in "
Roy is shot bro. He won't do anything. This is what I'm trying to tell ya man.
He doesn't do ANYTHING anymore, so how could he possibly contend with a Bhop who arguably has only gotten better. Bernard is so smart. He knows Roy will ball up on the ropes.. He'll do enough to win a round, perserve energy, and retreat. And roy will do nothing about it.. because roy isn't even a shell of his former self.

As for Bernard supposed to step it up. Bernard is the most stubborn fighter in boxing. He doesn't listen to his trainer, he fights his fight. He thinks he's winning when he's not. So he continues to do what he thinks is right. He lost to Taylor twice, and Calzaghe because he thought that he was winning and didn't need to do anything different. 3 strikes you're out. He knows better now.. believe me.

He didn't turn it up before but he will now. And how much does he actually have to turn it up against a Roy who is reluctant to even punch anymore?

[Taeth]

He won't, he isn't fast enough, Roy will be able to react if Bernard walks straight in, how many times have we heard that Bernard would step it up, and he didn't, he should have against Taylor in their second fight that was clear by the end of the first fight, but he didn't. At the very least if Bernard comes forward, Roy is blocking pretty much everything.

They both were different fighters when they first fought. Bernard also got respect from jones because he was a knockout puncher in his own right, and he was a lot faster back then.

" Roy will be able to react if bernard walks straight in "
Roy is shot bro. He won't do anything. This is what I'm trying to tell ya man.
He doesn't do ANYTHING anymore, so how could he possibly contend with a Bhop who arguably has only gotten better. Bernard is so smart. He knows Roy will ball up on the ropes.. He'll do enough to win a round, perserve energy, and retreat. And roy will do nothing about it.. because roy isn't even a shell of his former self.

As for Bernard supposed to step it up. Bernard is the most stubborn fighter in boxing. He doesn't listen to his trainer, he fights his fight. He thinks he's winning when he's not. So he continues to do what he thinks is right. He lost to Taylor twice, and Calzaghe because he thought that he was winning and didn't need to do anything different. 3 strikes you're out. He knows better now.. believe me.

He didn't turn it up before but he will now. And how much does he actually have to turn it up against a Roy who is reluctant to even punch anymore?

How many times did B-Hop promise knockouts, how many times has he promised exciting fights. Just because he looked exciting agaisnt Pavlik doesn't mean he will look exciting against lets say Chad Dawson. He is going to lose if he tries to fight too offensively against a good boxer, and he knows that. His ability to win especially at LHW against legitimate LHW's is moving and countering and occasionally gaining their respect on the inside.

He threw only 530 punches against Pavlik. Roy threw 475 against Joe Calzaghe. Bernard threw 468 punches against Calzaghe and landed 127 of them by compubox while Roy landed 149. That is a higher punch output and a higher landing percentage against Joe which I saw as well, the only difference is that Calzaghe was allowed to throw about 300 more punches against Roy, but onceagain I felt he didn't land solid punches very often against either of them, but Roy was infront of him more, also Roy threw 482 punches against Tito Trinidad.

Roy landed plenty against Joe, it just wasn't enough to overcome the fact that hte last minute of every round he had his back against the rope, that is what people remember, but they don't acknowledge that Roy gave Joe a decent fight, and outlanded Joe when they were boxing in the middle of the ring which Joe clearly didn't want to happen, and he used his will and Roy's lack of will to do so, but I don't see Bernard coming forward with the same mentality as Joe like I've said.

[kingfrnk]

He won't, he isn't fast enough, Roy will be able to react if Bernard walks straight in, how many times have we heard that Bernard would step it up, and he didn't, he should have against Taylor in their second fight that was clear by the end of the first fight, but he didn't. At the very least if Bernard comes forward, Roy is blocking pretty much everything.

They both were different fighters when they first fought. Bernard also got respect from jones because he was a knockout puncher in his own right, and he was a lot faster back then.

so wat you are saying is that you think Roy can beat bhop as of now??

[Taeth]

I didn't say Roy wins, I am saying that it would be tougher for Bernard than you guys are making out, you guys are acting like Bernard is 28, HE ISN'T. He doesn't throw a lot of punches usually anymore, and Roy is hard to hit cleanly anyways.

The reason he couldn't react is because Joe Calzaghe is so fast, and he still countered Joe a few times... He isn't as shot as some people would make you believe, I predicted this would happen because Roy doesn't get off enough, physically he is fine, he still has the speed, he was never tired against Calzaghe, he just didn't QUITE have the reflexes to deal wtih Joe's arsenal and SPEED. Speed and output are the key factors.

BUT Joe is an offensive fighter which is the exact opposite of what Bernard has become, I believe this is a cerebral fight, and I also feel Bernard would want to prove he is the better fighter by trying to outbox Roy.

If Roy was getting hit cleanly at range by Calzaghe all night I would agree he was shot, but Joe couldn't hit him at range unless Roy's back was against the ropes or with the occasional jap that also landed on Bernard. 80% of the scoring punches Calzaghe landed on Roy were to the body.

What I am saying is that how long has been since Bernard consistently came forward, he didn't even do that against Oscar De La Hoya, its not in Bernard's nature anymore to come forward, and if he did at this stage I think it leaves him a lot more open then he would like.

Roy is definitely slower than he once was, but by Bernard's own admission Roy is still twice as fast as him.

You can go ahead and say I am wrong, but lets look back and see how many people thought Hopkins could totally outbox Pavlik.

I don't make predictions out of craziness, I make it out of what I see. I saw Calzaghe outpunch Roy on Saturday, I didn't see a higher level of skill from Calzaghe, I thought they both made eachother look bad when they had their hands down, I don't think Calzaghe looked good in the middle of the ring at all against Roy, and Roy looked poor off the ropes because he didn't throw anything.

If Bernard can keep Roy on the ropes for sure he would win, but the last 8 years would indicate that Bernard isn't that guy anymore, and that he definitely is the KO puncher that would take Roy out.

[The Genius]

Roy has nothing left. NOTHING.

Watching him fight Joe was like the last time I watched Evander fight. He can see the openings but just can't throw the punches anymore. It must be supremely frustrating for Roy. It wasn't a lack of openings that made Roy lose the Calzaghe fight, it was the fact that he just doesn't have the skill or the will to fight that he used to.

As much as it pains me, Hopkins would beat Jones if they fought now. Handily too. Jones would just lay on the ropes and take a beating, watching openings go by and not offering a shot. Hopkins' style has allowed him to age remarkably well. Jones' style is exactly the opposite. Couple that with his gunshy nature since the KOs and you have a fighter who is the definition of finished.

It's over for Roy. He needs to retire while he still has his faculties. He's done enough to be considered great.