p4p top 10 after saturday night and calzaghes retirement??

[JazMerkin]

Are you serious?? So Cotto beating Jennings somehow bumps him back up above Hopkins, Mosley & Izzy??

& where are Rafa & Calderon??

& I'm a big Berto fan but there's no way that right now he's even in the top 20. Guys like Dawson, Caballero, Valero, Soto have all done considerably more to deserve being in or around the top 10 than he has.

[kingfrnk]

Are you serious?? So Cotto beating Jennings somehow bumps him back up above Hopkins, Mosley & Izzy??

& where are Rafa & Calderon??

& I'm a big Berto fan but there's no way that right now he's even in the top 20. Guys like Dawson, Caballero, Valero, Soto have all done considerably more to deserve being in or around the top 10 than he has.

exactly thats an aweful list he only had the top 2 right.

[HattonTheHammer]

Are you serious?? So Cotto beating Jennings somehow bumps him back up above Hopkins, Mosley & Izzy??

& where are Rafa & Calderon??

& I'm a big Berto fan but there's no way that right now he's even in the top 20. Guys like Dawson, Caballero, Valero, Soto have all done considerably more to deserve being in or around the top 10 than he has.

exactly thats an aweful list he only had the top 2 right.

hey

Nobodys saying its the actual confirmed p4p top 10 just my own unique take on things.

If you dont like the list youve every right to put your own on rather than just badmouth someone for trying douchebag

I ranked cotto so highly because of both saturday nights performance and in light of the whole margarito scandal. Not before that whole thing went down he was 2-3 in many peoples eyes now all of a sudden because he got beat by a guy who had an illegal advantage just like you lot did with hatton you proclaim he is washed up??

And unlike most asian/south american fans on here i dont have every half decent fighter below 126 on the list just because they throw more punches than guys who fight at 168/175(the logistics of that are pretty simple to figure out)

[JazMerkin]

Hell, I'll do a top 20 if you like.

1. Manny Pacquiao
2. Juan Manuel Marquez
3. Bernard Hopkins
4. Shane Mosley
5. Israel Vasquez
6. Rafael Marquez
7. Ivan Calderon
8. Vic Darchinyan
9. Chad Dawson
10. Ricky Hatton
11. Paul Williams
12. Celestino Caballero
13. Miguel Cotto
14. Nate Campbell
15. Antonio Margarito
16. Juan Diaz
17. Juan Manuel Lopez
18. Arthur Abraham
19. Nonito Donaire
20. Kelly Pavlik

Cotto was ranked #4 I think before the Margarito fight. However, the fact is the performance against Jennings does nothing to answer my questions about him. Ignoring the handwrap controversy (which I believe may well have taken place) the fact is I still don't know how he will cope with a guy who he can't knock out & who just keeps coming. I have ranked him higher than Margarito, but has he done enough against Jennings to push him above all those other guys? & as for Berto, like I say he's probably one of my favourite active fighters right now, but there is NO way he is in the P4P top ten, when most don't even consider him in the top 3 in his division.

The fact is the guys at the lower weights have historically not got the credit they should, hence it being pound for pound. If all these fighters were at the same weight I would fancy Ivan Calderon to box rings round half these guys, if anything he's one guy who being at a lower weight lowers his status. If you haven't seen some of these guys fight below 126, you are missing out.

[robinswe01]

POUND-FOR-POUND TOP 10





1. Manny Pacquiao - Lightweight
Philippines (48-3-2, 36KOs)
Pacquiao destroyed a spent Oscar de la Hoya in Las Vegas to cement his place at the top of the P4P tree. Could now fight Ricky Hatton next summer, and what a fight that could be.

2. Juan Manuel Marquez - Lightweight
Mexico (49-4-1, 36KOs)
Marquez became the first man to stop Cuba's Joel Casamayor in his first fight at lightweight and will now chase a third bout with Manny Pacquiao.

3. Bernard Hopkins - Light-heavyweight
United States (49 wins, 5 losses, 1 draws, 32KOs)
Hopkins showed he still has plenty to offer with his schooling of the upstart Kelly Pavlik in Atlantic City. Ironically, at the age of 43, he is running out of viable opponents.

4. Israel Vazquez - Super-bantamweight
Mexico (43-4, 31KOs)
Vazquez reclaimed his WBC belt from Rafael Marquez in August and nicked the rubber match in March. A relentless fighter with a vicious left hook.

5. Shane Mosley - Welterweight
United States (46-5, 39KOs)
Mosley caused a stunning upset in outclassing Antonio Margarito at the age of 37. May want to defend his crown against Miguel Cotto, who beat him in
2007.

6. Miguel Cotto - Welterweight
Puerto Rico (32-1, 26KOs)
Cotto finally met his match against Antonio Margarito in a classic encounter, but lost little of his lustre in doing so. Beat Chorley's Michael Jennings for the WBO crown on Saturday

7. Ricky Hatton - Light-welterweight
England (45-1, 32KOs)
Hatton beat Paulie Malignaggi in Las Vegas and the Hitman may now fight Filipino superstar Manny Pacquiao, possibly in front of 60,000 fans at Wembley, next summer.

8. Paul Williams - Light-middleweight
United States (34-1, 25KOs)
Williams defeated Antonio Margarito in 2007 and claimed the interim WBO light-middleweight crown by beating Verno Phillips in November.

9. Ivan Calderon - Light-flyweight
Puerto Rico (32-0, 6KOs)
Calderon defended his WBO light-flyweight crown against Hugo Cazares in August and will likely take a unification fight at some point in 2009.

10. Rafael Marquez - Super-bantamweight
Mexico (37-5, 33KOs)
Marquez has not fought since losing a rubber match to Israel Vazquez last March, but is a tremendously powerful boxer. A fourth fight with Vazquez in the offing?

[C-Lo]

1. Manny Pacquiao
2. Juan Manuel Marquez
3. Bernard Hopkins
4. Shane Mosley
5. Israel Vasquez
6. Rafael Marquez
7. Ricky Hatton
8. Miguel Cotto
9. Vic Darchiniyan
10. Chad Dawson

[Taeth]

1. Manny Pacquiao
2. Juan Manuel Marquez
3. Bernard Hopkins
4. Shane Mosley
5. Israel Vasquez
6. Rafael Marquez
7. Ricky Hatton
8. Miguel Cotto
9. Vic Darchiniyan
10. Chad Dawson

How do you have Vic Darchiniyan above Dawson or Hatton above Cotto? Did Mayweather not beat Hatton worse than Margarito beat Cotto? He won almost every round.

[Taeth]

Are you serious?? So Cotto beating Jennings somehow bumps him back up above Hopkins, Mosley & Izzy??

& where are Rafa & Calderon??

& I'm a big Berto fan but there's no way that right now he's even in the top 20. Guys like Dawson, Caballero, Valero, Soto have all done considerably more to deserve being in or around the top 10 than he has.

How is Valero or Caballero any more proven than Berto? Fuck that. He isn't top 10 yet, but he easily top 20, and Cotto deserves to be higher than Mosley seeing as he beat him, and will again. I think he shouldn't be higher than Hopkins though, that is stupid, IMO Hopkins beat Calzaghe, and then also beat Pavlik.

[:::PSL:::]

Berto shouldn't be up there (yet).

[mike_tha_man]

my top 20

1.Zab Judah
2.Carlos Baldomir
3.Amir Kahn
4.Ricardo Mayorga
5.Carlos Maussa
6.Cory Spinks
7.Enzo Macarinelli
8.Butterbeam
9.John Ruiz
10.Jason Litzau
11.Peter Manfredo Jr
12.Jose Cotto
13.Julio Cesar Chavez Jr
14.Junior Witter
15.Kassim Ouma
16.Nikolay Valuev
17.Oleg Maskaev
18.Anthony Mundine
19.Samuel Peter
20.Sergei Liakhovich

Honorable mentions to Shannon Briggs,Vivian Harris,Walter Matthysse and Manny Pacquiao

[killersheep]

my top 20

1.Zab Judah
2.Carlos Baldomir
3.Amir Kahn
4.Ricardo Mayorga
5.Carlos Maussa
6.Cory Spinks
7.Enzo Macarinelli
8.Butterbeam
9.John Ruiz
10.Jason Litzau
11.Peter Manfredo Jr
12.Jose Cotto
13.Julio Cesar Chavez Jr
14.Junior Witter
15.Kassim Ouma
16.Nikolay Valuev
17.Oleg Maskaev
18.Anthony Mundine
19.Samuel Peter
20.Sergei Liakhovich

Honorable mentions to Shannon Briggs,Vivian Harris,Walter Matthysse and Manny Pacquiao

I agree with this list completely except I would switch # 1 and 2 and move Valuev higher after his amazing performance against Holy. Lastly, Ruiz should be at least top 5 if for nothing else but the sheer excitement he brings to the ring. Good solid list though.

[JazMerkin]

Are you serious?? So Cotto beating Jennings somehow bumps him back up above Hopkins, Mosley & Izzy??

& where are Rafa & Calderon??

& I'm a big Berto fan but there's no way that right now he's even in the top 20. Guys like Dawson, Caballero, Valero, Soto have all done considerably more to deserve being in or around the top 10 than he has.

How is Valero or Caballero any more proven than Berto? Fuck that. He isn't top 10 yet, but he easily top 20, and Cotto deserves to be higher than Mosley seeing as he beat him, and will again. I think he shouldn't be higher than Hopkins though, that is stupid, IMO Hopkins beat Calzaghe, and then also beat Pavlik.

You've got serious problems mate lol, why do you get so worked up over these things. You & JonesJrMayweather are made for each other.

Well as Valero is rated at #1 at 130 (which is a stacked division) & demolishes every opponent given to him (& they are certainly equivalent at least to Berto's resume) he deserves to be higher. Caballero also has a resume at least as good, & has proven more so far. Just because they're not all up on HBO doesn't mean they're not good. Berto just hasn't done enough yet to justify being in the top 20 boxers in the world. Right now Berto has one Ring rated fighter & that's Collazo & some feel he lost that fight. I didn't before you have an aneurysm.

So because Cotto beat Mosley a year ago, he should be rated higher despite what has happened in the year since? Also whilst I felt Cotto won, it was not a dominant performance anywhere near the manner of Mosley's over Margarito. Well all they need is them to fight again to prove it & if Cotto wins then he will be right up near the top of that list, but until then the fact is that right now Mosley is the man at 147.

Also if you're going to put Cotto up there on the basis of the reasons HTH has, then it's not anymore stupid to have him above B-Hop than it is having him above Vasquez.

[C-Lo]

1. Manny Pacquiao
2. Juan Manuel Marquez
3. Bernard Hopkins
4. Shane Mosley
5. Israel Vasquez
6. Rafael Marquez
7. Ricky Hatton
8. Miguel Cotto
9. Vic Darchiniyan
10. Chad Dawson

How do you have Vic Darchiniyan above Dawson or Hatton above Cotto? Did Mayweather not beat Hatton worse than Margarito beat Cotto? He won almost every round.

Darchiniyan just beat Mijares and Arce which IMO is bigger than Dawson's recent wins over Johnson and Tarver.

Hatton just came off a great performance against Malignaggi while Cotto was inactive for 208 days until he just recently beat Jennings. Jennings was a comeback fight while Malignaggi was arguably the most elite 140lb contender for Hatton's belt. I'm not basing a P4P list on Cotto/Hatton's losses, I'm basing it on their recent wins.

[Taeth]

1. Manny Pacquiao
2. Juan Manuel Marquez
3. Bernard Hopkins
4. Shane Mosley
5. Israel Vasquez
6. Rafael Marquez
7. Ricky Hatton
8. Miguel Cotto
9. Vic Darchiniyan
10. Chad Dawson

How do you have Vic Darchiniyan above Dawson or Hatton above Cotto? Did Mayweather not beat Hatton worse than Margarito beat Cotto? He won almost every round.

Darchiniyan just beat Mijares and Arce which IMO is bigger than Dawson's recent wins over Johnson and Tarver.

Hatton just came off a great performance against Malignaggi while Cotto was inactive for 208 days until he just recently beat Jennings. Jennings was a comeback fight while Malignaggi was arguably the most elite 140lb contender for Hatton's belt. I'm not basing a P4P list on Cotto/Hatton's losses, I'm basing it on their recent wins.

Mijares never deserved his p4p ranking, and Arce is a joke, Chad Dawson was never KO'ed. Glen Johnson and Tarver have been at the top of the sport way longer than anybody Vic has foughten, and now Adamek who everybody forgets is now arguably the best cruiserweight in the world, after being one of the best light heavyweights whom Dawson beat almost every round. When was the last time Hatton fought before Malignaggi? Wasnt' that around the same time Cotto fought. Cotto beat Quintana, Judah, and Mosley in his weight class, and he outboxed Margarito for 6 rounds. Clearly he is ahead of Hatton.

[C-Lo]

How do you have Vic Darchiniyan above Dawson or Hatton above Cotto? Did Mayweather not beat Hatton worse than Margarito beat Cotto? He won almost every round.

Darchiniyan just beat Mijares and Arce which IMO is bigger than Dawson's recent wins over Johnson and Tarver.

Hatton just came off a great performance against Malignaggi while Cotto was inactive for 208 days until he just recently beat Jennings. Jennings was a comeback fight while Malignaggi was arguably the most elite 140lb contender for Hatton's belt. I'm not basing a P4P list on Cotto/Hatton's losses, I'm basing it on their recent wins.

Mijares never deserved his p4p ranking, and Arce is a joke, Chad Dawson was never KO'ed. Glen Johnson and Tarver have been at the top of the sport way longer than anybody Vic has foughten, and now Adamek who everybody forgets is now arguably the best cruiserweight in the world, after being one of the best light heavyweights whom Dawson beat almost every round. When was the last time Hatton fought before Malignaggi? Wasnt' that around the same time Cotto fought. Cotto beat Quintana, Judah, and Mosley in his weight class, and he outboxed Margarito for 6 rounds. Clearly he is ahead of Hatton.

Cotto did beat Quintana, Judah, and Mosley but he lost to someone that wasn't on the P4P picture. Hatton lost to P4P #1. When it comes to resumes I think Cotto's is a bit stronger than Hatton's but a P4P list is more about "what have you done for me lately," not "what have you done your whole career."

And since we are discussing about "what have they done lately," it goes like this:

Hatton lost to P4P #1 Floyd Mayweather, beat Laczano, and beat a top contender in Malignaggi.

Cotto lost to Margarito, then beat Jennings.

Hatton's recent activity is more impressive which is why he's ahead of Cotto in my current P4P list.