Cotto may never be the same

[Onix]

All great replies to my original post and question. I know being a fan of a specific boxer than seeing him lose is hard to swallow and we all want to believe he can make it back.

I see this fight to be a throwback to the Chavez/Taylor fight literally the same thing was happening, Taylor putting on the clinic and Chavez kept on driving forward till he caught his man and although Chavez got a gift after that fight Taylor was never the same, both in the ring and outside. He took too much punishment and now has speech problems and speaks alot slower.

I am not saying that Margo put on that kind of punishment, but It didnt look like Chavez did either at the time. Time will tell.

[Chino]

although Chavez got a gift after that fight Taylor

Not sure if you can call a fight a gift if the referee asks the fighter "Are you ok?" only to have him blank stare at the referee with a disfigured face and no answer. The rules of boxing are clear in that situation.
Will Cotto be the same? Not sure about that if he ends up getting another beating at the rematch or even if he gets rocked, bloody face / cuts, etc. Against Jennings just like Cotto has already when facing past journeymen.
He has to tottaly knock out Jennings to look like he's back in track. I wouldn't get all excited for this fight as much as I didn't when he faced Gomez though.

[Onix]

although Chavez got a gift after that fight Taylor

Not sure if you can call a fight a gift if the referee asks the fighter "Are you ok?" only to have him blank stare at the referee with a disfigured face and no answer. The rules of boxing are clear in that situation.
Will Cotto be the same? Not sure about that if he ends up getting another beating at the rematch or even if he gets rocked, bloody face / cuts, etc. Against Jennings just like Cotto has already when facing past journeymen.
He has to tottaly knock out Jennings to look like he's back in track. I wouldn't get all excited for this fight as much as I didn't when he faced Gomez though.

there was like 2 seconds left when the fight was stopped. Its pretty hard not to to say it was a gift, and for the most part taylor was responsive to steele's instructions.

[Chino]

although Chavez got a gift after that fight Taylor

Not sure if you can call a fight a gift if the referee asks the fighter "Are you ok?" only to have him blank stare at the referee with a disfigured face and no answer. The rules of boxing are clear in that situation.
Will Cotto be the same? Not sure about that if he ends up getting another beating at the rematch or even if he gets rocked, bloody face / cuts, etc. Against Jennings just like Cotto has already when facing past journeymen.
He has to tottaly knock out Jennings to look like he's back in track. I wouldn't get all excited for this fight as much as I didn't when he faced Gomez though.

there was like 2 seconds left when the fight was stopped. Its pretty hard not to to say it was a gift, and for the most part taylor was responsive to steele's instructions.

If the rules say that if there are a few seconds left in the last round then he can continue even if his face is disfigured and he doesn't answer to the referee then I would also agree that the stopage was wrong. But no, rules state that if the boxer can't answer and doesn't seem like he can continue then the fight is stopped REGARDLESS of time. A fighter that can continue after a knock down normally gets up and walks to the referee with firm steps and boxing stance showing he can continue and even answer VOCALLY "Yes, I am fine" or whatever. Taylor did NONE of those.

[Spicoli]

Cliché but time will tell.Imo,the damage sustained mentally will out weigh the physical damage in his case.I think Cotto can regroup and find his footing as a champion again.The man was improving in his ability all the way up until his brutal confrontation with Tony and he is still fit and fluid.But,none of that is viable if he does not believe it where it counts.In his chest and in his head.I still believe he needs to approach his return the right/smart way and imo....a rematch with Margarito one fight removed is not it.All in all,I do not think he can beat Tony.There are also differences in Chavez/Taylor and Tony/Cotto.Talk about a mentally crushing defeat....Taylors might appear much more damaging,with the ending and huge all time shadow that one produced.Taylor could and did stand with Chavez in spots,He moved Chavez and fought JCC's fight when touched and battled back with effect,Chavez respected his pop.In that regard,I do not believe Cotto is like Taylor.I think he rebounds stronger than Taylor in respected careers but we will see.

[levi#1BoxingFan]

I beleive when the rematch occurs between cotto and margarito, cotto will win by UD. I've never seen a chin like Margarito's, cotto was landing shots that would have knocked out some middle weights. As strong as Cotto is he never shook Margarito up one time. The reason I believe he wins in the rematch is because in the next fight he learns from his mistake and goes back to his body attack. If there was one flaw of Cotto's that night it was that he didnt go to the body enough. I think that body attack will slow margarito down enough to where cotto can slip in and out without getting caught on the ropes. Cotto has that killer spirit about him that wants to knock you out and thats what makes him so entertaining, but sometimes you just have to to what it takes to win. Welterweight is without a doubt the toughest division but I believe Cotto will be champion of it in the future!

[Andre]

Something has to change for sure,the body work is a good way to implement a different fight in sections but like everything it wont work 100% of the time, nothing does.

I think he also needs the right tenacious kind of sparring partner (one he cant hurt that will just hunt him down maybe a heavier guy) to help him stay cool under close pressure.

Id also like to see him work on getting out to MArgos side flanks during the closer combat flurries but remaining in so close so he can catch him turning back into him with more power and maybe even a couple of unseen temple shots from right there.

You wont stop Antonio from straight out in front on a shot that he sees comming at him so to fight from the outside with power wont win it.

IF you are going to slow him up he needs to be clocked a number of times from an unseen angle and the temple from the side would be my top target, body too, right before or right afterwards, on the reaction.

And Margo wont back off he will just turn in to you and continue to hunt you down, without regard to himself at some stages.

All that and extra lasting power trained for and tied into tight footwork so Cotto never gets caught cold in a corner without the legs to move out or under and out on greater angles or spin and stick.

[Kel]

He will be back and back stronger I think. Better stamina would make him a much better fighter.

[boozeboxer]

He will be back and back stronger I think. Better stamina would make him a much better fighter.

They used the he was down at 140 stamina excuse for 5 fights or so. What are they going to do at 147?? If he didn't know he had to have good stamina with Tony, he is a moron. I just don't think he ever will have good stamina (or at least AM stamina [which few have]).

[boozeboxer]

Not sure if you can call a fight a gift if the referee asks the fighter "Are you ok?" only to have him blank stare at the referee with a disfigured face and no answer. The rules of boxing are clear in that situation.
Will Cotto be the same? Not sure about that if he ends up getting another beating at the rematch or even if he gets rocked, bloody face / cuts, etc. Against Jennings just like Cotto has already when facing past journeymen.
He has to tottaly knock out Jennings to look like he's back in track. I wouldn't get all excited for this fight as much as I didn't when he faced Gomez though.

there was like 2 seconds left when the fight was stopped. Its pretty hard not to to say it was a gift, and for the most part taylor was responsive to steele's instructions.

If the rules say that if there are a few seconds left in the last round then he can continue even if his face is disfigured and he doesn't answer to the referee then I would also agree that the stopage was wrong. But no, rules state that if the boxer can't answer and doesn't seem like he can continue then the fight is stopped REGARDLESS of time. A fighter that can continue after a knock down normally gets up and walks to the referee with firm steps and boxing stance showing he can continue and even answer VOCALLY "Yes, I am fine" or whatever. Taylor did NONE of those.

Taylor didn't want to continue.

[CGM]

To me it is obvious the ref made a very quick decision in Taylor Chavez, without due consideration. It took him like one second to make up his mind after asking are you OK? Don't forget this is Richard Steele, who has a rep for premature stoppages.

Steele knows how much time is left, you can be sure of that. Now I ain't gonna say that Steele is in someone's pocket, but you can be sure that the powers that be want the big unbeaten streak to continue, and are happy with the decision.

[Rantcatrat]

Just watched the Margo V Cotto fight again...

Cotto performed at the highest level possible, literally the man put on a clinic.

The bombs that Cotto was landing on Margo were devastating slipping in and out hitting Margo with heavy handed cement fisted shots that could literally have dropped much bigger men. The dancing and foot work that Cotto was using made Floyds work on dancing with the stars look like amatuer night at the Apollo...THE MAN COULD DO NO WRONG.

He got beat up.

Cotto is a great fighter/warrior, but how do you come back from that, to have put on the best performance of your life, only to be preasurred into submission, I think it was the kind of loss that can change a fighter, at the very least his style. There were some moments in that fight, that I caught some looks and body language from Cotto that alluded to what ultimately happened in the fight, looks of desperation truly.

Here's my question, Cotto is coming up on a fight soon and afterwards probably will come a rematch against Margo. Will he be the same? I know there are lots of Cotto fans and I respect you all. but try to be objective here. I'd also like to here what you think Cotto's mental state will be going into a Margo rematch, can he pull the trigger against the man who beat him, I guess im looking to hear your thoughts on Cotto's mental state, was he beaten to the point of being a lesser fighter because of that loss?

I know you're a Margo fan, and I commend you for your well put together post. Thanks for recognizing just how well Cotto fought, although in a losing effort. Most boxing fans tend to dismiss a fighter's efforts once he loses, but I agree with you that Cotto was putting on a boxing clinic, AND hitting Margo with some bombs that would've dropped lesser fighters.

Regarding Cotto's mental state, I feel Cotto is an EXTREMELY strong fighter mentally. But to automatically assume that there will be NO effects from his devastating loss to Margarito when they meet again... is to not recognize the realities of boxing. That Cotto has the tools to be an elite champion at 147, I don't think anyone disputes that. And I think he's got the mental makeup to come back. But a rematch with Margarito would be very dangerous indeed. Although knowing Cotto, he'll probably jump at the opportunity.

Cotto wasn't putting on a boxing clinic; he was winning, but it wasn't a clinic. Clinic is mastery over your opponent. All three ringside judges scored round 2 for Margarito; in round 3, although Margarito lost the round, he bloodied Cotto's nose. Rounds 4 and 5 were for Cotto. The momentum of the fight, however, surely had changed by around round 6. Midway through round 7, Margarito actually hurt Cotto with a barrage of punches. The rest is history.

For an example of a boxer who put on a boxing clinic, but then was beat, see the Bute v. Andrade fight - Bute probably won 10 or 11 rounds before succumbing to Andrade in the twelth. Cotto won 4 of the first 6. By round seven, the fight was becoming close. By round 10, Cotto was withering and most judges had the fight for Margarito or a draw. Round 11 saw Cotto give up. If the fight was a ten round fight, the scores would have been close, probably with Cotto winning, but again that isn't a clinic. Cotto deserves praise for his guts and lasting as long as he did in that fight.

Cotto lost a big fight, let's wait to see how he fights in his next fight to assess whether he'll be the same. After seeing him lose to Maragarito, do you think he'd beat the other elite welters - Clottey, Williams, or Cintron?

[littlebif]

I would like to see Cotto in with Clottey or Cintron.I think he would beat Cintron but he would have a very hard night with Clottey.Has'nt Williams moved up a weight?

[Rantcatrat]

Williams may have moved up a weight class, but only because no one at 147 wanted to face him.

[Chino]

It took him like one second to make up his mind after asking are you OK?

He looked into his face and asked twice "Are you ok?...Are you ok?..." while Taylor probably thought if a freight train just ran over him.

Cotto lost a big fight, let's wait to see how he fights in his next fight to assess whether he'll be the same

He's fighting just another journeyman like the rest in his list so I am not really getting all hyped up about his fight with Jennings. Sure, I can see some people in this forum going "Ooooh my gaaaaaawd! He totally beat the Great Jennings!" but really, it's just a stepping stone and I wouldn't be surprised if Jennings cuts, rocks, and hurts Cotto like past fights against other journeymen. Let's see how he does in his rematch or any other young big name in their prime.

After seeing him lose to Maragarito, do you think he'd beat the other elite welters

I wonder the same. How would he handle fighting against an elite young big name in his prime. Anybody can look good beating bunch of has-beens or journeymen. In his case, he has looked bad facing some journeymen. Let's wait until his rematch. I am not so hyped about the Jennings fight.