Cotto may never be the same

[OumaFan]

The problem is Cotto is not a very big welter but he couldn't really make 140, seeing him at some of the weighins, especially later on like the Malignaggi one he was as gaunt and sickly looking as anybody I've ever seen.

I wouldn't say he's a small welter though, but he's not a big one by any means.

[Hoggmeister]

i think if theres anything that can be said about miguel cotto, its that hes obviously got a very strong character. the loss he suffered against margarito would have finished alot of fighters am sure, but i doubt it will cotto. i see him dusting himself off and getting straight back to business in 2009. the guys a warrior.

[Hunter]

I think people are getting a little carried away in saying Cotto will never be the same...he didnt take a Lacy/Cal, Pavlik/Hop, or Citron/Marg style beating (or even Hatton/Mayweather)...he was competitive in the first part of the fight.......Margarito just wore him down....

I think he is going to be fine....In the rematch I think he will be more competitive down the stretch with Tony but will still lose a decision....

[Onix]

I think people are getting a little carried away in saying Cotto will never be the same...he didnt take a Lacy/Cal, Pavlik/Hop, or Citron/Marg style beating (or even Hatton/Mayweather)...he was competitive in the first part of the fight.......Margarito just wore him down....

I think he is going to be fine....In the rematch I think he will be more competitive down the stretch with Tony but will still lose a decision....

well if you are referring to the actual thread, my statement/question was Cotto may never be the same. Secondly, it's hard for us as fans to know what kind of losses are tougher on fighters. Are the blowouts worse? the close ones? or the ones that got away? There's an argument for all of them really. A blowout may not be as bad, because all you tell yourself is he or his style is better, ill stay away from him or his style. The close ones may not be as bad because you think to yourself I can get him next time. I just have to work on stamina or maybe a better jab, etc.

A lose like Cotto's to Margo is kinda the one that got away, cuz he had it and it got away and while you can also make an excuse or give yourself a reason why you lost and why its ok, it can be just as devasting to your mental make up as any other loss. Like i've said before that "death jog" of Tony's can really be an intimidating thing.

I wont take a thing from the opposition that Cotto has faced, he has faced very competitive opposition, but I would say the higher caliber of his opponents were at 140, now he moves to 147 and they have all been alittle past their prime or not as top notch. This loss to Margo may make him doubt his ability to compete against the top notch fighters at 147. So yes Cotto may never be the same.

[TitoFan]

I think people are getting a little carried away in saying Cotto will never be the same...he didnt take a Lacy/Cal, Pavlik/Hop, or Citron/Marg style beating (or even Hatton/Mayweather)...he was competitive in the first part of the fight.......Margarito just wore him down....

I think he is going to be fine....In the rematch I think he will be more competitive down the stretch with Tony but will still lose a decision....

well if you are referring to the actual thread, my statement/question was Cotto may never be the same. Secondly, it's hard for us as fans to know what kind of losses are tougher on fighters. Are the blowouts worse? the close ones? or the ones that got away? There's an argument for all of them really. A blowout may not be as bad, because all you tell yourself is he or his style is better, ill stay away from him or his style. The close ones may not be as bad because you think to yourself I can get him next time. I just have to work on stamina or maybe a better jab, etc.

A lose like Cotto's to Margo is kinda the one that got away, cuz he had it and it got away and while you can also make an excuse or give yourself a reason why you lost and why its ok, it can be just as devasting to your mental make up as any other loss. Like i've said before that "death jog" of Tony's can really be an intimidating thing.

I wont take a thing from the opposition that Cotto has faced, he has faced very competitive opposition, but I would say the higher caliber of his opponents were at 140, now he moves to 147 and they have all been alittle past their prime or not as top notch. This loss to Margo may make him doubt his ability to compete against the top notch fighters at 147. So yes Cotto may never be the same.

LOL... "death jog"... that's a pretty good way of putting it. And when you add Margo's evil smile while he's doing his "death jog", it must be even worse.

Regarding the main point, I think it's always tough for a previously unbeaten fighter, who has begun to think of himself as invincible, to suffer his first loss. And in this case, Cotto boxed a beautiful first half of the fight, only to see Tony shrug off his best shots and stalk him down. It HAS to be tough mentally. But if any fighter has the mental makeup to deal with that and go on, it's Cotto. That's what I'm betting on, anyway.

[Onix]

i think if theres anything that can be said about miguel cotto, its that hes obviously got a very strong character. the loss he suffered against margarito would have finished alot of fighters am sure, but i doubt it will cotto. i see him dusting himself off and getting straight back to business in 2009. the guys a warrior.

How do we know that he has a strong "character"?

[TitoFan]

i think if theres anything that can be said about miguel cotto, its that hes obviously got a very strong character. the loss he suffered against margarito would have finished alot of fighters am sure, but i doubt it will cotto. i see him dusting himself off and getting straight back to business in 2009. the guys a warrior.

How do we know that he has a strong "character"?

I dunno... depends how you define "character" in boxing. If you define it as someone who is dedicated to the ring and sport and always gives his all in the ring... if you define it as someone who does not need to trash-talk anyone, but rather let's his fists do the talking... if you define it as someone who takes on all opponents they put in front of him... if you define it as someone who refuses to make excuses when he is beaten... if you define it as someone who comports himself with class in and out of the ring...

Then yes... IMO, Cotto would qualify as having a strong character.

Does any of this help?

[Onix]

i think if theres anything that can be said about miguel cotto, its that hes obviously got a very strong character. the loss he suffered against margarito would have finished alot of fighters am sure, but i doubt it will cotto. i see him dusting himself off and getting straight back to business in 2009. the guys a warrior.

How do we know that he has a strong "character"?

I dunno... depends how you define "character" in boxing. If you define it as someone who is dedicated to the ring and sport and always gives his all in the ring... if you define it as someone who does not need to trash-talk anyone, but rather let's his fists do the talking... if you define it as someone who takes on all opponents they put in front of him... if you define it as someone who refuses to make excuses when he is beaten... if you define it as someone who comports himself with class in and out of the ring...

Then yes... IMO, Cotto would qualify as having a strong character.

Does any of this help?

Ok you just described every fighter that is competitive in the sport, except for the trash talk part, so if they all have character what makes Cotto so special? and why can he bounce back from this one and Jeff Lacy not bounce back from from his loss to JC? Maybe its not that Lacy couldnt bounce back maybe it was like some other posters have said in the past about him, maybe he got "found out"...maybe Cotto got "found out" I'm not saying that specifically but the argument could be made for it.

[TitoFan]

How do we know that he has a strong "character"?

I dunno... depends how you define "character" in boxing. If you define it as someone who is dedicated to the ring and sport and always gives his all in the ring... if you define it as someone who does not need to trash-talk anyone, but rather let's his fists do the talking... if you define it as someone who takes on all opponents they put in front of him... if you define it as someone who refuses to make excuses when he is beaten... if you define it as someone who comports himself with class in and out of the ring...

Then yes... IMO, Cotto would qualify as having a strong character.

Does any of this help?

Ok you just described every fighter that is competitive in the sport, except for the trash talk part, so if they all have character what makes Cotto so special? and why can he bounce back from this one and Jeff Lacy not bounce back from from his loss to JC? Maybe its not that Lacy couldnt bounce back maybe it was like some other posters have said in the past about him, maybe he got "found out"...maybe Cotto got "found out" I'm not saying that specifically but the argument could be made for it.

(patient sigh of exasperation)...No Onix, I DIDN'T describe every fighter who is competitive in the sport. Geeez, you and Chino can wear a guy out with your non-sensical anti-Cotto rantings. Lots of competitive fighters out there: 1) blatantly duck opponents, for whatever reason (ie: Oscar and Margarito), and 2) make all kinds of excuses when they're beaten. So you see... you're wrong right off the bat.

As for Cotto getting "found out"... found out about what?!?!? That he's been a bum all along?!? Get a grip, for chrissakes.

You know, for not wanting to be a "dick"... you're walking a very fine line.

[Onix]

I dunno... depends how you define "character" in boxing. If you define it as someone who is dedicated to the ring and sport and always gives his all in the ring... if you define it as someone who does not need to trash-talk anyone, but rather let's his fists do the talking... if you define it as someone who takes on all opponents they put in front of him... if you define it as someone who refuses to make excuses when he is beaten... if you define it as someone who comports himself with class in and out of the ring...

Then yes... IMO, Cotto would qualify as having a strong character.

Does any of this help?

Ok you just described every fighter that is competitive in the sport, except for the trash talk part, so if they all have character what makes Cotto so special? and why can he bounce back from this one and Jeff Lacy not bounce back from from his loss to JC? Maybe its not that Lacy couldnt bounce back maybe it was like some other posters have said in the past about him, maybe he got "found out"...maybe Cotto got "found out" I'm not saying that specifically but the argument could be made for it.

(patient sigh of exasperation)...No Onix, I DIDN'T describe every fighter who is competitive in the sport. Geeez, you and Chino can wear a guy out with your non-sensical anti-Cotto rantings. Lots of competitive fighters out there: 1) blatantly duck opponents, for whatever reason (ie: Oscar and Margarito), and 2) make all kinds of excuses when they're beaten. So you see... you're wrong right off the bat.

As for Cotto getting "found out"... found out about what?!?!? That he's been a bum all along?!? Get a grip, for chrissakes.

You know, for not wanting to be a "dick"... you're walking a very fine line.

Haha, walking a fine line? why cuz I am not agreeing with you? I never said I didnt like Cotto I am very much pro Cotto, I'm simply making a point as are you and I'm not calling you a dick for it.

Maybe I jumped the gun in saying that every fighter has character, ok maybe not, but alot of fighters have the traits that you described about Cotto so why is Cotto so special?

What I said in regards to him being found out is more of a statement as to why people say Lacy's loss to JC was so devasting, maybe it was just that he cant compete at that level not that he had such a terrible loss, so why cant the same be said about Cotto?

I think my replies regarding this topic have been very "sensical" if you dont want to be tested and questioned about your replies then maybe you should not post them up.

You call them "anti-cotto" rantings, then what are yours pro-cotto rantings? The differance here is one major point, lets just say im pro-Margo and you are pro-cotto, I can see Margo's weaknesses and acknowledge his losses without excuse. You dont argue the loss but you will not accept that maybe he is not fighter everyone thought he could/should be. The Margo fight was supposed to be Cotto's huge coming out party, I think even Arum was like shit I just fucked my boy up on this one. I dont doubt his pedigree, Cotto is a great fighter, but leave your mind open to the fact that maybe he's not at the level of you want him to be, as Im open to the fact that he may come back and beat Margo on the rematch.

[Kirkland Laing]

How do we know that he has a strong "character"?

I dunno... depends how you define "character" in boxing. If you define it as someone who is dedicated to the ring and sport and always gives his all in the ring... if you define it as someone who does not need to trash-talk anyone, but rather let's his fists do the talking... if you define it as someone who takes on all opponents they put in front of him... if you define it as someone who refuses to make excuses when he is beaten... if you define it as someone who comports himself with class in and out of the ring...

Then yes... IMO, Cotto would qualify as having a strong character.

Does any of this help?

Ok you just described every fighter that is competitive in the sport, except for the trash talk part, so if they all have character what makes Cotto so special? and why can he bounce back from this one and Jeff Lacy not bounce back from from his loss to JC? Maybe its not that Lacy couldnt bounce back maybe it was like some other posters have said in the past about him, maybe he got "found out"...maybe Cotto got "found out" I'm not saying that specifically but the argument could be made for it.

Cotto has infinitely more boxing ability than Lacy. I don't think he'll have any problems coming back to what he was but I don't think he has any chance in a Margarito rematch.