Boxing and brain damage.

[Trainer Monkey]

The amount of force the average Hocky Player takes from a hit during an NHL game is beyond what a Pro boxer recieves from a punch...

TESTED...MEASURED...RESULTS RECORDED...FACT!!!!!!!

Before you start trying to act like you know something do yourself a favor and do some research before you make a fool of yourself.....

A Hocky Player on the tail end of a full body check gets hit bwith a lot more then just a punch they absorb the full weight of a 200lb man coming at them 5-10 miles an hour....That much with out anything more is common sense..

They takje less shots then the average fighter certainly by far but if you compare the 2 blows one is much harder whn measuring power wise....

Also since you write without reading everything I do remember mentioning in one of my post about long term effects from a massive amount of blows not just one or two concussions being more dangerous..

Since you feel that everything remains around the KO then explain to us all fight DR how it is guys like Pernell who only suffered 1 KO loss or better yet Hector Camacho who has NEVER been KO'd....and he has brain damage

I figured I'd have to defend my position, I just didn't know it would be this easy. I figured someone would at least put some thought into a reply, so let me break it down slowly so that you can understand.

YES, a hockey check exerts more pressure than a punch. But where is the pressure exerted? TO THE HOCKEY PLAYER'S BODY. Its mostly shoulder to shoulder/chest impact. On the odd occaision where a shoulder catches a chin, the results are disasterous, YES. But the majority of checks are body to body, therefore THE BODY obsorbs the majority of the blow.

Think about it: Earnie Shavers punches me in the arm, and Oscar de la Hoya punches you in the head. Obviously Earnie's punch will exert much more pressure, but my body is obsorbing the blow, whereas your head is obsorbing Oscar's blow. I took a harder blow, but you're going to be the one spelling his name with an "894" for the rest of his life. Understand?

And where did I mention EVERYTHING is about the KO? Re-read my post. I didn't. I said a KO equals a concussion, which by definition equals damage to your brain. I did not say that was the only way to damage your brain. I am well aware that subconcussive blows are also incredibly damaging. I have no idea why you brought this up, because it only adds to my arguement.

Even then your argument is flawed,you take 3 straight KO's your on indefinite suspension until you have your noggin examined.
You take three concussions in hockey,or football,they just see when your ready to come back

[Beanflicker]

Even then your argument is flawed,you take 3 straight KO's your on indefinite suspension until you have your noggin examined.
You take three concussions in hockey,or football,they just see when your ready to come back

I don't know where you're getting your information you're using (thin air I would imagine), but these big league teams have trainers and physicians on hand for the athletes, so if you have ONE concussion, you get examined and you're cleared when you're better. They don't wait for you to get knocked out 3 times in a row to pay attention to your health. These leagues take care not to tarnish their reputations so there is a lot more emphasis on safety.

Also, when a player is injured often (particularily with concussions), he becomes a liability and often finds his work options limited (look at Eric Lindros). I'm not saying these big league owners are saints, but its a far cry from letting 45 year old Holyfield, a guy 12 years removed from his prime, get into the ring and fight world champs. Or letting a guy with BLATANT signs of brain damage in 41 year old Riddick Bowe fight on the undercard of a world championship fight.

[Trainer Monkey]

Even then your argument is flawed,you take 3 straight KO's your on indefinite suspension until you have your noggin examined.
You take three concussions in hockey,or football,they just see when your ready to come back

I don't know where you're getting your information you're using (thin air I would imagine), but these big league teams have trainers and physicians on hand for the athletes, so if you have ONE concussion, you get examined and you're cleared when you're better. They don't wait for you to get knocked out 3 times in a row to pay attention to your health. These leagues take care not to tarnish their reputations so there is a lot more emphasis on safety.

Also, when a player is injured often (particularily with concussions), he becomes a liability and often finds his work options limited (look at Eric Lindros). I'm not saying these big league owners are saints, but its a far cry from letting 45 year old Holyfield, a guy 12 years removed from his prime, get into the ring and fight world champs. Or letting a guy with BLATANT signs of brain damage in 41 year old Riddick Bowe fight on the undercard of a world championship fight.

Andre Waters
Chris Benoit
I can keep going here
Now if you want to say there should be a national overseeing body, and that brainscans should be mandatory coming off a KO,rather then doing what Mesi did,wait until his liscence expired and re-apply somewhere else.
Now there we would be in agreement.
There are ways to make the sport safer, but your original posit was that the sport itself was more inherently dangerous then other sports.
The statistics dont support that.
Should the rules be tweeked
Yes they should
But it doesnt make boxing more inherently dangerous then any other sport. I also cave,which is seriously inherently dangerous compared to boxing

[Beanflicker]

The statistics dont support that.
Should the rules be tweeked
Yes they should
But it doesnt make boxing more inherently dangerous then any other sport. I also cave,which is seriously inherently dangerous compared to boxing

The stastics do support that. Boxing is INHERENTLY more dangerous than any other sport because when it is done PROPERLY, someone is injured. Like I said before, the PURPOSE of boxing is to hurt you opponent, and you can't say that about any other non-fight sport.

You also named 2 names, one being a football player and the other a pro wrestler. I'll tell you what, you name as many people brain damaged from EVERY other sport and I'll name everyone brain damaged from boxing, and we'll see who comes up with more names.

You say cycling is more dangerous because it has a larger quantity of injuries, but contrast that to how many people cycle and how many people box.

[Beanflicker]

I assume this is where you got your info from... measuring how many trips to the emergency room each accounted for.

1. Basketball: 512,213
2. Bicycling: 485,669
3. Football: 418,260
4. Soccer: 174,686
5. Baseball: 155,898
6. Skateboards: 112,544
7. Trampolines: 108,029
8. Softball: 106,884
9. Swimming/Diving: 82,354
10. Horseback riding: 73,576
11. Weightlifting: 65,716
12. Volleyball: 52,091
13. Golf: 47,360
14. Roller skating: 35,003
15. Wrestling: 33,734

Ok so which of these activities did more people participate in: swimming or boxing? Roller skating or boxing? Baseball or boxing? Riding a bicycle or boxing? ECT ECT

And again it comes down to how serious an injury is, and I content that an injury to your brain, which is irreversible, is more serious than an injury to a limb, which heals in time.

[Trainer Monkey]

I assume this is where you got your info from... measuring how many trips to the emergency room each accounted for.

1. Basketball: 512,213
2. Bicycling: 485,669
3. Football: 418,260
4. Soccer: 174,686
5. Baseball: 155,898
6. Skateboards: 112,544
7. Trampolines: 108,029
8. Softball: 106,884
9. Swimming/Diving: 82,354
10. Horseback riding: 73,576
11. Weightlifting: 65,716
12. Volleyball: 52,091
13. Golf: 47,360
14. Roller skating: 35,003
15. Wrestling: 33,734

Ok so which of these activities did more people participate in: swimming or boxing? Roller skating or boxing? Baseball or boxing? Riding a bicycle or boxing? ECT ECT

And again it comes down to how serious an injury is, and I content that an injury to your brain, which is irreversible, is more serious than an injury to a limb, which heals in time.

A) No it doesnt, you may even think its healed,but your going to feel it later. This is why I sleep on the couch rather then next to my wife. Im disruptive in bed and disturb her sleep, because of numerous "healed" limb injuries
B) I have never had a boxer suffer from repetitive concussion syndrome, but I have seen numerous football players who have

[holmcall]

This has become a very interesting thread. Great debates and good info.

[Trainer Monkey]

The statistics dont support that.
Should the rules be tweeked
Yes they should
But it doesnt make boxing more inherently dangerous then any other sport. I also cave,which is seriously inherently dangerous compared to boxing

The stastics do support that. Boxing is INHERENTLY more dangerous than any other sport because when it is done PROPERLY, someone is injured. Like I said before, the PURPOSE of boxing is to hurt you opponent, and you can't say that about any other non-fight sport.

You also named 2 names, one being a football player and the other a pro wrestler. I'll tell you what, you name as many people brain damaged from EVERY other sport and I'll name everyone brain damaged from boxing, and we'll see who comes up with more names.

You say cycling is more dangerous because it has a larger quantity of injuries, but contrast that to how many people cycle and how many people box.

You mean a free safety isnt trying to injure his opponent?
It would come as a hell of a surprise to every single coach in the NFL. One of the first things they teach offensive lineman is to chop block,thats where you throw your weight right in to the other guys knees. In baseball when they teach you to pitch,they teach you to throw at a guy,you mean a hard spherical object thrown at someones head,isnt intent to injure?

[CGM]

The statistics dont support that.
Should the rules be tweeked
Yes they should
But it doesnt make boxing more inherently dangerous then any other sport. I also cave,which is seriously inherently dangerous compared to boxing

The stastics do support that. Boxing is INHERENTLY more dangerous than any other sport because when it is done PROPERLY, someone is injured. Like I said before, the PURPOSE of boxing is to hurt you opponent, and you can't say that about any other non-fight sport.

You also named 2 names, one being a football player and the other a pro wrestler. I'll tell you what, you name as many people brain damaged from EVERY other sport and I'll name everyone brain damaged from boxing, and we'll see who comes up with more names.

You say cycling is more dangerous because it has a larger quantity of injuries, but contrast that to how many people cycle and how many people box.

You mean a free safety isnt trying to injure his opponent?
It would come as a hell of a surprise to every single coach in the NFL. One of the first things they teach offensive lineman is to chop block,thats where you throw your weight right in to the other guys knees. In baseball when they teach you to pitch,they teach you to throw at a guy,you mean a hard spherical object thrown at someones head,isnt intent to injure?

Can I respond to this?

OK TM, here is an undeniable fact. Regardless of your feelings about the sport of boxing, striking your opponent in the head such that he suffers an injury (KO) is an integral part of the sport. IT is encouraged and desireable. It is allowed. We applaud it. Even when it doesn't end in KO, do it enough times and you get brain damage.

Deliberately throwing a baseball at someone's head is against the rules. It will get you tossed out of the game. Hell, a couple of pitches that even come close to a batter's head will get you tossed.

See the difference?

[Trainer Monkey]

The stastics do support that. Boxing is INHERENTLY more dangerous than any other sport because when it is done PROPERLY, someone is injured. Like I said before, the PURPOSE of boxing is to hurt you opponent, and you can't say that about any other non-fight sport.

You also named 2 names, one being a football player and the other a pro wrestler. I'll tell you what, you name as many people brain damaged from EVERY other sport and I'll name everyone brain damaged from boxing, and we'll see who comes up with more names.

You say cycling is more dangerous because it has a larger quantity of injuries, but contrast that to how many people cycle and how many people box.

You mean a free safety isnt trying to injure his opponent?
It would come as a hell of a surprise to every single coach in the NFL. One of the first things they teach offensive lineman is to chop block,thats where you throw your weight right in to the other guys knees. In baseball when they teach you to pitch,they teach you to throw at a guy,you mean a hard spherical object thrown at someones head,isnt intent to injure?

Can I respond to this?

OK TM, here is an undeniable fact. Regardless of your feelings about the sport of boxing, striking your opponent in the head such that he suffers an injury (KO) is an integral part of the sport. IT is encouraged and desireable. It is allowed. We applaud it. Even when it doesn't end in KO, do it enough times and you get brain damage.

Deliberately throwing a baseball at someone's head is against the rules. It will get you tossed out of the game. Hell, a couple of pitches that even come close to a batter's head will get you tossed.

See the difference?

But yet it happens in every game almost
And what happens to a wide reciever if he goes over the middle when a safety is sitting in Zone Coverage.
If you said practically having your head removed from your shoulders,you would be correct
The NHL has an entire class of players called thugs,that are only in the league to wallop people,they arent great skaters,they have minimal puck handeling ability,but they can level a guy

[DaxxKahn]

The statistics dont support that.
Should the rules be tweeked
Yes they should
But it doesnt make boxing more inherently dangerous then any other sport. I also cave,which is seriously inherently dangerous compared to boxing

The stastics do support that. Boxing is INHERENTLY more dangerous than any other sport because when it is done PROPERLY, someone is injured. Like I said before, the PURPOSE of boxing is to hurt you opponent, and you can't say that about any other non-fight sport.

You also named 2 names, one being a football player and the other a pro wrestler. I'll tell you what, you name as many people brain damaged from EVERY other sport and I'll name everyone brain damaged from boxing, and we'll see who comes up with more names.

You say cycling is more dangerous because it has a larger quantity of injuries, but contrast that to how many people cycle and how many people box.

You mean a free safety isnt trying to injure his opponent?
It would come as a hell of a surprise to every single coach in the NFL. One of the first things they teach offensive lineman is to chop block,thats where you throw your weight right in to the other guys knees. In baseball when they teach you to pitch,they teach you to throw at a guy,you mean a hard spherical object thrown at someones head,isnt intent to injure?

Well said...anyone doubting that there are intentions to injure other players....I suggest the book "They Call Me Assassin" By Otis Sistrunk...

Read up about Ben Davidson....Then deny there is no intentions to injure their opposing players