The Amazing Race: Pacquiao vs. JM Marquez for P4P supremacy

[KKisser]

I hate Oscar, so I'm not one to defend him. But are you implying that Oscar WASN'T completely past his prime, and pretty well shot, when he fought Pac? 'Cause if you are... you are in a definite minority.

i'm sure you said oscar was shot before his fight with pac just like everybody else lol.

With the size difference, I didn't think it would matter. But I must admit to being totally blown away by how bad DLH looked during the fight. Or are you going to claim that was vintage DLH?

always easier to make our opinions on hindsight. but what if oscar made it a more competitive fight? hatton didn't want to fight oscar and marquez i'm sure wouldn't think of it before pac faced de la hoya. in short, nobody thought oskee was shot before the fight. roach had an inkling but you really couldn't tell until both pac and oscar got up on the ring and perform. i honestly think it was pac's speed and game plan coupled with oscar's having to go down in weight that resulted in what it was. under different circumstances and maybe a different opponent oscar imo would have had a better showing.

[KKisser]

JMM's fights with Pac were close and inconclusive... so scratch that one. And a shot DLH doesn't measure up to a prime Casamayor. I don't agree with you.

i supposed if pac would have fought casa and gave him a whooping like he did oscar then casa would have been called shot, washed up and old. lol

No, Casamayor had not lost 3 of his previous 6 fights in the preceding 5 years (not including the Sturm debacle which is officially a win). He'd only lost twice in 11 fights & those were against Corrales & Castillo. In contrast in that time whilst ODLH's wins were against Sturm (see above), Mayorga & Stevie Forbes. In that time Casamayor beat Nate Campbell, Corrales (twice), Daniel Seda, Santa Cruz (debatable decision) & Michael Katsidis. If Pac had fought almost any of the other belt-holders in 135 division, he would of got much more credit then he did for beating David Diaz. If he beats Hatton as I think he will then there will be no room for debate

c'mon, fighters are always judge by their last fights. just look at casa's last 2 and IF pac gave him a total beating that's what he would have been called, shot, washed up and old.

[TitoFan]

i'm sure you said oscar was shot before his fight with pac just like everybody else lol.

With the size difference, I didn't think it would matter. But I must admit to being totally blown away by how bad DLH looked during the fight. Or are you going to claim that was vintage DLH?

always easier to make our opinions on hindsight. but what if oscar made it a more competitive fight? hatton didn't want to fight oscar and marquez i'm sure wouldn't think of it before pac faced de la hoya. in short, nobody thought oskee was shot before the fight. roach had an inkling but you really couldn't tell until both pac and oscar got up on the ring and perform. i honestly think it was pac's speed and game plan coupled with oscar's having to go down in weight that resulted in what it was. under different circumstances and maybe a different opponent oscar imo would have had a better showing.

For the record, I was one of the ones crying "foul" BEFORE the fight, because I felt Oscar was going for the easy payday, picking on the naturally smaller man. To Pac's credit, he didn't know which Oscar was going to show up. And while Oscar DID turn out to be a shell of his former self, Pac himself put on a marvelous display of skill, speed, and power. Not to mention the fact that he won ME over by humiliating Oscar. But weight-drained or not (and I guess he probably was), that was a far cry from the old, vintage De La Hoya.

[JazMerkin]

i supposed if pac would have fought casa and gave him a whooping like he did oscar then casa would have been called shot, washed up and old. lol

No, Casamayor had not lost 3 of his previous 6 fights in the preceding 5 years (not including the Sturm debacle which is officially a win). He'd only lost twice in 11 fights & those were against Corrales & Castillo. In contrast in that time whilst ODLH's wins were against Sturm (see above), Mayorga & Stevie Forbes. In that time Casamayor beat Nate Campbell, Corrales (twice), Daniel Seda, Santa Cruz (debatable decision) & Michael Katsidis. If Pac had fought almost any of the other belt-holders in 135 division, he would of got much more credit then he did for beating David Diaz. If he beats Hatton as I think he will then there will be no room for debate

c'mon, fighters are always judge by their last fights. just look at casa's last 2 and IF pac gave him a total beating that's what he would have been called, shot, washed up and old.

IMO better to look like that against Santa Cruz & Katsidis (who many thought could beat him prior to the fight) than against Steve Forbes, a guy who whilst being one of my favourite fighters was another blown up lightweight fighting at 154 (following on from Mayweather). Pac gets a lot of credit for what he's done before, but not his last 2 fights. If we're going off last 5 fights it's much closer with Pac just edging it, if its last 2 its Marquez.

[KKisser]

With the size difference, I didn't think it would matter. But I must admit to being totally blown away by how bad DLH looked during the fight. Or are you going to claim that was vintage DLH?

always easier to make our opinions on hindsight. but what if oscar made it a more competitive fight? hatton didn't want to fight oscar and marquez i'm sure wouldn't think of it before pac faced de la hoya. in short, nobody thought oskee was shot before the fight. roach had an inkling but you really couldn't tell until both pac and oscar got up on the ring and perform. i honestly think it was pac's speed and game plan coupled with oscar's having to go down in weight that resulted in what it was. under different circumstances and maybe a different opponent oscar imo would have had a better showing.

For the record, I was one of the ones crying "foul" BEFORE the fight, because I felt Oscar was going for the easy payday, picking on the naturally smaller man. To Pac's credit, he didn't know which Oscar was going to show up. And while Oscar DID turn out to be a shell of his former self, Pac himself put on a marvelous display of skill, speed, and power. Not to mention the fact that he won ME over by humiliating Oscar. But weight-drained or not (and I guess he probably was), that was a far cry from the old, vintage De La Hoya.

oscar hasn't been vintage in his last several fights and pac's team certainly took advantage.

[KKisser]

No, Casamayor had not lost 3 of his previous 6 fights in the preceding 5 years (not including the Sturm debacle which is officially a win). He'd only lost twice in 11 fights & those were against Corrales & Castillo. In contrast in that time whilst ODLH's wins were against Sturm (see above), Mayorga & Stevie Forbes. In that time Casamayor beat Nate Campbell, Corrales (twice), Daniel Seda, Santa Cruz (debatable decision) & Michael Katsidis. If Pac had fought almost any of the other belt-holders in 135 division, he would of got much more credit then he did for beating David Diaz. If he beats Hatton as I think he will then there will be no room for debate

c'mon, fighters are always judge by their last fights. just look at casa's last 2 and IF pac gave him a total beating that's what he would have been called, shot, washed up and old.

IMO better to look like that against Santa Cruz & Katsidis (who many thought could beat him prior to the fight) than against Steve Forbes, a guy who whilst being one of my favourite fighters was another blown up lightweight fighting at 154 (following on from Mayweather). Pac gets a lot of credit for what he's done before, but not his last 2 fights. If we're going off last 5 fights it's much closer with Pac just edging it, if its last 2 its Marquez.

my point was marquez gets more credit for beating casa than if pac would have faced casa and beaten him. reason was casa was competitive against marquez but say pac blows him away casa would have been called shot.

[XaduBoxer]

I hope JMM won't challenge PAC anymore (well he called out PBF instead of PAC, that's a good sign) for there's a greater chance that he will be KO'ed this time around specially at higher weights, like for example 140 lbs.

JMM faced life and death in his last 2 fights against Casa and Juan Diaz while PAC had an easy time slaying giants like David Diaz and Hoya... The added beatings JMM received from Casa and JuanD softened his body more and facing PAC for the 3rd time will finally make his body crumble to pieces...

IMO, JMM can't overtake PAC in amazing P4P race...
.

A question.In all seriousness do you just copy and paste this stuff.Ive noticed that you posted this exact mantra,word for word, in about three different threads...But in this one ya added the part about over taking in the p4p race ??Hey,do what you do,only wondering

David Diaz 'A giant'.....come on man.The hype is just to thick here.Diaz was basically a belt warmer and if ya looked hard enough you could see 'everlast' stamped on his forehead.He had no chance and served as the one dimensional,predictable perfect foil for Pac to springboard into the lightweight division...grab a strap...and then leave.

First, thanks for appreciating how I customized my similar postings on each thread... This is the "amazing race" thread so that's explain that additional line...

David Diaz was lumped with Hoya when I consider them giants... It might be overrating Diaz but giant label is approriate for Hoya... PAC was coming up in weight when he faced David... As a PAC fan, I was a bit uneasy on how PAC will perform in the Diaz fight in a higher weight class... Then came another giant in Hoya... Though I truly believed PAC's speed, youth and stamina will eventually overwhelm Hoya, I again had that worried feeling on how PAC handles the bigger Hoya at 147 lbs. division...

Addendum:
Now PAC slated to face Hatton next on a lower division of 140 lbs. ... I didn't feel any worries anymore... That's how confident I am in this PAC-Hatton fight...
.

[Taeth]

There was nothing Oscar could have done against Pacquiao even a couple years ago, Pacquiao wasn't there to be hit.

[XaduBoxer]

There was nothing Oscar could have done against Pacquiao even a couple years ago, Pacquiao wasn't there to be hit.

Very true...
.

[Addicted to_boxing]

Pac is still number one based on a gift decision on paper. No one can erase that fact! But I'll take JMM's last 3 fights including the Pac fight over Pac's last 3 fights. The last two being clear KO's as opposed to KO's on attrition against immobile foes by Pac. (ODLH was spent as soon as he stepped into the ring). Great spent boxer forecasting by Roach. (addmission by Roach himself)

However, Pac should gain more distance after he beats another immobile boxer that just happens to be "OVER RATED". Pac will surely be spoken of in god like terms after this stylistic mismatch / beating.

Problem is JMM's body will not support anything over 135. Anything above 135 hinders JMM significantly. So expect a 3rd fight to be at 140 or 147 by Pac's extremely smart handlers.

[XaduBoxer]

Pac is still number one based on a gift decision on paper. No one can erase that fact! But I'll take JMM's last 3 fights including the Pac fight over Pac's last 3 fights. The last two being clear KO's as opposed to KO's on attrition against immobile foes by Pac. (ODLH was spent as soon as he stepped into the ring). Great spent boxer forecasting by Roach. (addmission by Roach himself)

However, Pac should gain more distance after he beats another immobile boxer that just happens to be "OVER RATED". Pac will surely be spoken of in god like terms after this stylistic mismatch / beating.

Problem is JMM's body will not support anything over 135. Anything above 135 hinders JMM significantly. So expect a 3rd fight to be at 140 or 147 by Pac's extremely smart handlers.

I agree, a PAC vs. JMM 3rd fight above 135 is very dangerous for JMM... He's been receiving considerable beatings in his last 2 fights while PAC enjoying easy vacation fights... The toll of these competitive fights by JMM will be heavily exposed by PAC if ever there's a 3rd fight specially at 140 or above... Better for JMM not to chase PAC anymore... JMM is better off calling out PBF Jr. ...
.

[Spicoli]

Pac is still number one based on a gift decision on paper. No one can erase that fact! But I'll take JMM's last 3 fights including the Pac fight over Pac's last 3 fights. The last two being clear KO's as opposed to KO's on attrition against immobile foes by Pac. (ODLH was spent as soon as he stepped into the ring). Great spent boxer forecasting by Roach. (addmission by Roach himself)

However, Pac should gain more distance after he beats another immobile boxer that just happens to be "OVER RATED". Pac will surely be spoken of in god like terms after this stylistic mismatch / beating.

Problem is JMM's body will not support anything over 135. Anything above 135 hinders JMM significantly. So expect a 3rd fight to be at 140 or 147 by Pac's extremely smart handlers.

I agree, a PAC vs. JMM 3rd fight above 135 is very dangerous for JMM... He's been receiving considerable beatings in his last 2 fights while PAC enjoying easy vacation fights... The toll of these competitive fights by JMM will be heavily exposed by PAC if ever there's a 3rd fight specially at 140 or above... Better for JMM not to chase PAC anymore... JMM is better off calling out PBF Jr. ...
.

Marquez has prevailed against adversity in the form of a young viable and top 5 quality challenger and an aged but possible HOF linear champion.'Competitive',yes...Beatings...no.I'll take that any day of the week over easy vacation fights as you call them.Once again...Diaz was a belt warmer for Pac,simple as that.Santa-Cruz was having a huge vacation also the entire way,battering Diaz up until Diaz found a brick. Its as clear as day that although Pac holds a disputed victory over Marquez that the matter remains clouded and generates huge interest.Marquez should not have to 'chase' Pacquiao to 140 just as Pac should not walk away from a stacked division in favor of glamor cash grab affair with DelaHypa.

I vote we consolidate these threads,it really is nauseating.Contrary to some hype merchants beliefs,The boxing world as a whole does not revolve around one single fighter . Yaaawn.

[fan johnny]

c'mon, fighters are always judge by their last fights. just look at casa's last 2 and IF pac gave him a total beating that's what he would have been called, shot, washed up and old.

IMO better to look like that against Santa Cruz & Katsidis (who many thought could beat him prior to the fight) than against Steve Forbes, a guy who whilst being one of my favourite fighters was another blown up lightweight fighting at 154 (following on from Mayweather). Pac gets a lot of credit for what he's done before, but not his last 2 fights. If we're going off last 5 fights it's much closer with Pac just edging it, if its last 2 its Marquez.

my point was marquez gets more credit for beating casa than if pac would have faced casa and beaten him. reason was casa was competitive against marquez but say pac blows him away casa would have been called shot.

Dude... get a clue! It's because Marqeuz is already an old man....

[KKisser]

IMO better to look like that against Santa Cruz & Katsidis (who many thought could beat him prior to the fight) than against Steve Forbes, a guy who whilst being one of my favourite fighters was another blown up lightweight fighting at 154 (following on from Mayweather). Pac gets a lot of credit for what he's done before, but not his last 2 fights. If we're going off last 5 fights it's much closer with Pac just edging it, if its last 2 its Marquez.

my point was marquez gets more credit for beating casa than if pac would have faced casa and beaten him. reason was casa was competitive against marquez but say pac blows him away casa would have been called shot.

Dude... get a clue! It's because Marqeuz is already an old man....

yeah, an old man beating up on an even older man casamayor lol.

[HattonTheHammer]

Pac is still number one based on a gift decision on paper. No one can erase that fact! But I'll take JMM's last 3 fights including the Pac fight over Pac's last 3 fights. The last two being clear KO's as opposed to KO's on attrition against immobile foes by Pac. (ODLH was spent as soon as he stepped into the ring). Great spent boxer forecasting by Roach. (addmission by Roach himself)

However, Pac should gain more distance after he beats another immobile boxer that just happens to be "OVER RATED". Pac will surely be spoken of in god like terms after this stylistic mismatch / beating.

Problem is JMM's body will not support anything over 135. Anything above 135 hinders JMM significantly. So expect a 3rd fight to be at 140 or 147 by Pac's extremely smart handlers.

I agree, a PAC vs. JMM 3rd fight above 135 is very dangerous for JMM... He's been receiving considerable beatings in his last 2 fights while PAC enjoying easy vacation fights... The toll of these competitive fights by JMM will be heavily exposed by PAC if ever there's a 3rd fight specially at 140 or above... Better for JMM not to chase PAC anymore... JMM is better off calling out PBF Jr. ...
.

jeez you post some crap on here

Its all well and good being patriotic to your countrymen but then it borederlines into the ridiculous.

Even pacs own team manager would probably tell you the higher up the weight classes jmm-pac goes the less chance of an actual manny win rather than a lopsided decision.

JMM would massacre pac at 135 and butcher him at 140

Next you`ll be telling us all how pacquiao would own cotto at 147